Club 904 | Jaguars – Rams Preview | Will the Jacksonville Jaguars Make ANOTHER Trade?

Club 904 | Jaguars – Rams Preview | Will the Jacksonville Jaguars Make ANOTHER Trade?

Heat. Heat. Heat. Heat. N. in the club Today, in the words of the philosopher Meek Mill, ain’t this the one they’ve been waiting for? John Shipley of Sports Illustrated joins us for the collab that you never knew you needed. Making his maiden voyage in Club 904. We’re going to look at the Jaguars Rams matchup this upcoming Sunday. We’re also going to reflect upon the first six weeks formally of the Liam Cohen era as well as the last 8 n 10 months. My goodness, I can’t believe it’s been that long that we’ve been free of Trent Balky. We’ll dive into some other long-term plays for your Jacksonville Jaguars. Are there trades on the horizon? What do we make of all the money that’s being moved around? All that and more coming up on a Thursday edition of Club 904. Welcome into a Thursday edition of Club 904. I am your host, Mia O’Brien. We are technically taping today’s episode on Wednesday, so it’s technically Wednesday. You’re listening to this on Thursday, October 16th, just days away from the Jaguars match up with the Los Angeles Rams across the pond in London. We are live though and streaming in future me time syndicated on the Action Sports Jacks 247 channel. Brent Martino and Steuart Weber are across the pond right now. So, be sure to lock it in. Like, subscribe to all of Action Sports. Jack’s social media, YouTube.com channels because that is your one-stop shop for all things multimedia when it comes to the Jaguars overseas. Today, a whole heck of a lot we’re going to get into. And it is an honor and a privilege to welcome the one and only John Shipley of Jaguars on SI for his first visit to Club 904. Ship, it’s been a hot minute. And by a hot minute, I mean I saw you 24 hours ago or no, 48 hours ago at the Jaguars facility. How’s it going? It’s going good. It’s going good. It’s hard. It’s hard to keep up. We’ve been there so much over the last like seven days playing two games there in one week. Definitely had me kind of in a haze on Sunday, but we’re all good. Locked and loaded for week seven. Were the Jaguars in a haze though in that 20 to2 loss to the Seattle Seahawks? That is the question. Here’s what we’re going to do, folks. Ship and I are going to break down the Jaguars matchup this upcoming Sunday against the Los Angeles Rams while reflecting on their matchup with the Seattle Seahawks from the previous week. Then we’re going to take a quick break. Then we dive into what I know most of you are here for. You’re looking for scoops. You’re looking for insight into where this team goes in the second half of the season. We’ll reflect upon the operation too and maybe where we may see Liam Cohen’s offense evolve in the weeks ahead. But let’s start with this. John Shipley, James Coleman. Big Games of the Sports Den popped in Club 904 on Tuesday and said the following quote. If Jared Verse wants to whoop Walker Little’s behind, he’s going to whoop his behind. Jared Verse is currently eighth according to PFF and pass rush win rate. Of course, the Rams as a whole one of the better defenses according to DVOA and Aaron Shatz. Um they are the ninth best 4-2 defense that we have seen since 1978 in the National Football League. What do the Jags do to combat this defensive front for the Los Angeles Rams? Yeah, I mean, you look at it and they kind of present a lot of similar problems that the Seattle Seahawks represented, which in fact, I think even deeper than that, I think the Rams have better individual pass rushers. You know, Seahawks are really known more as a stop the run unit. They got after the Jaguars pass blocking obviously to a big degree. Trevor Lawrence had never been sacked more than five times in a game. And they did it while blitzing at like the third lowest rate of any defense in the NFL that week. So the the Rams obviously know how to get after the quarterback if they know how to do anything on defense. They rank fourth in pressures right now, seventh in pressure rate. Jared Verse is a legitimate defensive player of the year level talent. And like on top of that, he’s not a great matchup trait wise for Walker Little. We’ve seen Walker Little before kind of struggle with those more powerbased pass rushers. uh he normally has more success against speed guys or really finesse guys or even guys try to win based on technique. Uh the power is always kind of giving him some issue and Jared versus entire pass rush you know skill set is more or less that he’s trying to run through somebody’s face on every single play. So it’s definitely not an ideal matchup I don’t think for the Jaguars. But I think when you look at the other things that the Jaguars can try to take advantage of, whether that’s trying to move the ball a little bit on the ground, Liam Cohen said he could have been, you know, a little bit more committed to that against the Seahawks. It felt like the Jaguars went into the game thinking, okay, their defensive line’s really good. Their secondary is hurt. We have to throw the ball this week. And then they just didn’t move on from that during the game. I feel like they’ll have to be more balanced this week because I feel like that’s when the offense has been at its best. you know, Tre Trevor Lawrence in this passing game isn’t efficient enough to throw it 50 times and, you know, expect good results. So, I think if the Jaguars want to combat that defensive line, you know, the way to get after it is by leaning on Travis CTN and to a lesser extent, Be Shaude. And that’s the point that James, the former Florida State fullback, made on Tuesday. He said, “It’s not a matter of this offensive line being mediocre or below mediocre. It’s the reality that there’s maybe one or two quarterbacks in the National Football League that can drop back 42 times in a game and you can win that football game handily. It’s the reality of we’ve always viewed the term game manager, I think, John, or at least in recent history with this negative connotation when that’s what you want your quarterback to be. You want them to be the point guard and you want to have an equal distribution as much as possible. Um maybe not 250 250 as the philosopher Urban Meyer once claimed, but you want to have balance. And so I I say this, we knew the Seattle Seahawks run defense was going to be stout, number two in the National Football League coming into the week six matchup. The Rams are 15th. Why will the Jaguars be able to run on the Los Angeles Rams comparatively to Seattle? I I think you look at the Seahawks defensive front and the Rams have some premier pass rushers and Jared Verse and Byron Young obviously Kobe Turner. Uh Braden Fisk had a really great rookie season, but the Seahawks front to me is deeper in terms of, you know, the rotation and wave of guys that can send out and it’s also just a more stout unit against the run. I’d give the Rams the edge in terms of their natural pass rush ability, but I don’t think they are as stout. You know, they don’t have a Leonard Williams up front, Byron Murphy. You know, Puna Ford’s a I was just going to say, don’t you take Puna Ford’s name in vain, John. is a really good player and he’s been like a really impactful addition for them, but the Seahawks kind of do it with, you know, by sending a wave of run stoppers at you, whereas it feels like Puna Ford is, you know, pretty much their entire like line of defense against I mean, he’s big enough. He’s big enough to be the entire line of defense. He’s an absolutely terrifying looking person. So, I mean, I I I think that’s the biggest reason to think so. And it’s also that, you know, just the way that the Rams play defense. You know, the way Chris Schula kind of structures his defense, you know, there’s he’s not loading up the box a ton. He’s kind of spreading his defense out. They play a lot of soft, you know, shells, soft coverages, so the corners are off the ball a bit. You can kind of get the edge on them. I I think those are some of the reasons why the Jaguars need to think they should at least try to get the run game going on Sunday. And it’ll be curious if they can get the passing game going because while yes, obviously that was the big talking point for Liam Cohen on Monday, this idea of we need to focus on ourselves and what we do well, which is running the football. And that’s the identity of the 2025 Jaguars, not Trevor Lawrence dropping back 42 times. Maybe somewhat surprisingly, John, the Rams passing defense is ninth in total yards allowed through the air. a little surprising when you look at that depth chart and I feel like we say it every year, but ultimately this is a Rams defense that doesn’t draft defensive backs or safeties high and yet they’re able to maximize undrafted free agents and day three picks to the tune of top 10, top 15 rankings. No, 100%. They definitely get more bang out of their buck than most teams do. I mean, you look at their defensive, you know, back depth chart entering the season and you’re like, you know, are they really entering the season as Super Bowl contenders like with these guys as their quarterbacks, but they’ve always felt comfortable doing it. I do think part of their numbers, you know, they played Cooper Rush. They played the the Texans when Nick Kaye was still struggling to, you know, tell his left from his right early in the season. Play still struggling with that. I I mean I listen you played the Rams and you or excuse me, not the Rams. You played the Ravens, one of the worst defenses in the league. You played the Titans, literally the worst team next to the Jets. I I don’t But that’s besides the point. Continue. No, I’m with you. I’m I’m When the Seahawks play the Texans on Monday, it’s either going to be like the dagger that ends like the Texans season or it’s going to be the their emphatic, okay, they’re here to play, you know, for the AFC South this year. Because I’m with you. I mean, there’s a clear reason why Houston went 0 and3 against the good teams they played and then 2 and 0 against, you know, the two terrible teams that they played. But I also think that kind of factors into, you know, the Rams, they played Jaylen Hurst as well and obviously their passing game’s kind of been a mess. The the one thing, you know, M. Jones kind of got after them some, but it wasn’t like M. Jones was having like a Sam Darnoldesque game a couple weeks ago against Tampa where he’s just dropping bombs left and right. you know, there’s a lot of checkdowns, a lot of soft coverage from Los Angeles. So, I feel like while it’s been a productive unit, it’s still one of the Jaguars like their talent level at some point should be able to have the advantage. Like Brian Thomas obviously had the bad drop against Seattle, obviously had the other rep where he slips running, you know, coming out of his break and isn’t able to come down with what was otherwise a wellplaced pass. But other than that, you look at his other eight targets and that to me was by far the best he’s looked. all see it was the first time he looked like 2024 Brian Thomas all season in my opinion for you know most of a complete game and even the the two miss plays I mean th those are plays that he wasn’t making last year at times either he didn’t suddenly just have bad hands this year I mean how how many touchdowns of his last year did he double catch you it’s just it just comes with the territory of his game so I think Brian Thomas Jr. is still a premier talent and if he continues his trajectory, I don’t think there’s any reason to think he can’t get going against this specific secondary. Oo, interesting. I like that take, John Shipley. We’re going to dive into the discourse surrounding number seven coming up in just a little bit. But first, with regards to Sunday’s game, I want to flip it on over to the defensive side of the ball for the Jacksonville Jaguars. Uh, my first question is simple. Who marks Dvonte Adams? Expect it with Puka Nakua being out. I mean, who else? And I think 22 Atwell’s out as well already ruled out for Sunday’s game too. It So what I expect it to be is for Buster Brown, Greg Newsome, Travis Hunter to all get their own reps against him that the Jaguars don’t really have like, you know, once they traded Tyson, you know, they don’t really have size in their quarterback room. Everybody’s already, you know, kind of going to lose the size battle to Devonte. What I would do if I was them and what I think their lesson coming out of week six should have been is if the other team has an alpha male wide receiver, you’re putting Travis Hunter up. And that’s even if Travis Hunter isn’t playing the whole game on defense. I think he’s played like 39% of the defensive snaps this year. If you want to keep doing that, that’s fine. But when he is in the game, I wouldn’t let there be a snap where Travis Hunter isn’t on Devonte Adams. I don’t really expect that quite yet. But I think the tape, the numbers, everything the last few weeks has shown that Travis Hunter, while a rookie and while he’s gonna have his growing pains, is still their best corner. And that’s not even like a slight to Jordan Lewis who’s played really well. Buster Browns had three pass breakups in the last two games. I think Greg Newsome’s a really, you know, good talent. But Travis Hunter, I mean, you can see on that play against JSN at the end of the first half last week, he’s just he’s a different talent. And somewhere in London right now, Brent Martino is punching the air in celebration hearing you say that because that was his biggest takeaway on Sunday’s postgame show in case anyone missed it out there. According to underdog fantasy, uh the Jags only played five defensive backs on 20% of their snaps. That of course had to deal with the Seahawks lining up in two wide receiver sets and 12 personnel so much. I don’t think that right now as much as Shawn McVey in this new iteration of the Rams has really committed to running the ball. He they drafted Terence Ferguson out of Oregon High because he wants to have the tight ends be a more integral part of this offense. They have not up to this point. And so I think because you will see more 11 personnel even without Puka Nakua for the Rams on Sunday. I think that opens up the door for Travis Hunter because that’s why he played a season high 11 snaps at right corner. A and I think that a lot of it just had to deal with not having Tyson Campbell, but also when they were in two two defensive backs because they were in their base defense, it was Jordan Lewis and then Buster Brown and Travis Hunter didn’t even have to come onto the field. So, I think that that changes, correct me if I’m wrong, just because of the personnel that the Rams are expected to run. No, for sure. And I think also, you know, like you said, you know, they trade Tyson Campbell, Greg Newsome had only been there for like 48, 72 hours for the game. that obviously played a role in it, but I I think the health of the wide receiver room plays a role well. You know, DA Brown is now getting further removed from that shoulder injury that that’s why I think, you know, when they didn’t have Deami against the 49ers and everybody kept wondering why isn’t he playing defense really at all, that to me was the biggest reason is because, you know, they’re already short one receiver. Uh they they couldn’t afford to be short a second one. They just needed Travis Moore at receiver that day. And that’s kind of the beauty of having Travis Hunter is, you know, it can kind of depend game to game where you need him more. But again, I I think moving forward the strategy should be if you’re playing a team with a number one receiver, go ahead and just, you know, cut cut that cord. Just, you know, let Travis Hunter go out and do his thing. So, the other thing I want to note about Seattle and their offensive game plan, you noted it off the top ship, this idea of they were very much like, we’re going to play it vanilla. We don’t want to even risk Sam Darnold throwing the ball and risking against the the defense that has the most takeaways of any team in the National Football League up to this point. We’re just going to let him drop back 16 times, run the ball for barely anything, and then hope that a couple explosive plays take us over the top like it did. I don’t think you will see that, like I said, from the Rams just based off who they have. But at the same time, Seattle also benefited by lining up in more heavy personnel from Max protecting. Do you think that is the reason the Jaguars struggled to get pressure on Sam Darnold or is this more of a long-term problem? I I think it’s a little bit of both. I think it’s a big reason why they didn’t get after Darnold much. Like against the Kansas City Chiefs, for example, you know, they didn’t have Trayvon Walker. I I think you could just tell most of that game that they were putting four to six hands on Josh Hines Allen on every play. And that’s just the reality of the Jaguars defense that, you know, defenses have to give attention to both Hines Allen and Walker. And when one of them isn’t on the field, they can kind of isolate the other because, you know, the Jaguars depth guys and Emanuel Agbon, Dewan Spoot, and their interior guys, Eric Armstead, Devon Hamilton, Mason Smith, just none of those guys are ever going to be at the top of a coach’s scouting report of, okay, this is who we have to stop this game. It it’s the conversation starts and ends with Hines Allen and Walker. Walker obviously was really limited against the Seahawks. Played I think only like 16 snaps. Almost makes you wonder like was there even a point to him playing in in in general third down you know they’re like and he admitted to me in the locker room afterwards he was like yeah no money downs and some second downs like that was and to his credit he got a couple pressures and you know for uh Hines Allen it was a game where you know like you said a lot of max protect they were clearly putting a lot of attention on him. I think that max protect was the biggest reason the Jaguars didn’t get after Darnell much because I mean Cohen put it well. He said they were either a max protect or they were getting rid of the ball quickly. You know, they weren’t just dropping him back and giving the Jaguars main chances to get after him. And I firmly believe Anthony Campanelli, you know, I know his exotic blitzes had like caught the eyes of a lot of people, but I firmly believe that if you asked him what kind of what style would you play, he would say, I want to rush four and drop seven in coverage. So, I I think that’s what he wants to do. When you do it against a team that has so many guys in pass protection, it’s harder to do. But I also think I mean, you just look at the metrics, you know, the pressure rate from, you know, their backups and their interior guys, none of them are really getting after the quarterback very well. Right now, just by the numbers, their third best pass rusher is Mason Smith, who while he has had flashes, it’s just been that flashes, you know? I mean, they haven’t gotten consistent pressure from Armstead. Smoot and Abba, I believe, have pressure rates of like 2.4 4 and 4.2%. So I I think biggest reason they didn’t get pressured against the Seahawks was because of how the Seahawks played them. But I do think as you get along, you know, that could become a bit more of a red flag just getting that pressure outside of Hines Allen and Walker. And now they have to go against the NFL’s leader in passing yards at age 37. Remember when Matthew Stafford was like going to go hang out with Brian Dable? Like that was a lot of fun ship at the combine when it was oh yeah he’s going to go to New York going to reunite with his brother-in-law Chad Hall. Whoops. Um no he stayed in LA and uh he’s healthy after being in the uh bionic chamber or whatever it was called. What was it called? Do you remember back? Yeah bio for something like that. I I I had completely forgotten the Chad Hall bit and you just reconed it for me. That that that is that is a fantastic line of thinking that people went with. So like they just hired him to try to get Yes. Stafford and then when Stafford says no, they’re just like, h you’re well, he’s also the he’s literally the assistant quarterback’s coach. Uh subscri subscribers to the O’Brien NFL notebook and our Patreon uh heard that story earlier this week. So, uh another plug to make sure that you’re locked in there if you’re not already. But truthfully, John, why at age 37 is Matthew Stafford leading the National Football League in passing yards? Why has this offense, even after he missed most of training camp, been so effective? I mean, he gets better honestly every every year. I think he obviously there’s limitations to his game in terms of the mobility. He’s not going to be extending many plays. He’s not going to leave the pocket very often, but I mean the the ability to which he can manipulate defenses with his eyes uh pre-nap, postnap, and then I mean he has a case even at his age uh there’s a case to be made that he has the most arm talent in the NFL right now just you know strictly from where he can put the ball uh the velocity the different arm angles he can hit. I mean that play against the 49ers where he finds 22 Atwell downfield, you know, nobody remembers it very much because they didn’t win the game, but if they win the game, you’re seeing that play for the next, you know, three and four months on highlights. He’s just an absolutely unreal quarterback. And I think, you know, for a Jaguars defense that stresses, you know, having eyes on the quarterback and on his eyes, you know, it could be a a frustrating day because I’m not sure there’s any defense that I would pick to succeed against Matthew Stafford the way he’s playing right now. He’s he’s legitimately a Hall of Fame talent and he’s playing like I think still the best football he’s ever played. The Jaguars 29th in the National Football League with just eight total sacks. We will see if that changes or if they add to their NFL leading 15 takeaways. 15, right? Or we have 14 still. I I’ve lost track. I believe 14. I think it it should have been 15 on like four different occasions on Sunday. JJ Green out of this, John. No, it wasn’t. There were multiple. There were like several times where I’m like, “Wow, that really should have been an inter interception.” Let’s take a quick break. We know why you’re all here. Ship and I are going to hit the latest rumors surrounding the Jaguars as well as reflect upon the first six, seven weeks of the Liam Cohen 2025 season. We’ll be right back after this. Welcome inside the Armor Guard exterior and gutter helmet showroom. 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If you missed any of today’s program, of course, you can catch it on demand on the Action Sports Jacks YouTube channel as well as wherever you get your podcast. But ship, we know why they’re here. They’re hoping we’re going to drop some scoops. They’re hoping we have some insight. Before I get to potential trade targets for the Jacksonville Jaguars, positional or specific players, I do want to address what we do know right now, which is that James Gladstone and the front office have really been moving a lot of money around here in the last week after trading Tyson Campbell for Greg Newsome and a pick swap last Wednesday night. And so you tell me in adding more void years to the likes of Jordan Lewis, Deami Brown, Greg Newsome’s current contracts, moving money off the books, giving signing bonuses in cash. What do you believe the play is for James Gladstone? Is it quite simply to create $12 million in cap space just to have a healthy ecosystem financially if something was to break or is there in your opinion a fire to the smoke? Like I I don’t think they did it for a specific move or player. I don’t think they’re like, “Okay, we need to create an X amount of cap space because this is the guy we’re targeting.” I think they did it because they needed to at least give themselves the flexibility and the ability to go after somebody if they find the right deal. Because, you know, after trading Tyson Campbell, you know, like a lot of people painted the Tyson Campbell trade as like a money saving thing and it really in the short term really isn’t. You’re taking on more money on Greg Newsome’s contract because it’s a fully guaranteed fifth year option this year. So, you’re paying more money this year for Greg Newsome than you would for Tyson Campbell. You get 19.5 million in dead cap next year for Tyson Campbell. You’re paying So, he’s about on your books for about $20 million just to not play for you. You don’t really get any cap relief from not having Tyson Campbell’s contract anymore until 2027. So really the move was more about, you know, yeah, we might not save money, but we don’t necessarily want to pay a guy who we don’t think fits the scheme. So I I I don’t think that was a factor in the Tyson Campbell trade. And I think taking on Newsome and his contract, they had to create some room to begin with. But I think they did it so they could be flexible to make a move because if there’s one thing that I think people should know about, you know, this regime so far is that they’re not going to be afraid to really unturn and uncover every single stone. Whether they’re the ones making the phone calls, whether they’re the ones getting called, I mean, they they’ve just been a flurry of trades. Christian Kirk, the Travis Hunter trade, Luke Forner, Tank Bsby, Fred Johnson, Tim Patrick, now obviously Tyson Campbell and Greg Newsome. I mean, it’s a it’s a long long list of trades so far. So, I think the biggest reason is they just want to give themselves the ability to make a move if they find one as opposed to, you know, they’re doing the Birdman, you know, hand rubbing gif and already, you know, have their move picked out. It helps when you can trade with more than four teams. Heyo. Um, speaking of Trent Balky, I I think what’s interesting to me, John, is that while yes, there was I don’t want to say damage done and there was a bit of a mess that James Gladstone inherited because I don’t think that Trent Balky left the books a complete mess, but constantly adding void years to deals and pushing money out further into the future was not something that he prided himself on through the first two to three years of his reign as general manager. But then we saw it in the final two seasons that he was not afraid to do that. Now seeing these void years being added to contracts like a one-year deal for Deami Brown. I think it’s four void years added on. What does that say about what James Gladstone is doing in terms of operationally? Is it signaling we’re going to win now and we’ll figure it out later or do you think that money gets stretched out even further? I I think it’s showing a lot that, you know, really their mindset is that they want to take advantage of where they are right away. you know, they don’t see this and they’ve never called this a rebuild. You know, through all the different changes that they’ve made and, you know, overturning about half the roster, if not more than half, they’ve never gone as far as to say, “Okay, we’re starting from scratch. This is a clean slate. This is a rebuild.” They’ve said the opposite really, that they expect to, you know, have some success early on. So, I I I think the big thing with the void years is, you know, it’s really kicking the can down the road to give yourself that present- day flexibility to be aggressive. But the the way the cap goes up each year, the way that it’s projected to continue rising and just how Cassri the Jaguars owner is, I mean, that’s why you see successful successful front offices like the Philadelphia Eagles, you know, do it so often. You know, there’s a real edge to getting it, right? Absolutely. Okay, so trades, possible targets before that November 4th trade deadline. I’ve said it on Club 904. I’ve said it at the Moryan NFL notebook. John, what I have been told and what I believe is that the Jaguars will be in the markets for minnows, not Sharks. I don’t believe this Jeffrey Simmons nonsense. I don’t think the Giants, now that they think they have a quarterback, are going to be willing to trade Dexter Lawrence. And so realistically, who are some names that you think maybe that’s a potential guy or even if it’s not a specific name, someone in a ballpark or a position group? Because I do think defensive line is at the forefront. As Jeremy Fowler and Ian Rapaort reported as well, I do believe that to be a fact, but as somebody in the league told me earlier this week, John, everyone’s looking for defensive line. It’s not as easy as, oh, well, we’re just going to get that guy. Everyone wants that guy. And do you have the capital to go get that guy? No. 100%. It’s, you know, saying you want to improve your defensive line. I mean, that’s like, you know, saying you want, you know, uh, to win the lottery tomorrow. Of course, you want to improve your defensive line. Pass rushing interior defensive lineman. Oh, what? I would also There’s a reason Premier defensive tackles rarely hit free agency. And there’s a reason why Milton Williams when he did hit free agency got paid an eyepopping, you know, amount of money. It just doesn’t happen often. I do think that’s where the Jaguars focus probably be. I’ve said for the last couple weeks when people have asked me, you know, I don’t think safety, I don’t think receiver. I, you know, I think they’re going to keep the running back position as as it is. But I really think defensive line, whether that’s defensive tackle, backup, defensive end, and then tight end are the three positions that I’m really looking at the most because, you know, obviously they’re they’re going to get Brit Strange back at some point this year. Probably within the next month, month and a half. I’m not sure if they’ll get him back right when he is eligible to come off IR, but they’ll get him back at some point. But until then, like that’s a big void in the offense because like, you know, the the way they built the tight end room is they built it clearly for Hunter Long and Johnny Munt to be deaf guys, you know, not guys that you’re leaning on to play most of the game and you can’t put the their skill sets together and kind of recreate in the aggregate what Strange gives you. So, I could see them looking for a tight end with kind of a similar game to Strange, whether that’s Chig Auano in Tennessee, whether that’s I think Josh Oliver, if you can make the money work sense. Yeah. I mean, he’s really in a lot of ways was like Jacksonville’s Britain Strange before, you know, Britain Strange was there. It didn’t end up working out for him, but you know, the Viking season has gone kind of sideways. They always are looking for more picks. Maybe you can get them a day three pick to get a guy who can help you when Brendon Strange is out and then serve as a really good number two that complements his skill set when he comes back. As for defensive line, I think Malik Collins of Cleveland is obviously the name that a lot of people think just because, you know, Cleveland’s deep at defensive tackle that just drafted Mason Graham. Mason Graham does happen to have the same pressure rate as Devon Hamilton, but that’s nor here. We don’t want to talk about that though. We don’t want to talk about that. And I I think another guy that you don’t see you haven’t seen talked about much really since he got drafted. I think Logan Hall from Tampa Bay would be an interesting guy. Somebody who maybe could just use a change of scenery. I think he had five and a half sacks last year. There’s obviously some talent there, but he could really bring your nickel package, some juice. So th those are kind of the three names that I’ve been thinking of, not necessarily hearing those, but the three names that based on what I believe they’re going to look at are three guys who make sense of them. I want to throw one at you that I was workshopping this afternoon and he just signed a a reworked three-year extension back in August. So, I don’t think it’s a reality, but I also don’t think the Miami Dolphins expected to be in the position they find themselves in. I know there’s some reports out there that both Chub and Phillips, the two edge rushers, could be on the move out of Miami if things continue to go ary. What do you think about Zack Celler, Zyler, however you pronounce it? I know people change their pronunciation of it every day. I mean, he’s a player. I mean, I mean, he’s a pillar of their team, so that’s why I don’t think they trade him. But I was just trying to think if Miami is going to be a seller at the deadline, who’s an interior piece that the Jaguars maybe could pluck off. Oh, no, 100%. I think he’d be a great fit. He would give them a lot of, you know, that kind of interior push that they’ve been missing. I I know being there in, you know, Miami for that joint practice earlier in the year, uh, he gave the Jaguars offensive line complete fits was one of the better players on the field and was kind of wrecking what the Jaguars are doing. So, you would have to assume they’re fans of him. No, I I I think he’s it like if you’re going to take a swing, that’s the kind of swing I think would make sense. Not a Dexter Lawrence, not a Jeffrey Simmons. Mostly because I just don’t think the Titans would, for as dysfunctional as the Titans are, I don’t think they’re trading Jeffrey Simmons to an AFC South rival any anytime soon. So, I mean, I I think if you’re going to take a swing, I think that’d be a heck of a one to take. And of course, the Dolphins drafted Kenneth Grant out of Michigan. Different player, same position though, at number 12 overall this past April. So, I just saw that a couple of the Dolphins names had popped up. And so, then I was like, okay, who do they have on the interior? That could be interesting. One more just because it was floated to me. He would have to wave a no trade clause. To my knowledge, he has moved his family back to Arizona because this is this is the last dance. If Jonathan Ganon and company continue to implode, is Klayas Campbell on the market? Does Kas have a no trade clause? Yeah, I know. It’s hil It’s hilarious. The whole thing is hilarious. But that’s a good bit. That’s a good bit. I mean, he’s somebody they’ve it’s like for the last like three or four years they should have signed. Like, you know, they’ve they’ve had him in the building before and they just haven’t pulled the trigger on it. I I I think if you’re talking from like a cultural perspective, he’d be a big help from them, but he’s also still a really good player. Like, he’s his pressure rates like around at 10%. He has 13 pressures. Both would be by far the best of any interior Jaguar guy. He has three sacks or three and a half sacks. He’s still a really good player. I think putting him back with Josh Hines Allen and all that Hines Allen has matured as a player and as a person since he last played with him would be really interesting. And he could show, you know, Mason Smith and the other young guys kind of in that room, you know, how to go about their business. I mean, Kas to this day, you know, if I’m thinking of the best leaders that I’ve seen in the Jaguars locker room since I started covering them in 2019, he’s probably near the very top. Like, it’s it’s hard for me to think of many that were better. And to your point, it’s not like you’re just trading for a culture guy if he was to be made available. It’s the fact that he would be your most productive interior defensive lineman instantly. And that was the funny thing about like the last time that they were flirting with signing with him, I think was 2023. Yeah. And I want to say I think Yeah. And I want to say he signed with the Atlanta Falcons. And it came out that um you know like reports came out that you know the Jaguars front office basically told him like we kind of see you as a backup like we want you to be a leader but not to play as much and no he would have been pretty easily one of their best players. Different front office. Different front office. Great segue. John Shipley. Um what do you make through six weeks of regular season games now nearly 10 months of Liam Cohen and James Gladston’s and Tony Melli’s collaborative effort to lead the Jacksonville Jaguars. We’re going to go big picture, a couple different tent pole items, but from an operational standpoint, did Shod Khan finally get it right? I think there’s a lot of reasons to think so. I think, you know, obviously still six games is a little early, but from what the signs that we’ve seen so far, I mean, everybody knew that Liam Cohen was a good play caller and that he would put together a good offensive scheme. I know the offense hasn’t exactly taken off yet, but I don’t think, you know, Liam and his play calls or the scheme is a reason for that. I think he’s a big reason why they’ve been successful in a lot of ways. But what people need answered was, you know, can he be a leader of men? And, you know, from everybody I’ve talked to in that organization since Liam got there as, you know, they think Liam is the piece when it comes to what they’re trying to build. like you know obviously Tony is very important obviously James Gladstone is very important obviously Trevor Lawrence is very important but Liam Cohen is very clearly seen as the most important piece of what’s being built in Jacksonville right now and the way he’s won over you know people uh in the locker room uh throughout the organization he’s clearly somebody who guys like playing for they’ve taken on his personality you know and he said that he wanted them to be a physical team uh you know the offensive line up until week six had been more physical than really it’s been in years. They’ve been tough and I think a lot of that comes from Liam. But I also think that they did a good job of kind of establishing that, okay, here’s what we’re doing. If you’re not moving in this direction with us, you don’t have to be here. which the Jaguars for years have, you know, had malcontents, you know, throughout the roster, just kind of wasting away and guys unhappy with their role, guys unhappy with the coaching staff, guys unhappy with the front office and it was more or less shrugged that and I think Liam has done a good job of identifying the people that they want to build around and the people who, you know, they think that they are just better off kind of moving on from. Like I I said to somebody like Tyson Campbell was like the first guy that this regime like jettisoned off where I wasn’t like okay this was a culture move like no no everybody loved Tyson Campbell like the coaches love Tyson Campbell they didn’t love the big plays he was giving up but as a as a player and as a guy and as a soldier for the franchise everybody loved Tyson Campbell right all the other moves that I can think of they were doing you know because they wanted to get everybody on the same page that complete buyin which I don’t think the Jaguars have had often in the past. Like my my big critique of the Trent Balky era Jaguars has little to do with his evaluation ability because he obviously did bring in some talented players. Brian Thomas, good player. Trayvon Walker, good player. Parker Washington, Anton Harrison, good players. He found some good players, but building a team is different than drafting players. And I think that the Jaguars have gone the extra mile in terms of team building under Liam, under James, and under Tony to make sure that they have that right mesh, not just on the field, but in the locker room, off the field, because in a lot of ways that matters more than just having the most talented team. We say it here at the Homestead, I think at least once a week. Talent evaluation was like the eighth or ninth reason Trent Balky was fired, folks. Like that was not what where the issue was. It was everything else. It was the fires in the building. It was the the survival instincts. But that’s not here. We live in the James Gladstone, Liam Cohen era. And I do agree and cosign to your point, John, that I think Liam Cohen is a dude. He is what Shawn McVey and Kevin O’Connell said he was, which is he has next. But is he the quarterback whisperer that those other two gentlemen are? I’ve said it time and time again. I think I say it every episode. Again, I I don’t want people to compare Trevor Lawrence’s development in Liam Cohen’s offense to Baker Mayfield and Liam Cohen because number one, very different trajectory. Number two, very different skill set. And number three, Liam Cohen was very forthright from the moment he got hired. These are two different offenses that he’s trying to run between Jacksonville and Tampa. 100%. And different supporting cast, too. Like I I know obviously Tampa had some receiver injuries last year, but when everybody was healthy, I mean Mike Evans, Chris Godwin, Tristan Worse, I mean all three of those guys would have been, you know, the best player on this current iteration of the Jaguars offense. But I I do think that you’ve seen improvements from Trevor, especially in the last three games. He’s been much cleaner, much more efficient, has for the most part cut out some of the boneheaded plays from the first three weeks. you know, he’ll still have the the couple misses a game where he throws high or whatever. Those are always going to be there, but I think the last two games especially like he he was purely in and like you said, game manager isn’t a negative on on its surface, but he it felt like purely was in game manager mode through the first four games, you know, wasn’t trying to press the issue, was just trying to run, you know, what’s called the last two weeks, you’ve seen him become more of a playmaker and play more out of structure. It was really out of necessity, especially against the Seahawks. But I think that was the next natural step for him in Cohen’s offense. And I think Cohen has shown that, you know, he can put the scheme around him to scheme guys open downfield. Brian Thomas’s touchdown catch was a great call by Liam Cohen. You know, doing that fake screen and the Seahawks bid on it completely. So, I think it’s instance instances like that or where you see why Liam and why Trevor just kind of work. Yeah. And that’s where I still have confidence. And Liam Cohen has said in Tampa, that offense really didn’t take off until probably like week nine, week 10, that’s why even if they were to lose on Sunday, I don’t think it’s over for this offense in any way, shape, or form because that offense in Tampa had to evolve as injuries occurred. And I believe this offense will evolve based off of who they’re playing as well as what the skill set of their players are. Speaking of current players, you hit it you hit on Brian Thomas Jr. a little bit earlier. You’re not worried to be clear? No, I’m I’m not worried in the sense of I still think Brian Thomas Jr. is going to have a productive season and be a very productive receiver. Now, is you don’t think they missed on the evaluation like I I’ve heard some other folks maybe? No, no, no. I I think he still very clearly can take over a passing game. Now, does that mean in the off season they try to find, you know, somebody who can kind of support the areas where he’s weak? I I think they could definitely do that. And I definitely think there are parts of Brian’s game that could keep him from being that elite, you know, alpha male option, you know, specifically going over the middle. But in terms of what he can bring to the offense, no. I I think there’s not much reason to be worried about Brian Thomas. Is there reason to be worried about him becoming a top five receiver in the NFL? Sure. But I mean, if that’s your biggest worry with him at the end of the day, you’re in decent shape. Well, especially because now you mentioned you would like to see Travis Hunter potentially at least this week on Devonte Adams as much as possible. That then I would think takes away from wide receiver reps. And the thought is he is not afraid to go over the middle of the field and make a tightly contested catch. And so what are your expectations not just this Sunday but going forward usage? Is it quite simply just week to week and if he helps you win the football game no one cares how many snaps he plays? I I think it is week to week, but I do think if they, you know, if you had to give them a truth serum, they would tell you that right now where they’re lacking the most is scoring points on offense. So, you know, seeing the plays he makes, uh he’s made, you know, four explosive plays uh in the last four games. Uh some of them being just simple after the catch, you know, fooling guys. He’s been really good in fantastic catch situations. two is two of two this year and that’s why every other Jaguars receiver has struggled. But he also, you know, I did a story on it earlier. Out of 114 receivers who have ran, you know, so many who have 20 targets this year, he ranks 99th and average depth of target. So, his role really has been scaled down in terms of he’s just not getting many downfield shots. I think that’s the next evolution of his game. But it’s, you know, the obstacle of dealing with the Travis Hunter situation is how much you give him on this side of the ball because you’re going to need him on the other side of the ball because it’s kind of the gift and the curse. Like I I’m sure they’d love to expand his role as receiver and teach him the other three receiver positions, but look at last week, he was the only guy who could really keep up with Jackson Smith and Jake B. So, can you afford to do that when he’s also kind of your secret weapon on defense? And it’s just this big question of out of the slot, can you run him downfield? Like, can you just tell I mean, and James made the point on Tuesday’s show, he’s like, “Yeah, you just literally tell him, go to this marker, go to this area of the field, and come back a little bit and I will throw it to you and you could teach him that.” I I don’t know if it’s that simple. I I think that there is a case to be made that he is one of your better vertical threats because Deami Brown since coming back from the injury hasn’t looked the same. But at the same time, like I I don’t think they’re going to stray away from the plan with an asterisk. I’ve heard from enough people in that building that they have made it known Travis Hunter needs to have the ball in his hands more. No, I and I I think you know Sunday was really the first game, you know, this year. And I know fantasy football people who took him in round five or six complain every week about him not the ball enough. Sunday was the first game where I really did feel like, okay, figure something out to get him the ball in his hands more because when the offense is lacking, you know, what he can do after the catch is just so special that you just need to figure out some way to scheme the ball into his hand. I know they try to do it on screens. I’d probably throw those out because it’s clear that nobody is falling for them at this point. But just getting him this ball what you know in space in some variety that definitely needs to be an emphasis moving forward because he he he is a spark plug after the catch. A long awaited podcast collaboration between John Shipley and yours truly comes to a close. I would like to take a brief victory lap. I know it’s only 6 weeks in ship, but you and I were on the Liam Cohen train early and here we are four and two your Jacksonville Jaguars through six weeks. We will see what happens. But it obviously is encouraging knowing this was supposed to be the more difficult part of their schedule knowing the easier I won’t say soft. I don’t want to use the sword. Don’t want to put the Colts in the sword category. Um the softer, easier part of their schedule is still to come. Um before we get on out out of here, any other final thoughts as well as plug away anything you have cooking over at Jags on SI? Yeah, you can find me and all my team’s thoughts on the Jags and our boots on the ground coverage at Jaguars onsi. Uh you can find me on Twitter John Shipley. I understand two underscores is outrageous, but there’s like an 80-year-old sports reporter in Minnesota named John Shipley who beat me to it by several decades. So, but no, I mean really my leaving thought is I I do like the trajectory the Jaguars are on. Clearly, I if you had told me before the season that they’d be 4-2 going into London. I I I would have, you know, said no. I I don’t I don’t think so. How are you getting that? So, I think the Jaguars are in a good spot, but it’s the NFL. People are always going to feel how the last game made them feel. So, even though they’re 4-2 coming off a tough loss against the Seahawks, people are just going to feel the way they do. and they’re going to let their takes be known and they’re going to at the two of us_j shipley at Mia O’Brien TV. We encourage, you know, or maybe not. Maybe just going to mute you, but that’s all right. Um, I encourage discourse though. I know you do as well. I also never knew that about the Minnesota sports reporter. So, that’s a nice little nugget to, you know, put in your pocket and take away with you from I’m I’m coming for him. I hope he knows it. Let’s Let’s hope he doesn’t hear that. I don’t I think you’re’ll be around a little bit longer than him, John. But I appreciate you stopping by Club 904, a long-awaited episode. I know that the listeners appreciate it as well. Hope you guys enjoyed that conversation with Jags on SI reporter John Shipley. Again, we recorded today, Wednesday. This is airing on Thursday. Let’s hope and pray the Jaguars don’t make any midnight moves tonight that then mess with our conversation. We appreciate you being locked in here on Club 904. Of course, you also can check out the O’Brien NFL notebook, our Patreon Discord community, constant updates, constant news and notes that I know you guys are going to love. We’ll keep you posted what other scoops we may or may not hear. Currently, you can sign up $5 for Standard Scoopers, $10 for Friends of the Pod, and a free 7-day trial. And of course, be sure again to like and subscribe to our friends at the Action Sports Jacks 247 channel because they are boots on the ground in London since Tuesday morning. Video, sound, podcasts, writing, you name it. Brett Martino and Steuart Weber have it covered. So, make sure you check them out and make sure you subscribe here. We will be back on Sunday night, 12 hours after the Jaguars kickoff in London at Wembley Stadium. We will have your late night postgame report. I I don’t think we’ll have Brent Martin. I think he’ll be on a plane somewhere. I promise we’ll have a lot of fun, though. That’ll be 9:04 p.m. on Sunday before the Jaguars head into their by-week for the 2025 season. Until Sunday, we’ll catch you later. When it’s time to get a new car for anyone in your family, just remember, nobody but Nimnic, the number one Buick GMC dealer in Jacksonville. Get the latest price breaks on 2023 and 2024 models or the newest 2025 vehicles in the showroom on Phillips highway or shop online at nimic buickgmc.com 24 hours a day. GMC Sierras, Yukons, and the redesigned Acadias or get the allnew redesigned line with Buicks. It’s nobody but Nimnic. And part of the reason why is this is a first class buying experience here at Nimic Buick GMC. You’re not just a customer, you’re a friend. 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Host Mia O’Brien is joined by John Shipley of Sports Illustrated to not only breakdown the Jacksonville Jaguars’ Week 7 match-up with the Los Angeles Rams in London: they look ahead to the November 4th Trade Deadline as well as reflect on the first 10 months of the Liam Coen-James Gladstone Era in Jacksonville, Florida.