Detroit Tigers on the Brink of Historic Meltdown | Cody Stavenhagen

Detroit Tigers on the Brink of Historic Meltdown | Cody Stavenhagen

Cody, do the Tigers have a pulse? I I think they have a pulse, but it’s getting lighter by the day, right? I mean, this is this has gotten bad. I’ve never seen anything like it. I don’t really know how to describe it. I don’t have a lot else to say. Uh it has been a very bad stretch of baseball. They’re not getting any breaks. Their roster’s turned into a mess. Um now they’re fighting for their lives. Before we get into like the team and the issues and the problems and the questions, is this the worst off day that you can remember for this team in a sense that they have to wake up today and not play a game staring at the fact that they’ve been one and nine in their last 10 or is this the best off day possible? Regroup, everybody’s ready to go and it’s a fresh day tomorrow with your ace on the hill. That’s kind of a good question, Eric. I asked Spencer Torqulson that after the game yesterday, like, you have an off day. Are you going to think about baseball? You going to totally unplug somewhere in between? He said, “I’m totally unplugging.” He said, “We’re we’re all just disconnecting, not thinking about baseball.” I kind of hope that’s what these guys do. I think they’re spending their off day in Cleveland. So, um, you know, Zach Meisel, my colleague, wrote wrote uh some funny lines. Are they going to go up to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and play a little garage band? Are they going to go out to the zoo? they should do something like that because the more you press, the more you worry about baseball, the more you worry into um dive into the numbers and the scouting reports. Doesn’t seem like that stuff has been working for them. So, I hope they’re having a nice time and maybe can come back uh freshened up tomorrow. Isn’t that what happened at the All-Star break, Cody? And then I think they had a really bad start to the second half of the season. So, are they sure they want to do a reset where you just float away and have a nice boat day? That’s a that’s a fair question. They had six guys at the All-Star game because remember they were really good in the first half. So, um I don’t know, maybe those were the guys who needed to float away on the boat somewhere. Okay, so take me to the trade deadline because we were discussing this. Were the Tigers smashed enough for doing a quantity over quality trade deadline? As I saw you retweet uh yesterday, I’m forgetting the name, but we can show the tweet again at some point here. How many pitchers were brought in and how many pitchers are now not on the roster anymore? So, like when you add up all of the trade deadline, what did they actually get and how much did they miss out on going after big boys? Yeah, they they’ve been crushed a lot for the trade deadline, both at the time and especially now. Um they got Kyle Finnegan who had an IIL st. He’s only allowed one run. Raphael Montero, one of these project guys that was like, “Okay, really? He’s been pretty good. they’ve helped him get better. They really needed to add swing and miss to their bullpen. Those two guys have actually done a decent job helping. Um I think if you were to ask the Tigers and be like, “Well, why didn’t you get a closer?” They’d be like, “Well, when he wants to get Ryan Hley, he’s been awful.” Um and I think that is the thinking that led to this approach. Let’s get a bunch of guys, throw it at the wall, hope a couple of them stick. Kind of a risky approach in itself, though. Is that really a better approach than just going and getting a couple dudes who throw a hundred and are really hard to hit? I think that’s the big question here. But the worst thing they did was go get two starters, Charlie Morton and Chris Paddock. Both came relatively inexpensive. And uh Morton’s no longer on the team. Chris Paddock’s been demoted to the bullpen. He’s hanging on by a thread. I I was one of few banging the jump for like you need to reinforce this rotation. and you’re an injury away from being in a bad spot. Arise Olson got hurt. You got two guys, one of them was 41, came to you with an erra around six. The other Chris Paddock just hadn’t really been that good uh for a couple years now. They have failed spectacularly. And the Tigers have tried to kind of do the cute thing where they cycle in and out a bunch of different pitchers, turn the roster, turn the bullpin every series. They did that last year and it worked. Um they’re showing why that may that’s not necessarily the most sustainable approach because it hasn’t worked this time around. Now you’re entering the biggest series of the year with some relievers stuck in the option cycle and and with a bullpin that just doesn’t look very good beyond one or two guys. Did this happen quick to the to the clubhouse the vibe when you walk in there? Did it happen quick where they’re like, “Ah, whatever. We got this. We got this. Holy crap, we don’t got it.” or has it been like a slow build here through these last 10 games slash two weeks? I I think it’s been kind of quick. I mean, you can go back to June and the Tigers were playing closer to 500 ball than being the team they were in May, but they had such a big game in in a big lead in the AL Central. It never really felt like it. They lost 12 of 13 at one point in July, and it wasn’t great. But you look at the standings and be like, okay, well, this is baseball. They’re going to snap out of it. And I think that was kind of the mentality and they lost a couple games. Um I was with the team in Miami and I was like it feels oddly tense in here. And since then, maybe it’s been slower since then, but the last 10 days it’s like every day feels a little worse, a little tighter, a little more quiet. Um and now you look up and and you’re fighting for their lives. So one of those things that happens gradually and then suddenly kind of all at the same time. Cody, how much of this though do you think was a lack, and I’ve said this, I thought they would turn around once they got it back in their division. Is a lack of I don’t want to say focus because that’s not the right thing, but lo lack of, you know, immediiacy and like we have to go now because they’re like, “Oh, we have a 10-ame lead. Oh, we still have a sevename lead. We still have a fivegame lead.” And they never were able to get that urgency and ready to go and the fire back. And now they have to try and find it. And a lot of times what you see happen is once you lose it, it’s really hard to get it back for most teams. Can they do that? Yeah, right. That’s the big question. I don’t know. I’m not trying to question the competitive character of those guys, and I don’t envy them having to stand in front of the cameras every day and try to explain this when they’re the ones on the field uh kind of getting their teeth kicked in right now. But they’re being tested. That’s the huge question. Can you turn this around? I I do think there must have been some element of not coasting, but it’s just different. When you’re up 10, 12, 14 games, you’re not playing with that pressure. You’re also not playing with urgency. I think that must have set in subconsciously. And then you wonder too, when your front office doesn’t really go get you some real horses at the trade deadline, what message does that send to the team when your front office and and um you know, the coaching staff, they’re bumping guys back to build in extra rest. They’re kind of giving these retread pitchers tryyous because hey, we have a 10-game division lead. We can do this stuff. What kind of message does that send to the players and then all this builds up and suddenly you’re in a really really bad spot on the verge of a historic collapse? To me, I I would kind of buck against that. It sends confidence. Hey, we don’t need that many people. We think what you guys are doing, even though they are all above everybody’s norms for their career or their last like three or four years, we believe in you. So, I would kind of buck against that that if a front office can back the current players on the field, that gives them a vote of confidence. But now you’re you’re in the case where a guy like Colt Keith goes down. He wasn’t producing to like this MVP level. Do they not have enough depth to fill that in? And along with that depth, you knew Jav Bayz was going to come down from where he was. If the team was in another situation, would Jav Bayaz have played himself out of a position for the postseason in the way that he’s played in the last two and a half months? The funny thing about that, Eric, is I’ve kind of been advocating for Jav Bias to play more because the guy who’s been playing over him, Trey Sweeney, has a WRC plus of one in the second half. He’s given you equal to worse production than Jav at the plate. And there’s still some small things Jav Bayz does in the field during the game that can be complete difference makers. Jav Bayz has had a terrible second half. He’s playing like the guy who we weren’t sure if he was going to be brought back on the roster. Uh but to your point, Eric, like the alternative might be worse, and the alternative beyond Trey Sweeney and the organization, at least on the 40man roster, is nothing. They have gotten in a weird spot where especially left-handed bats on the farm, they don’t really have anything other than Kevin McGongle who’s in double A and that it doesn’t seem like they want to bring up. And I don’t necessarily blame him uh for not want to throw McGonogal into that situation, but yeah, the depth has thinned out. You had a guy in Jace Young who’s on this roster replace Keith, big- time prospect. A couple years ago, they oh, they didn’t want to block him. Whatever. His his development has really tapered off. Um, it’s funny how I think every team probably enters the season thinking they have depth and then you get to August, September, you look up and your depth can evaporate pretty quickly based on injuries, based on underperformance. I think that’s certainly happened where now you kind of have two shorts stops who might not be on a lot of other rosters or on playoff rosters, but you have nowhere else to turn. Cratz, let’s talk about Omaha Stakes. And it’s not just steaks, it’s chicken wings, it’s smashburgers, big deli style franks. There are a number of categories that you can hit all in one place. They’ve been doing it for a long time. They’re the best in the biz. And if you got a good fillet, life’s good, man. But you got to finish every meal with some dectable desserts, too. They have those, too, to go along with these delicious steaks. Mhm. Apple caramel tarts on the list among many other menu items to check out. Be the hero that orders Omaha steaks and is the most popular person in your household. So, get fired up for fall grilling with Omaha Stakes. Visit omahastak.com for 50% off sitewide during their redhot sale event. And for an extra $35 off, yeah, 35 bucks off on top of that, use promo code FO at checkout. That’s 50% off at omahastak.com and an extra $35 off with promo code FO at checkout. Seite for details. If at the trade deadline you don’t bring in a big boy, like if you’re the Tigers and you don’t go for a Duran or we talked about even a bat because they had flexibility, a Gino Suarez or something like that. Are you telling your team, “Hey, we believe in you. We don’t need anything.” Or are you telling your team, “Yeah, we don’t want to trade any prospects. We’re on the 10-year plan.” Depends on how you look at it. If you were in the clubhouse and you’re the Tigers, well, if you’re in the clubhouse, you don’t care about the prospects because you want to win now. So, you don’t care. So, you’re like, “All right, well, they must think we’re good.” But at the same time, trust me, there are people that were complaining in that clubhouse that they didn’t go out and make a bigger move. Because even if you think you’re really good, like you don’t think you need any help in the playoffs, you don’t think you need another big boy in the bullpen or another definitely guys complaining about it. I promise you there was guys saying, “Why didn’t we do more?” Yeah. How did you feel at the time, Cody, that the clubhouse reacted to the trade deadline? It was hard to get a sense for it. I think it’s been a reminder that this is a pretty young team. This is a lot of guys who are still trying to establish their careers, trying to stay in line. Uh if they had a problem with the organization, they weren’t going to be saying that to me or anyone in the media. Um I did say at the time like maybe this is a vote of confidence in the guys in the group. But man, yeah, like to your point, these guys want to win. They want to win the World Series and I I think they would know they would feel better if they they they got another big horse in that room. Um, one thing I want to point out, and it’s not really a defensive of the Tigers, but there’s so much focus on the trade deadline, and there are a lot of other teams that were like the Mets that were more aggressive and it didn’t work out. But the Tigers are getting blasted for the trade deadline in part because of other bad decisions they’ve made along the way. Alex Cobb, Kintamaya, they spent 25 million on those two pitchers. They got nothing out of them. They signed John Brebia, they daed him before the All-Star break. um you you add in a couple injuries, they didn’t close the door or they didn’t uh get the Alex Bregman deal done. They didn’t go after a guy like Hassan Kim who was available again mid-season. Some of the waiver claims victories they’ve had on the margins over the past couple years haven’t really been any of those this year. So then when you don’t have that depth, when you have needs in the rotation and elsewhere and you don’t do it at the trade deadline, everyone’s pointing to the deadline saying, “Hey, why didn’t you do more?” In a way, it’s a function of bigger and smaller decisions for the past 10, 12 months. Yeah. Part of it to me is I do think front offices look at their biggest wins as those pickups. Like Kyle Finnegan, you can make a case for, right? Not highly coveted. Then it comes over here, they’re like, “Hey, throw away more splitters. Oh, look, look what we did.” And you can kind of brag about it. It’s not as easy to pull off when you’re convincing your owner for more money and for trading more prospects. So, Cody, do you feel like this front office is digging too deep into, you know, bargain hunting versus going for a big fish when clearly they had that ability, right? They went for Alex Bregman. They just weren’t able to close it. Uh, I mean, yeah, that’s been their approach. Bregman’s really the only big guy they have pursued in a serious manner under under this current regime. And look, a couple years ago, you’re still building up. You’re trying to see what young guys you have. That makes sense. You were coming off a playoff run and you added Tommy Canley and Alex Cobb and John Bre. Yeah. Glabber Tourist was a pretty nice signing. Had a great first half, has tapered off in the second half, but it was a one-year deal. Uh they like their one-year deals. They like their flexibility. Look, I know long-term deals are scary, right? There’s some risk built in there, but um I think the second half has shown that like, hey, the matchups, the mixing and the matching, all that is great. There’s a reason a lot of teams prefer to still just go get really good players. Um sometimes that’s the more reliable way to win games. All right, Cody, we got to remember they control their own destiny. Take us to this week. They have Scooble going twice. It seems like I think they face, but it’s not it’s not Cleveland’s horses, their hottest pitchers right now. How does this week play out? To me, and we talked about earlier, looks like it’s the Tigers advantage because they have Scoo going twice. Doesn’t look great for the playoffs, but they got to get in first. Yeah, I think in an ideal world, you don’t have Scooble going twice because you win some games and you push him off that that last day in Boston. Uh but Ter Scubble is this team’s great equalizer, their great trump card. He’s the best thing this organization has going and you’re going to give him the ball in a big game and hope he can give you, you know, seven shutty or something to that effect. Help you get off this schneide and then hey, maybe you steal one more in Cleveland. Maybe you’re feeling a little better about yourself. We’ll see. You don’t want to lose that start. They’ve lost three of their past five trick starts. But if there’s anything to make you feel better, I think you’re right. I think it’s all right. I messed up. I thought Gavin Williams just pitched. So, the Guardians do have their two best going. They have Gavin Williams and Tanner Bbeby. I thought he pitched on Sunday. I was mistaken. So, Tigers are cooked. My bad. Well, they’re getting a a Guardians team that I mean is historically good in the last few weeks in run prevention. So, Cody, the rest of the way here, it’s three against the Guardians. And then scoreboard watching gets really weird because at one point not long ago it looked like the Red Sox were just going to kind of be firmly in one of those wild card spots. They’re not they have to finish strong. So we might get to that final series of the year where the Tigers need to win and oh wait the Red Sox aren’t cruising either. So that’s their last three games of the year in Boston. So how daunting is this schedule here for them? Um it’s it’s not ideal but it’s going to be some fun baseball. It’s going to be some real atmospheres, some tense, tight atmosphere. The Tigers and Guardians play each other, you know, fighting tooth and nail all the time. You’re going to go into what could also be a big series in Boston with Alex Bregman playing playing third base for the other team. Yeah. Uh I I don’t know if it’s what you want. You’d probably rather face the the White Socks or the Rockies right here, but this is what you got. It’ll be fun. Last year, I covered a team that overcame 0.2% 2% playoff odds and had a historic run. This year, I’m covering a team that is on the verge of blowing 99.9% playoff odds and having a historic collapse. So, I’m so far out of the the prediction business. If the Tigers went on go five and one down the stretch and go to the World Series, it wouldn’t shock me. But also watching this team for the past month, it wouldn’t shock me if if they end up being toast.

Cody Stavenhagen, host of Tiger Territory, joins the show to break down the Detroit Tigers stunning collapse. Once up more than 15 games in the AL Central over the Cleveland Guardians, Detroit has unraveled with injuries, trade deadline misfires, and a bullpen in shambles. Cody explains how the vibe in the clubhouse has shifted, why Tarik Skubal is the team’s only lifeline, and what’s at stake in their crucial series against the Guardians and final stretch in Boston vs the Red Sox. Can the Tigers avoid one of the biggest collapses in MLB history?

Go to https://OmahaSteaks.com to get 50% off sitewide during their Red-Hot Sale Event and use Promo Code FOUL at checkout for an extra $35 off.

Subscribe to the podcast!
https://apple.co/3KWKFNo

Follow all our social media channels for more content!
Tweets by FoulTerritoryTV
https://www.instagram.com/foulterritoryshow/

@foulterritory

https://www.facebook.com/FoulTerritoryShow
https://www.twitch.tv/foulterritoryshow

0:00 Tigers freefalling
4:16 Clubhouse vibe
7:25 Not enough depth?
10:17 Trade deadline regrets?
14:10 Will they make it?