State of the Green Bay Packers Defense Revisited – Mr. Irrelevant Ep. 274
Yeah, the Friday edition Mr. Relevant. Away we go here on Mr. Relevant. I’m Alex Drove with you from the Gerber Law Offices. One call that’s studio downtown Milwaukee on this Friday. I’m still on vacation. So, we’re still looking back at state of the Packers 2025. If you missed this conversation, you’re a Packers fan though, don’t go anywhere because this is the place for you. We’re going to take a look today with Jason Wy of Wy and Touch, Gabe Knitel, Jen, Gabe, and Chewy from our state of the Packers 2025 program a couple of weeks ago at Summerfest. Actually, that was just long last weekend. It feels like it was forever ago. Um, state of the defensive line obviously in terms of the pass game last year, not great for the Packers, right? Rashawn Gary, Lucas Vaness, Kenny Clark, Devonte Wyatt, they struggled to get sacks last year. good in the run game. An upgrade from Joe Bailey when he was the defensive coordinator in year one under Jeff Hafley, but a rough year. Can they turn it around in year two? The linebackers, I think this is the position group to have the most buzz and excitement about, right? Quay Walker is a guy who I’m still holding that hope for. It’s seeming like he’s starting to put it together. Edan Cooper blasted onto the scene as a rookie. He was awesome. Isaiah McDuffy is back. And then Isaiah Simmons, Jason Wely has an interesting nugget in state of the linebacker on him. kind of an under the radar signing for the Packers this off seasonason. A guy who was a top 10 pick, can be a versatile piece, can play all over the field. He Jason on him is going to be much better than I am, but he’s a guy that intrigues me. And then state of the defensive backfield. You feel great about the safeties. Corner might be another story, although one of us on the panel feels very good about where this cornerback room is at. That is all ahead. It is state of the defense time right here on Mr. Irrelevant. It’s time now to take a look at the state of the defense and we will start with the state of the defensive line coming off of a rather rough season in year one under defensive coordinator Jeff Halfley. They make a change at defensive line coach this offseason. Demarcus Coington the new defensive line coach for the Green Bay Packers. But other than that, we’re running it back. No additions in the draft, at least meaningful additions in the draft until day three. No free agent signings. No trade for Trey Hendrickson or TJ Watt. It’s Rashawn Garry. It’s Kenny Clark. Devonte Wyatt who they picked up the fifth year option on this off season and it’s Lucas Vaness. The state of the defensive line is a scary one Gabriel. Yeah, it’s bad. It’s not good. It’s not good because you’re paying your best pass rusher probably a little too much money because he just couldn’t live up to the potential that he showed, you know, and and it’s scary to think that the the best he was was coming so close off that ACL because he had he he he vaulted up the year coming off the ACL right on Thanksgiving. He had nine sacks. Nine sacks. Mhm. Then nothing the rest of the year that year. Last year he only ends up getting eight sacks. Yes. He gets his first Pro Bowl uh you know nomination and nod, but he’s not good enough. Kenny Clark now we know there were some injury issues with him. He wasn’t good enough. Um and Lucas Vaness just he’s been disappointing through two years. And I know that he when they drafted him, much like Rashawn Garry, it was okay. This guy has a lot of the physical tools that you need to be a really good pass rusher. He just didn’t have the actual ability and they were hoping they could coach that into him. And yes, I know he was dealing with a thumb injury, but there’s no excuse to me for being a top 15 pick in this league and getting blocked on multiple occasions one-on-one by a tight end. And that happened a couple of times last year. In fact, he had as many sacks as Keshan Nixon had. They both had three last season. So, I I I don’t have a lot of hope for that group. I think they did a pretty good job against the run, which is something that we always harped on when when Joe Barry was the was the defensive coordinator. I think that schematically switching to the 4-3 certainly helped I think in that area, but at the end of the day, the teams that are the best can get pressure with four and this group cannot do that. Yeah, you saw what the Eagles were able to do against the Packers offense. There was an opportunity in that game with as rusty which was part of the equation that their quarterback was the defense held the Eagles to 16 points for three plus quarters of the game. Uh but they the Packers could not protect Love. They obviously had the injury to Elton Jenkins. But it is a gamecher when you can get pressure with four. It gives you so much more flexibility in the back end. Now to Jeff Halfley’s credit and this is one of the story lines of the season. He figured out a way to be a really good defense in spite of not getting that. They And the worst part of their sack numbers is that they’re so misleading because they got so many of them in just a handful of games that they actually make it look like they had a decent year. They finished tied for eighth in actual number of sacks, but I think nine were against Tennessee. Like you just they weren’t good enough. And and look, Rashan Garry, whether it’s fair or not, Rashan Garry and Lucas Vaness when you’re picked 12th overall and 13th overall, when you get the $96 million contract that Rashan Garry received, then if you if the expectations are higher for you, there’s no there’s no two ways about it. And you can say, well, you can’t just measure their impact by sacks. Nobody says that about Trey Hendrickson. Nobody says that about Miles Garrett. Nobody says that about TJ Watts. How come the highest paid guys are the ones that have the most sacks? Yeah. Well, not all of them. Mean this. And so, look, I you know, I I think, you know, Rashan Garary talked about his Pro Bowl nomination. Uh, again, I I I’m sorry, but I don’t see that as a legitimate measure of where he’s at in terms of being a field tilting player, which is what they need him. If you good, he’s a good player. He’s a good player, but he’s and and this is something that Chewy talks about, and it’s one of my favorite points he always makes when it’s when he’s talking about football teams. In order to have a successful season, you need your A players to play like A players. Bingo. He’s an A player. He is being paid and is being expected to be an A player. And realistically, he’s a B player. Yep. which is which is fine. You know, obviously you’re going to have B players. You’re not going to have A players everywhere. But when you’re playing when you’re being paid to be an A player, you’re expected to be an A player and you play like a B player. Now, somebody else has to make up for that. And they they haven’t had anybody that’s been able to do that on the interior. Could this be Kenny Clark’s last season as a Packer? Oh, it absolutely could be. Mhm. For sure. And and look, you know, it Kenny did not say anything about his foot issue. He was on the injury report, but he always played. Didn’t miss a game. Yep. Um and again, Kenny, we love to tease Kenny. Um because he still hasn’t celebrated his 30th birthday yet, but that is going to occur in, I believe, October. And what do we know about Gudy and 30-year-old players? What do we know about Guty and third contracts? He got one of those because he was so young when he entered the league. But look, they they need Devonte Wyatt to play like a first round pick. And in fairness to Devonte Wyatt, he played like one for like the first four games and he hurt his ankle against the Vikings and he was just never the same player and then he was finally starting to look like he was maybe recapturing that and then their season ended in Philadelphia. So, you know, he’s another one of those I talked earlier about this dozen or so guys. Him and Quay Walker, who I know we’ll get to when we get to linebackers. those guys. You know, in my little cheat code on my 20 most important Packers, I’m telling you right now, I put those two together because they both were first round picks that are in Quay’s case entering the final year of his contract. He didn’t get the fifth year option. And in Devonte Wyatt’s case, he wouldn’t have gotten one either if it wasn’t for his being far less expensive than what Quay Walkers was. So, both of those guys, again, they have to do more. And that’s I think that’s almost the theme Gabe of this team is that they got a lot of good players that have to be more than just how good they’ve been. They go and that’s to me that’s Ryan Gutakun has done a good job of drafting really solid players like really good I mean starters across the league right and and even if you don’t pay Shawn Ryan like somebody else is going to pay Shawn Ryan not the way that um you know Josh Meyers got paid in a one-year deal. Someone’s going to give you know Ryan or Walker. Yeah. He’ll get starter money. Yeah. Like so so that’s good, but you also need to have a bunch of good players don’t win Super Bowls. And this has always been my big problem. And and you need more stars. Packers lack stars right now. And when you have opportunities to draft as early as they did when they got Rashawn Kerry, when they got Lucas Vaness, I’m not saying you have to hit both of them because that’s tough, but you got to hit one of them. And and that’s been and that’s now you’re chasing right now. You’re going, “Oh, they have to trade for TJ Watt. Why aren’t they calling, you know, Cincinnati for Trey Hendrickson with an X? So, it’s it’s a situation where you didn’t hit those. It’s a niche joke, but a good one. If you read Murphy takes five on Packers.com today, you would understand that. But to your to your point, yeah, I’m I’m looking at at this group as a whole and and I do believe that Gudy on balance cuz not everyone they don’t hit every single pick. That’s an impossible standard. Ron Wolf is in the Hall of Fame and his first round picks, the Ross Verbas and the John Michaels’s, uh, even Craig Nuome, like there weren’t great first round picks. He was unbelievable in the third round, which is not where Goody had been unbelievable, but look, all of his misses that were high-profile picks, like look, Jier Alexander was not a miss. Nope. But Eric Stokes was. Yes. Right. Which is why you have to sign Nate Hobbs. uh second round picks. Josh Meyers played a lot of games for you, but clearly not well enough for you to want him on your team anymore. That’s why you go out and sign Aaron Banks. So, that’s a miss. Uh at running back, it’s great that Aaron Jones was as productive as he was cuz he saved your bacon. Not on your major cheeseburger, though, cuz you don’t have that. But AJ Dylan was supposed to be your back of the future. You missed on him. That’s why you signed Josh Jacobs. You missed on uh Darnell Savage. That’s why you sign Xavier McKini. Now, what’s great about Gudy is that unlike Ted, he uses free agency to fill in for his misses. But when you make picks that are on your team that you don’t move on from, and they’re still not home run swings like the two edge rushers, that’s why the pressure is on both those guys this season. I think that’s really well said. It’s a good answer. Yes, it was. Good answer. Good answer, guys. What is that? Family feud indeed. Um, if one guy on the defensive line reaches superstardom level this year, who is it? Rashan Garry. Uh, no. I think the ship sailed. Rashan Gary is who he is. Uh, my my my best hope I think is Devonte Wyatt. I think he’s the one who’s flashed the most at this point and obviously they we’ll get this with Quay Walker. They picked up the fifthear option. Mhm. So obviously they still have hope that what they saw last year, he can translate that into a more consistent season should he be able to stay healthy. Kingsley and Ibar, he’s my sneaky little guy that could get cuz he’s in a contract year too, I believe, right? A guy who gets kind of a lowerriced deal because he’s having a really good start to the season. about twothirds of the way through the year, he signs something and he ends up being him and Carl Brooks are the two guys. Oh, I like Carl Brooks. That are guys that I like Carl Brooks aren’t top 15 picks. You don’t make the playoffs without Carl Brooks last year. That’s true. Carl Brooks middle finger. You’re 0 and6 in the NFC North without Carl Brooks. Wow. That’s I don’t you know what? I don’t want to think about that. state of the linebackers. Quay Walker, who you mentioned last segment, Jason, entering the final year of his rookie contract, did not get the fifth year option picked up. So, a crucial season for him. It is year two for Edin Cooper, who I think many of us view as potentially an up andcoming superstar for this Packers defense. Isaiah McDuffy’s back uh for the linebackers. He will fill in as a depth piece for them, a nice depth piece for them. But it’s really about those first two guys, Quay Walker and Edin Cooper at linebacker. Pretty good duo between Quay Walker and Edin Cooper, I’d say. I mean, one of them’s good. One of them’s good. Quay Walker is somebody, and I know Jen has fallen in love with the tools, right? He’s big. He’s physical. He’s fast. And I understand if you’re a Packers fan that feels that same way as Jen does on Jen, Gabe, and Chewy from from 7:00 to 9 Monday through Friday. But the production has not matched up to what again he’s got a lot of that potential. He flashes it at times, but also there’s so many times where he just guesses and guesses wrong. Running up to fill a hole and next thing you know, the running backs, oh, there he goes. There goes Saquon again. Yeah. And for me, for for Quay Walker, the actions are speaking louder than the words for the Green Bay Packers cuz yes, they did not pick up the fifthear option, but Goody was also saying, “Oh man, but we will, you know, he factors into our future plans. we want to sign him to an extension. All right. When’s that extension coming? And there hasn’t really been much talk of it since goody brought that up. So much like some of these other guys that have potentially waiting for extensions, I I have to believe that it’s not happening. I don’t know if the price was too much and and and Quay was asking for too much, but obviously based on their actions, the Packers aren’t as of right now looking at Quay Walker as a future piece of this defense. You seem frustrated with the financial department of the Green Bay Packers. No, I’m not f No, when it comes to Quay Walker, I mean, Gabe Ball, I mean, again, with Goody, you just have to kind of parse through what he says, you know. Oh, hey, if Aaron Jones, no doubt he’s going to be around, I guess not. So, you have to parse through what he says. So, look, if if they’ve decided that they don’t want to sign Quay Walker, I’m in agreement with that. I haven’t seen enough out of him for 3 years for them to pick up again. the fifthear option just realistically wasn’t an option because of the way that the NFL does that if you’re unaware. Uh so somebody like TJ Watt who is a pass rusher, but because the uh Pittsburgh Steelers run a 34, he’s considered a linebacker. So those are the salaries. You know, some outside pass rushers are getting buku dollars get factored into what that fifth year option number is ultimately going to be. So you’re not going to pay a a middle linebacker or a offball linebacker the fifth year option money. It just doesn’t make sense. So, I understand why they didn’t do that. But also, they haven’t seemed to be in a rush to sign him to any other sort of long-term extension. So, I don’t know if they need to see more, which again, I would agree with when it comes to Quay Walker. I I just wish Goody wouldn’t say, “Oh, yeah, this guy definitely definitely factoring into our future when they haven’t made a move to try to lock him up long term.” Yeah. Believe what they do. Yes. Don’t believe what they say. Correct. I think is a good way to view the Goody uh era. And so, look, a a couple things cuz I’m I was catching up on the live chat on our uh ESPN Milwaukee YouTube channel. First of all, I don’t think anybody on this panel, uh, Jim is underestimating what the defense did last year. I thought the defense last year was magnificent. What I respect about what Halfley did was he managed for it to be a top 10 defense in both, I think, fifth in yards, sixth in scoring or vice versa. um without a consistent front four pass rush. I think what we’re saying is that group needs to be better. I think if we look at the linebackers, I think we see we all see through the same lens that Edgeran Cooper has star potential. Guy was a defensive player of the week. He does so many things twice. Not rookie, not defensive rookie of the week, player of the week. You saw him run stride for stride with Christian Kirk in that game. Uh that dude’s a fast wide receiver and made a lot of money. Yeah. Break up the pass and then break his collar bone by landing on him. Right. We saw the the sacks, the pressure he can create, the turnovers he creates. He has potential to be really good. Now again, I am a Quay Walker stan because what I like about him and and what I also think has held him back is that he is as hard on himself as any player. I like he had a good game last season and we had to have the PR staff go get him out of the parking lot because he is so hard on himself. And again, I don’t want to be in parent mode even though I’m old enough to be most of these guys dads. Dude, it’s hard to be a really good NFL player. Celebrate the wins. It’s okay to feel good about yourself. And he and I talked one-on-one for a really long time. And I am in no way saying that I was imparting knowledge, but I would say that it gave him an opportunity to talk about things that he had hinted at in group settings, but he he’s just so demanding of himself, and I think it’s to his detriment. And what I thought, what was the disappointment of last season for me defensively was going into the Seattle game, he was playing the best football we had seen him play. He wasn’t running into the wrong gap. He wasn’t running like around a gap to try and tackle the guy from behind. Yep. Right. He was He wasn’t thinking. He looked like he knew what he was doing in this scheme. Then he hurts his ankle, he misses time, isn’t a factor in the playoff game cuz he misses the rest of the regular season, comes back for the playoff game. If he if that glimpse that we got before the Seattle game is who he’s truly capable of being, he’s going to be really good this season and Jen’s going to feel really good about that. And then he’s going to go play for somebody else. Mhm. I think is what the reality is until Goody midway through the season says, “Oh, no. I meant what I said and here’s a four-year extension for him.” I don’t believe that. Now, I do think there’s an intriguing wild card here. Okay? And that is Isaiah Simmons. Now, again, another thing that I’m a sucker for is a good reclamation project. And let’s be honest, Zack Baughn was a huge difference maker for the Philadelphia Eagles last season, and he wasn’t supposed to be. Correct. And Devonte uh Devandre Camp Devandre Campbell, I forgot his name cuz he walked out on me and the team. Uh is is it was a first team all pro that they got in June for 2 million bucks. Now again, I don’t know what Isaiah’s role is going to be. They they have two Isaiah’s first of all, which is a lot of Isaiah. They need like a Jacob and a Lamentations, but that’s a that’s a Christianity joke. Uh but I I really want to see what Simmons can do. That’s a Christian because he he his explanation to us, and I have no reason not to believe him, is that in his with the Giants and with the Cardinals previously, they loved his versatility so much that they didn’t put him in any one spot. So he’s playing safety, he’s playing nickel, he’s playing linebacker, and he I mean, this guy won the Buttkiss award. Y this guy was the eighth overall pick, so you know there’s talent there. So if they can unlock that, that also allows them to move on from Quay Walker if he doesn’t play at the level that you’re hoping. Well, and and look, I I I think the fact that we’re being hard on, at least for me, being hard on Quay Walker and being hard on the defensive line just again tells you how good Jeff Halfley is because they were they were able to find ways to generate pressure with just four. It just wasn’t the front four. They would do some different zone blitzes. Obviously, you’re kind of putting yourself in some advantageous situations then as well. Like you can’t. But as good as Jeff Hafley is, as much as I love him, I don’t think you can be good consistently on defense just through schematics alone. You’re right. You need to have players that that are going to make his job that much easier. I think we know Jeff Hafley’s a good coach, but now he needs the players to be able to help him out so they can run more of the things that he would actually like to run instead of him becoming a mad genius and coming up with these different fire blitzes and zone blitzes. To to your point on this, the best case scenario is the Packers are looking for a new defensive coordinator next year or have a new defensive coordinator when we do this show next year because my sweatshirt first. That is that is if Hley becomes a head coach and I think it’s certainly possible. Oh yeah, but I don’t think that’s the best case scenario. Well, no. The best case scenario is he does a Ben Johnson. That’s true. And he earns the opportunity to be a head coach and he passes on it for another year and they’ll win the Super Bowl then he gets a different job. Well, they win the Super Bowl again. You mean? Yes. But yes, only well two of only one of us is not a fan on the panel. Look, here’s the thing to your point and it’s again I I I don’t I can’t believe how good of a show you’ve had and I know how good you are at this job, but like to your point Jeff Halfley got them to be who they were last season through a lot of schematics that were not the plan going in. You hear him and Laflur and their players on defense talk about this a ton that they did a bunch of stuff that did not in any way match what their plan was coming in when he got the job. That to me is the mark of a really good football coach. So now we’ve established that. The next question becomes were are those B players that are supposed to be A players going to become A players? Because if they do now you’re not talking about fifth and sixth in total defense and scoring defense. Now you’re talking about one or two. And now you’re talking about giving your quarterback a little more leeway to make mistakes, right? I mean, remember Favre used to love to talk about how Loy Butler and Santana Dodson and Reggie White would after you throw an interception, hey, don’t worry about it, but we’ll get it back for you. And then they go out there, get a takeaway, and he’d be in business, then he’d score a touchdown. Like they didn’t have that during the Joe Barry Carroll era. Did they have any turnovers during that era? I believe the answer is no. It didn’t feel like it. Well, not zero, but it may have felt that. Okay. All right. It often times did. There’s there’s one that doesn’t really come to my mind is all I’m saying. It’s actually a really good uh Qu Walker. Alexander in the playoff game in Dallas. Yes. He had a pick. Oh, yeah. That’s right. Quay Walker at a pick six against the Bears. Jordan Love’s first game as the starter. First game as the starter. Yeah. Yeah. So, no. What What do you got against Joe Barry? A lot. I have a lot against Joe Barry. Interesting hire. Um, the Isaiah Simmons piece I’m still hung up on a little bit because that he is a guy that fascinates me and I I hope you’re right. I hope the change of scenery brings good things for him, but I they need, as we’ve talked about, we they need athletic stars on their defense. I don’t think he is one. You get drafted in the top 10 as a defensive player if you hit certain athletic measurements. Correct. And obviously, he hit those. So, it’s can you mold that into something? And again, we’re just singing the praises of Jeff Halfling. So hopefully if there’s a coach that can do it, you’re hoping that he can deliver him in a consistent spot and go, “Hey, I know you’ve been used all over the place. Maybe we utilize some of that.” But we also think that if you you’re going to benefit from being in one spot, you get to learn that spot and be comfortable. Look, Clay Walker didn’t practice all off season. He I saw him scooter by on one of those one-legged scooters. Uh and I think I didn’t get to I didn’t get to talk to him beyond him riding on a stationary bike next to me at practice. He said hello. So, I don’t have a lot of insight from him, but during the entire off season, it was Isaiah Simmons getting a lot of the work when they’d go two linebackers next to Edger and Cooper. So, he got indoctrinated into the defense quickly. That’s where they want to play him. That gives him some opportunity to maybe not be as versatile and maybe be more productive. Is Quay still going to be the green dot, do you think? That’s a great question. Again, I I would look at Quay Walker and say he is much better when he doesn’t have to think as much and he can just react. And I think we’ve seen that growth. The issue is like I would say probably Isaiah McDuffy would be who played for Halfley in college would be the guy I would love to have the green dot but you take him out when you don’t go through when you go sub package. So that’s not really realistic. Yeah. And do you Yeah. Would you want to give it to um And I don’t want to burden Edger and Cooper. Exactly. Like Cooper seems like he’s progressing. Does that is that too much too fast? I I’ll tell you who had it when he was in New York and I have no doubt could do it even from the back end. It’s Xavier McKini. They’re almost through the defense. State of the defensive backs. State of the defensive back field. There’s obviously two portions to this safety. Do you feel pretty good about Xavier McKini, Evan Williams, Javon Bullard, some upandcomers and obviously a massive free agency signing last year bringing in Xavier McKenna who at one point in the season was probably the front runner for defensive player of the year or at least in the conversation last year. So he had a terrific year for the Packers at safety. You feel very good about that group. On the other hand, I don’t know how good you’re feeling about quarterbacks now that Jaier Alexander has officially been released. Carrington Valentine, Keshan Nixon, Nate Hob. It’s like they’re two separate conversations. Yeah. But I I guess the the more interesting one to me is the quarterback group cuz I feel like I’m more confident in this group than a lot of other people are really. I I feel I feel pretty good about it. I mean, how many teams I feel good about three corners on this team. And I mean, maybe it’s just because I’m I’m listening to my guy Q Meyers who who really told me that Nate Hobbs was going to be a great addition for the Packers despite him I think he only played 11 games last year for the Raiders. But I look at that and I can’t imagine there’s too many teams that have three guys that they truly trust. And by the way, because the safeties are so good and they would drop them down to the nickels sometimes, that adds to some of the depth that they have, right? Javon Bullard especially. Yeah. How many times toward the end of last season did did you walk away from a Packer game go, man, the quarterbacks are an issue on this team? Not a ton. And I think they’re better than they were at the end of last season. And the reason obviously why I say the end of last season is because well there was no Gier Alexander. And I know that was such a big part of the discourse this offseason about the Packers quarterbacks and and how bad they’re going to be without Jaier Alexander. But the the fact of the matter is the Packers the reason why they signed Nate Hobbs was because they knew they were moving off of Gier Alexander. They knew this entire time that Gier was not going to be a member of this team. I don’t know why Goody waited as long as he did, but he did. And this team, I I like Carrington Valentine and I feel like his arrow continues to point up. Keshan Nixon, the only thing he has done is delivered in every role the Packers have ever asked him to perform in. I look at him much like we were talking about Rasheed Walker. Oh, hey, we’re going to put Rasheed in competition. Well, here comes the guy he’s going to. And is he a quarterback one? I don’t know. Probably not. I know he likes to, you know, said that had the quote of being quarterback one at the end of last season. And I really like Nate Hobbs. feel good about those three guys and hopefully some of the other young players behind them continue to develop and if there is an injury they’ve got the safeties that they trust behind that. Nate Hobs has never played a full NFL season. He is the closest he came was 16 games as a rookie. Um he played 11 last year. He played 11 in 2022. I think he had 13 in 2023. So while he didn’t miss as much time as Jier Alexander, he plays a very physical style. Mhm. And that leads to ankle injuries and a broken hand and all the things that he dealt with, but I agree with you that he was a smart signing. Um, you know, they could have still kept Jer Alexander at the number that the Baltimore Ravens paid. Goody just hadn’t Gy and Leaf. They just didn’t want him back, period. Yep. Right. But I would feel differently about this group because here’s the problem that I have. That’s great. that you feel that good about those three. How do you feel about him once one of those guys misses six games because of a MCL tear or whatever happened, you know, PCL with Jire? Because here’s the problem behind that, you know, again, they’re all young guys that that you’re eager to see what they can do, but like Kayn King didn’t play at all. Like Micah Robinson is a seventh round pick. Like I went into the draft thinking that corner was one of their top needs because they were moving off of Jire and even though they had signed Nate Hobbs. I look I like Stro’s guy. I am a big Carrington Valentine guy. I think he has a chance to be in that conversation of Donald Driver, Mark Touser, Adam Timberman, Rasheed Walker, seventh round picks who turn out to be really good football players for you. But all three of the guys we’re talking about have something to prove. Uh Keshan Nixon needs to prove that he’s a number one. He everything else we’ve asked him to prove he has. So for me, to your point, for me to bet against him would be foolish. but he has to prove he is capable of being a number one corner. Uh Nate Hobbs has to prove that he can be a full-time player because he was a subpackage guy for the Raiders and Carrington Valentine has to prove after 22 NFL starts that he’s more than just a seventhrounder overachiever. It’s a nice story. Yeah. Right. And I think all three of them can prove to be the people that I’m asking them to be, but they haven’t done that yet. And on top of that, they all have to stay healthy because behind them, you’re counting on a bunch of guys. I mean, uh, Gregory Jr., correct, who I had, he’s a talk about great story from, I would cheer Baptist or wherever he’s from. He’s played 100 snaps on defense in the NFL. They do not have and and you can say what you want about Eric Stokes, and many have. You can say what you want about Robert Rochelle. Rochelle the musical. That’s another Seinfold reference. uh and Cory Valentine when they had the law firm of Valentine and Valentine. But those guys have played. These guys have not that are behind them and they may play great, but right now they’re counting on those three to stay healthy all season long. Yeah. And look, you’re right. They could have afforded to have depth. I just think that there’s not a lot of teams across the NFL. I think that most teams have three guys they feel good about and then they’re kind of holding their breath after one of those guys gets hurt. I I just think that’s the state of that position in the NFL. I don’t think there are let there I don’t think there are very many teams that are rolling four deep with guys they absolutely love and adore. I I think that that’s a position because of the way the NFL has gone and everybody’s stre, you know, spreading it out and and it’s a position that gets stretched in and even a lot of teams probably don’t have three guys that they could potentially feel as good about as Let me ask you this though and and you’ve had an unbelievable show. So I it it pains me to get after you a little bit, but aren’t you doing with the corners what we kind of are saying that they do with the wide receivers? Bingo. that they got a lot of guys that you like, but we don’t really know how good they are. And isn’t that equally applicable to I mean, look, the problem too is But I would say this schedule has way more good quarterbacks and way more good wide receivers on their schedule. That’s very true. But the one thing I would say though, at least with Keshan Nixon, is that Keshan has stepped up. Like Keshan’s answered the call. He’s answered the bell. And I don’t think I can say that to any one of the wide receivers. Yes, he has more another step to take because he’s going to be counted on to be their top quarterback, but again, I I I feel good about this group. Um I I I also advocated for Jire being on the team, not even not even at the number that he was signed for in Baltimore, right? At the number that was just owed to him because you only saved, you know, $5 million or whatever it would have been against the cap. Correct. So for the 5 million extra bucks to me that you saved, especially the way they decided to postmarked the prophecies unbelievable, which has never happened. Never seen that before that I can know in the NFL history. But so for that extra $5 million, I would have Yeah, you’ve got the money. Just keep him around and then you can have that luxury that not a lot of teams have even though you had already signed Nate Hobbs. I mean, I’m with you, Jason. But I I also just accepted reality of the first statement you said that neither Goody or Laflur wanted this guy around and for whatever reason decided to wait until after June 1 to release it. Just to be clear for those of you watching on video, I didn’t put my headphones down and ignore Gabe cuz I didn’t like what he was saying. The fan fell down so I had to fix that. So you great points as always. The floor is yours. I I am surprised at the optimism level of Gabe to be honest with you. I figured this would be we always reference two years ago our 2023 state of the Packers and you guys kind of rained on my parade for two or three hours, however long our program was back in the day. It was only two and that wasn’t enough. It wasn’t enough. That’s why it’s three now. Um that feels like too much. Too much too much time dealing with me. No, not at all. We could do another hour, but I’m not going to. We could and then we could split safeties and corners into could have should have but didn’t cuz boy have we talked a lot about the safeties in this smooshed in segment. What? Xavier McKinn’s great. He is. Savior McKinnon Williams pretty good, too. Yes. Uh and I have high hopes on Bullock. Um so I I’m surprised by your optimism of the top three to be honest with you. But I I I it’s good to hear to to be honest with you because I agree with the Keshan Nixon thing. He’s answered the call at every turn. I thought he played really well last year. Um you know, given the circumstances of Jaire being inactive a lot of the time. I like what Carrington Valentine’s done, but to Jason’s point, I think right now as it stands in his career two years in, it’s just a good story. I don’t know if we can say he’s a really good corner yet. And then Nate Hobs, it’s TBD, I don’t really know much. Uh, hearing that your buddy Q Myers from ESPN radio, uh, who covers the Raiders out in Vegas says that he’s a really good player. That’s great. But I worry about what Jason brought up as well and that he misses time practically every day because he plays physical. He does and then all of a sudden we’re going, “Oh boy, how good is Kalin King?” I know people were excited about him, but we’re actually going to have to find out this season. at some point, right? So, that’s that’s where I get a little bit of the EBGB of I don’t love the depth, but I do like the guys at the top of the depth chart. I think that’s fair. I didn’t expect hebies on my bingo card. I mean, what did you say earlier? Something in a different language. Correct. Amundo, I believe you got Coramundo. Yeah. Yeah. So, my that was wasn’t on my bingo card either. So, there we go. Uh, anything else on the safeties? I I you know, I put Evan Williams at 18 on my list, which maybe some people wouldn’t have put him on that list. I would have but but I look at him, you know, not only in the uh vein of Micah Hyde, but he’s the one guy that is has such a high football IQ that I think the reason why he’s so important. And I wrote about this at channel 3000.com is that you can if he’s the other safety, he gives you the flexibility to at the last second switch responsibilities and have Xavier McKini do something different than what they’re showing. And I think one of the challenges for this defense down the stretch last year was opposing offenses figured out a way to steer clear of Xavier McKini. And while there’s value in that, there’s undeniable value in that, I don’t want them to be able to avoid him because he is a playmaker for me. I want him to have chances at the ball. And if they’re just saying, well, Mckin’s on that side of the field, kind of like Mike McCarthy ignored the Richard Sherman side of the field in that first game against the Seahawks career. Did not go. Jared was a non-factor that day. He was And that is the state of the Packers defense from State of the Packers 2025. If you missed our conversation on the offense, we did that on Wednesday’s edition of Mr. Relevant. You can find that in the ESPN Wisconsin app, Apple Podcast, Spotify, wherever you get your podcast. Just search Mr. Relevant and YouTube as well, where we go over the state of the quarterback, state of the running back, state of the pass catchers, and state of the offensive line. Coming up on Monday, we’ve got a really interesting edition of State of the Packers. It’s kind of a hodgepodge of our other conversations. So, state of the coach, state of the GM, our overarching thoughts and theme and final takeaways from our long conversation on all things Packers. And then what we’ll start Monday’s edition with is who on the Packers offense is under the most pressure in 2025. That was by design. Um, all three of us have different answers. Again, by design, but it’s an interesting quick conversation with Willy and Nitel that I think you’ll enjoy. So, that’s coming up on Monday. But hey, got to tell you about our friends. Door County Distillery, locally produced, handcrafted, award-winning spirits, made locally in beautiful Door County. If you’re heading up there, Door County anytime this summer, got to check them out. Uh they’re connected with Door Peninsula Winery. So, you can do the tours, you can do the tastings. It’s a huge building. It’s a really neat building. It’s like a must do if you’re heading to Door County, even for a quick drink and maybe just a quick browse. It’s worth your time up in Door County Distillery in Carlsville. But if not, bring Door County to you. Whether that’s in uh whether that’s in uh Madison, Milwaukee, Stevens Point, Green Bay, bourbons, uh well bourbons, but whisies overall. They’ve got rye and a single malt as well, but I’m a bourbon guy. Uh they’ve got great brings the cherry brass. They’ve got rums, they’ve got gins, they’ve got vodkas, anything you can need. Check them out. Distillery.com. Enjoy the weekend. We’re back with you Monday. I’m back with you live Wednesday. We will talk to you then. Peace. Heat. Heat.
Alex Strouf, Gabe Neitzel, and Jason Wilde dive into the Green Bay Packers defense in year two under Defensive Coordinator Jeff Hafley. Can the defensive line be more disruptive and get after the quarterback after a lackluster year? The Packers linebacker crew looks FUN – with Quay Walker, Edgerrin Cooper, and Isaiah McDuffie all back. Will Isaiah Simmons make an impact? Gabe feel very comfortable with the Packers cornerback room. Do Strouf and Jason?
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