Utah Mammoth 2025 NHL Draft Preview | Special Guest Trent Hess from @CleanHitsHockey | EP40

Utah Mammoth 2025 NHL Draft Preview | Special Guest Trent Hess from @CleanHitsHockey | EP40

welcome back to the Puck Bunker this is episode 40 a special mammoth edition of the Puck Bunker featuring Trent from Clean Hits Hockey and as always I’m joined by my co-host the man who once swam across the river from Windsor to Detroit and didn’t get caught Darren Boyce how you doing today yeah I think that might be a myth Rocco i I don’t I don’t know i I watch with my own two eyes i’m I’m pretty sure uh Trent thanks for joining us today um we’re excited obviously the draft is coming up utah was maybe you know one of the two big winners obviously here in the draft lottery you guys moved up quite a few spots and are are poised to uh add a franchise piece to the puzzle here um but first give us a little bit about yourself um for our viewers who who don’t know you um and haven’t seen Clean Heads Hockey and and what you’re all about yeah for sure thanks Rocka thanks for having me guys thanks Boyer uh I’m going to have to ask some follow-up questions after this about that river dip but uh I’m down here in sunny Arizona where all of our rivers are dried out for the most part either that or they’re at the bottom of canyons uh I’ve been a longtime Coyotes fan since 1996 if you can believe it i was the little fifth grade kid jumping up and down for joy when the Winnipeg Jets came and then uh all these years later my own fifth grader was sitting there heavy-hearted as his team was leaving and I’m like “Oh man comes full circle doesn’t it here?” But uh watching the longsuffering Coyotes for so many years has made me a bit deranged uh I would say my cheese has slid fully off the cracker so much so that I followed the team up to SLC uh and have been a diehard Utah hockey club Utah Mammoth fan ever since didn’t really let the reloc relocation sway me too much there uh so when the LA draft lottery came around uh having watched the Coyotes never once moved up ever in the history of the lottery despite being pretty terrible the entire time I just knew I knew this was going to be the dagger the Mammoth were moving up and lo and behold here we are picking fourth overall little bit of that Coyote’s curse left over because despite winning the lottery we still couldn’t get into the top two uh so that record still stands but uh force better than 14th so I’m pretty pumped for this draft either way i I love that so you guys at Clean Hits you guys are all former Arizona Coyotes fans right you guys are all based in Arizona and this your guys podcast only started this year is that right yeah we started it right before the last draft um so we were providing a lot of content for the last draft i’m actually I called the TJ Ginlet pick on our on our pre-draft show so I’m one for one so far on calling the picks we’ll see if the uh if the streak holds here uh our other guys on the show are in Arizona other than uh Corey one of my co-hosts is in uh Ontario so you guys should go out for a beer sometime he uh he’s worked for uh the CHL in the past he’s working for uh Daily Face Off now so he’s pretty uh pretty plugged in himself yeah that’s great and you know what and and give a shout out to the other guys on the show i feel trying like you’ve probably already got more words in here today than an episode with Brad hosting yeah fair enough yeah sorry about that i might be uh a little bit too chatty uh yeah we’ve got Brad who usually hosts and pres prevents me from uh rambling so much he’s Gretzky Betsky on Twitter he’s got a whole online sports gambling empire that he’s building and then there’s also Clean Hits Corey who’s kind of our Photoshop guru as well uh as Corey who I mentioned previously so that’s it that’s it’s the four of us on Clean Hits talking mammoth all the time so uh if anybody outside of Utah has any interest in learning a little bit more about the Mammoth please check us out uh we’re having a lot of draft experts on so even if you’re a fan of the Predators or the the Bruins or the or the Flyers or whoever and you want to get some insight into what the experts are saying about what might happen at a pick before yours tune in to our Stephen Ellis episode we’ve got some other big names coming soon so uh exciting stuff in the cards for the Clean Hits crew at at some point during that that little spiel I’ll have put a link to uh to their pod up there so so click that and check that out and uh subscribe to them um let’s go through your current prospect pool here um I’ll get your thoughts on it and then uh Boyce and I can jump in and we’ll we’ll kind of take it from there so notable picks this is the last last four drafts uh 2024 Tiginland Co Dwayne 2023 you got Simichev and Boot and goalie Harabble um in the second or second or third I think second round 2022 Logan Culie uh geeky key piece of the Sergichev trade uh the leaning tower of Lamar and then uh Ardam Duda you got to have you guys you got like your Russians we’re going to get to that boys have some some fun uh 2021 you got Gunther and the Junior Don with JJ Moser and Lilia then a whole slew of picks up coming in the next few years but we’ll touch that in a bit here um what have you liked about uh well between between the HC and the Coyotes what have you liked what they’ve done the last the last four four drafts here and and what have you not liked and really what uh what hole do they have to fill with with this well most importantly their first rounder yeah absolutely uh I’ve I’ve I’ve been a big fan right you look at this list and there’s been a lot of pieces that are trending positively and a lot of pieces that were able to be used to bring in a foundational piece in Sergev right so Logan Culie and Dylan Gunther both look like they’re turning into future all-star caliber players developing chemistry with captain Clayton Keller who had a career year uh things are trending up really well there you see Geeky and Moser who were key components of that uh Sergeev trade he led the team in ice time he was top five in the NHL in ice time for most of the season last year i’m not quite sure where he ended up but he was a huge key piece for us especially with Shawn Dury and John Marino missing most of the season with injury he kind of held that decor together and kept us in the fight maverick Lamaroo played no small part in that pun intended uh he came up and helped hold down the fort while injuries were going i actually had a chance to go down to Tucson a couple of times last year and check out Maverick Lamra and port person uh friend of the show Maverick Lamra if you’re a fan of his go check out our interview with him he’s a big part of the future as well i would say apart from Lamaru Josh Don and Arjum Dudo were the two other big standouts in Tucson last year uh really happy with the seasons they had developmentally don came up to the NHL roster and was a fixture on the third line last season um Simichev and Boot were the big surprise picks kind of the story of their draft shocked the world a little bit uh they just won a Gaggarian Cup in the KHL playing uh smaller roles on the team uh especially boot but got great experience in the men’s league there they just both recently signed their ELC’s and are headed to camp uh looking to make the big squad the Mammoth this year uh Robble I think has had uh some up and down times uh but I think that his latest NCAA season and his latest World Junior’s performance were both really really uh good showings and I think there’s a lot of hope for Robble and the future in net in Utah as his uh eventual era parent to fellow Czech neck minder Carell Vmela and then with uh Bo Dwan also friend of the show uh we’re a big fan of him uh future third line center uh hard-nosed player uh work ethic culture builder um sets the pace on and off the ice and then Ta Ga who was my uh my pick for the team last year i was thrilled to have him but he missed most of the year with a hip injury which is a bit concerning so I would say overall uh a really good showing by the uh scouting staff there in Arizona and Utah uh picking up players who are all making a positive impact in one way or another uh and trending in the right direction uh I think your other question was about what the needs are or the holes are in the prospect pool is that right yeah yeah and I’ll just take a quick sec to give a shout out Cole Boding as well uh we’re going to give a little shout out to Melissa at EVO Performance Cognitive in in Ottawa um she’s worked with with Cole um closely and um he can tell you all about that relationship but wanted to say say hi to her um and then the other thing um you were mentioning having some of the credit to the scouting and development staff uh for the Utah fans we did an interview with Charlie McTavish who who worked in uh as one of the goending coaches and in the development system for for Utah for a couple years he came over with uh with Tini um from this their days together in the ‘ 67 so um that that was a cool interview for the for the Utah fans um but yeah yeah exactly um following up to that um what might they be missing here now you said great group of guys they look like they’ve hit on a few of these picks i was a massive again fan uh so what what do you think they’re missing and then I’ll let Boyce jump in and give his thoughts on on the overall depth of the organization sure yeah i think number one is center depth um I think you have Logan Culie who’s looking like he’s going to be a really solid number one center uh but he hasn’t hit that high water mark yet uh we don’t really know where the ceiling is for him we don’t really yet know uh whether the floor is high enough there’s a lot that remains to be seen with Logan Culie as he grows and matures in the NHL um and then behind him on the current depth chart is Barrett Hatton who’s a a really solid young player uh who’s had some streakiness some injury issues some up and down seasons but I think is settling out to be a very good number three possibly number two player there’s a lot of uh flashes that he’s shown in the league so we’re waiting to see where the offensive upside tops out with Barrett Hatton is he really a number two or is he really a number three cole Bodwin is a little bit like Barrett Hatton in that way uh where he’s probably more of a third liner we’ve had Jack McBain filling in as third line center for most of the season uh he’s comfortable on the wing as well he may be more of a fourth liner he was on our show as well so check that out he’s an Ontario boy so any fans who want to see uh Jack McBain interview uh check that one out but he uh he’s going to be a fixture in the bottom six whether it be center or wing so I think from my perspective what I’d be looking for with this number four overall pick is a number two center okay Boyer how do we feel about uh Welcome to the show Darren sorry to keep you waiting we’ve got special guests in attendance how do you feel about the Mammoths uh drafts the last few years there and same question to you what do What do you think they’re missing uh well in terms of what they’re missing I do agree that they’re missing kind of a number two center i think that is kind of glaring to say for them uh in terms of their drafts I mean especially their top couple rounds I’ve really liked i mean we liked Tigan the last year um I do enjoy in 2023 how they just went with the biggest gigantic person they could with every pick basically um if you’ve listened to our show we really like size in this uh on our show um and it does look like Simv can play um you know and boots overall well they did i mean I don’t know if he’s going to be light like I don’t think he’s going to light things up Rocco but I think he can play effectively yeah exactly so I mean I I if they get a player out of that pick that’s more than adequate pick can’t find those guys around the league or around the league sorry um I do have questions if you know if Kulie is actually number one center or not i’m not sure um but again where you’re picking I don’t know if there really is a number one center option you can really find there um possibly but I mean again there’d be a lot of development required um you know for that I guess for that type of uh for that type of pick um again it’s just it’s to me it’s just kind of what type of team you want to be for with your top six forwards that’s kind of the question I have uh because as of current you know I mean you have Keller you have [ __ ] like they’re kind of smaller guys is that kind of the are those the guys you want to be building around is that And are you kind of augmenting that like are you kind of looking more you think for size to augment around that or is there a different play style they’d be looking for yeah I think they’d probably want to look to complement that a little bit rather than add to it so me personally I have James Haggins very highly ranked i’ve been a James Hagens apologist for most of the season i know that this is probably not the podcast for that i’ve heard other podcasts that are a little bit more aligned with me i know that Punk Bunker is maybe a little bit more critical of Hegens than I am but nonetheless he’s probably not the guy I would step up and draft just because of the factors you mentioned we’ve already got Logan Culie who’s slight of frame and not the tallest guy in the world as our uh slated in number one seed he did have 65 points at age 20 on a non-playoff team uh you know a middle of the pack bubble team anyway so I think that bodess well for his future he went and uh really showed well at the World Cup for what whatever that’s worth right or the World Championship uh this summer so uh I I do have a lot of faith in his development um Vlog or I’m sorry Clayton Keller had over 90 points this year so these are foundational pieces and I would agree i don’t think you want to build your foundation on too many players who are dimminitive right you want to get a little extra size they started that with boot um AIA’s got kind of average size so I I think they’d want to lean towards somebody who’s got at least NHL average size um I know that they’ve really leaned heavily on character picks and culture builders like Ta Gin and Coen who are known to really uh drive the pace of play on and off the ice and are seen as big- time culture builders this is something that every team harps on but I feel like Utah and Bill Armstrong especially tend to harp on a little bit more is that character piece so I would say that that’s something they would probably value inside of the top five as well yeah and I I love their I love that pick both their picks last year honestly I loved I thought again was to to me the the shest thing in the draft to be a 30 a 30 plus goal guy i mean he he’s he’s got all he’s got all of it um without really any major hole in his game and like you said character guy being Jerome McIll’s kid is going to come by that pretty pretty honestly and and Bod Dwayne I thought was phenomenal value um where you got him uh there was a point in the draft where that might have been a too high of a pick but I think I think I think it was 23 um that that you got him at i thought that was great value for for a guy who’s going to bring all the right things to the middle six um to the middle six of your of your roster um once he gets going now like you said center depth um lot of skill on the wing keller Agla uh Gunther boot hopefully right um down the line so let’s say that two of the first three picks are going to be Schaefer and Misa i think even if if uh someone steps up and takes someone different um neither of those two guys getting past third overall um who’s your top two target number one and and and who’s your best backup plan and and and then of of the other consensus guys at the top why not fair enough yeah I’d say uh Boycer is going to like my first name which is going to be Caleb Denoier who I think would be an amazing pick if he makes it to four yeah uh so Calb Denoier would be my favorite i’ve watched a ton of him i went back after we won the lottery and watched all of his playoff games because I thought he’d be a realistic opportunity uh I’ll be honest with you when I saw our lotto ball come up my first thought was Caleb Doier like hey we’re moving up to fourth we could get Denoier we’re there uh so he was the guy who was my first impulse like holy smokes we could potentially add this player that I’ve been dreaming of adding all season but knowing that the team was performing a little bit too well to be in the range of so that would be my pick probably um he is right there neck and neck with him for me i’m sorry Boer keep the keep the blood pressure down all right you know take a breath it’ll be all right um and I uh I’ve got a little bit of a wild card after that um I think for me I know that this one’s going to be a little bit uh controversial but I firmly believe that Brady Martin might be right next for them here at four i do um I’ve been paying close attention to it i’m hearing Stephen Ellis saying that he could go as high as four i’m hearing Jeff Merrick say he could go as high as four um I’m looking at the helium he’s had this draft year and how much it reminded me of the helium TJ Ginleta had tj Ginleta did not start out in the top 10 on preseason rankings he had a big second half uh he really performed well down the stretch uh in a way that I think Brady Martin did as well i think in terms of second half scoring in the CHL he’s one of the most improved players uh in the entire CHL for draft elig eligibles I should say um I think that even though they got smoked in the first round of the OHL playoffs a little bit of a gentleman’s sweep if I recall correctly I thought that he was pretty uh pretty heroic in his efforts to keep his team in the fight uh and filling in the gaps when there were when there were low points during that series so then he goes to the U8s where general manager J Bill Armstrong is actually in attendance i think the higher the pick is in the draft the more uh the general manager has a say in things i don’t know how much time general manager Bill Armstrong spent in Monton this year probably none um but I do know that he was definitely in Texas watching Brady Martin flip that tournament on its head uh hitting everything in sight and just playing like the absolute bastard that Bill Armstrong wants to add to the lineup um especially with all the helium that uh that uh Sam Bennett has currently and all the brand equity for these sort of hard-nosed uh second line centers these days in the NHL in this copycat league i have to think our GM is drooling a little bit watching that tournament so I’m thinking that’s my wild card for it is is potentially somebody like Brady Martin at fourth overall uh so can I ask so those are your kind of your three options that you have at that pick um again so that means that you are you know willing to take Brady Martin over say a Porter Martone an Anton Fondelle um what do you what do you see that are you know kind of maybe the red flags that are kind of holding holding you guys back on maybe picking one of those two guys they might walk right up and pick either one of them i don’t know um I like them both right i do like Porter Martone but I think that Martona kind of depends on what night you watched him right um he’s got some consistency issues to say the least shift to shift game to game and freaking week to week right i joked on our podcast that it’s almost like you have three dice right one of them’s like uh Matthew Kachchuck uh the other one’s like Eric Daz and the other one’s like Hugh Jessimon right and then you have either then you have either like one reference oh my god I love it then you have like then you have like one two or three and then you have shift game or days right and then you just roll them and you’re like “Oh you might get Matthew Kachock for three shifts.” Uh or you might get Hugh Jim for three days um you don’t really quite know what you’re going to get with Porter Martone that said he is his team captain team Canada loves him um I thought his playoffs were a good statement for him um I’ve seen some consistency come in there he’s going to go to college and get good strength and conditioning program uh instilled and play against a higher level of competition where he won’t be able to get away with bad junior habits like an inconsistent motor that he’s demonstrated so you can project him to be a person who doesn’t really have those red flags anymore if you want to look into your crystal ball a little bit but for me watching OHL games uh on TV from Phoenix um I saw too many things that made me say “hm” in his game that I didn’t really see with Brady Martin who’s a little bit more of a consistent menace um really same complaint about Fondell uh that you know he didn’t show very well at the U8s or in some of the bigger moments um I believe his ice time was cut as Juard was in the promotion round to move up to the SHL uh not necessarily a great sign though pretty good that he was there to begin with given that he’s a draft eligible and a young one at that uh I think that his uh tournament in Fris probably left a bad taste in the mouth of a manager who was there um and I think additionally with him while he is a center I think the strength of his game being that massive one-timer that’s something that we’ve already got Dylan Gunther doing on PP1 and Will for the foreseeable we just added Tia Ginland last summer so he’s kind of a long-term option there as a trigger man as well and I wonder even if Anton Fondell is a center five on five he’s probably gonna play that role on a power play that won’t really be available to him in Utah so how much does that limit his effectiveness and production in the long term and he might be a better fit somewhere else not going to lie I didn’t expect a Hugh Jessimon reference from me okay that was that was awesome i still remember I’ll never forget watching that draft i was still still a kid watching at my parents’ basement and Perry Maguire they call him huge specimen and I’m like “Oh my god make that joke i’ll never forget.” Um Cory Perry went in the late 20s with that draft that was a great reference now okay I like I love that you said Brady Martin he is going to be spoiler alert probably this the biggest riser for M and Boyce’s final list um if I have any say about it which I have at at least half so um Brady Martin I thought like God I don’t give I don’t [ __ ] care if he only scores 50 points i don’t care cuz like look at Sam Bennett and And you know it’s funny it’s funny that you you brought him up as a potential target because I tweeted that out earlier this afternoon and I’m going through my final watch right and and I’m doing my centers this week and I watch Hagens last time I watched Martin i’m like got to watch me watch Higgins again watch Martin and I’m like well [ __ ] me if this guy wouldn’t do more things to help me win at the end of the day and then of course game one comes on and I’m like yeah okay like this guy this Brady Martin is in about like of the 24 forward sponsors Brady Martin in about 16 of them um on the two teams that are left in the finals right what in terms of style of play or tenacity or or whatever it is physicality and he’s not the biggest business do you know what Brady Martin’s doing this summer I saw him post today and I like I hope he’s staying home to farm during the draft rather than going to the draft So that’s I just I just want to be careful here i just want to be careful here but in the OHL because someone got suspended for saying this but I’m pretty sure he is a Menanite so that’s why he’s farming but be careful because I might get suspended for that if I was in the OL well other people farm too come on we’re not here to attack especially the I’m not attacking him that’s awesome so here’s the thing here’s the thing they’ll never know the fact that he’s the fact that he’s willing to stay home from the draft to farm with his parents he’s like “Oh well my family couldn’t leave anyway so I spend the draft with them and do a little farming while we’re at it.” Like how is this guy not going to win a Stanley Cup at some point in his career like so and the you have a few elite talents in the draft and I have a real hard time passing on Porter Marone at fourth look I think Dana is firmly he’s third on my list he’s third on Boyce’s list he’s third on your list i think he’s going to Chicago um I kind of don’t want him to though no me neither because they don’t the Chicago fans you don’t appreciate this is a sidebar you don’t appreciate Caleb Dana i we’re since we’re friends with with the Dawn uh we’re we’re deep we’re deep in the throws of the Chicago Blackhawks Twitter world and the Caleb Dway hatred like the anti- Dane rhetoric’s got to stop because you guys would be lucky to have him anyways Porter Marone big massive guy but you guys have your wingers right and that’s maybe where that debate comes into play i don’t think Hagens is the fit for you because I think it’s more of the same um despite his obvious talent I think um I think he can book a one-way ticket to Nashville um is you know that that would be a really good fit there i’m going to throw one more name out there that I don’t really necessarily think is a realistic pick at four however it would fit the mold of what they’ve been trying to do and it would shore up something that’s obviously very important and despite the lack of offense you you’ve shown a willingness to take a guy that early with Simiche so what about Ratam Mertka big MKA fan yeah we had Sam Cosantino on our show after the uh after the Helinka and Mka and Fiddler were both kind of circled twice on my list for Utah at that point uh that was before the season of course and things have changed there uh I think with Murka he’d be definitely right in their wheelhouse in terms of what they like you have uh as you said Simichev big mobile guy defense first player what we’re all hoping is going to be uh the the Russian slaven right um if if if everything turns out right so I could see MKA being you know on the right side and Simish on the left um it’s not too redundant there what I would say is they did just commit to Shawn Dury long term on a six-year deal um he’s a player that you kind of had to have watched over the last couple of seasons to gain an appreciation for because he missed so much time and he kind of came from nowhere a little bit but they obviously believe in him with that big contract so that’s on your right side there then they’ve already invested a first round pick in Maverick Lamra who’s like banging on the door to get let back into the NHL playing great in Tucson so that’s another right-hand shot and then Michael Kessle ring and the fleecing of the century we got for free from uh Edmonton for Nick Bug’s dad who ended up resigning with the team anyway in the summer so we just got a free Michael Kessle ring from the Oilers uh he’s a big Yeah fan favorite and asset management specialist Nick Bugstad yeah that’s right so we’ve got uh we’ve got Michael Kathering on the right side too is a big 64 player uh friend of the show by the way we had him on and the very next night he had a Gordy How hat-tick in Buffalo if you can believe that so we’re going to go ahead and say that’s the clean hits bump so we love the Kessle King in Utah as well another right-hand shot and then Thomas Lavois had a season of a lifetime after being a a top QMH QMJHL pick with a somewhat disappointing draft season fell to Utah in the third and is now looking much more like that player that went first overall in the Q draft than that player who went in the third round to Utah so that’s another big right-hand shot defenseman so most of these may not be the caliber of uh of of of MKA but they’re all pretty darn solid uh and they all are pretty darn close so I would think that if you’re going to go with need the need is probably at center um and I think the need is the tiebreaker so even if they were really really really high on Murka uh the odds of them being so high on him that they have him so far ahead of one or more centers who are available at pick four I think are pretty low no and and and that’s and that’s fair and for for me like the guys that we’re talking about here I think those would be and and be before yesterday I would not have even included Martin as high as fourth overall discussion it would have been whoever’s left between Dane and Marton for me regardless of the fact that Marton’s not a center I think um he just fits so well into into team philosophy that you just take him and you figure it out later um but yeah Martin would be Martin’s right there for me now that I’ve done my my final review i I can’t find a damn thing I don’t like about him other than the fact that he can’t stick handle like Ziggers but Ziggers is no [ __ ] good so like give me Brady Martin all day long do you have any final thoughts on the first uh first round selection before we move on to what they might have I have a question for him um I was asked this question yesterday about a different team so I’m going to ask you this is there any sense that Utah could be looking to move up move down or they just you really think they’re just going to make the pick where they are yeah I could see them moving up they took Michael Mis out to dinner uh night before last I think um I think they’re within striking distance of a potential franchise altering selection and Michael Misa in a way that they probably won’t be that close to a talent like that again for some time given uh how the rebuild is going and where they finished the season last year so I think they’d be crazy not to at least explore the opportunity to move up a tier in this draft uh if you ascribe to the philosophy that Schaefer and Misa are in a tier and then everybody else is in some other tier uh which is how I view things so I would not be surprised if they were looking at some of the immense capital they’ve built up over the years they have three second round picks next year as an example as well u and those picks are there to be traded that was a war chest he established years ago people were laughing why is he picking up second rounders that are three years away well this is why uh they’re ready to turn a corner they have a better idea of what their needs are and I’m sure they’re ready to deal those picks the question is just whether there’s a willing partner in the Islanders or the Sharks uh to move all the way back to four uh just for additional futures assets which feels like a little bit of a long shot to me uh there is tons of speculation out there that Utah is looking to make a big big move this summer a lot of people are talking about Mitch Marner they’re linking them to all the big trade rumors that are coming around some of which are kind of silly like Robertson and Fetchnikov you know things that probably won’t happen but um they did pull off the huge blockbuster last draft where they acquired Mikuel Sergev and then like five minutes later John Marino uh and they gave up deer dear assets to do that right assets that are on the screen here geeky Moser um three different second round picks went in those two deals so they obviously are not afraid to swing big there’s a glaring hole up front when it comes to scoring they’re knocking on the door of the playoffs last year they were in it till the last week um and it’s a new market with a new name a new owner who’s got lots of money to spend um and he may be uh hammering the desk pounding for uh some big trade acquisition so I would not be surprised to see them trade out either uh I think the least likely scenario is them trading down just because the pick volume they’ve had they’ve already had to let Justin Kipky walk unsigned because there was no spot for him um I think there’s more prospects that they’re going to lose that they would have preferred to keep um that’s going to be you know Utah’s trash will be some other team’s treasure because there’s going to be some decent kids they’re going to lose I think um so I don’t think they’re looking for more pick volume so I think of those situations uh stick and pick is obviously the most likely i would say uh trading out or trading up are much more likely than trading down it is interesting because Misa actually does look like he fits your roster quite well and that hasn’t really been at all maybe discussed in the mainstream at all as an actual option darren Misa would fit anyone’s roster he would fit this one really well though yes like that’s again of course he would fit anyone’s roster well this is a team that has an opening at center that can give him the minutes that he needs and this team’s actually realistically close to being pretty good it’s it’s he’s not going he wouldn’t be going to I hate to say it the Hawks here where it’s you know a little bit more of a process here he could go to the Islanders i think this is a kind of a better situation the Islanders to me though so I mean if if that’s a possibility Yeah it’s it’s almost like when uh the Stars moved all the way up to what was it three maybe to get Mero Heiskin and Heiskin got to walk right on to basically a playoff team right away they were contending not long after so uh one of those lucky lucky breaks that if you’re within striking distance of a talent like that you you’d have to explore it now your second round pick is 46th overall I believe yep which Russian are you going to take this year kban Limitov probably yes would be my guess yeah if they were going to pick one Russian I would guess it’ probably be Lamontov um or uh Procarov perhaps you know uh would be another option there uh the guy I’ve got my eye on maybe circled twice is Vaklav Nestil not a Russian he’s a check but he’s another massive check just like Michael Robble and he’s going to UMass with Robble uh I personally have a few signability concerns with Robble i’m a little nervous he talked about earning his degree in his post-draft interview he’s at UMass he’s already played two seasons he’s going into his third i’m a little nervous so you add Nestrasil who just played in the USL like Robble did he’s going to UMass with Robble their countrymen i’m like come on you know we just saw Boot and Simichev come over as a package deal can we use our little uh second round pick here to grab another massive check to kind of hook the other one in and we’ll get a two for one deal on this i like that idea a lot not a bad strategy and those are me and Boy talked about that and those are literally all the all the names that we came up with now we we feel that we feel that most of those guys might already be gone by that pick but Procarov was the guy that we kind of settled on as as I literally have him at 46 and and he’s got like he’d be a perfect guy to take a swing on because if if he pans out you’re looking at like a real tough to contain menace of a of a player and you guys got the picks you got the picks to burn like you said like 2026 2027 look at that right there 20 picks between the next two years they’ve got a full extra draft class at their disposal um to work with and take shots on guys with some with some really high upside if he’s there would be a phenomenal pick I think he might be gone but um geez we we might have to we might have to poach you and just bring you into the puck bunker full time you you like the same guys that we do that’s a good sign Yeah yeah i think some some other options now if those guys all go early that means other guys went later than you thought right so if Nestrasil and and and Limitov and and Procarov all go higher then maybe a few guys drop maybe a guy like Will Horov a guy like Shane Vanzagi or maybe a guy like Mason West i could see all three of those being firmly on Utah’s radar as well so I guess I have a followup here you’re talking about because they have so many prospects and so many picks coming up if we’re talking about them moving up maybe it’s more prudent that they would move up maybe into the end of the first round somewhere for a guy that they would like um they they did that for Bodwin yeah they moved up for Bodwin yeah so is there is there any is there anyone around maybe mid20s that you would be interested in you think are you kidding me there’s the one name the one boyer bill wild Bills on is who we want in the 20s are you kidding me there’s only one name that’s the one we want Bills on it yes let’s move up do like we did for Bo Dwan and walk away from this draft with Brady Martin Bills on and the funnest class uh of any team in 2026 i would like to be on record that we were the first outlet of anyone that covers a draft to rank him as a firstrounder and we never had him outside of our top 20 all year bill’s the man he’s going to look great in an Ottawa Senator’s uniform get this bills on in the Utah propaganda out of my face i think in any any pod mock a podcast mock that we’ve done it’s been one of us that’s picked him yeah I could see it i could see it i love Bill Sonnet i do there was a while there where I was trying to convince myself I liked him better than Shustan Carbano uh I ended up not being able to get there but uh I do like a lot our very our very last episode focused on on just that um episode 39 we did a head-to-head Zhan verse Carbono um and we each picked a side and that was a fun debate so good for bringing that up uh spoiler alert uh I have Zan higher uh oh yeah I’ve got that one bookmarked Rocco i saw that one today i I’ve got it bookmarked yeah so I’ll be in the comments beating you guys up on that one uh if Zonan’s gone already because the Senators did some voodoo and and stole him away from us and we trade up um Braden Coots is another guy that I think would be really fun to add to Brady Martin imagine getting Brady Martin and Braden Coots in the same draft that’d be pretty crazy in terms of culture builders and high motor players and just adding a little Energizer Bunny element to your future roster really if you got two guys that wear a letter for Team Canada the UA teams I think I think you’re coming out all right boy boyer what were you gonna say there sorry i was just saying it really improves their center depth too like really quickly um and Coutas kind of like Martin he kind of just played in a situation where it just wasn’t a lot around him uh so the point totals could have been a little bit better just you know with who was there uh now I did want to follow up on the Harabo thing coots and Bodway would make a hell of a tandem down the road on your on your either your second or third line like that with Josh Stone Josh Don there with him too i mean talk about a high motor yeah that’d be crazy well let’s put Zan Martin and Josh Don on one line see how that goes let’s do it no Zan zonan Martin and and Gunther actually anyways I I wanted to follow up on your goalending situation because I would say that your NHL team is more of a tandem type situation uh Harabo I think is the best prospect though you do have some interesting guys tin’s interesting um would you guys maybe do you think that maybe they would target a goalie with that second round pick at all is that something they would look at yeah sure i could see it yeah I I I don’t think it would probably be anyone who’s under six foot uh much to the chagrin of Steven Ellis who was singing the praises of the othersized goalenders on our podcast earlier this week but I could see him picking Medvidev or somebody like that an eye roll we’re uh we’re big proponents of the bigger size goalies on this show so uh we’re the opposite yeah we uh we we we we heard Ellis wax poetic uh about his man Ivan Kovic which I kind of appreciate you know I get a little nostalgic i think about Zerbe and some of those scrappy little goalenders of my youth and I look at Ivan Kovic and I’m like damn I wish we lived in a world where there was a place for him i’m just skeptical that we do so like I like I think like Ravensburg and will be gone by that pick but both the Russians again you guys have no problem taking Russians and I think there’s two really good Russian prospect goalies here that would really fit for you guys because you guys do need I feel like you do need some goalies at least in the system that you’re confident in uh so to me that was kind of a target I was looking at there and we by the way on that previous podcast we had also heard that you know you guys probably look for goalies that are above not even six feet maybe 61 62 so well Michael Robb’s 6 foot 100 uh is how Ellis described him yeah so um if Harabo the Chuck burns you just dropped Pardell the Slovak and you just switch sides on that little equation and there you go i I thought about it he’s sort of the bizarro Robble right the the the Robble from another mother right prodel yeah I can see it uh I think I think you’re right on the money there Boyer i think we could definitely use the help in the goalending pipeline uh it’s nice to have Tin and and Robble but you need more because goalies are kind of voodoo so I think Spray and Prey is a good philosophy with that make sure you’re peppering them in there because you never know which ones are going to turn out i like that um cool let’s move on from from the draft uh stuff i think that covers I mean you got the third and fourth but I mean that’s generally just best player available you’re taking guys that um that your team just generally likes now actually I’ll give you a chance to touch on that before we move on is there anyone that is ranked outside of what would be the typical top 50 or 60 or 70 players that you think is a very deep sleeper um that would be a great fit that has a chance to to make a contribution long term for these guys much the same like Liierberg is starting to do as a mid to late round pick yeah uh I’ve got a couple that I’ve noticed that I thought seem like they might be right up Utah’s alley in terms of what they like to look for i think one is Shamar Moses um who probably has a pretty limited upside in terms of you know top six or top nine but uh could be uh a useful NHL player at some point given the way that he plays so Shamar Moses is one that stood out to me uh and then also uh let’s see um man deep cuts let’s see have you have you watched William Bell at all no no there there there’s one to look for he’s a rough and rough and tumble [ __ ] that would fit right into your team’s philosophy I think but that that was one guy i want Ottawa to take him too so all right we’ll leave him for Ottawa uh I like Tyler Hopkins what I saw from him uh down the stretch so I think Tyler Hopkins could be another good pickup for us um another goalie I had circled was Felbergs Leonard’s Felbergs uh maybe not as a second rounder but maybe as a third or a fourth kind of guy um yeah Hayden Papanis perhaps uh is another potential option as a larger center who’s more of a long-term project he’s uh uh in Colona now with Tigla for the Memorial Cup season next year so uh they might have a little bit of an inside track there this would be a good spot for uh my deep Russian here rocco Bogden Pastratzovv i was going to say Pstratzovv and and Roman Bows would both be guys that would that would that would fit that that might be available in the in the mid rounds me and Boyce have a little little bit of a guilty affinity for the for the dark arts of the hockey world you know the the Russian prospects we we we feel they’re massively undervalued uh and you can typically find great deals on on uh on draft selections from there and the the NHL is such a fun league to watch too it’s an absolute circus it’s a gong show you know i mean the disperate levels of talents and competition in that league are crazy and it makes for some really weird scenarios but it’s it’s fun to watch that’s the hardest thing for me about watching that league is is making sure you don’t get too excited when a when a mediocre prospect beats up on one of the like one of the teams up in like the frozen tundra that come down once a month to play a hockey game um but it is it is a fun league to watch it’s not not short on entertainment value now you know who taught me that lesson was uh Ivan Dowovski you guys remember him didky ivan Dowski never got drafted anyway Damo uh I don’t even remember yeah I I was I was sure that this was the future uh third line energy uh player in the NHL he never even got drafted yeah so what are we uh what are you looking for for Armstrong and company to try to do here in the offseason so let’s say you get your draft you get um maybe you get either Martin or or Dane uh and or Marton and you’re addressing a need up front someone that you can plug into your top six for the next decade or so ideally um you get a quality player in the second round um more of a complimentary piece now you have a good draft what’s the offseason plan that makes you a happy camper going into training camp they’ve talked a lot about all the money they want to spend um and how it’s playoffs are bust this year they gave themselves some grace and said they wanted to be in it until the end they were mission accomplished there i think they’ve reset their expectations and it’s playoffs are bust uh they’ve made they’ve been chest thumping out in the market about uh the big swings they’re going to make so I think if they end up with a center um they might go big on a winger um whether that’s a giant blockbuster for somebody totally unexpected or someone who would have been seen as inconceivable like Fetchnikov or Robertson or somebody like that uh just a few months ago um or some other name like that i could see them take a swing on at at Winger uh Mitch Martner’s name continues to come up with Utah as well i know everybody’s putting their hat in the ring there he’s again I’m a little skeptical about that with Kulie and and Keller already on the top line is there really room for Mitch Mner down the stretch when you have all these other pieces you’re going to want to sign um three and five and six yeah exactly so I’m not sure if Mner’s the way to go if they do end up drafting a winger or a defenseman like Marton or Murka I can see them going all in on Marco Rossi the Ottawa 67’s favorite of head coach Andre Tyranny uh who’s always sung his praises and uh has described him I believe as the perfect hockey player previously so I could see them uh really taking a big swing on Marco Rossi potentially as a more of a long-term center fit um and then if they uh go winger or D at the draft rossy’s interesting rossy smaller guy though that’s my only thing that’s my only thing with with him is can like it takes a rare is he is he braiden point is he because otherwise it’s going to be tough to win um a championship with with him as as as your first or second line center that’s that’s my only thing and I I love the player because he does bring Look he controls everything he can other than other than being small right um if you if if he was 6’4 he might just be right up there with with the Barovs and the Copitars of the world and that might be a a fair comparison for the coach to put on him like that but um that’s an that’s an interesting one any chance that Sam Bennett could uh you know take his Stanley Cup ring and keep his climate and move to a little more key place or or are you guys not quite uh is that maybe not the fit that might lure him um to Utah yeah I mean if he gets another ring and he’s looking to get paid Utah has the money to make it happen and I think that general manager Bill Armstrong uh has been on record many times talking about how free agent day is the day that you lose um there’s no winners on free agent day uh he’s talked a lot about the fact that you don’t want to sign pieces that keep you from winning when you’re actually ready to win he said that as good as Logan Culie and Dylan Gunther are uh one thing you can’t sign on free agency is a time machine to suddenly make them 25 years old that their window for actual contention is not coming for a few more years so what you don’t want to do is sign somebody who’s 31 or 32 or 33 to a four-year deal um and all they do is hold you back once you have actually hit your contention window so I think that right now they’re looking for pieces to help them get into the playoffs and it’s a few years away from looking for those pieces to help them get through the playoffs i think Sam Bennett is decidedly a through the playoffs type piece and what they need is a to the playoffs type piece so if they draft a center like Caleb Denoier or Brady Martin I would look for them to bring in more of a placeholder center whether that’s free agency with John Tavvarz or Matthew Shane who would both qualify as big swings or whether they do something a little bit more uh mild like bring in Ross Colton from Colorado who’s suddenly a little bit lost on their depth chart uh or maybe they look at Vegas who wants to switch things up and has everybody tied to a no move or no trade other than William Carlson who has maybe a five or six team or something so maybe they can uh grab Carlson to keep spot warm for a few years uh while he uh plays out the the the rest of his contract so I think if you pick a center you probably don’t need to go out and spend a million dollars on a center not a million dollars a billion dollars on a center you will want to spend at least a million um but you’ll uh maybe bring in a smaller more placeholder piece i can see Duchain uh looking to get paid he took some discounts he’s moved around a bit he might be looking for some stability uh I think with everything that’s going on in Dallas and his performance they’re probably going to look to move on um I think Duchain would be a great fit for a three-year option here in Utah while we wait for DO or Martin don’t mind that at all i like that Carlson idea if he’s available if they’re trying to move money i mean might be able to get him might be able to get him for cheap and they they’ve got the nice thing is 20 picks in the next two years that they can go through this draft make their picks and then still have an abundance of things and there’s look there there’s deals to be had when top teams are up against the cap and also looking to find ways to get better so um if Armstrong can take advantage of that that that’d be huge uh boy do you have any any last questions um for Trent no I’m good i’m just I’m just really interested in this William Carlson to Utah idea now i think I think that’s the best fit of everyone that he said because that’s a guy who does everything really well he’s kind of undervalued how good he actually is knows how to win he knows how to win and you have younger guys who kind of need that those habits that he has uh I like also Vegas is going to need a million picks to trade later yeah exactly so he would be he’d be a great fit for those younger guys he’d be a placeholder there and you know it would just I think it would really help you guys get to the playoffs too because he can match up a lot of you know against the you know higher level centerman in the league okay last one trent prediction time i got I got a $100 to put on the fourth overall pick who is going to Utah prediction not wish falls for four darren who’s going to Utah i also think Deno is going to Utah as well i don’t think the Hawks are going to take him i think Denway is going to be gone one way or the other porter Martone ends up ends up in Utah and they just they they figure out a center they’ve got enough pieces um you collect assets at the draft and and you you trade and sign into a championship contender um either way Trent this has been great thank you so much for joining us uh once you get through the legitimate draft analysts on your show we’re happy to hop on oh come on now happy to hop on as well um are are you willing to come back on here after the after the draft in the first week of free agency and we’ll we’ll see what Utah did and and follow up on this chat yeah I’d love to I’d love to come back on in in July and I’d love to have you guys on either before or after the draft for predictions or reactions that’d be great yeah that’s that sounds awesome thanks so much for your time uh we appreciate you sorting the time zone out with us um thanks as always both of you guys have a great weekend see you see you guys

This episode is an absolute Mammoth, as we talk all things Utah with the Co-Host of @CleanHitsHockey, Trent Hess. Topics include past draft history & analysis, current team needs, targets with the 4th overall pick in the 2025 NHL Draft, targets with the 46th overall pick, some late-round Sleepers, as well as analysis of what a successful offseason might look like for General Manager Bill Armstrong. Hosted by Rocco Zappia & Darren Boyce
Players discussed in this episode include Caleb Desnoyers, Brady Martin, Porter Marton, Anton Frondell, James Hagens, Michael Misa, Matthew Schaefer, Radim Mrtka, Daniil Prokhorov, Kurban Limatov, Will Horcoff, Shane Vansaghi

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