Senators Roundtable – Big Trade with Flyers, Ullmark, Pinto’s Next Contract, Joseph for Tanev & More
hey everybody welcome back to the Senators round table I’m your host Jacob Billington joined by Dayton Rymer today how you doing Dayton OH pretty good um glad to be back wasn’t here for the last one so yeah things are good happy to have you back it’s been it’s been an insane week in Ottawa um it’s there’s been rumors everywhere and people talking and uh it looks like there’s going to be a lot of movement here in the next week or so so um we have a lot to get to but before we do that this one’s not so much a rumor um and it’s not really news either but it’s kind of a talking point um I know that you’re very well connected to the draft and you kind of have your eyes on some certain players but Sam Dickinson did an interview with Merk Masters and uh had a conversation about what it would mean to be drafted to Ottawa and he knows that his name has been linked to Ottawa um in a few different places he’s from Toronto uh he could be a pretty good Target for Ottawa outside of him being a left-handed defenseman but I mean after this week who knows that might be a position of need for Ottawa um so what do you think of Sam Dickinson and is he somebody that Ottawa should be targeting yeah I think so um I wrote a post a couple of weeks ago now that laid out I think what Sam Dickinson could bring to the Senators and why he should be a Target I don’t think he’s a perfect Target there are some concerns but uh he is one of the most well-rounded defensemen heading into the NHL draft he’s going to be a top 10 pick if he falls out of the top 10 that would be insane yeah he brings a lot of offense he has a well-rounded defensive side uh he was one of like he was kind of a shutdown guy in the Memorial Cup and in the playoffs for the London Knights but he also like I said brings a lot of offense he had 70 points in 68 games this season so he is kind of a total package the only concern is that he shoots left and like you mentioned there could be an opening if some of the rumors that have been circulating do come to pass and I also think that the Senator’s left-handed defensive depth isn’t fantastic like it’s good especially with the guys that you have right now in the NHL but beyond that you don’t have anybody who could slip into the top four and definitely not the top two top four maybe top two definitely not and Dickinson would give them another option and I don’t think the Senators should be I guess turning their nose up at somebody who doesn’t quite fit because you never know who’s going to fit yeah and I mean the only argument I have against that is you never know in let let’s say it’s another two years until Sam Dickinson is a full-time NHL player he spends two more years in junior or he spends a year in Junior and a year in the AHL whatever it is let’s just say two years um until he’s a full-time NHL player you’re going to have a 23-year-old Jak Sanderson as your top left-handed defenseman you don’t need another number one guy like that which I believe Sam Dickson is going to be um would you absolutely love to have one absolutely uh and whether it’s going to be Chan or Shabbat still in the lineup or neither um having somebody like Sam Dickinson on your second pair you make room for a guy like that um and so no the Senators don’t need another number one guy but having another option is is really really good and Sam Dickinson when I watch his game I see a lot of what Jake Sanderson brings and I think that that could be uh a really really good onew punch if that’s what odwa decides to go with because with Chan and Shabbat I mean we’re going to talk about both of them in a little bit but you don’t have that true two-way uh kind of play from them and do you really want one of them um being your number one guy at this point if Jake Sanderson gets hurt I don’t know yeah definitely and I think any NHL team has ever complained about having too much talent on the roster so well and look at what Tampa Bay did I mean I we’ve referenced it a million times with the three-headed monster that they ran with uh headman uh sergachev and mcdna and they said you know what things haven’t been working we’re going to go back and get MCD so they they missed that so Ottawa certainly needs to uh take the best player available I think and if it’s Sam Dickinson on for left-handed defenseman you take it because you’re going to need him someday and if not he’s going to be a really valuable trade chip I mean like people forget that that if Ottawa didn’t need Jake Sanderson coming out of uh when he was coming out of uh the NCAA you could trade him he had a lot of ton of value um maybe not fifth overall value but he had a ton of value so um worst case scenario you can trade somebody you can always trade somebody so just wanted to touch base on Sam Dickinson a little bit uh next up on the list Shane Pinto uh we just talked about a lot a lot about Jake Sanderson let’s go to another node aen and uh Shane Pinto seems to be looking for a very large contract um given the fact that he played 41 games last year uh he is looking for $5 million on a five or six year deal is that something you’d be willing to give them it sounds like Ottawa is looking more like a two-year deal so that they don’t have to Shell out the five million but where do you sit with the pinto contract I think if it was anywhere other than Ottawa I would be okay with it that’s fair uh it’s just Ottawa has too much history of signing young guys early in their career after a you know Bright Start and then it fails like 90% of the time and it shouldn’t be that frequent but it is in Ottawa right you got Josh Norris great season gets an $8 million deal he has hasn’t touched that level of success since um you you got Colin white like those are the two most egregious examples but you could probably even throw in Anton no not Anton um goodness why did I blank Jonas yonas caalo yes he had a really good season in La it was very brief and you bring them in sign them big and oh that’s not great so I have seen that they’re also looking at a bridge deal I think you kind of touched on that it’s looking at two to three years maybe 3.5 that’s okay will it be you know incredibly valuable afterwards and maybe up to an $8 million deal sure possibly at that point you probably don’t have Norris anymore I I don’t think he’s sticking around long enough to finish Pinto’s uh Bridge deal especially the way that things are going I’m I’m a bit more of a uh skeptic in for Norris yeah I think a lot of people around Ottawa are pretty pessimist think about the future of Josh Norris in Ottawa oh yeah yeah no I think a bridge deal is what he should sign because then he could really cash in um I understand why Ottawa would want longterm but a bridge is is usually a good compromise between two parties and it’s worked out in several different markets and I think Ottawa should just follow suit in that yeah you see Ottawa they did not want to give out any Bridge deals and I think that was a bit of a fear of them wanting out like let’s commit to these guys let’s have them commit to us was I think a bigger issue um so you see Brady kachuck Tim stutzel Josh Norris uh Drake bson Jake Sanderson Thomas Shabbat they’re all signing six plus year deals you mentioned Colin white you mentioned Josh Norris for every one of those players you also have a Tim stutzel and a jake Sanderson so there are contracts or Drake bson which is a perfect comparable um I think that when Drake bson signed his uh $5 million deal or 4.95 whatever uh I think I would take Shane Pinto today over the day that Drake BS signed that contract no that’s a fair point uh I think Pinto could become better than bson definitely I’m just I don’t know there’s a there’s a hesitancy in signing somebody to 5 million after a partial season yeah and well and to be his offense this year was on Pace to be much better than last year um he would have scored uh he was on Pace for 18 goals 36 assists uh for 54 points uh which would be almost 20 points more than his uh total last season in all 82 games so he was on he was on Pace to be a 50g goal Center uh or a 50o center wish he was a 50 goal Center um but yeah he’s just again you you can only project so far ahead yeah for sure I yeah I I don’t know if you’re swaying me to your side today um I appreciate the effort but I think if he was on Pace like how many guys were on Pace to be really really good and then just disappeared like n Yakupov had one of the best rookie Seasons when he came in and it was a shorten season but he still was lights out really talented and then disappears off the face of the Earth he can’t even touch his rookie totals yeah he you never know what’s going to happen and with ottawa’s cap situation and a lot of the guys who will be coming up and Pinto isn’t going to be a first line Center like you said I think he could be maybe he could touch 70 points if his Lin mates are really good on the second I would love to see him on a third line as a solid two-way Center playing beside two guys who can put up points and he’s like a 50 60 point guy I think that is the ideal situation I think that’s why he was drafted I don’t want to pay more than five million for that so my last rebuttal to you in attempt to sway you into giving in on the $5 million deal uh do you are you not okay with signing a third line Center to 5 million with the cap going up $4 million a year at the minimum for Shane Pinto projects to be a pretty high-end third line Center like we’re not talking about um like I don’t I can’t even think of an example but like it’s not like we’re talking about Mark cik who’s just gonna fill in on the third line yeah no he’s he’s not a grinder he’s a a a very talented two-way guy who could score like 30 goals in the right situation that’s fantastic I could go up to 6 million but the way that people are kind of talking about him it’s like we can’t lose him we can’t lose him it’s like you could it would suck but you can find somebody replace Shane pinto and if you’re trying to lock him up right now long term I think that is a bit of a mistake fair enough um we’re gonna move on to another bottom six player since that’s all Shane Pinto is to you um going for the for the cheap shots here um Matthew Joseph uh it sounds like Ottawa was trying to get rid of him before the draft his $2.95 million looked a whole lot better this season than it did last season but still not ideal uh maybe even a little bit less ideal is Brandon tanv uh who has $3.5 million for one more year opposed to Matthew Joseph’s two years uh very similar like Point totals uh similar impacts different skill set but they both make a pretty similar impact on a lineup what do you think of just the concept of moving uh Joseph out and bringing tanv in and part of bringing Brandon tanv in is going to be to incentivize Chris tanv and joining the team so if you have any thoughts on Chris tanv joining you can add that in at the end too um well that whole situation reminds me of I think it was back in 2005 2006 coming out of the lockout the Anaheim Ducks acquired Rob Neer Meer uh and I can’t remember from whom again but then they also signed Scott NE me or maybe that was the trade and then it was sign I they brought in both brothers to the Ducks surpris surprised they win the cup right now Scott NE is a Hall of Famer Chris tanv and Brandon tanv are not even the most glowing reports don’t have them anywhere close to that doesn’t mean that they’re not effective I don’t just see them as a bottom pairing guy um I think it’s a it’s a really good move I think maybe his price is a little bit high but if you are kind of working that angle I think that would be great I think Joseph has kind of made himself as Expendable he’s been really good but also inconsistent he’s meshed well with some guys but then they keep moving around and he just I don’t know I don’t know if he has a long-term future on this team and if they were going to bring in his brother Pierre Oliver Joseph from the penguins that would be great he’s just talented depth defenseman but I don’t think they’re going to do that and I don’t think Pittsburgh wants to get rid of them so let’s go with the tan of anle they’re local too aren’t they are they Ottawa or Ontario uh I’m gonna look that up real quick uh might be wet I thought they were they’re from Toronto yeah okay so not local but kind of I don’t know why I had to skatch one in my head there is a lot players from Saskatchewan there is uh I I looked it up for you by the way uh so they traded for Rob Neer Neer Meer in the 023 season and then sign Neer Meer in the lockout or Scott Neer Meer okay so I did have that right yeah fantastic um but yeah I I I think bringing in the tanv uh brings kind of that that thing that Steve stos has been looking for and that’s quality veterans uh you’re not bringing in like you’re not going to trade a second round pick for der ston again uh that’s not what’s going to happen with the Brandon tanv trade the same premise is there like bringing in I’ll be honest bringing in Derek Stefon I really liked the deal not for a second round pick maybe a fifth round pick would have been fine um and I like I like the premise of it you need These Guys these quality depth players that can uh do well in the lineup and help the young guys that’s what Ottawa needs right now is to get somebody like Brandon tanv who’s been there done that he needs to uh come in and just kind of mentor for some of these guys and just be a presence in the locker room and we’ve all seen from his uh his NHL mug shots that he is one of the funniest guys in the league the way he always has his eyes wide open um and then if if he can bring Chris tanov along with him that’s an absolute win Chris tanov is should be one of the top targets for Ottawa this season this offseason um in some other news Jacob markstrom has finally been dealt uh Matthew and I talked about this on a video on the hockey Riders YouTube channel last night um and my take on it was finally Calgary and uh New Jersey decided to shut up and kiss it was always going to happen um Ottawa seemed to be in on merom pretty strong but it was inevitable that it was going to happen to uh happen to be that uh the Devils getting them so Ottawa is Shifting Gears to lenus olar and it sounds like only lenus olar um reports today um from David pegoda some people don’t love his reporting some people do but he did report today that uh lenus olar would be willing to wave his uh no trade clause to go to Ottawa he is on the list but he would be willing to wave it and liim’s Maran who again isn’t um like with a big company or anything but he has a lot of connections and uh posts online and he uh said the same thing that lenaar has waved his no trade clause it’s just a matter of Steve seos and Don Sweeney getting a deal done we kind of talked about Mar with you a few weeks ago how you don’t think that he is the solute and that getting aend is the solution but now that we’re kind of we might be on the eve of the trade what are your thoughts uh pretty much the same as before it’s like you said not the solution I think there are bigger issues I think Chris tanov would help those issues significantly so if that’s in the ballpark and I think it’s a fantastic upgrade I think uh Corpus Alo just hasn’t been the guy he needed a lot of support and unfortunately forsberg just isn’t a guy who can come in and play half a season to top numbers he can bail out a starter frequently I I love him as like a 1B situation where he’s playing maybe 30 games uh but you need a guy who can play like those 50 60 which is kind of a rarity now and I think Omar could almost be one of those guys uh I don’t think he’s hit that recently but he’s been in the 4050 range I’m pretty sure um let me bring that up right now he has never played 50 games in a season okay has he been in the 40s uh yes every year um each of the past three years yeah so he can handle the workload and he has the numbers to back him up of course the Bruins are much better defensively so don’t expect those numbers to follow him to Ottawa unless the defense core was completely reshake or shaken up there we go um no I think it’s a good deal I don’t think stos is going to overpay he hasn’t shown that he’s going to do that just to bring in somebody um yeah it’s an upgrade I don’t think it’s the solution but it’s definitely a step worth taking it sounds like the rumored asking price is uh Jacob Chan 25th overall so Boston’s first round pick back and a prospect are you willing to give up a package that big for Lena Omar um maybe not the prospect but the first two for sure you’ll give up CH in 25th for y om yeah they’re two guys who have one years yeah I think that he needs to come with an extension if he’s willing to wave his no move clause and come to Ottawa or no trade clause and come to Ottawa I’m willing to bet he’s willing to talk extension um that’s just that’s how it works I would like to see something figured out before before the trade is done though I don’t want to see another um even with Chan he had two years left that’s still coming back to bite them if Chan had four more years left on his deal I think that Thomas Shabad is probably the one leaving um and if Alex De Brat had four more years on his deal I’m sure that he’s still an Ottawa Senator and everything is fine and dandy like it’s just right now Ottawa needs somebody to come in and commit uh one of these big trades that they’re doing they need a long-term reassurance yeah definitely for sure so uh Jacob Chan probably getting really really sick of seeing his name in trade rumors he seemed very relieved to finally be traded out of Arizona to come to Ottawa and he kind of just said like I’ve I’m getting tired of seeing my name everywhere and we’re less than 18 months later and here it is again he’s probably top five on most uh trade bait boards and he’s probably before the draft like within the next week so uh we talked about Boston a little bit it sounds like Philadelphia and Ottawa are cooking up quite the deal um couple people have chimed in on this uh Travis Yos kind of started off the conversation he’s the one that broke the jaob marks from trade two um but he said that they have a framework for a deal in place and it’s probably going to happen a little bit closer to the draft uh some people have said uh it was Jordan Schmaltz who posted that Ottawa is going to be moving a defenseman and that they have multiple bigname defenseman on the trade block so I don’t he didn’t get into specifics who that is I don’t imagine it’s Sanderson I don’t imagine it’s Zu I wonder if stos is trying to move Shabbat and Cham both that would be very interesting um but what are some pieces from Philadelphia that you’d be looking to take back it’s hard because we don’t know like is this just going to be Matthew Joseph and a third round pick for Scott lton is it going to be Jacob Chen and seventh overall for Travis connect me and 12th overall like we have no idea the magnitude of this kind of trade but what what kind of assets are you looking at in Philadelphia um well there’s been of course a few rumors that have been talked about there’s been Scott lton uh Travis kkny has been talked about I don’t foresee that but that would be a good get I think he definitely fits what the Senators are building he has really high upside just had almost a 70p point season and appears to be kind of you know on the rise here but he also just was named the assistant captain on a team that is trying to build something as well it’s also the same team that scratched their Captain last year so I take that with the grain of salt that’s fair tartz is still there isn’t he yes yeah yeah you never really can bet on anything when torz is your coach yeah you never quite know um yeah I mean there’s a lot of names that I’d be interested in uh Joel farby I think he’s an interesting player you know young has is on the left side leftwing but you know has the skill 50p point guy even some of their defenseman like cam York I know he’s on a little on the other side under siiz but he’s really skilled I like Travis sanheim as a shutdown guy um Morgan Frost is is interesting Tyson Forester there’s a lot of guys I would not be mad at I don’t know if any of those are in the move but if you’re moving someone like Shabbat or chran I would expect at least one of those guys yeah the name that I keep looking at is Joel farby um a lot of comparisons between him and Drake bson were made um and he signed a very similar contract he has four years left at $5 million um we talked a lot about $5 million men today but um yeah he scored 22 goals and 50 points this year he’s been kind of developing very well he’s going higher and higher in points every year um he’s 24 he’s a little bit slower um than that comparable of Drake bson to getting uh his feet fully wet and turning into a true star but he is one of those Wingers that um could do really really well in Ottawa and you look at their second line left wings but they have a hole there and right now um Joel fby could be a really good option there I saw um I I saw 350 trade rumors today between Ottawa and Philadelphia um none of them really stuck out to me as being that could be really realistic or that could be um I’d be really interested in that but putting a couple of them together uh I look at whether it’s going to be shabat or Chan I don’t know I don’t know how other teams value both of them right now um I would imagine that they’re fairly similar um maybe cheran a little bit more valuable just because of his cap and uh whatnot but would you do Jacob Chan seventh overall for Joel farby 12th overall and 30 second overall um that’s a pretty decent offer um I would definitely think about it I think that is worth considering um far like you said five million he signed that uh two years ago he’s played two years of that contract yeah and yeah so he’s he’s making progress 20 goal score last season uh it’s also his second season as a 20 goal scor getting that 12th back and another pick I think that’s that’s fair yeah yeah I think that’s the kind of deal to expect yeah because I mean you look at what Philadelphia wants they obviously want to move into the top 10 um I don’t think that’s a secret at all and Steve stos has said like if the right deal comes across my lap I’m more than happy to trade back and I mean you look at this draft you you’ve done that plenty there’s a lot of good options at 12th overall I mean like worst case scenario if ottawa’s walking away with h Beck Becket senica or um cona helenius that’s that’s a success yeah believe it or not I’m actually writing a piece on why the Senators should Target Becka Sena so nice yeah no I think he is a fantastic fit for the Senators and won’t be there Beyond 12 I don’t think he’s no absolutely shot up the draft and if your trade is Joel farby Becket senica and I don’t know you said a second round pick coming back as well right the Florida’s first round pick so 32nd overall oh 32nd okay yeah yeah uh Al might have to give up a second or third or fourth something like that but I think have a couple believe throw in one of those because I think they’re still giving up the better player in ch oh 100% um but that locks up the Senators top six yeah that would be fantastic yeah I I think it’s going to be really interesting um and this is another one like I just mentioned with Calgary and New Jersey you look at these two teams and you kind of want to say shut up and kiss like just between all the Scott lton trade rumors over the past couple years I mean Scott LT in trade rumors was a pier Dory on DJ smith thing um I wonder if that carried over uh Dave pulan knows a lot about Philadelphia he knows a lot about the guys um so I I don’t know this is either going to be extremely disappointing when it is Matthew Joseph and a fourth round pick for Scott lton or it’s going to be a huge move that’s going to change everything about how odwa is built right now I still wouldn’t be mad at a matth Joseph third for Scott lton no not at all but just kind of with this hype it’s like if we’re like four days in advance we know that this trade is there’s a trade happening and that’s it why wait but bringing this back to uh Shane Pinto you have Scott lton he’s a third line guy I think we can safely you know kind of pigeon ho hold him there he’s 30 he puts up 40 50 points you’d hope 50 points but it’s mainly been 30s um and that would then push Pinto into that second line role you have someone like lotton and then Pinto I’m I’m much more comfortable with that because otherwise you’re making Pinto that third line guy which again not mad about he has the skill to be a very very good two-way guy um but then you’d want somebody better than pinto and that’s not as easy to find at least for a reasonable price there you you’d be paying a lot for somebody better than Pinto get in Lon sign Pinto yeah that’s that’s a pretty decent uh Center death yeah I I think that Ottawa can do a lot of really good things this year um they have a lot of assets think they’re they should be willing to move um so before we wrap things up I have one final question for you uh we’re recording this before game six of the Stanley Cup Final win or lose as this uh Conor mcdavid’s con SMI oo yeah yeah I I agree he’s already got 40 points in the playoffs that’s absolutely ridiculous yeah no it’s uh when you start breaking Gretzky’s records no matter what they are you’ve kind of put your name on the map for winning an award if bosski puts up a 72 save shut out and they win the cup tomorrow does McDavid still win yeah abovsky got pulled you can’t erase that yeah and he’s got like a I don’t know it’s like a 653 save percentage over his last seven periods it’s abysmal so I think they got to him I think they broke bosski and it took him a long time but they did it and it’s going to be tough to get that back yeah I agree all right uh that’s going to wrap everything up for today um this has been a very very packed show which we haven’t really had in a while there hasn’t been this many rumors come out in quite some time in Ottawa uh but it’s yeah it’s been nice to kind of get to talk about these things I wrote about them in the Senator’s news and rumors piece but really getting to express opinions and kind of have some back and forth conversation is what makes this kind of conversation um really valuable so thanks for coming on as always and thanks for having this conversation and if you all enjoyed this uh episode make sure to leave a like and a comment and check out all the rest of the content on the hockey riters YouTube channel in the hockey riders.com there’s tons of draft content so make sure to check all that out we’ll see you next time
In this episode of The Hockey Writers Senators Roundtable, Ottawa Senators writers Jacob Billington and Dayton Reimer get together to discuss Sam Dickinson as a draft target, Shane Pinto’s next contract, acquiring Linus Ullmark, swapping Mathieu Joseph for Brandon Tanev, rumours of a big trade with the Philadelphia Flyers, and more.
0:00 Intro
0:40 Senators 2024 NHL Draft Targets: Sam Dickinson
4:59 Shane Pinto’s Next Contract
11:25 Mathieu Joseph for Brandon Tanev?
15:44 Senators Are Now Targeting Linus Ullmark
20:04 Senators & Flyers Are Close to Making a Trade
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Dayton Reimer – https://thehockeywriters.com/author/dreimer/
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