LIVE: Camping Out | 8/10/25 | Dallas Cowboys 2025

LIVE: Camping Out | 8/10/25 | Dallas Cowboys 2025

[Music] The following is a production of DallasCowboys.com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club. How about you Cowboys? Go Cowboys. [Music] This is Cowboys Camping Out presented by Solo Stove and broadcasting live from training camp in Oxnard, California. The Solo Stove is a blaze in bright orange, burnt orange, if you will, as we welcome you in to Dallas Cowboys training camp in Oxnard. This is Camping Out, brought to you by Solo Stove. I know that I’ve just made all of my co-hosts so happy here next to me, especially this guy. It’s Derek Eagleton, Patrick Walker. That’s right. And Mickey Spagnola. Speaking of two wins. Oh, wow. Okay. Okay. Well, and we’re quickly going to kick Patrick off the show here to start. Uh, but no, gentlemen, thanks for being here. It’s a nice cozy evening. Chris Beam is in the front here holding it down for us. Thank you so much for spending some of your Sunday night here with us. Fellas, first time that we’re on air after the Cowboys preseason opener last night against the Los Angeles Rams, a 31-21 loss, and Brian Shimer’s debut. We’ll start with just overall quick thoughts. Derek, I’ll go start with you to start. Yeah, I um I’ve I’ve done a lot of preseason games in my time. So, for me, I look at it, I’m like, it’s it’s just a game you get through. You try to get as few injuries as possible. These days, especially in in the preseason, you most the vast majority of the guys that were playing last night for either team, uh probably won’t be getting meaningful snaps once the season begins. There were only a handful that will. Um and I thought some of those guys, I thought we saw some positive things from them. people like me. Uh but but a lot of those guys, they just unless something drastically changes between now and the time we get to the season, the likelihood of them playing a lot isn’t very high. So you just try to get through the game, you try to work on some things knowing that again, a lot of what they’re going to show is not going to be uh the stuff that they’ll even be doing during the regular season. So, I don’t take too much from it other than, you know, you look at a couple of individual performances and I thought some of the guys that needed to do well did and and some of the guys that probably needed to show a little bit more may not have. 37 was the count of total players that did not play yesterday, whether it be sitting out or with injury. Patrick, what did you think? Well, I’m with Derek in the fact that um wins, losses preseason, I don’t care. Like, I could not care less about wins and losses. For me, it’s about evaluating individuals. Uh, and for a Cowboys team that suffered so greatly as far as injuries and then thereafter depth because of the injuries, that’s what I was looking for. And there were some positions like wide receiver for example, which we’ll get into. I like the depth a lot that I’m seeing at wide receiver. But when you start talking about, you know, how things looked on the defensive interior depthwise, that didn’t look great. Cerwise, Izzy Muamu’s interception notwithstanding, there were some struggles there as well. Um, so those positions that we came into camp wondering about, I’m still wondering about going into the second preseason game. And I’m going to take uh Derek one more step further when he said a lot of these guys won’t get snaps. A lot of them won’t be on this team. So I was trying to say it in a nice way. Leave it to me. I’m saying it very bluntly. Nice going right out the window. He has no such filter. Uh, yeah. Yeah. It’s like wins, losses, it doesn’t matter. you’re looking at performances and even at that. So, if some of these guys might have to play, they’re not going to play with all the backups. They’re going to play with guys that have talent out there, starters, right? Uh so, yeah, it’s hard to judge. And I know people get all excited about, no, they look this, they look that. Well, they’re not going to look anything once the season starts. So, I think I counted uh maybe three guys that could possibly start played in that game. And Tommy and I were talking about it for our um inside Cowboys training camp tomorrow. I counted 27 guys that didn’t play that would be either starters or significant rotate. That’s half your roster, right? If you get to 53. So, um yeah. So, you know, it guys needed work. They got to work. Now, we’ll see what they do with it. What do we got? Three more days here before they take off or practices. Uh, and then it’s another week, week and a half of practice when we get back to the start. Yeah. And they take on Baltimore at AT&T Stadium. We’ll get to that a little bit later, but you mentioned there 27 players that more than likely would be starters or rotational pieces not playing. One guy who is not going to be the starter, but is a younger player, and really you think about the preseason in general, younger players need these snaps, is Joe Milton. And probably the most anticipated player going into last night because he’s only got one regular season NFL game under his belt. Even last year in the preseason, he only played in three games, didn’t get as many reps. This time around, the plan was for him to play the entire game. Hurts his elbow late, ends up getting pulled out. Brian Shimeimer told us last night that they’re not too concerned about that. And Joe Milton seems to be okay. But good and bad from Joe Milton. Derek, what did you think was the good? Yeah, the good was I I think at at some point probably in the second quarter, uh, he did start to to kind of settle in a little bit. He talked about it after the game and and talked about how, you know, really what he’s got to work on is is settling in a little faster. Uh, those first, I think it was six passes of the game, I don’t think there was a single one that was on target. Um, and and to be honest with you, that’s something that we’ve seen out here in camp. like if there is an inconsistency to his game, if there’s a most if you were going to say the most glaring inconsistency in his game, it is his ability to throw the ball on target. Um that’s what we’ve seen out here. And and so as that game was starting, it was a lot of that he just wasn’t being able to get the ball in the right placement uh for his receivers. And and so I but I do think as the game wore on, you started to see him kind of loosen up a little bit. you start to see him kind of settle in um and and start making some of those throws and making some completions as well. We saw the the power of his arm downfield uh which is one of the great things about him as well. So I I you know I for him I look at it and I say there was some good things there obviously some tough things. Uh now he’s got to figure out how he can kind of decrease the number of bad things and increase the number of good things hopefully in the next opportunity he gets on the field. Yeah, Mickey and I were talking before this just about how important touch is for a young quarterback, right? You think about the play that stands out to me, I don’t know about you guys, is the deep crosser to Ryan Fenoy where there was nobody within five yards in a radius of Fenoy and Milton just oversales him. He’s got all the time. He was moving around a lot, too. A lot of these throws came on the move. I think Milton needed to do a better job of just kind of setting his feet in the pocket. He’s such a gifted athlete that he can afford to move around and make those kinds of throws, but when you haven’t had as many reps at this level, it’s difficult to do that. Mickey, what what do you just Can you build off of that a little bit? And what did you think for um you know, I said this last night and I was trying to remember I said to myself, but I said that about another quarterback and then it dawned on me and what I said was there are times he does something and you go, “Oh, look at that.” And then there are times when you go, “Oh, what was that?” I said that about Trey Lance. You know, it just dawned on me that that’s who I said it about. And it was this uneven of, okay, there’s something there, but then there’s not enough. And when you’re the backup quarterback, you got to get all the reps now cuz once the season starts, you don’t get any in practice. So, this is this is it for him. And he’s, you know, what, two more games? I I don’t know if they’re going to play Dak a a series or two, but the reps are going to start decreasing and he needs them to increase. So, I’m not sure where we’re at with the backup quarterback. Real quick, I I’ll ask this question. I can’t get out of the host role. Um, as you said that, it was interesting. It was interesting because I’ve heard a number of media people as we’re just talking, watching practice, I’ve heard a number of people have that same realization like, is is this just Trey Lance? I’ll ask you guys, do you think there is an appreciable difference between those two players? Because I do think in a lot of ways when you look at their trajectory and what they’ve done to this point and their skill set if you’re just looking at them as people, as athletes, and and how extremely talented that part is compared to what you see on the field, is there an appreciable difference? I think there’s a there’s a difference in physical stature. I think Joe Milton is is physically a little bit more imposing, so a little bit tougher to take down in the open field. I think Tre Lance is a little bit faster in the open field, but I think those are negligible. Uh, I think the biggest thing is their similarity is kind of eerie when it comes to the the concern about the lack of touch, the lack of consistent touch, kind of like what Tommy, no pun intended, touched upon there a moment ago. Um, that’s something that transferred over into the first preseason game that I and I’ve been vocal about on social media and the talking Cowboys is we know that um that Joe Milton has a cannon. We we know that. What we don’t know, what we need to see is the consistent ability to put touch on the ball. The play you’re talking about deep crosser to Ryan Fenoi. That was one play. The other another I’m going to say the other another was again Ryan Fenoy double move down the right side. Absolutely puts his defensive back in a blender. All you have to do is just lay that up there and that’s a back pylon touchdown. Easy money for Ryan Fenoy. He sells it. It goes out of the end zone. Saw that too frequently last night. But the concern is it it’s not an aberration because we’ve seen this day in and day out. Now that’s not to say that Joe Milton has not shown where he can put touch on the ball cuz he did against the Rams. You saw that again. Consistency in doing so. That’s the point. You know he can do it. Yeah. Consistency in doing so. Um and I’m I’m of the mindset is if you show me you can do something once that means you can do it. So now I just need you to stack good days and do and do it. The other glaring concern that’s transferred over from training camp practices to the Rams game um is he needs to really slow down and go through his reads. I feel like if he if he’s forced to come off of his first read, he panics. There was a couple or a couple of times where he had the outlet to the right or to the left and he trusts his arm a little bit too much to go downfield. Like the the throw to Fenoy that ended up in the interception, he had an outlet pass. All he had to do is get to that outlet pass. First and second read were not there. He said, “Hey, I I trust my guy to get it.” You weren’t having that kind of game, Joe. Um, but I will give him roses. He stuck in there. You talk about the second quarter, they were moving the ball. Unfortunately, guess what showed up? Self-inflicted wounds. You have to help a young quarterback by not penalizing yourself on offense. That killed that drive. Um, but then had a rough third quarter, fourth quarter, he started to surge again. So, I like that he battles and he continues to battle. I’m looking forward to seeing what that can be. And if we’re talking about the difference between Trey Lance and Joe Milton, I think the the biggest differentiator and really the similarity between the two when you compare to Cooper Rush who’s been the backup in Dallas for so long prior to this season is experience. Both of these guys don’t have a lot of experience. They have not played a lot of games. And that’s why this preseason is so important. But it also begs the question, you know, last year if that goes down, you know, it’s Cooper Rush because Cooper Rush has been there for so long. Well, now Cooper Rush isn’t there. And you’ve got two quarterbacks in this room right now and Joe Milton and Will Greer who have not played in a lot of NFL in-game action. So, it begs the question, should Dak Prescott, who has missed timed the last three out of the five years in his career, go down, can you feel confident in Joe Milton running this offense? Well, the other similarity and it’s not a good thing with Lance is both of them had this problem recognition. They don’t see things fast enough. There it is. And and and and that ends up they’re holding the ball too long. There was a couple times the receivers were open, but by time he got to him or he was staring them down, the DBs catch up. So, uh the only way that improves if you play, but again, there’s two preseason games left. That’s it. And they got to better have a book here and where these veteran quarterbacks, free agent quarterbacks are. And this is this to to that point, this is something that um going into this training camp, I know a lot of people um immediately put Joe Milton as the front runner and the QB2 and it was an absolute lock. And I fought against that that thought process and saying you have to let the process work itself out. You take the the game against the Rams for example, Will Greer comes in because Joe Milton exit exits with the elbow injury. Will Greer comes in and with limited reps, he makes a lot of things happen. Now, of course, shouts out to Malik Davis. He also had a big he was a big uh driver in there. Talk about making things happen. Yeah, exactly. But that that’s what you have to do as a backup, particularly if you’re one. Malik Davis signed off the street for a reunion the day before. Will Greer the anticipation was he was not going to take a single snap against the Rams. He gets put in late in the fourth quarter because Joe Milton goes out with the elbow issue. Will Greer takes advantage of it. Malik Davis takes advantage of it. That’s what you have to do. So to Mickey’s point, when it comes to Joe Milton as a backup quarterback, you really only have two more games. And that doesn’t mean you have eight quarters because you don’t know now if the Cowboys want to see more of Will Grim the game. Will Dak Prescott get a series? So your eight quarters probably now turns to six. And the clock’s ticking. And the clock’s ticking. I will I will also say though I think you know I think it’s a better question you mentioned you’re looking at a book of veteran quarterbacks I think we look at that they look at that option after this whole body of work in three games is over the bottom line oh no it’s too early to just make sure we 100% and you don’t and you know you want to give them every opportunity you bring in a guy now that’s it his snaps are over and he’s the third quarterback and there’s no development going on I think you got to see it True. And in that book of backup veteran quarterbacks right now, it’s pretty like a page or two. There ain’t a whole lot. But not only that business out there, I also think that I mean he’s in my opinion, he’s making this team. I don’t think he so whether he’s so whether he’s ready right now to be the backup or not, they’re going to continue to develop him. So the point is keep seeing what he can do during this this this preseason. They will continue to work with him during the season. they will probably use him whenever they’re going to play, you know, a team that has a quarterback that can move a lot and and use that speed to be able to scout team, but but at the end of the day, he’s going to probably with all likelihood, he’s going to be on this team. So, he’s not going anywhere. It’s just going to be a matter of is he ready to assume that backup role or is he more of a third guy that they’re going to keep trying to develop? That’s what he’s really working toward. Good question. Cuz I do believe both Will Gear and Joe Milton make this roster. So, yeah. and and you know the the the thing that always sticks in the back of my mind is Tony Romo was kind of in the same situation when he first got here, right? And uh he was a work in progress. And you know, if they don’t cut Quincy Carter in 2004, Romo’s the odd man out. Yep. And they never get to see what Tony Romo is. But they Bill had a vision for him, worked with them, and by 2006 it’s like, “Okay, time for you to play big boy.” The halftime of the Giants game after heading into heading into the locker room. Yeah. So, but sometimes, you know, you got to see it through, but do you have the luxury because they had other veteran quarterbacks at that time that they could turn to? They don’t have that veteran now. Will Gleer. Look, the the three of them to the two of them together have played three NFL games. That’s it. Wow. Yep. It’s not a lot. That’s scary. That’s not a lot. That is not a lot. Let’s go ahead and before we wrap this segment up, just really quickly talking about some of the other guys on offense who stood out. Patrick, you you mentioned Malik Davis. Yes, I did. He had 28 hours. Yes, I did. in between when we saw him on the practice field in Oxnard and he’s signed, which by the way was a walkthrough practice and he didn’t even participate. He was just standing in a jersey watching everything and then 28 hours later he’s taken the field for kickoff at Sofi Stadium and he leads the team in rushing yards, seven carries, 63 yards, nine yards per carry. Sources say that’s pretty good. Yeah. Uh I think that’s damn good is what that is. But this is one of the reasons when you look at the uh the injuries that they’re they’re having. and Duce Vaughn, he was able to return from the hamstring injury, but Miles Sanders, he’s still dealing with a knee issue. Uh Jay and Blue, he’s dealing with the foot, ankle issue, bruise, nothing major, but it was enough to get keep him out against the Rams. See if we can he can play against the Raiders. Um but free agencywise, Malik Davis was the only candidate in free agency that you could have done yesterday in Los Angeles, what you were able to do, which is bring this guy in, have a walk through, and say, you know what, now go play in the game. That’s because he’s familiar with the playbook. He’s familiar with um Brian Shottenheimimer and the only thing that he really had to learn was some of the new terminology, but he’s familiar with the organization and the club. And then what does Malik Davis do? He goes out there and he he makes a name for himself. Now the question becomes if we’re talking about depth chart conversations, yes, we were talking about, well, we don’t know who RB1, RB2 is right now. Okay, everybody has who they think it’ll be. But if in seeing what Malik Davis did, how is he not in the conversation now? So if he’s in the conversation, also I’d be remiss if I didn’t mention how impressive Phil Mafa was yesterday. Okay, so Mafa obviously in the in the conversation, but now Malik Davis is and we’re going to go ahead and say Javvante Williams is still very much in the front of that conversation. We’ll see how it plays out for Miles Sanders and then Dvon. you have an extra piece in a crowded running back’s room with a lot of questions that just got more interesting thanks to Malik. But, you know, we’ve seen this before for Malik Davis. I I was, you know, when they let him go last year, I was like, well, why? You know, I we could have argued last year, Malik Davis or Rico Donald. I mean, I could have, and we’ve seen this before, but there’s something there that they say, no, practice squad, no, we’re not keeping you. And, you know, sometimes that can be a new coaching staff, right? That could be the old coaching staff he kind of fell out with. I’m not saying this is what it is. I’m saying sometimes that’s what can happen. You get a new coaching staff and they’re like, “Man, this guy’s got talent. Why is he not here?” And they’re like, “All right, bring him in. We want to bring him in. We want to see him.” But I’ll also say this. I I I think when we start talking about people like Malik Davis and and Phil Mafa, their ability to make this team is only in part about what they can do when the ball is in their hands. The big part is what are they gonna do on special teams? if they can’t play special teams, you would suggest I would I would think those top two guys are probably not going to play special teams for you. I could agree. Um Jaden Blue, maybe, maybe not. Who knows? But I think for all those guys that that’s below the top two guys, whoever that might be, they’re going to have to play special teams, especially if they’re going to be able to be active. That’s why right now, I don’t know that we’ve seen enough to know what this depth chart is going to look like, cuz I don’t know if I’ve seen enough on special teams to know what this is going to look like. That’s that’s the challenge of for Phil Mafa because obviously you never want to see any of your teammates go down and get injured, but the reality is this is the NFL. When that happens, here’s your opportunities. What are you going to do with them? Phil Maf was taking great advantage of his opportunities yesterday, but because they’re so um thin at the running back’s depth chart. It negatively impacted his ability to play special teams against the Rams. I think he had five or six special team snaps. That’s not going to be enough to build that body of work. So to your point, to be able to sit back and say, well, if it’s three games of that, a total of 15 to 20 special team snaps, that’s not enough to gauge what he can or cannot be on special teams. So that’s the other side of the coin when it comes to Phil Maf cuz looked great uh on on offense. Showed a lot of potential, showed great vision, showed the ability to uh phys, you know, out physical another guy, which is one of his green flags coming out of Clemson. Um looked good in space, looked decisive. He got up and down instead of, you know, trying to run east and west. But that’s offense. Like Derek is saying, once you get down to RB3 and below, special teams is going to be a key part of it. And we’ve s we’ve seen Phil Mafa a little bit working with special teams in practice. Now, Malik Davis, that’ll be the question for the running back room. Uh, some other standouts, I thought Tawn Holden led the team. One of my guys to watch from from Oregon out here in practice, too. Yeah. And then he transferred it. He did. And then Raldo Farweather, the tight end. If you know, and down the line now, when you’re asked the trivia question of who uh who caught Joe Milton’s first touchdown pass for the Cowboys, it was Raldo Fairweather. They got a lot of tight ends just kind of packed all in there together. And they didn’t have a lot of them playing yesterday. Jake Ferguson was out. Uh Hunter Lipkkey was out. So, it was a pretty Fant didn’t play either, did I don’t think. Yeah, Kristen Fant didn’t play. I was kind of surprised by that. He He is He injured the last practice. He didn’t practice. I think there might be an injury there. There’s an injury there. And then, you know, everybody was big on Brevin Span for and he was having a nice start to camp and then at least he’s out of his boot, but who knows when he’s going to be healthy. So, they they there if these guys don’t start getting healthy. There’s only so many guys that you can say, “Hey, we’re cutting you so we can put these guys on IR. Just sit there.” and then 24 hours later we’re signing you back so we can put this guy on IR return. But how many of those guys, you know, if you let somebody go, you know, you do a deal with SIG, you know, they’ve done that before. Anger, he’s not going anywhere. But now, who else can you just say, well, sit there and some team comes by and goes, well, claim, you know, I’m going to give you some money here now, right? Claim. So, so yeah, that that’s going to be the difficult part, especially if you’re still sitting there with Diggs, not knowing if he’s ready to go. Um, you know, they they can’t do it with Micah. At some, you know, some point that’ll get done. Uh but there there’s guys like that, you know, um Revel, you know, so you got guys you want to keep, but if they can’t help you the first month of the season, you got to kind of put them on IR return and that that’s kind of a headache. Now, to um to Tommy’s point as far as bringing up Holden, and I’m glad you did because it circles back to my my point we talk when we will talk about and we’ve had concerns over defensive tackle cornerback. Man, this wide receiver room is such an embarrassment of riches right now. I mean, when you have a guy like Trayon Hold, an undrafted free agent out of Oregon, he’s reunited with Junior Adams, or I should say he followed Junior Adams because this is Junior’s first year here with with the Cowboys. um to be able to come into a game with limited reps in the back end of the fourth quarter and just do what he’s been doing almost every day out here at camp, which is create a highlight. Um Ryan Fenoy, year two, right? I mean, his his ability to separate has improved over year one. His confidence has improved over year one. His physicality has improved over year one. I can’t stress enough that double move was a thing of beauty. May not have been something that we saw from Ryan Fenoy as a rookie as he was kind of working through confidence things. So when you look at the top end of that depth chart and then you get to the middle and in the middle is Kavonte Turpin staring you right in the face because he’s absolutely making the team. Then the question becomes well is it Tawn Holden versus Ryan Foe versus you know can Jaylen Craropper make a run. Jaylen Brooks obviously who also has some NFL games uh under his belt as well and impactful reps in those NFL games on short notice when he was thrown into the game as a rookie and games plural as a rookie due to injury. So that wide receiver room including Tan Holden is fun to watch. And you know the fact of the matter is I I honestly I I will want I will be interested to see No. And Jaylen Tobert of course. Yeah. But I would be interested to see how much does this this coaching staff really lean on the the the competition that they say because if you look at it you would assume that Tolbert you would assume that Mingo are probably going to make this team. So now you’re already five deep. Like for all those other guys you mentioned that have had pretty good camps doing some thing in these pre in these preseason games. If you’re going to go with six, that means you only got one spot. Yep. Or is it a possibility that one of those guys can jump up and maybe take one of those guys that are in the wide receiver four and five spots and move them down? That’s a hard thing to expect. But that’s where you start wondering like is the competition factor like is it real? Is it a real competition or is it kind of like eh? I think it’s level. We want to see we want to see how you do, but at the same time, like we kind of know who our guys are. And by the way, part of that is we know we can trust certain guys. They’ve been in the fire. Top’s been in the fire, right? So, so regardless of maybe what you see out here and and what you see from other people out here, it does factor in what’s the history. And the history says last year he he led you in touchdown. So, you know, you got spot problems to it. Trade trade bait. Ah, cuz think about the guys you just mentioned. You cut him, you’re not going to get him on the practice squad. I guarantee you. Like Fenoi, he’s not going to make it to the practice squad. Jaylen Brooks might not. The one thing I will say the one thing I will say about that, Mickey, is I have seen a number of times and we’re out here at training camp and we’re at this point in training camp. And we’re like, “Oh my god, there’s no way you’re going to get this guy back if you if you cut him. There’s no way you’re going to get this guy.” and then they the the trade the the the the cuts come and then everybody makes their claims and then lo and behold all those guys you were worried about end up coming because other teams have guys that that showed up at their training camp and they were like oh this guy was great. So it’s I I really think especially at the wide receiver position, what I’ve tell seen from history is that a lot of times those guys that have great camps, you can get those guys. Irony irony to your point being a glaring example of that is Malik Davis in his first year. There was so much of the fandom that were like, “Oh no, the Cowboys. Absolutely. You cannot cut Malik Davis. He will not clear waiverss.” And they waved him. He cleared waiverss. And I literally watched social media all say the same thing at nearly the same time. Wow. Didn’t expect that. Yeah. To your point, that’s how it goes. Yeah, it happens. That’s how it goes. You know, it happened uh I want to say it happened last year with uh Jaylen Craropper. Yeah. He was a star, right? But then the lights came on and it’s like, well, where’s that same guy? And and he was another guy that, you know, he you got something, but he made it to the practice squad. Yeah. It is an interesting balancing act of weighing what you see in the preseason and training camp and what you see in the regular season and three quarterbacks, six wide receivers. What do you do? There’s still plenty of time to figure out what happens there. And there’s still plenty of time left here on Camping Out. When we come back, we’ll take a look at the Cowboys defense from their performance on Saturday. In just a moment, we’ll be back in a minute. AT&T has a new guarantee because most things in life are not guaranteed. Like getting through selfch checkckout by yourself. Warning, each item must be placed in the bagging area. Not guaranteed. Place item in the bagging area. 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All right, fellas. We talked about the offense in the first segment. Let’s flip to the other side of the ball. When defense, we have talked extensively about when Matt Fluss’s unit is playing at their best, they stop the run and they tend to do it very well. Yesterday was not the case. They give up 181 yards on the ground. But again, like we talked about in the first segment, 37 players did not play and 27 of them by Mickey Spagnola’s estimation, which we believe is law around here is uh or at least some of us do is uh were wouldbe starters on both sides of the ball. So when you look at that 181 yard staring at you and you think about the history that this team has had in recent years in struggling to stop the run, Patrick, does it concern you? It does. And the reason it concerns me is not necessarily for the reason it concerns some fans right now. Some fans are probably looking at it from the context of, oh, woe is us. The Cowboys can’t stop the run. I get the connection from the the previous to the now in that regard. But the reason it concerns me is going back to what I said at the top of the show, depth. I’m concerned about the depth on this team, particularly when you talk about the defensive line, cornerbacks, how they struggle in coverage for the most part. Um, but who do you have behind Oso Digisa, Solomon Thomas? You’re trying to figure that out. Those are your two interior defensive linemen that I feel going into the season. We know what OSA can be. OSA can be just dominant impact. He has all pro potential. We’re just waiting for him to tap into that particular level of it. But Solomon, Solomon looks like he’s peak right now. Just absolute peak Solomon Thomas. Great. Outside of that, we’re waiting to see Mazy take the next step. Okay, we’re waiting to see if the rookie Jay Tho can translate because Jay Tho’s been having some flashes out here in camp, that did not translate against the Rams yesterday. So for a team that has been so snake bitten over the past couple of years, last year especially at several almost all positions, for me to see a game like the Rams uh against the Rams where your depth pieces have trouble upholding a standard that you are going to try to hang your hat on defending the run and getting after uh the opposing quarterback. Both of those things were kind of lacking yesterday and that’s where my concern is rooted. Let me touch on this real quick. Maybe this will make you feel better. Please make me feel better. Mickey, all those backups ain’t playing together, right? You You’re going to One guy’s got to go in and play next to Solomon Thomas, right? He’s not next to Perry and Winfrey. Uh he’s not next to Toya. I I want to not all those guys. And he’s going to have some veteran linebackers behind him. Well, that’s true. I hope. But again, look at the injury list from last year. Yeah, I understand. I understand. Here’s my concern though, Mickey. To your point, what my concern is is when we saw the Rams out here practicing against the Cowboys, we saw a similar thing. Now, that concern and the starters were out there during that practice and we saw a similar thing. They were running pretty effortlessly through the Cowboys. And that’s that’s where I’m more concerned about it more so than the preseason game. I’m more concerned watching that practice that it looked like they were having some issues stopping the run. And that’s where I start wondering, is this a situation of personnel or is this a situation where they just haven’t quite quite gotten the the hang of the scheme of what they’re being asked to do? Cuz we see that sometimes with a a new coach brings in a new scheme, he’s asking them to do different things and the adaptation period just may last a little while getting guys acclimated to what they’re asking them to do if it’s a big departure from what they were doing last year. So that’s where I’m a little bit more concerned is is more about the practice. I I saw a similar thing happen in practice when the starters were out. Well, maybe it was a good thing that I didn’t watch the defense. Oh, yeah. Mickey and I were over there offense. Well, I’ll say this just a couple quick points. I think and I’ll not not to combat you completely on this, but I thought the defense was better against the run than I thought they were going to be in the joint practice. In the joint. I should clarify. Yes, please. Yes. No. Yes. And let me be honest with you, I didn’t watch the whole thing cuz I was moving back and forth. There was a part when I was over there and it seemed like every few minutes they were just slicing right through the defense. It was highlighted by that long run by Kairen Williams. But I thought for the most part, and I’m not saying they were, you know, piling up tackles for loss. They weren’t doing that. They weren’t dominant in run defense whatsoever, but I thought they did better than I thought they would with their starting unit. Was that good? In the joint practice? No, you’re speaking relativity. Relatively. Yes. And as far as the preseason game goes, just sifting through the numbers earlier this morning, Jay Diao was double teamed on more than half of his that’s he’s doing his job. So I think my concern lines up in if he’s doing his job and he’s got two guys trying to block him. Well, then your linebackers have to come up and fill those gaps. You got to fill the running lanes or you’ve got to have somebody step up next to you. I don’t think that was happening. I’m not saying the way I played a perfect game, but if he’s doing his part, your front seven has to do the rest around him. I did find myself saying a couple times and and again, I haven’t watched the film, so that’s where I’m a little bit like you want to watch the film to be able to really see if what you thought you saw was was accurate, but there were a number of times in that game I was like, where are the linebackers? Like, it just seemed like it seemed like there wasn’t a fill. It seemed like there was there was a hole that had been created, but a linebacker should have been filling that gap, and it just it didn’t seem like 19 missed tackles yesterday. By the way, Patrick, you know what the bottom line was, right? Cody Schrader was ripping them. Leading rusher in the SEC, says the Missouri graduate here at the I don’t even know who you’re talking about. Who was that? The guy that was ripping him in the fourth quarter. Here we go. Yeah. Okay. S I guess our No, because I’ll give him credit cuz the Michigan guy was ripping him in the first quarter. Yeah. Right. Right. And that’s coming from a bulldog. Um, but I will say as far as giving roses cuz we’re we’re rightfully talking about the things that need to be critiqued coming out of that preseason game. Um, you mentioned line both you guys mentioned linebackers and I’m glad you did. Maris Lee a foul. Yeah. Lone bright spot in the linebacker. My god. Everything that we’re seeing from him in training camp, which is the potential to be an elite linebacker in this game, got turned up a notch in that preseason matchup. I mean, he was the bright spot. He was filling those lanes. His read, his reaction time, quickness, speed, physicality, demeanor, leadership, and helping to organize guys pre- snap. Uh he was in the back field. He was helping stop things at the line of scrimmage. He was out on the flats covering guys coming out as as uh as receivers out of the back field. Maris Leopile can be special. And I do mean special. And I and I have to say that because again we’re pointing out the things that need to be improved upon rightfully so. Um and we’ve talked about guys like Tan Ho and Malik Davis, guys who who played well, Israel Muhamm. But man, Maris Leaf, he stole the show and I’m really looking forward to what uh a combo pack of him and Dear Van over. Go ahead and throw your hooks up. No, I’m just saying honestly that that’s what I’m waiting to see because I I love what the Cowboys did this year when they went out and got Sanborn. They went out and got Murray. I think those two guys will be very solid for them this year. But I’m excited about what the future will look like once they can get overshown back and then get get Maris out there more. I I am really really excited about what this linebacker they may they may be in a situation where they will have the two linebackers that you see from defenses like San Francisco had the last several years when they had Green Law there uh like with Warner like that was I didn’t want to say the name but understand when you got two I don’t disagree and and they run and they run and they get to the ball and they thump you when they get there like that’s what the Cowboys may have if they can get you know overshy and get those two guys out there together. Absolutely. If I remember about Leafou, he had three tackles. I think he only played 10 snaps. Yeah, he Well, here’s the thing. So, do the math. Maris Le tackles. He was the best defensive player the Cowboys put out on the field yesterday. I almost expected it to be like a All right, we’ll see a couple drives of you. Take your pads off. You’re good. And he was that. He’s probably on a different level than than the other teams players that were out there at that point, too. Like, let’s also be clear. And I’m not I’m not trying to take away from him at all. He was a great performance. He’s more of a starter type player. He’s more of that kind of player. So, you know, you kind of maybe that’s a lofty expectation, but I thought I figured, okay, if he’s going to play in this game, you’re probably going to see him flash more often than not. And he did. Nonetheless, it’s always a good sign. But again, he was also one of the better players the Cowboys put out there yesterday. Well, if they put three if they go three linebackers, he’s one of the three. Yeah. So, he’s a starter. To to tie it all together, you make an excellent point, Tommy. Of course, the expectation is that someone of Leaf Foul’s uh caliber is going to flash and shine against, you know, second string guys, second team guys, but we also know that he shined against starters as a rookie. So, all of that goes to say this year two jump for Leaf looks very real. And I just love his humility. Oh my god. I mean, everything about this dude, I just really really think he’s a a really good person and a really really good football. All smiles. So, you have to just root for him. smiles off the field and just a cycle on the field. Like it’s just a perfect combination. Add that to the fact that his good hair too. Great hair. Yeah. Add that to the fact that his girlfriend Sonia Sutron is hooping right now for the Washington WNBA. I saw her rocking the 35, too. She had 35 on today. She is hooping. So, that’s always good to see, too. All right, let’s drop it back a level back uh to the secondary. All but one play yesterday. Did you juggle? No, I’m sorry. Did that come out? The mic caught it. They might caught it. But I I I think it it’s somewhat fair because you look at yesterday, all but one play the Cowboys were in nickel. One time they weren’t in nickel. And what’s their biggest question mark? The nickel quarterback spot. And so that begs the question. We’ve talked about the defensive line. Let’s marry it together. Now, if the Cowboys can’t get home with four, and again, we know that yesterday’s defensive line was a majority of guys who are usually deeper in the depth chart, but if they can’t get home with four with how they’re banged up right now at defensive back, is there any level of confidence that they can get it done on the back end in coverage when you’ve got five defensive backs out there? Yeah. Here’s my biggest problem with what I saw yesterday is right now Andrew Booth if if these injuries don’t clear up they they may have to use him to start the season. They may have to use him to start the season and and he was having some troubles out there yesterday out here. Yeah, he has. And and again that’s again I’m not trying to kill the young man. And I I think at the end of the day, that’s just I think that’s an area where I am really concerned because again, what I was talking about at the show at the beginning of the show is you look at guys and you say, “Okay, what are they going to be asked to do once we get to week one, week two, week three of the season.” For a lot of these guys, they won’t be asked to do much. So, you don’t worry too much about what you saw. Booth might be in a position where they actually have to use him. And that’s where I’m a bit concerned is against guys that he was playing yesterday that are not probably going to again probably won’t be playing a lot in the NFL week one. He was having some struggles. Imagine against that that receiving core in Philadelphia. Yeah. So that that concerns me quite a bit. That really and and it really should because that was the position like and and Tommy and I we’ve talked about this on Talking Cowboys along with Isaiah Cal. It’s it’s kind of been a split decision between defensive tackle being the highest concern versus quarterback. And I my answer was always quarterback. And it’s still quarterback coming out coming out of the preseason opener because far too many times I saw Rams receivers with a ton of separation and not just on one corner, but on multiple corners on the same play time and again. And if if not for a couple of overthrows from Stson Bennett, the score looks a lot different than what it did. So again, I don’t care about the score because I don’t care about the win loss, but I care about evaluating the production and the production of these quarterbacks. Uh when we talk about depth, it’s scary. Trayvon Diggs, when he comes back from the pup list, will he require a grace period to get back to prime form? We don’t have time for that. We don’t have exactly my point. Savone Revel, he’s a rookie. So when he comes back, not only does he have to get back to his version of top form, but he has to get to NFL game speed and playing speed. Okay, we know what Dron Bland is. Great. Fantastic. and Kyler Elum. Pleasant surprise out here in camp. I wanted to see him against the Rams. Hopefully, we’ll see him against the Raiders, but once you get past those guys and two of those guys are on on reserve right now, okay, maybe to start the season, we don’t know. So, if the season started right now, it’s Kyrie Elim or Don Bland, Kyrie Kyrie Elim and then who else do you have confidence in? And the fact that you don’t have an answer to that is why I’m still concerned. And let’s go ahead and have that conversation here before we go to our final break. Uh, slot corner has been a big conversation after Jordan Lewis departed in free agency to go to Jacksonville. I think the name that is going to be a really big domino in all this also happens to be the name of the guy who made the play of the day for the defense yesterday in Israel. Yes, sir. Because he’s taken snaps at slot. He’s taken snaps at outside. And when you look at the way that he’s built physically, big, tall, long armed guy, it screams outside corner. But they have tried him in the slot. So, really quickly, just quickfire, do you feel like Mwamu is a better fit outside, which means you would, if he, if he’s a starter, obviously, if you have the other two guys that you mentioned in Kyrie Elum and Don Bland, do you bump Don Bland inside or do you keep Bland outside and put Mwamo in the slot? Mickey, you start us off. Uh, I don’t like him in the slot. He’s not built to be a slot nickel uh corner. Uh we saw what happened with the last guy that was that tall they tried to put in the slot. He’s no longer here, right? Um he he doesn’t see things fast enough in the slot. To me, if Diggs ain’t ready to go, then Bland has to be Ronda Barber. Base defense, you’re on the outside. You go to Nickel, you move inside. And I got to find another guy to play outside. I don’t think McCamu is that guy. And Andrew Booth is not that guy either. You think that guy’s not here? Is that what you’re saying? Whoever that guy is scares me that now. Let’s talk about some of those young quarterbacks cuz I mean you got other guys that are here that Childris uh Rochelle. Uh there’s some young guys that are Roelle got hurt too by the way. Yeah. So are any of those guys standing out to you as guys that might be able to do it? I mean, we were we were all talking about Keeman Hall and Zion Childress and then that they played last night and they didn’t look as good as they did here in practice. I didn’t think so. Uh I think that outside cornerback till Diggs gets back is a problem. I think I think Mwamu is is a matchup piece. I think it depends on what team you’re playing. Um, I think if you’re playing a team that primarily likes to run 12 personnel and, you know, heavy on tight ends, I would be comfortable with Muamo in the slot because I put him on a tight end. Would I put him against Hunter Renfro? No, I wouldn’t. But, you know, anybody going to put up right now unless it’s a answer right now is I don’t know. Okay. Um, but if you’re talking about a bigger boundary guy on on a team that also has a Hunter Renfro or a, you know, a Cole Beasley, somebody who can just absolutely cook in in the slot, then you put him on the bigger guy on the boundary, not Devonte Smith. You just kind of cross your fingers and hope that he can and believe that he can cover AJ Brown on two or three reps on the boundary. So that I think Muamo is a matchup piece. I don’t think you commit him to one or the other. you look at the matchup going into the week and say what does this team like to run primarily what’s the best spot to play Muamo all right it’s always a good conversation and you think about some other names there too like Kiman Hall Zion Childress in terms of the slot I think just because of size alone you put Mwamu outside because of the fact too that in the slot you got to work so much more in the middle of the field and is he that guy that you feel good moving about east and west whereas when he’s moving north and south his frame gives him time and space to recover like we saw yesterday. He did it against one play. I understand that, but I’m just saying he has the ability. We saw him last year, right? And I’m I I’m not saying that he he is going to do that consistently, but at least like Patrick said, you’ve seen him do it once. Can he do it again? And and all all things are relative, too, right? Compared to those other guys I just mentioned, maybe he’s the best option you got. It might not be ideal, but he might be the best option we see. Trayvon Diggs is holding them hostage right now that he’s not ready to play right now. The the only the big answer is you just pray that Trayvon is ready for the beginning season. We’ve seen that’s your answer. We we went we all went to um this was pre- Tommy, but Tommy’s here now. But we went to No, no, no. Because we went Tommy Tommy after Tommy. We went we went to Tampa Bay and we watched Israel Muamo get thrown into the fire by Dan Quinn at Nickel and basically help the defense shut down Tom Brady in what ended up being Tom Brady’s last game. Okay. So I know that he can play nickel but it’s a matchup thing. Okay. And as far as Don Bland, the reason I don’t I would prefer to have Don Bland boundary more so than Nickel is because if you put him in the slot then you’re helping the offense because you’re hiding him. Okay. Now the offense has I’m not going to say free reign, but it’s less of a threat to challenge the boundaries because the pick six king is covering the interior. He’s covering the inside. So this isn’t a first team allpro boundary corner that can play. It’s the Tyler Smith argument. Which do you want? Do you want the allp pro left guard or do you want a Pro Bowl left tackle? Yeah, it’s a good argument to have and the Cowboys will certainly have to continue to discuss what they want to do on the back side of that defense. When we come back, we’ll continue our discussion and have a little bit of fun, fellas. It’s our last Camping Out show from training camp, so it’s time to hand out some training camp awards and s’mores if Vicki doesn’t destroy our set before then. We’ll be back in a moment on Camping Out. Derek doesn’t want it. Don’t put off getting your oil change. Dallas Take Five Oil Change, a proud partner of the Cowboys, is faster than you think. 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AT&T has a new guarantee because most things in life are not guaranteed. Like getting through selfch checkckout by yourself. Warning. Each item must be placed in the bagging area. Not guaranteed. Place item in the bagging area. Place item in the bagging area. You know what AT&T guarantees? Connectivity you depend on, deals you want, and service you deserve. Or we make it right. Firms and conditions supply. Visit att.com/garante for details. AT&T. Connecting changes everything. Back to Cowboys Camping Out and Roast. Welcome back to Camping Out presented by Solo Stove. Someone is excited to roast some marshmallows over our Cowboys themed Solo Stove here. Patrick was so excited in the break that he was about to eat a s’more before even toasting his marshmallow. Listen, anyone anyone of culture does understand that a raw marsh marshmallow is still delicious. Okay. Absolutely. It is. Yes. But it’s better on the s’more if you burn it. Absolutely. Yeah. Per per the sponsor. Per the sponsor. And you want you want to be soft on the inside and crispy on the outside. Like you got to And you’re not wrong. I’m just saying like let’s let’s not look down upon, you know, a marshmallow fresh out the bag. That is still quality. That’s still quality. Mickey is not only burning his marshmallow, but he’s trying he’s trying to break our Solo Stove here. That can’t happen. Thank you to our friends at Solo Stove for setting us up with this. And thank you to Chris Beam for going and grabbing the marshmallows for us. I’ll enjoy mine after as well. Derek is going. You won’t? I’m going to bed, man. Okay. Well, then I’ll have Derek more. Thank you, boss. His his watch timer is going off. Yeah, it’s telling me it’s past my bedtime. All right. Well, we’ll try to get Derek to bed here in a little bit, but one more uh article of business to close in on. It’s our last camping out show from training camp. We do the starter show, we do the end show. We still got a couple more days of practice, but we’ll hand out some training camp awards now that most of this is in the books. We’re going to start with most valuable player. Who’s been your training camp MVP, Patrick? Oo, training camp MVP. Um, you know, and this is uh in part thanks to what Dak Prescott is doing now that he’s fully healthy, but it’s CD Lamb. CD Lamb is absolutely having his way and that’s why it was funny that he he said what he said uh after the last padded practice before the uh before the preseason game when he was asked which you know to evaluate the quarterback’s room uh and CD said and I quote well none of them are giving me hell um but you know there end quote and that’s you can’t guard me you can’t guard me veryish it’s it’s peak 88 club is what that was so for me it’s uh short answer CD Lamb, he has been absolutely unguardable on every route. No matter where he’s placed, inside, outside, it’s a go. He’s running the full route tree. CD Lamb looks like he’s set up to do some damage. And that was before factoring in George Pickkins. Derek, you kind of looked surprised when Patrick said CD Lamb cuz I I think for me, I think the clear answer here is Cavonte Turpin. What Turpin has done, I every single day there are wow moments where you’re like, “Oo, wow, they got something with this guy.” And the beautiful part about it is they know how to use him. Like now now we’ll see if that that doesn’t turn off once we get to the season, right? As it has. I still I still got to I still have to see that they’re actually going to Mickey. You’re going to lose. Oh my goodness. It’s But look at that. Nice and soft on the inside. Well, there’s nothing left on the inside. All that’s left is the inside. Right. If you got nerve, you word. Oh my god. No. So, so I think I think for me it was it was pretty clear Cavante Tur and that’s no knock against CD or anything else. I just think I look at Cavante Turpin and I’m like they are finally using him in the way that we all have wanted them to use him. And I think if they continue that into the regular season, he is going to be an outstanding weapon for this team. So guess what? None of those guys could do any of that without Dak Prescott. Yeah. And I said it. I I said it. And to me, he’s showing you why when your starting quarterback misses nine games like they did last year, you’re up against it. And I went back last year and looked at all 14 teams that made the playoffs. And I think only one only one didn’t have a starting quarterback start at least 15 games. And a couple of those they held them out the last game because they didn’t need to win. Yeah. So, if you got your quarterback in there, you got an opportunity. And I just think the way he’s come back, he seems to be playing free. He doesn’t seem to be worrying about his leg. He’s running when he needs to run. He’s racing CD, but there’s very few times the ball’s on the ground unless he’s disgusted and throws one in the ground. Yeah. So, to me, he he’s he’s the MVP. Let’s also remember the last time we saw Dak Prescott playing a full season, he was an MVP candidate in this league. So that anybody that’s questioning Dak, I’m like, you don’t you haven’t really been watching football. You notice how we’ve all offense, offense, offense. Yeah. And we’re going to go four for four off. My my MVP was going to be George Pickins. I mean, you know, you look at what the Cowboys were asking from their wide receiver, too, right? They wanted a guy who could alleviate some of CD Lamb’s workload. They wanted a guy who could come in and take the top off of a defense because that allows CD CD Lamb to move into the slot where he’s been at his best in his NFL career. He’s can play everywhere, but in the slot is really where he’s had a lot of his best work. And George Pickkins is kind of the epitome of a 50/50 ball catcher just because his body control is so good. I’d argue he’s one of the better, if not the best possession, downfield possession contested catch receivers in the NFL. And still, I don’t think he gets enough credit for what he can do after the catch. Not necessarily about which school he went to. I think it’s all about alluding to here. Just put that nonetheless. Nonetheless, uh I think what what they have asked him to do, he has done and then some. And if he and CD Lamb can continue to open doors for one another next season. I said this before when we did 20 questions leading up to training camp. I think George Pickkins earns his first Pro Bowl this year. So George Pickkins is my training camp MVP. All right. Next award we’ve got to give out. Most improved player that we’ve seen at training camp. Mickey, I’ll start with you this time. Oh, that’s not fair. Um how’s that not fair? Cuz I got to think. Well, you had to think. The other one I knew right away, right? Well, he was he wasn’t enjoying his marshmallow. He just burned lost it to our solo stove here to Hades. Oh, I know. Cavante Turpin. He’s getting an opportunity, right? Yeah. And now he’s showing you why. And I know it’s a different level. He wasn’t just a return guy in the USFL. He was a wide receiver. He won the award as offensive player of the year and it was because of his receiving ability and they some of it was him explained to me because he didn’t understand the offense well and they didn’t trust him. Now, for some reason, something clicked and they trust them now. And you’re seeing them throwing the ball to him down the field. Not just jet sweeps, dump off screens, smoke screens. They’re throwing him 15, 20 yards down the field and he’s open. And boy, when he’s open and on the run, they ain’t catching him. It’s interesting that you say that that that you know, some of the things you’re hearing about him not uh being able like maybe they didn’t trust him. The crazy part is that now they’re asking not just to be a receiver, not just to be a return guy. They’re lining him up in the run back field. They’re giving him handoffs. They’re giving him pitches. They’re giving him sweeps. They’re giving him all kinds of stuff. He’s playing all over the place right now. So, so they’re not only trusting him, they’re trusting him with probably as much if not more responsibilities as maybe anybody else on the offense outside the quarterback. I mean, what was it three years ago? The practice at um San Die in San Diego. It was the No, here it was the Chargers. we wherever Cost co Costa Mesa. Yeah. And and he had those returns in the practice, right? And I remember I’ll never forget this talking to him afterwards and I looked at him and I said, “What makes you think I’m looking eye to eye to you that you can make it in the NFL at your size? You’re no bigger than me.” And he goes, “Speed kills.” And I’m like, “Okay, you win.” And Mickey’s like, “I can’t run with that. I can’t run with that.” We would love to see that. That would be great. We’d have to go back many years. Maybe give you a 50 or so yard head start. Uh Patrick, your most improved player. You know, uh for me it’s a it’s a no-brainer. Um I would have liked to to have seen had seen better film from him against the Rams, but for me it’s Deone Clark. It it’s it’s light years over what Deon Clark was putting on the field when he was allowed to get on the field under Mike Zimmer in 2024. Um last year was um kind of a lack of confidence. uh he couldn’t gel with the coaching staff, the defensive coaching staff. Uh Mike Zimmer just basically didn’t believe in him and you could see that he basically lived on the inactives list time and again. So so much to the point so much so that it got to the point where Tommy you and I we’re sitting in the press box and every time the inactives came out in the back half of the season, we were like Demone is on inactives again. Now fast forward to this training camp and again yesterday’s film wasn’t great. So hopefully I’ll see better from him against the Rams and then in the final preseason game. But he is such a standout in this training camp out here in Oxnard. I talked to him um outside of practice and he has like this glow and he said he feels refreshed and he loves the fact that Ibra Flu also is a dedicated linebacker’s coach, but a young-minded dedicated linebacker’s coach. He’s completely bought into Ibra Flu’s system and the belief that the coaching staff has in him that’s coming in and he’s he’s flying around. He’s reading better. He’s reacting better. His physicality was never in question. Okay. But those things he needed to improve, I’m seeing them improve in spades. Now, the only thing I need from Deone Clark is to do it under the bright lights. Yeah, I would have said Deone Clark uh but just to be different. Uh I’ll throw out Maris Leafoul. Not that Meisoul wasn’t good last year during camp, but you could see last year he was trying to figure a lot of things out. He was thinking a lot. This year it seems like he he understands what he’s doing. He’s just flying around. uh there isn’t a lot of having to second guessess himself. He really is just playing by instinct and his in instincts are fast. So I think from a from just a year-over-year comparison, I think he is light years ahead of where he was this time last year. Yeah. And and real quick on De Mo, he’s shown us flashes under the bright lights and not just the fact that he was an all-American at LSU. Um but his rookie season when he came back much sooner than many thought from that spinal fusion surgery in October, he made his debut immediately was an impact guy for Dan Quinn. made another impact or more impact for Dan Quinn in year two, but you know, year three under Mike Zimmer, it just fell off the rails. But he looks like he’s very much back on the rails. We forget in 2023, he was the team’s leading tackler. That’s what I’m saying. 120ome tackles. That’s what I’m saying. And he just got lost in the shuffle somewhere last year and didn’t make sense. Ian Zimmer just it just didn’t work. Sometime, you know, sometimes he just didn’t have a vision for him maybe. I don’t know. Especially with in the building. He is balling out. Yeah, and I’ll close this out with a guy who we didn’t see here at training camp last year, but I think was in need of a confidence boost, and that’s Kier Elim. Even going back to OTAAS, it feels like this is a guy who came in from Buffalo after the Cowboys acquired him via trade and he said, “All right, let’s see if it works.” And boy has it up to this point, I mean, he’s been one of their better, if not their best corner that has played on the field, aside from Deron Bland. So, if that continues, it’s going to be a welcome sign at the start of the year, especially if Trayvon Digs can’t go. Would you have bet that in the first preseason game they withsit him? Not really. Not at all, actually. Oh, we don’t want him playing. We can’t get him hurt. Yeah, that that tells you something. All right, we’ll go rapid fire here with this one. We’re running out of some time. So, rookie of the camp. Can’t do rookie of the year because there has been no year yet. But rookie of the camp, Derek Donzaraku. Shout out to the Q’s. You’re not biased at all. Tough to beat that. All right, Patrick. You’re not biased at all. Um Oh, good grief. It’s It’s Ezaraku. Um yeah, it’s Ezaraku. I could explain why, but it’s Ezaraku. He’s doing some some major things. And I even in the game, granted, he didn’t get I know some people wanted to see, oh, two, three sacks, etc., but he was eating up double teams and freeing up other guys. He’s already being schemed for in a preseason debut. Can I give you a hot take? Go for it. He’s going to be second on this team in in sacks this season. You know what? You know what I like about what you just said? It’s going to piss off Sam Williams. Sam, you heard that? Dante. Dante, you heard that? But I’m telling you, Ezrau, positive motivation. Ezrau, Ezrau’s got he’s got some Oh, he’s got a lot of They should have counted pressure. And I And I think a lot of the things too, like if they use him in a way to where he’s just a guy they bring in to to kind of put pressure on the quarterback where they might be relying on those other guys maybe to do a little more, right? They may be relying on them on rundowns and stuff like that. But I think Azaraku is is primed to be a guy that’s just going to rack up sacks. Maybe the most pro ready edge rusher from this past year’s draft class. Mickey. Yeah, I’m not going to argue with that. I might have if he hadn’t gotten hurt. I liked what Jaden Blue was doing in these practices. Uh, and he there was a practice more than a week ago where he got sideswiped and it looked like he got dinged, right? And he laid there for a while. He went off, they checked him, and I’m going, “Okay, rookie, what you got?” And it wasn’t 10 minutes later, he was back on the field carrying the ball. And that speed t it it it you can time him in the 40. That’s fine. But his takeoff, he gets going so fast, so quick. Um, he was going to be my guy now. Hopefully, you know, it’s a foot, ankle, leg. He’s out of his boot. So, well, that’s good. So anyway, uh, keep an eye on him, but I I would go with Ezaraku. All right, so three Ezarakus and an honorable mention it seemed like there for Jaden Blue. Patrick, you mentioned biased. I will be fully biased. Say it with me, Derek. Hook him horns. Give me Jaden Blue. Well, here’s the thing, too, is yes, Ezra’s been good. I think it’s been interesting to watch the last couple of practices, the joint practice and the preseason game. It seems like all they’re having him do is bull rush. I don’t know if that’s just the Brian Shottenheimer using the seven iron there, but one of Well, we know he can he has other moves. That’s the reason why I’m saying I think it’s more than just he’s not doing like I think there’s something more there, right? And that’s that’s what that’s the point I was trying to make is, you know, if you look at the preseason game and say, “Ah, you know, I don’t think I saw him as much as I wanted to.” Well, he wasn’t really using his hands a whole lot on these pass rushes and he only had like 10 snaps. So, uh, you know, I I agree with Derek. This guy’s going to be a really good player. But man, Jaden Blue, there is a difference between 40 speed and football speed. And I think Jaden Blue has game-changing football speed. And what’s impressed me the most about in this camp, and he was really proud of it when I talked to him the other day, he hasn’t fumbled yet. Mhm. He has not fumbled. And ball security was the biggest issue with him coming out of Texas. So, if that can get that fixed, if that can continue, you’ve got a really good player on your hands and a guy who can uh make a lot of plays on this. Shouts out to Derek Foster when you talk about the fact that Jaden Blue hasn’t put one on the ground yet. And I and I talked to I was going to say maybe it was the Texas coaching staff. No, shouts out. It wasn’t because we’re in backtoback college football playoffs. I’m not going to throw that at my boy. I’m going give my boy Choice what he did with that running back. There are not many better in the game than Desard Choice were at Texas. You think about the five running backs that he sent to the NFL while he was there. So, I’ll say that. That picture speaks for itself. by the way. Welcome. Um, that’s going to do it for us here on Camping Out. What an amazing time we had. Derek, can we do this back at the star? Derrick’s going to sleep. He wanted to keep as long as we do it in the afternoon. I don’t know if we even need the fire with how hot it is, but with Solo Stove, we always want it out here. We don’t need it in Texas. We’ll just put them on the sidewalk like eggs. Right. Right. Thank you to our friends at Solo Stove for the great Solo Stove here that’s with us. We’re going to keep this fire going and light some s’mores after this. for the rest of the crew. Mickey Spagnola, Patrick Nosy Walker, Derek Eagleton, Chris Beam in the front. I’m Tommy Y. Thanks for hanging out with us on camping out. We’ll see you tomorrow with some more content here from training camp in Oxnard. This has been a production of DallasCowboys.com and the DallasCowboys Football Club. How about you, Cowboys? [Music]

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