Garden Report Celtics vs Nets Postgame Show: C’s NO SHOW in NBA Cup Game

Garden Report Celtics vs Nets Postgame Show: C’s NO SHOW in NBA Cup Game

We are live. Oh my god, dude. What just happened? What the hell? Or are we dead? We’re alive. Day with DOA. Dead on arrival. My goodness. Oh, this was Guys, this this was not the Friday night I thought I was going to have. This was not. But yes, what do you know? Xanis is back for Xanis is back for another L. The Garden Report starts. This was not scheduled on has to be a shot at somebody, but I know they’re never clean. They have to run. That’s the only shot they have. They do it for 82 games. We’re about to find out. He already has shown what he’s capable of. Did surprise me. I thought we were going to hang in there. This makes me think that we do need to be humbled. I actually think you’re the only one who deserved that beating. And there we are. We are here. the Garden Report postgame show as the self uh you know you knew one of these was coming, right? Yeah. You knew one of these was coming. Yeah. You knew one of these was coming. Oh, it came. It came. And I still I knew it was coming. I didn’t know this was going to be the one, John, until halftime. What I say to you? I was like, this is your classic home loss. They had a few of them, you know, in the past couple seasons with how many times did they say, “Oh, you know, we just didn’t show up tonight. We took it. We took, you know, we we we thought that, you know, the game was going to be given to us.” The the good Celtics used to used to think that way. This Celtics team, we’ve already talked about it. They cannot take games off. It doesn’t matter who it’s against. Doesn’t matter where it’s it where it is. They are not good enough to take any team for granted. even if it’s arguably the worst team in the league. And at halftime, the way that they were playing defense, the way that they were allowing Brooklyn to get inside on them and get those second chance points and scoring at the rim and right out of halftime, what happened? Brooklyn did the same thing like a minute into the third quarter. Joe called the timeout, but it just never really changed things. Just never really I mean, they made a little run here and there, but you went down like 18 to Brooklyn in the third quarter there. That was like a wo moment. Like, oh my god, these guys like this is a this is a this is a loss. I think up until that point, I thought maybe they would make a comeback and into and to their defense, they did in the fourth quarter, but ultimately this was not a Celtics team that we’ve seen uh in in many cases this year. The effort was not there in the defensive end. And then when Jaylen Brown went out with that fifth foul, awful, um they just fell flat in their faces. That was a little peek at what life would be like if you’re if you play a game without Brown or White. We said this going going into the year and we said this throughout the season. Health has been on their side. Still is. But you lost Jaylen Brown tonight to foul trouble and you got a little peek at what life is like with one of those guys isn’t in the game. There’s nobody coming to help you. No, they uh the the there’s so many crappy things about this game to to get into, but I I for me the the big thing, and we’ll get into it a little bit at some point, is just the lack of adjustments on the players part, on Joe’s part. I mean, how many times will K to be in drop coverage and just let Michael Porter Jr. just raise up? I mean, he must have got at least 10, 12 points that way. And it’s it was there throughout the course of the game. It was just little things like like uh just not making adjustment defensively, not playing harder, not tracking down loose balls, not boxing out. There was so many little things that they did that you would have thought that this was like I don’t know, you had three or four allstars on your on your roster instead of one. Uh you would have thought that this was a team in Brook and the thing about Brooklyn is you know they’re going to play hard because they don’t have a choice. They’re not good. I don’t know. You know that. Have they played hard? I don’t even know. I haven’t watched the second of them except earlier this week. Well, that that’s the sad part about this game though. I don’t think this was a typical a typical Brooklyn team. They didn’t play as hard as they normally do. They just out they looked good. Yeah, they looked good. I mean, but but this is the thing though. At no point did you give them any reason to push back. And here comes Joe. Let’s What the What the hell’s Joe got to say? Oh, this should be good. Hey everybody, what’s up? Joe muted. That would be I can’t hear Joe. No, I don’t hear him either. I don’t hear John either, actually. Whole thing’s effed up. Whoever is at the garden. Jo is muted. Joe is muted. I’ll leave him up. I think he’s going to come up in a second. Let’s try to guess at what he’s saying then if we can. I don’t want to do that. I don’t want to do that because because to me I I would interpret whatever he’s saying as some absolutely profanity lace. What he what he should say what he should say is that they got outworked. They got outworked on the glass. They got outworked in the paint. Um I I don’t think that it Oh, and Joe’s gone. Oh, well, somebody will have to clip it and tell us what he said, John. Yeah, it was just We’ll get there. We’ll get there. Yeah. Well, I’m showing it muted on on our Oh, maybe because he’s not on the stage. Okay, that makes sense. No, it’s the mic’s not hooked up. Oh, okay. You just truly hate to see that. Damn it, Amit. Um, well, what else? What else then? Let’s go back to what we were what we were yapping about. You know how you know how I knew it was bad? How I knew that it was this was a bad night for them and how I knew that Joe Mazula was really upset uh is that Anthony Simons played a lot. That’s how you know Joe definitely confirmed not having fun tonight. In order in order in order for that to happen, Joe had to be so angry at everyone else to give Simons the amount of run that he gave him. So true. That That’s how I knew. And by the way, nobody’s going to want to say it, but Simons kept him in it. Um, and many points, I thought. Um, nine of 10 of 10 of 16 from the field for Simons tonight. Uh, still a minus 10, but I don’t know if that tells the whole story. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, he he had some he had his usual, you know, set of defensive oops, my bad moments, but for the most They all did from the Clippers game as well. Here we go. We got you. I don’t I mean I I don’t um you know just if you get it Yeah. Knock it down. If you get it down there, but I don’t know that uh you know, the story of this game is solely on our missed layups. I think a lot of it has to do with uh both, you know, just I thought uh the Nets played really really well and and uh we got off to a good start, but we didn’t play uh you know, they played better than us throughout most of the game. I think that’s the bigger story is, you know, a little bit of our offensive breakdown, but, you know, our our uh defensive lapses on our offball execution or kind of like our individual tendencies and game plan stuff there. So, just got to continue to get better at that. Was there anything that the Nets did in particular that you think led to that or was it just on you guys like not being as sharp defensively? Um, I thought I thought they they played better than they did the other night for sure. You know, I have to give credit to them and we didn’t play as well. Uh, you know, just I think it was that simple. Joe, they play harder than you tonight uh for moments of the game for sure. I mean, I thought we got got off to a great start in the first quarter. Uh obviously a 40point second quarter. Uh you know, and then uh probably midway through the third, we started to turn it up, but I thought they executed, you know, they executed very well on both ends of the floor. Uh and we were just, you know, we didn’t execute like we talking about with some of the two-on-one reads and you know, our defensive execution. And what’s the kind of the frustration of searching? Like I think a minute into the third quarter, they got an offensive rebound. You went and pulled Luca and put him in the game. Like it seemed like you were kind of searching for answers. No, the one minute that was like we had a uh offball miscommunication, you know, which, you know, coming out of uh halftime during the coverage and on the first possession we miss an offball communication, you know, that’s just, you know, we got to be we have to be better at that, you know. So that was that was the the main teaching point there in the start of the third quarter. And is there kind of a lesson like they’re two and 12 but they still play hard like you just cannot take anyone lightly. You can’t like even though you beat them three nights ago. Yeah, I mean there’s there’s a ton of lessons. They just played better. They played better than we did tonight and regardless of you know record or not. Um you know we are at our best uh you know we play we have to play at such a different level you know physically mentally we have to play at a different level to be at our best and if we don’t play at that level physically or mentally at our best we could any lose any night by to anybody. Joe you mentioned that 40point second quarter. Just what did you see go wrong in there? Um it was a little bit of a connection of our transition defense uh but really was our individual defense. I thought, you know, guys got downhill. Um, you know, layup to Claxton, layup to Clowny to his right hand. I thought they just did a great job attacking the basket. We fouled a lot in that second quarter. Uh, so we put him at the line. It was a, you know, a little bit of transition, but Joe, you said you guys have to play at a different level physically and mentally to be at your best. Is that true of any basketball team or is that something particular to this group that is unique? I think it’s true of any basketball team, but I think it’s it’s the margin for error is smaller for certain teams and the margin for error is smaller for us. we have to be the best, you know, we have to be the sharp physically and mentally every night and that’s just that’s, you know, we’ve understood that that’s a strength of ours when we’re at our best and, you know, we have to try to play at our best. Thank you. Thank you. And that ultimately is that in a nutshell and I think that that’s the theme of the entire show. Uh, and again, this is why I get frustrated like you get frustrated a lot. I do get frustrated, but this is why I get the most frustrated. I can’t we just all we all know what this is. Can we all just get on the same page and like stop the yo-yo back and forth analysis like everybody chill like like it the sky is not falling when they lose and they’re not they’re only two games out a second in the East. Shut up. like just and they should be better actually everybody and they should look at the offensive and the defensive rating this team Stal’s doing and it’s a couple more if they if they’re better in the clutch they could be like top in the east shut like it’s guys that we know what this is lost all these we lost all these players like when they play well and when they play hard we celebrate that and they have been playing hard. Okay, but Joe just said it. We’re not good enough to rest and you’re they’re they’re so not good enough that that that even a a mid effort, this wasn’t an awful effort. This was mid against a bad team and you can lose. That’s just where they are. And you know this and against really good teams are going to get cooked. You know, they’ll be able to hang with a bunch of teams because the the Eastern Conference middle class is in is huge. So they they can they can run with anybody, you know, like I know people were overreacting to the Bullpad article and heavy because of that one quote about we don’t fear the Celtics anymore, but the majority of that article was basically like those guys play their asses off every night and like they’re a pain in the butt and if you don’t come ready to play, they’re going to beat you. That’s what they are. They’re a little engine that could sort of team and you can celebrate that, but like let’s not get out over our skis every time they win a couple of games and start talking about like what’s going to h it’s this is who they are. This is who they’re going to be. It’s going to be up and down all season long. It’s going to be frustrating. There’s going to be moments where it’s whatever, but like everybody just got to just recognize it for what it is. It’s going to be much easier to watch this season if you do it that way, you know? So, I don’t know. That’s that’s where I’m at. Well, the but the thing is here’s here’s the thing, John. I I mean, what you’re saying makes a lot of sense and and I I agree for the most part, but the one thing about nights like this that I’m looking for is I’m looking for Joe to find some buttons to push that can, you know, at least recalibrate the situation and get them to play a little bit closer to that team that he knows they have to be in order to win. And that was the thing that bothered me most about this game. I didn’t think that there were any adjustments or even attempts to make adjustments to move them inch them a little bit closer to being a team that has to play at their best to be competitive. I mean, they this was a me effort, but I thought coaching wise, I thought it was bad on Joe’s part. I didn’t think he did much tonight. Uh, and that was one of the many things that didn’t go their way. And to me, just like the players have to be better and and and things of that nature, Joe has to be better than he was tonight. Uh, this I think this is one of the worst coaching games Joe has had this day. And Joe, I think, has been pretty damn good. But tonight was not one of his better nights. Yeah. And it’s the second game, you know, back to back, you know, that you get each each coach gets a little film to work with and a little bit of a chess match there, right? You know, making adjustments. You’re going to see the same guys uh in a few nights. And I agree with you, Sher. I think that, you know, the Nets came out tonight and they looked ready to play. Um, you know, I I I if I had never watched either team before, if I sorry, if well yeah, if I never watched either team, but also if I hadn’t known that the Nets were, you know, playing like one of the worst teams in the league, I certainly wouldn’t think that tonight. I thought that, you know, they played with um intention on both sides of the court. I I I like that they answered the Celtics whenever the Celtics tried to, you know, get back in in the second half there. And I thought that um what’s his name there? Um Michael Porter Jr. He played with like a swagger tonight, you know? I mean, he was doing it all over the place. And I thought obviously, you know, Jaylen Brown picking up that fifth foul completely changed, you know, everything the Celtics were trying to do to, you know, get back into things. And Jaylen Brown, I’m sure we’ll talk about him because, you know, John’s on the show and everything, but you’re getting a little bit of a jackal and hide, you know, with him. you know, it’s unacceptable for him to pick up five fouls with eight minutes left in the third quarter, right? Um I I like that he’s finding some spots on the court that, you know, are a little bit more comfortable for him and he’s bringing a mid-range game back. I still think that he looks slow out there. U I like that he’s drawn a little bit more contact and drawn contact and he doesn’t look like he’s like worried about that, but I still do wonder if he’s getting back to, you know, where he needs to be athletically. Um the three-point shot is still what it is. It’s never going to be, you know, top tier, you know, at this point. So, I’m just not sure. Um, I have some questions, but I have some questions at the top just like I have questions at the bottom of, you know, like who’s who’s going to be on the team in the next few years? Like, who are they rolling with? You know, I almost question that at the top as much as I question that at the bottom. I mean, depending on where you think this team’s heading, uh, I think it’s fair. And Derek White had an awful game, too. Yeah. Yeah. So, this might have been we’ll get to White um you know uh for sure because this might have been his worst game of the year in a in what’s been a fairly rough year and his body language is atrocious tonight when he’s when he smoked that bunny he just looked like he just wanted to go into a hole and and and and hide. Um and it’s been rough definitely rough for him but I I’m just going to address some of the comments. the the Joe Mazula lowhanging fruit. It’s just guys, there’s no rotations. There’s no secret answer. Again, yeah, I just want to say something real quick, John. As soon as Bobby comes on, you have to go to apology camp. Continue. Okay. He guaranteed victory. He guaranteed victory. I know. I know. And that’s that’s when we knew that’s when I thought they were I said they were going to sweep these g I said last week they’re going to sweep these three and everyone’s going to be like, “Oh, look how good they are.” And thankfully I’m wrong. But look, guys, I I’m just the the the Joe stuff is insane to me. There’s there’s no secret sauce with this team. No matter what you do, you’re going to play guys one night and you’re going to feel okay about it and be like, “Joe pressed the right buttons.” And then they’re going to play the same guys another night and be like, “Dude, what’s he doing putting guard? Why didn’t Hugo play it that it’s just they simply just don’t have the horses to to to mismanage the roster. All of the guys, it’s a crapshoot. You don’t know what version of Minot or Walsh or Garza you’re going to get on any given night. You’re just rolling them out there and just hoping for the best.” It’s not like it’s like why did you play that guy? That guy might have been the right decision and he could still suck because they’re just not high. It’s just not last year’s team. Like you just It’s not the same. It’s not the same. I didn’t have an issue with the guys he played cuz you’re right. I mean, this is what he’s What are you gonna do? You don’t like Kada? You’re going to bring in Garza. What are you gonna do? Walsh wasn’t Walsh wasn’t effective. [ __ ] [ __ ] I’ll try this guy. He at least tried three guards a little bit tonight. So that’s something he hadn’t done. Like what are you gonna do? Like what’s he supposed to do? What did you want to see? Less Simons or less Pritchard and more may not I don’t you know everyone’s like dude Hugo the shooter just played. Yeah. Go ahead play Ugo 35 minutes tonight. See what happens. You know right it’s not Go ahead. The the thing about Joe though, my issue had nothing to do with the personnel he played, but the way that he did make any adjustments with that personnel. If Michael Porter Jr. is coming off picks and just raising up over and over again, and Kada is dropping his ass in the paint, you might want to not have him drop his ass in the paint. That was my only issue with Joe was that there just never seem to be any attempts at an adjustment. And that to me, that’s that was my issue because you’re right. I mean, it’s not like you’ve got the benefit of having guys play average and win by seven like you had last year. You could have a mint game like this and beat this team by 10, 12 points with last year’s crew. You can’t do that now. But at some point, you as a head coach, you’ve got to be even more meticulous about the adjustments you make because you don’t have the talent that gives you that cushion. And Joe talked about that about just the margin of of just frankly room to screw things up. You don’t have that much anymore. You’ve got to be more on point. and I just didn’t think he was in terms of the way he used his players because they’re not as talented as they’ve been in the past. But he’s got to be smarter about how he uses them. That was my issue. Yeah, I I agree with that, Sher. I’ll just say, you know, really what it comes down to is in the second half you lost Jaylen Brown and you had Derek White who was already non-existent. So you were all a team that’s already not talented lost their two most talented players or you know effectively didn’t have either of their two best players tonight and that and that amounted to them losing to arguably the worst team in the league and that’s just what’s going to happen. I don’t know what’s wrong with Derrick White. Jaylen Brown you know on any given night he can give you 35 right still. Um, and I think if he didn’t go out tonight, he could have probably done that without, you know, without a problem. Um, Derek White, something is clearly wrong. I I don’t know what it is. I don’t know if it’s mental. Um, I don’t think it’s physical. No one has said that he’s dealing with anything. Um, but he is in a slump. We’ve seen him get into slumps before. This is just a slump. And on, you already mentioned it, John, but the body language on top of it all, he is very hard on himself. And, uh, you know, it’s good to be hard on yourself. in a way because that you know challen you want to challenge yourself to be better and all that stuff but if it’s to the point where it’s like spiraling then we have a problem here they can’t afford Derek White to be in his own head out there in the court like he needs to my prediction at the beginning of the year was more of like a well if he isn’t they’re screwed and it was basically like this guy needs to be like borderline all NBA uh if some of these predictions that fans have of them you know making it into the playoffs and and getting out of the first round and blah blah blah it’s like, well, if Derrick White’s not close to first close to an all-NBA and obviously it’s a reach that he would have been a top 15 player, but the point I was trying to make is he needed to be like an easy all-star guy and a guy that like was just cruising. Well, let’s ask the question. Let’s ask the question, were we wrong? Like, you know, and this is globally like everyone was expecting the D leap, right? Um, and uh, you know, myself included, and everyone likes everything Dwight does. Everyone agrees that he’s an all-around player who does the little things, always plays smart, always plays hard, but the expectation was, hey, it’s going to he’s going to score now. He’s just going to score more. Uh, and he’s going to carry the load on offense. And I guess, and again, this was one of my concerns with everybody with Pritchard with, you know, even with White. Yeah. leveling up. Is that is that is that everyone leveling up and that you know a lot of people are saying it in the chat and I think it’s perfectly fair. How many people benefited from Tatum’s gravity? You know, and how and how immense was that uh for them? Uh sure. Extra little space sometimes is all it takes. You know, the amount of gravity that they have frees everybody else up. And we saw some stats. I think Bobby was sharing them earlier just how much these guys how many more of their points and how many more of their attempts are coming off the dribble versus off of catches. It just goes to show you that how much harder they have to work for buckets. So when you see White and then Pritchard for a spell, even though Pritchard was hot recently and you know didn’t have a great game tonight, when you see them struggling, it’s le it’s not always just a matter of the shots aren’t falling. It might be a matter of it’s they’re they’re working way harder for their offense than they used to before. And as a result, you’re seeing mixed results uh in terms of what they’re doing in terms of their efficiency. So, were we wrong? Like, is is Derek not capable or is this just a funk right now? Is he not capable of being a two? Is he really suited to be a three or a four on a team? Is he truly one of the best role players in the NBA or is he an actual NBA star? He’s looking more like a great role player. I mean there’s I mean the numbers are it’s there is no physical ailment or or limitations to him. He looks like a guy who’s a number three or four who’s been asked to be a number two. Uh and and those guys they’ll have nights where they’ve looked apart. But more nights than not they don’t they struggle. They they they’re asked to do more things have more decision-m responsibilities than they’re used to and they just not getting it done with the consistency that you need. So yeah, he looks very much like a role player who’s been asked to take on a greater responsibility and he’s just not getting it done. Doesn’t make him a bad player. It just it just it just kind of it just kind of puts him in this in a space that frankly uh is going to make this a long season, longer than I Yeah, I don’t know, Jimmy. I mean I I know. I mean I’m gonna unfortunately I’m gonna probably have to agree with Sherrod. I and I used to say that, you know, White I still think White is like the most allound guy. I just don’t think like he’s like on Mario Kart where everything’s like a four, right? And I just don’t know like out of five, right? So, I just don’t know if like again like that is enough to carry you uh as a number two guy. You kind of need somebody that’s going to have a couple fives on the on the scale there, right? And I’m sure there are some games where he’ll be automatic from three. And he’s always, you know, it feels like, I’m not going to say this season, but it feels like in the past, you know, he was the winning plays guy, right? He was the one that would just make the smart play. He felt like when he had the ball, he wasn’t going to make a mistake with it. He wasn’t going to make a silly turnover or uh, you know, make the wrong read and he was going to be where you needed him to be. But now when it’s really like, well, now we really need you to score more. Now, we need you to create your own offense and we need you to carry this team when you know Jaylen Brown is out of the game basically, right? Or when whoever is, you know, when when Pton Pritchard isn’t hitting his threes or whatever. Like, there’s not much else coming this season. And it hasn’t he hasn’t been able to do that. Simple as that. I mean, the numbers back that up. The eye test backs that up. And, you know, I I think the worst part is is he probably sees it and feels it himself. And that’s why uh you might see some of the reactions that you get are like he’s he’s he’s in one right now. So, uh, I would say to this point, John, yeah, I mean, anyone who said, I mean, clearly my bold prediction was, again, in the spirit of bold predictions, it was an exaggeration, but my bold prediction was that he’s going to be all NBA like third team. Like, this guy’s not even sniffing all not even close to an all-star, you know, like. So, um, of course I was wrong so far, you know. I still want I’m going to hold out hope that he can break out of the slump, but at the same time, like, is it going to be enough? Like I just don’t know if he’s if he’s like the one a that Jaylen Brown’s kind of been at Tatum. The irony here, Jimmy, is that you and I have to now pro you you and I now have to advocate, you know, that he’s doing more that that his game is about more than just scoring. But that’s what was expected this year is more scoring and to take a leap. It hasn’t happened. Here’s Jaylen Brown. Defense and just defense as a whole is is one of the problems in this game. What did you see from the Nets that you think led to some of that? Do you think it was purely on your end? Like what happened defensively for you guys? Uh, I’m not sure. I guess we got to look at the film and and uh see what happened tomorrow, but I’m not sure what happened tonight. What do you think was, you know, your initial takeaway? Like you said, you have to watch a film, but like what what’s your initial takeaway as to what led to the result of tonight? What’s my initial takeaway? If you come ready to play or don’t come at all. That’s my That’s my whole thing. We got to come ready to play. We just went through the motions today. Like I don’t I don’t understand it. Jaylen, you’ve talked a lot about the defense and the importance of that this year. Um what do you guys need in a night like this on that end to be able to drive a spark? I know you advocated for Jordan being that ball pressure guy and Ugo came in late. like what’s that process like of trying to ramp up the intensity on that end on a night where you might not have it? Um, I thought those guys did a good job. Hugo, Jordan being uh pressure just overall as a group. We just lacked energy, you know, uh tough whist of a night, you know, um I want to be out on the floor for my team and uh you know, wasn’t able to be out there. Um, and I guess I got to do better in certain spots, but just overall just a lackluster game from the Celtics. Jaylen, was there a moment in particular that you realized the team was going through the motion and you guys felt like you weren’t ready to play tonight? Uh, yeah, for sure. It was majority of the game, but or at least a large part of the game. Definitely to close the half and then the end of that third quarter. What can you guys do in those moments when you start to realize that to kind of fix that? Uh, I just think be confident. Um, you know, uh, be aggressive, I guess. Give credit to Brooklyn. Brooklyn did a a pretty good job defensively. They got some long guys that, you know, maybe can discourage some shots, but, you know, we we didn’t find enough stops to be able to get out and run and and uh end of the second, end of the third, especially the second. I think they had a 40-point quarter in the second quarter was a 40-point quarter and then the the uh the end of that third kind of gave them the separation they needed in this game. Joe’s talked a lot about how there’s a lot of guys on this team that are learning what it takes to be consistent in this league and how to win on a daily basis physically and mentally. How much did you feel like today was about the preparation from players leading up to it compared to what happened within the game itself? Yeah, I think you know I guess we’ll watch it tomorrow. Uh, but you know, regardless if you’re making or missing shots, you just I mean, regardless of anything, we just got to come out and play with great energy, great enthusiasm for the game, like want to win. It just didn’t seem like that was the case tonight. Jaylen, when you look at the the stretch you guys have coming up, Orlando, Detroit, Minnesota, Cleveland, do you view this as an important test for your team? Absolutely. Every game is a test, you know. Every game is a test. So, I just take it one game at a time. Um, you know, the schedule is a schedule and we just got to keep going. You know, my my focus is on, you know, how can I better prepare myself and how can I make my my teammates better? But we got to have some enthusiasm for the game. At the end of the day, you got to play basketball. Jaylen, how do you not let the officiating kind of impact you? There was some calls I’m sure you didn’t agree with and then the challenge on the fifth foul. I mean, how do you kind of keep your focus? I’m doing my best, man. I’m doing my best. You know, uh, tough whistle tonight. You know, some of them I could be better on for sure. Some of them like no comment. And what can you uh as a leader to kind of get guys to be you can’t go in there and give rahrh speeches but to motivate guys to make sure that they’re focused on every game. It just seemed like maybe having beaten them three nights ago you guys said okay well we got them at home we we should we should get this one. Yeah I I don’t know. Yeah I don’t know but we we going we going to watch it tomorrow and like Yeah. That’s my sentiment at the end of the day. We all got a job to do. We all getting paid to do what we love to do. Come ready to play basketball or you’re doing a disservice. So, everybody got to come and be ready to do enthusiasm and want to win. You know, that’s what it’s about at the end of the day. Celtic basketball. Um, so we’ll look at it tomorrow. Last question, Jack. You guys have been pretty honest about how the margin for error isn’t the same as it used to be. you kind of need to be that that high energy, high intensity team. Um, what what does this team need to play with so that you don’t have nights like this? You need to play with uh an edge defensively and offensively. Like we got to be the harder playing team. That can’t be negotiable. And tonight we weren’t. Brooklyn was a harder playing team. They play with more of edge and they deserve to win tonight. Thank you, Jaylen. Okay, that’s Jaylen Brown wrapping it up. We should we should get uh Bobby Manning and Noah joining us uh as well in a little bit uh here from um the garden as they get set up. We’ll let you guys know. Before we do all that, uh the show as always is brought to you by our pals over at Prize Picks. Uh you you got to love yourself some prize picks uh here. And again, doesn’t matter what season uh you’re in, basketball, football, hockey, uh it’s all good. Just play prize picks right now. Number one daily fantasy sports app in all of North America. Pick more, pick less. That easy. You see the offer on the screen right now. Download the app code. 50 in your lineups when you play your first $5 lineup. Once again, download that prize pick app code cls to get 50 in your lineups after you play your first $5 lineups. 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Um, so guys, we were talking a little bit about the Derek White conversation, uh, for sure of, you know, him, you know, struggling to kind of step up into that role. I think Bobby asked Joe about it earlier and Joe got a little confused. We don’t have the That was when Joe was on mute. I think Bobby was asking him about that dribble. We got to watch back. Uh, all right. If you guys, someone wants to clip that for me. Do we want to watch Bobby get beat up by Joe? I mean, do it. Dude, he’s on quite the run. Make that a poll. He is He’s on quite the run. I will say that. Yeah. But he is getting the apology. He is getting apology cammed immediately because that’s I want him to say why he was wrong. What what in his I mean he’s probably going to echo Jaylen Brown now because he was there for that. Jaylen Brown with some harsh words. I’m wondering if he’s just talking about the team or if he’s got any players in mind. if he’s frustrated by certain guys for him to say over and over, you know, we get paid to, you know, play basketball, we need to show up, we need to play hard, we need to all this stuff. Is he just saying we and just it’s kind of like a, you know, like we’ve heard we’ve heard this before. I think he put I know I think he puts him I think he puts himself in there with we um and I think just in general he just felt like the whole team was was had a low energy sort of game. Um, which is which is true. I just, you know, it’s also I always wonder that’s I always Jimmy I always used to joke about that. I’m like when you say we, who do you mean? You know, because we mean somebody, right? You always want to know there’s somebody in the back of his mind that he’s remembering a play or two or the way they came out. I don’t know. I don’t know if he’s talking. I always say I mean I don’t I think if you come out flat I I sometimes I point at the coaches for not having the team ready to go, not having them fired up, not having the right game plan in place, you know, whatever. I I put some of that on the coaches, but I I obviously understand that it’s on these guys to also get themselves going. I put it on the stars. I always put it on the stars, of course, but I think there’s something to be said about preparation in a way. I guess I guess I I I mean I if you tell if you think that Joe doesn’t have these guys prepared with the level of intensity and focus and attention to detail that he brings to all of their practices. I mean, I I find it hard to believe. All All we hear all off seasonason long is it’s like it’s a track meet. He’s killing us. We’re working our asses off. We know how maniacal he is about specific details and areas of focus. You see him hop off the bench as soon as he sees something he doesn’t like and yanks somebody. You know, he’s not afraid to send messages. He benches Jaylen last game. I just can’t put any of this on Joe’s level of motivation. I’m always going to start with the Stars and filter it through. Uh, and you know, they got to lead by example there. And I do think when you have a guy like Derek White struggling, you know, inadvertently he suffers a little bit from Jason Tatum body language syndrome, you know, and that stuff drags, you know, drags you a little bit. Offense can affect defense and then it looks like you’re dragging ass, but you’re really just sad. So, I don’t really know, but I mean, I guess it’s across the board there. I’m not really sure. You know, Kada was certainly looked like he was lacking focus at some times and Joe was definitely a little bit frustrated with him. uh as well. But I don’t know who he’s talking about there. I don’t know. Talking about I You go Sean. No, I was just gonna say it it just watching this game and listen to his words, it felt that this was more of a team comment on Jaylen’s part than any individual or even two. I I think so too. Yeah, cuz there were just too many guys that were screwing up out there for it to be one or two guys that he’s pointing to, including himself. Uh so it for this this particular instance I I would say that it’s more likely to be team centric than any individual that he’s pointing finger at including himself because I think he I think he’s got enough self-awareness to know that he didn’t play one of his better games either fouls or no foul situation. Yeah. Um wasn’t question by the way. Go ahead. Go ahead. Yeah. Well I was gonna I was going to say didn’t you guys enjoy the Sam Hower era? Um, it lasted it last lasted one game and then then tonight we’re back to this. Oh, take that off, John. That was that was mean. That was mean. You know what? You know what else? What’s up with this guy’s gone, too? Holy shoot, Bailey. But but but okay. So, that’s real. This is the reality of the situation. And I’m going to go back to what I was going to say, and I’m glad you put those stats up there, John, because that’s two. I mean, you could put you go up there. You could put, you know, Garza, whoever you want to pick, pick any guy, and we’re probably going to like scoff or or like be flabbergasted by like the the statline because it’s so bad. But it goes back to what I’m what I was about to say about Jaylen Brown. This is different for him because he’s used to competing, right? I mean, he’s used to having a contending night. What do you You did. You You used to like Minot, but I think I’m a I’m a May not fan. I I only But I only like him like 12 minutes a game. 12 to 15 minutes a game. I love Minot’s energy. Joe broke him. Well, he played seven tonight. Joe broke him. He’s He’s He’s in his He’s in his head. This is tough tough love did not work with him. Right. So, here here’s the two things. one, Jaylen Brown being I think I wonder if he’s starting to understand the situation and I think maybe frustration certainly sets in after a game like this, but I wonder if he’s looking at the roster, looking at, you know, how hard they’re playing and that’s their record. looking at like what’s coming down the road, I can’t imagine like he’s probably pumped at like the level that they have to practice at or like and so that brings me my next thing about Joe is if you lose the star and I’m not saying this is happening or this has happened but if it does like that’s when you lose the stars the coach isn’t long for the for the team and when he benched Jaylen, that was like a very bold decision by him because if you lose Jaylen, I mean Jaylen’s an all-star, you know, perennial, you know, multi- all I don’t know how many years, but he he’s considered one of the best players in the NBA. You don’t want to run the risk of embarrassing your superstar in a season where he’s putting him his body out there. He’s putting everything out there on a season that I think deep down they probably realize they aren’t going uh to the promised land here. So yeah, if I’m Joe, I understand his philosophies and all this stuff and how he treats the players, but I’d be very careful with the way you treat the superstars because if you lose them, there’s nobody that’s going to have your back and the losses are going to start piling up. And to your point, John, may not respond clearly to that type of coaching. I start to wonder if some of these other guys will. There’s a there’s a coach that that Joe might kind of remind me of and um that’s Tibs. And what happens to Tibs? He coaches his way out of town because the players eventually just can’t stand the way he coaches and how hard he runs them. And what happens? He might be a great coach, but he can never last because the players players are done with it after after a while. Yeah. Yeah. No doubt about it. Um, you know, one thing we were talking about before this game was um, you know, how this was supposed to be, you know, an automatic W, right? a nine and seven, you know, a guaranteed win. I wasn’t on the last show, but uh Jimmy Tusano did want to point out that Bobby absolutely guaranteed guaranteed uh guaranteed a victory. Guaranteed the guarantee. Yeah. Yeah. He was like smirking from ear to ear how confident he was and like that they won on after they won on Tuesday. He like couldn’t wait for Friday because he was just guaranteed the guarantee that they were going to win that game. And here he is. All sorts of good stuff over at omahastakess.com. Um, USDA certified tender steaks. Get whatever you want. Strips, ribe eyes, sirloin, brisket, like I said, roasts, uh, filt, bacon wrap fillets. It’s all good. Check it out. Get it now. You can order it for yourself. You can send it as a gift or you can send it as a gift heading into the holidays as you see on the screen there. 50% off sitewide sale plus an extra 20% off on select items. And when you use the code Patriots, there it is on the screen, an additional $35 off your order. So again, let’s just do the math there. 200 $200, you know, box of steaks, 50% off to 100, another 35 off, that’s $65 for $200 worth of product. You can’t beat that. And again, as I said, it does make a terrific gift. So yeah, check that out. omahastakess.com. Uh, sign up. Let’s get Let’s get over. They’re about to rap. They’re about to rap about the car. I apologize. Hot mic. All right. Go ahead. Here we go. Is it up? So, here’s our problem. Can I start? Go ahead. I I just think we I didn’t listen. I didn’t listen. But But in what world is it shocking? Like, this happens all the time. Yeah. Zoom in on Bobby. I want I don’t want I don’t want Noah to have to to have to catch. Yeah. Get me out of here. I’ll get up and walk away if I Noah. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Noah was defending Bobby. No, I was not defending Bobby. Not defending. This has been this has been an ongoing issue for as long as I’ve worked with Bobby that he thinks that because a team is worse than the records, there’s not just worse than the record, significantly worse, significantly worse, that there’s a 0% chance that that NBA team is going to win that basketball game. And we have been arguing about this for two years. And two nights ago, he said there’s a 0% chance that the Celtics lose either of these games. And in that moment, it became 100% clear that they were going to lose at least one of those games. And they were down by double digits in both games. And in this one, they were down by as many as 20. And they lose. And I want this to be the end of that talking point from Bobby. I never have to hear it again. Well, yeah, typically I feel good about that. And in this situation, I felt extra good about it because one, the Celtics are at full strength. Two, they seem to be hitting their stride. And three, this Nets team looked incapable of winning even a single game. Now, they got a little bit of momentum on Sunday. The three-pointers started to concern me a little bit in that first game there. And then obviously there were stretches in both of these games that the Celtics just seem to take them lightly, which has been a common thread through recent teams and then this one here. So, I don’t know what to say. Will you Will you promise us and the viewers that you will never win an NBA team has a 0% chance of winning a basketball? He’s not going to do that. He has to. That’s the only apology I’m accepting. Anything short of that is not an apology. Not a real apology for this team. This Celtics team, I have no any team there. I This Celtics team has to battle to beat anyone. That’s the take away tonight. Okay. So, you’re saying the Thunder could never lose to a I don’t think the Thunder could lose to the Nets. Oh my god. I can’t do this. This is a different situation. Not a You don’t know Michael Porter Junior, buddy. He’s basically like, “Okay, well, we just saw exactly that could happen, but nothing else.” That’s what I learned tonight. So, you Okay. I don’t think the the best of the league is going to lose to the bottom of the league tanking in a good situation. In a good situation, full health, all that, home court. But listen, obviously there’s there’s a chance here that I would send you a bunch of clippings of games where that hasn’t been true over the past five years, but you know that that hasn’t been true, so I don’t need to send you the clippings. All right. All right. I’ll admit it. There you go. There’s a greater than 0% chance that any team can win on a a night. Is that good enough? That’s all I needed. We can do the show. There we go. Let’s do the show. I want you guys to just So, on that note, what the hell happened? I’m still trying to figure it out. We were talking about this like throughout the postgame stretch there and I asked Anthony about it. You know, we’ll probably hear from him in a second here. There were a couple different explanations for it after the game. Jaylen went in on the effort and showing up and seemed frustrated with either someone or something that went on here or just the collective effort by the team. That’s the direction Joe went in to some degree. Uh Anthony was pointing the first half stretches that hurt them. Obviously, there was a bad one to close the second quarter and then the third quarter after the Jaylen injury was just a disaster. So, there were a couple injury follow trouble. So, there were a couple moments in this game where things went wrong, but they, you know, from the midpoint way point of the second quarter on, the Nets mostly controlled this game, which is the most concerning part. Like, their ability to get to the rim, their ability to find shots, play with a greater pace in this game. I thought the pace was a big part of this one as it was on Tuesday where they almost lost. And the physicality as well, like they just beat up on the Celtics in a way that Boston didn’t seem to have a great answer for. Yeah. And it was very clear. I feel like Jaylen doesn’t do those kinds of press conferences that often, but it was very clear that he wanted to send a message that he was not happy with their effort and intention. And I would have loved for him to have gone first before Joe because Joe was very kind of lukewarm. Didn’t really say a whole lot of anything. And Anthony was the first guy that said, you know, they beat us the 50-50 balls, which is the the classic like we didn’t play hard enough line that you hear players say in postgame press conferences. But I think the reality is, and like kind of what I was poking out with my questions, is like this team’s identity is playing way harder than the opposing team and that’s like why they’re even a 500 team right now. like they’ve been outplaying opponents on a pretty regular basis in the effort department, but and so if they are even a little bit outplayed in that sense, like they are no longer the better team on the floor. Even against the Brooklyn Nets, even against teams with poor records. We saw that a little bit with the with the Utah Jazz, too, where it’s like you’re, you know, the teams that we’re used to covering here, like you can maybe play a little bit less hard for two quarters and you’re still going to win the game by 15 and maybe nobody even notices you didn’t play that hard because you’re just that talented. their thing. What makes this team good when they’ve been good is literally that effort. And so it’s like you take that away and it’s like what’s really left? They’re not I can’t figure out why it wasn’t there. Like Pritchard started this game hitting shots. He got off to a good start here. Jaylen found some rhythm early like guys were hitting their shots early in this game. So it wasn’t like misses mounted and got maybe in Derek’s case he had a pretty rough game from the field and overall but for the majority of this team I don’t have a good answer for maybe it’s the foul calls Jaylen got hit with those obviously Kada got in some foul trouble midway through this game I thought the bench minutes were pretty rough once those guys started to come off the floor and then obviously the rotation got completely uh blown up into the third quarter where they had like the Shyman Hower Anthony Pritchard thing going on out there with Garza. That was a rough stretch in the third quarter there. So, it’s almost like the combination of the foul calls, the game not going the way that they thought it might. We’ve heard them discuss that in the past. Like, you can’t have expectations for how these games are going to go. And maybe to just a small degree, the fact that they were able to breeze by despite some issues in that first Nets game, too. They got away with them in that runaway stretch in the fourth quarter there. Um, the three wasn’t there, though tonight. That was a big factor I felt like throughout they were not able to get quality looks from behind the line. In the previous three games they were shooting well. So that was like the big change. The previous three games they were shooting the ball well and tonight again they weren’t. And Derek had a what was he two for 13 in this one? Like he had a really tough offensive game. And honestly like I wasn’t laser focused on Derrick’s effort or defense and I will when I rewatched look out for that because it’s just something that’s so consistent that it’s unless it was like right in your face you don’t really notice it. But it did kind of stand out to me that Joe was like, “Derrick obviously didn’t play well tonight because he normally would not just outright say that about a player if they’re just struggling offensively.” So I wonder if I mean I don’t I don’t know. So I I threw a theory at him and you guys probably heard it live. There was a graphic. He he is uh taking 40% more of or scoring 40% more of his points this year off the dribble compared to last year. He was at like 44% of his points coming off the dribble last year. that’s almost doubled um in this new role for him and you know Joe didn’t fully get this I didn’t have it fully queued up for him so I didn’t get a great answer for that there um he didn’t seem to think that was a significant factor in some of white’s struggles to start this year but he is 30% from the field 35 rather and 30% from three to begin this year that’s the weird thing it’s not just a three-point slump like he’s just like everything struggling in the short range like and we talked to him about he was like a wide open layup today like it’s crazy it’s mounting yeah is it mental um I mean definitely but I wonder like I did it impact his effort in defense because that’s like that was one of the things that I came away from the press conference has been like who is Jaylen talking about and and Joe also saying that I mean I don’t know but like Jordan and Ugo and those guys played really hard. I thought Anthony had one of his best defensive games of the season. Um Kada had like good moments and bad moments in this game of he battled through foul trouble through a lot of minutes. He was he was okay. So I’m just like I’m just wondering what what exactly Jaylen is referring to. Is it Peyton and Derek and kind of the backboard starting off a little slow? I don’t know. Um, yeah, it’s not. There’s some guys that I know right away it’s not. So, and he had a pretty fiery quote in there like, “We’re all getting paid to play. We all got to show up. We all have to, you know, do what we need to do every night.” Like, he was frustrated with something or someone. I also don’t think he enjoyed I don’t think he enjoyed sitting on the bench and watching the uh the Nets go on like an 18 to3 run in those five minutes. So, maybe I I have to see exactly who the players were on the court, but that probably mounted his frustration a little bit more than usual. Well, let me say this because he was adamant that that wasn’t a fifth foul. Obviously got Joe to challenge it. Not saying that the challenge attempt was devastating to their chances or anything like that, but he pretty clearly swung back in my mind. Yeah, it was it was a question of what came first though because he got bumped, then he swung, and then they called a foul on the next play. So, it was like it was like there was like five fouls in there. I think the question was just like literally what was the first foul? So, that’s what they were challenging. But um he’s leading the he’s like near the top of the league right now in offensive fouls for a non-post player. Like I think he’s number two in the NBA. He’s he’s tough with the it’s tough, but he’s drawing a lot of fouls. So I don’t know. I don’t know if he has to like it almost seems like the offensive fouling thing for him is becoming an issue, but it might be a little bit of a small sample. It might also be the the the reduced athleticism, meaning he can’t get by people as easily as he could. So he’s got to, you know, do a little bit of the old man YMCA shvy shove, you know. So, um, you know, that’s that that might be in there as well. Um, you know, I I I always do feel the the effort is a tad cliched in terms of that. It just felt Yeah, I definitely did. My freaking mic is horrible right now. What? Oh, I got throw walkie-talkie. I got kicked. Hold on. Effort stinks. What do you feel like was What did you feel like was the biggest issue tonight, Jimmy? I’m back. I thought, well, I thought, first of all, I I thought that they made Brooklyn look good. I don’t know if I think you got to give Brooklyn a little bit of credit. I know, Bobby, that you probably don’t want to, but I think Brooklyn came out and they just played hard to start things off. They set the tone. And I think the main thing was in that third quarter when Jaylen Brown went out with that fifth foul, whether or not you think it was legit or not, that what have we been saying all year that if either Brown or White misses a game, that’s an auto L. Sorry, Noah, but that would be an auto L. 100% lost. 0% chance. How do you feel about I’m not I’m not giving you guys a reaction on this anymore. You guys can choose you gave it to us. You did. I truly believe that’s it. That was the last reaction anybody is getting out of me without Brown or White and tonight they really next. Yeah. For a stretch in that second half because Brown was out and white wasn’t doing anything. you saw the worst team arguably in the league, you know, outscore them what, 18 to three or something crazy like that. I mean, that’s really that tells you what the depth of this team is. I’m sorry, but that’s just really it. Um, yeah, a huge part of my prediction, Jimmy, was based on that. Like I I would assume I think Jaylen Brown optimistically plays 70 games this year. I like that’s 12 automatic no chance you can win losses right there. 0% chance, right? 70 is a high number in today’s NBA. And that’s a high number. If he if he play DNA through full health, that’s No, but realistically, if Jaylen Brown missed 15 to 17 games, you know, you’re going to you’re you’re going to lose twothirds of those. Like that’s why it was like I don’t care who the opponent is, you know? So that’s a problem. That’s a problem. Yeah. and the onoff numbers haven’t spoken to that this year. I don’t know if there’s some noise there, him, you know, staggering in with those second units a lot of the time, but like there have been games tonight Utah which they lost obviously too. There’s been a couple circumstances this year where the and even tonight in the plus minus it doesn’t show. I think they were minus four when he was on and minus four when he was off. So it’s not you’re not seeing it in like the onoff numbers with him. In fact, I think they’ve probably been better statistically with him off the floor than on. Um, it’s just looks like they’re overly reliant on him to create offense for them. Not just him, it’s Pritchard, it’s White. And that’s why I asked that question about White because I feel like they have three guys. We can say Jaylen, but it’s also Pritchard and White. Three guys who can consistently create offense off the dribble for this team. And a lot of it’s difficult. A lot of it’s really tough mid-range shots in Jaylen’s case. White is struggling from everywhere as we mentioned. And Pritchard has had to when his three has, you know, disappeared, go in there, bang, pull up for those tough mid-rangers. Everything in the league. Everything is harder. Their shot quality. We saw that chart, you know, we were we were passing around before. They’re generating they’re not generating high quality shots, but you’ve had Jaylen Brown making a ridiculously high number of those. Payton Pritchard actually has done really well with the contested mid-range uh there, but like you wonder how much of that is sustainable at the end of the day. They haven’t been able to increase the pace and they’re not increasing the pace and they’re working really hard to get those shots off in general and you see you know a lot of the struggles have to do with that and you know for as as efficient as Jaylen Brown has been overall because he’s been so good from that mid-range now he’s now shooting 32% for the month from three for the month of November. So, he’s cooled way off there and you don’t know how much longer that’s going to be sustainable what he’s been doing from the mid-range there. If he’s not an automatic bucket every time he rises up, you know, from 15 ft, they’re going to really struggle to get, you know, offense right now. Everybody is working extremely hard for their buckets. Everybody. And that’s a problem. That’s a problem for this team. And it’s going to continue to be one. I don’t see daylight there. Uh in that regard, yeah, they’re working hard. And then the opposite end, Bobby. Oh, sorry. No, you go. People would rather hear Tuck than me. No, I was just going to say very, very briefly. I was just going to say that as hard as they’re working on offense, I thought tonight they kind of got worked uh in the paint, on the glass, second chance points. I think that ultimately gave the Nets like I mean, how many you you give a bad team a reason to believe that they can win and they’re no longer a bad team. I think that they realize they could just like kind of bully them a little bit. What’s that, John? Numbers were surprisingly close there. The second chance points, actually, the Celtics had 15 to Brooklyn’s 13 points in the paint. Boston had 52 to Brooklyn. I thought it was when when it happened, though. Yeah. So, it wasn’t this lops it wasn’t as lopsided as you would have thought. Noah, go ahead. No, I was going to say on the offensive front, I agree that it feels like it’s been a struggle and the jail mid-range efficiency is something that’s probably going to come down to earth a little bit. Um, at the same time, entering tonight, they have the sixth best offense in the NBA, which is kind of ridiculous when John’s head’s gonna explode. Why? Do you guys do really believe they have the sixth best offense in the NBA? I mean, that’s what that’s what the numbers show, right? If we But do you believe it for real, though? I mean, do you think I believe that their offense has been the sixth most efficient through six game through 15 games? Like, is that sustainable? Like, is is Jaylen Brown going to shoot 52% all year from mid-range? No. through six game through 15 games that’s what they’ve been and so there are some things that are going to cool down but at the same time I have a hard time believing that Sam is going to shoot the way that he’s been shooting much longer I have a hard time believing that Derrick White’s going to shoot 35% from the field the whole season maybe those you know like I I don’t know that they’ve been like punching above their weight on that end why though don’t don’t you think Noah a lot of it has to do with don’t you think a lot of it has to do their shooting struggles aren’t just a it’s not it’s not entirely I don’t believe a law of averages thing which is oh open shots will fall eventually. I think it’s harder to get those shots and that their opportunities aren’t as robust as they were and a large thing has to do with the gravity. Certainly Tatum had enormous gravity but all of the players that they lost and so I don’t know that that necessarily evens out. That’s the pro like I don’t know how’s not going to shoot 18%. But how’s been in the one of the like he’s been a foot short on his threes. Like it’s not it’s it’s not I mean he is his shot quality worse than it was last year for sure. Misses were bad. He’s not going to he’s not going to shoot as poorly as he has been. And Dererick’s not going to shoot as poorly as he has been. I don’t think Dererick’s going to shoot like he did last year based on we’re seeing that he’s getting different different looks. But yeah, they’ll come up some went off the glass on a corner three and missed the wide open lay. Like it’s this is he’s he’s in his head too. I mean, it’s been almost every night where it’s like he has a couple of errors and it’s like that’s why I was wondering if you want to talk about him because it seems like he’s so But yeah, I’m sorry. But no, like for the reason I question the offensive stats is don’t you believe that they just feasted on three of the worst teams in the NBA in blowouts to pad those stats to ridiculous levels. Do we really believe? But they also had a blowout loss against the Rockets and they’ve had they’ve played some tough teams too like their strength to schedule is above pretty average right now. Does it sound like they’ve had it is but they’ve also run into a bunch of teams that were missing their best players too. The whole league’s missing their best players though. I know. But the Celtics are not and the Celtics have had perfect health like you know throughout the whole season and they’ve had some dog opponents who have also missed their best playoff leading to 30 and 25 and 30 point wins. So I just I think all of these offensive defensive rating numbers are really that’s actual for actually I didn’t get I didn’t really get to my point but if I can go ahead go ahead. I think the the biggest thing that I’ve noticed and a little bit of an evolution is that Kada is actually a little bit of a scoring threat now. And you look at early in the season, like they really weren’t utilizing him at all. Like he was wide open for stretches. When I went back and rewatched the games, I was like, “Oh my god, I cannot believe I didn’t realize this in real time.” And he’s far from perfect as a scoring center. Like he misses some easy looks and he forces himself into some tough looks. But what did he have 16 on seven of 12 tonight? Like that is one of the areas where I think you can grow a little bit. like I don’t think that he’s reached his offensive potential. I don’t think they’ve reached as a as a team as far as finding him and looking for him. I think that it can get a lot better in that front. So, I guess I just don’t think they’ve really been punching above their weight as a as a team. Like maybe Jaylen has, but at the same time, like a lot of other guys I think are are going to find better opportunities and and that’s the part of the offense where I feel like I’m seeing the most growth is they’re looking for him and he’s he’s being active. Like he didn’t have a perfect game tonight, but he was super active on the offensive glass. He starts the fourth quarter with back-to-back putbacks. Like I think you’re going to see more of that from him where early in the season he really wasn’t scoring. Like he was doing some things well but he really wasn’t scoring. And so that to me is like the biggest area of growth and also figuring out a better way to if if Anthony Simons is sticking around for the year. Like I don’t think you’ve seen his potential fully maximize it either. And tonight I thought was his best defensive game of the season. His minutes aligned with that. Um and you can see I mean he’s he was probably their best source of offense for most of the game. Tonight was pretty emblematic of the Simons debacle, right? Cuz Jaylen goes off the floor, you throw him in, you say save the day, and he tried his best, right? And he had a good game here tonight, but what they asked him to do in that second half was extraordinarily difficult. And it’s another guy on this team who’s in a tough position of having to create everything for himself when he’s in those situations. There’s just not a lot of outlets on this team. And I I like that you mentioned Kada there cuz they started to do a better job of finding him as one here and they still missed him a bunch of times tonight. Like they’re that’s why I’m like the offense this offense is not like they got they got everything they can out of what they have and they’ve never been good at that. They’ve continued to make things difficult for themselves offensively because they don’t cut, they don’t run, they don’t have a post up threat, they don’t have a roller. Like there’s a lot of elements in this offense that they don’t they never go to the free throw line. Like think of those five things being reality for them. It forces them to make really tough shots. It forces them to never turn the ball over and it forces them to grab like a high high percentage of their misses inside. And they’ve done those three. They’ve been the eighth best offensive rebounding team in the NBA entering tonight. Think of what they’ve done to be a top 10 offense. Hit a ton of mid-rangers, grab every offensive rebound, and never turn the ball over. Is that stuff sustainable? It’s been there through a lot of the schedule so far. They’re winning those margins. They’re winning the shot battle on a lot of nights, but man, the amount of stuff that’s not there for them to fall back on when things aren’t going well is enormous. And that’s going to lead to some nights like this. And this is a 500 team right now. Like that’s how they’re playing. They’re up and down. They’re up and down. Key stretches of games they laughs. Overall, they’ve been pretty good. But I feel like we’re short of the 20 game mark. I feel like we have a pretty good idea of who this team is at this point. Like I think we’ve seen it all. I agree with that. Well, we are going to learn a lot more uh coming up here with this stretch of games uh coming up. Magic uh we’ll see. They’re probably going to duck ban banana there, but the Magic have been playing better regardless there. The Pistons, the hottest hottest team in the NBA. The Timberwolves look very strong obviously this year. Cavaliers back to full health. And then the Knicks. Um this is a this is a gauntlet here and it it continues on. you got to you got a gimme after that with Washington, but then you’ve also got the Lakers. Um, you know, coming up, I think seven of the next eight are going to be difficult here. Um, so I think we say we know what this team is. I want to see after this stretch um who this team is here because if they can hang and be competitive and come close to 500, even two out of six with who knows what when four of those that’ll tell you something because that’ll say they can they can they can slug it out with teams whose talent exceeds theirs. Um but if this turns into a miserable stretch here, you know, again, we’ll probably be having a slightly different conversation. So I I said give it about 30 games. I’m still not satisfied that we have a good idea who these guys are because again they’ve had full health every other full health relative to you know Tatum you know Tatum’s out obviously but um and a lot of the teams that they’ve played have even even the crappy teams have missed whatever few good players that they’ve had. So, I am really curious to see what’s going to happen here over this stretch of games when it looks like all of these teams are going to be playing them close to full health. That’ll be interesting. And yeah, to Noah’s point, a lot of people have a lot of injuries right now, but the Celtics I feel like have gotten a lot of breaks in that regard so far um throughout the schedule. So, we’ll see. We’ll see how that goes. Other thoughts for tonight? Um guys, we mentioned it briefly, but um you know, the Hower situation, I’m not really sure what’s going on there. Just it’s not just the missing. I’m surprised they didn’t start him tonight. Yeah, but it’s not just the missing. It’s that it’s the minutes, too. You know, like is he is he simply going to be a guy where Joe puts him in? If the shots falling, he leaves him in. And if he doesn’t, he’s out. And that’s who he is on this team now. Because we talked about everybody taking a larger role than they had last year. Hower is the only guy who has a smaller role, which is very weird, right? I think what it comes down to is that if you look at like the options that Joe has to play those wing minutes, you have Jordan, Ugo, Josh, Sam, Chris Bucher, and he’s totally fallen out of the rotation. And I think Sam’s obviously if you compete in Baylor and if you stack up all those guys against one another, like Sam’s thing obviously is he’s by far the better the best shooter. That has not been the case so far this season. He’s actually below average compared to those other guys. Baylor is shooting lights out. Uh Josh is shooting 38% from three. Like there’s been guys that have been more reliable. Jordan, too. Um and so now you’re saying, okay, this lump has been pretty much the entire month of November. What can he give you otherwise? And I don’t think he’s a bad defender whatsoever. I actually think we’ve talked about this a lot. He’s an underrated defender. He’s a good rebounder. He’s a smart player, but his ceiling and those in this defense is just lower than Jordan’s is. I mean, we saw Jordan do some things in the fourth quarter tonight that Yeah. As much as Sam would love to do those things, he can’t. Like he said it, he joked about it himself the last game that he’s just like not as good of an athlete as these guys. That’s why he does the tip out rebounds instead of going up there and grabbing them. You know what I’ll say about him? He is missing Tatum more than anyone else. One to create for him. Him and Derek would fight on that. But but yes, one to create for him obviously, right? And then number two, he would play next to Tatum and Tatum could get the rebounds, take on some of the interior role because Hower’s not an interior four kind of player. But to me, it’s not even about any deficiency he has as a defender. It’s that if this team’s thing is going to be they cause havoc defensively, like he pressured the ball pretty well in the last game, but like is he going to pressure the ball better than Jordan or Ugo can? No, I think it’s more the rebounding with him. Like I think yeah, he’s not as good of a rebounder. I mean Jordan and Josh have been by far the two best rebounders when it comes to like those wing minutes. So, it’s just like it’s tough because the thing that should be getting him on the floor is is that he’s a knockdown shooter and he’s creating spacing for everybody else and he’s giving you three or four threes a night and that just has him in the case almost all of the season. I mean, he’s had a couple really good games. So, I understand like why he’s fallen out of the rotation in the same vein. If you missing three shots sends you to the bench, like how much harder is it to stay off the court? You know, it’s like like Derek and Peyton, those guys got to go through slumps and because they’re giving you other things relative to what else is available, like they get to still play, you know? So, it’s a kind of a nightmare situation for a shooter to be like, “Okay, if I start over three, like I’m probably going to get yanked because there’s somebody out there that can defend better than me no matter how hard I play.” So, that’s kind of the story here. Like, he’s going to have to turn it around, and I think he will because he always does. But I’m going to ask the same Hower question I asked about Simons, which is again, if you if you’re if you’re an offensive skilled player who isn’t whose strength is not defense or rebounding, I don’t have time for you unless you’re unless you’re going nuclear on offense. But if you can play defense, I’ll live with whatever crappy offensive production you give me because that’s more important. Is that they are kind of torn between two identities, right? Yeah, I mean I think the identity is the defense. That’s the thing. But I think John’s point is that they’re relegating certain guys who could be helping them. I’m a little more torn on how I think opportunities, but they’re the same it’s the same argument. My everyone’s mistaken me as like being this pro Simons guy. I actually don’t think he’s great. I I I’m not like a huge fan. I think he’s is a good offensive player, but he and Hower are very much in the suffering the same fate right now, which is we can score, but I’m not Well, not really though. I mean, Hower’s been shooting worse than like most wings. That’s the problem. I mean, again, I think he’ll turn it around, but like that’s why he’s he’s not actually scorer. My argument is you’re you’re killing these guys by yanking them around. like they’re either regulars that you play and live with the es and flows or they’re not. They’re being jerked around like they’re journeymen who are like if you you know if you earn your minutes you can stay and it’s weird because both of those guys have a pedigree. Hower, you know, is trusted here and Joe has played him in in the past and Simons comes over as a 20point per game scorer but it’s but they’re positionally John. They are they put in over May not Walsh and company and like the rebounding issue from the first three games is back and all of a sudden the other teams grabbing every single Who would you have like how many minutes has finished with tonight? Uh he was down to uh what was it? 14. Who who would you have liked to see less of? Like genu genuinely speaking like I’m not even have these discussions and it’s very like there’s almost just like too many guys in a way. It’s not too But that’s the whole thing is is there like is the too many guys Walsh and May not like that’s what’s confusing is like I did we ever imagine I mean not played like seven minutes tonight right? No not tonight but before when when he when he supplanted Hower over the course of the season he’s lost minutes to those guys. Um now it’s Walsh before it was played better than him haven’t I think like you said it’s like you need you need a guy that can What has Josh and Josh and Jordan been doing? They’ve been matching up with opposing team’s best player. That’s not Sam’s job. Like, they have a completely different set of responsibilities than Sam would have. I mean, Josh and Jordan have the the second and third best defensive rebounding percentages on this team. And defensive rebounding has been their biggest issue from day one. And then the only guy that fights like it’s a weird comparison because he’s he’s comparing he’s fighting for minutes with guys that are doing have a different skill set than it’s it’s put it this way. Is there only one way to win or are there more than one? Right now, we have decided, he might be right, that the only way this team can remain competitive is to have people in those positions that can rebound and hold their defensive responsibilities better. That’s the decision that’s been made. We don’t know in a sliding door situation what it would be otherwise. All we know is the offensive players have been relegated to spot duty and hot hand duty and that’s it because that’s how Joe is coaching this team. I don’t know if it’s the right call. It might be. I’m not actually advocating for one over the other. All I’m saying is they’re in the same exact boat, which is Joe isn’t gonna he’s valuing one thing over another. And I think and I think it’s hurting those guys offensively because they can’t get into a flow and they can’t get into a rhythm because they’re not a regular part of the rotation. And as Noah said, they’re out there knowing if I miss my first two shots, I might be gone. So you advocate for going over Walsh mind. I just I just I just said as clearly as I possibly could, I’m not advocating for one over the other. I’m just simply saying this is how Joe plays it. And I don’t know if I don’t know if it’s the right thing. I’m I’m I’m throwing my hands up. That that’s all I’m saying is these guys have been ineffective and inconsistent and I don’t know how much of it has to do with the fact that they’re getting jerked around because of this particular situation. That’s all I’m saying. I think the problem is is that even when they’ve gone with their more defensive and rebound oriented lineups, which has been ever since Josh and Jordan started, like that’s the previous 13 games, they’re still a bottom 10 defensive rebounding team. like they’re now number 20 whereas they were like 29 for the first couple games. Yeah, they were trying to not be awful, right? They’re trying to not be historically bad as a defensive rebounding team. And I think through the first three games they like I was just I just wrote an article about the rebounding stuff like game two and three they were outrebounded by combined 33 boards and Jaylen was saying postgame in Detroit like we’re we have to figure this out like we can’t this this cuz you can’t win games being rebounded like that. And so to me, it’s like a necessity to have a Jordan or a Josh out there, whereas like having somebody that can shoot like Sam Can is a nice to have and it’s it’s a nice to have that got him paid $40 million because he’s one of the best in the world at it. And I think it’s going to come around. But this roster like because of the fact that you can’t have Jaylen Brown guarding the opposing team’s best player and doing everything that he’s doing offensively and you don’t have Jason Tatum who I think has been a really underrated defender for this team over the last few years and you don’t have Drew Holiday and Derrick White. Now you have Peyton Percher who has way more limitations defensively. Like they need to have that guy out there as their fifth guy. Like they just I don’t think it’s really an option because even still we’re seeing it’s not like they’re the best defense in the league and they’re the best defending team in the league. Like they’re just getting by in those departments. So I can’t imagine pulling back anymore especially when Sam has been shooting 30% from three on the year. Like and and again that sucks and I think it’s he’s going to turn it around but and they’re not putting him in the best position to get out of that slump. So he’s going to have to figure it out another way. and like him getting three shots a night is is definitely a shooter’s nightmare. But I just don’t think they have I don’t think they’ve even chosen to be like, “Oh, we’re going to pick the rebounding guy.” I think it’s like just a means of survival at this point. I think they probably should have started Sam tonight. Like that’s what I expected them to do coming off the fourth quarter he played there. Obviously, you saw what he did with the starters down the stretch of that game. I’ve said it over and over again. Whoever’s among those role players, whoever is going to play with the starters the most is going to be the most empowered player. And if you’re getting the most points per shot, let’s say from Hower in those situations, more threes from him, better efficiency from him, that might be what you have to lean toward there. Now, you can go a different direction down the stretch. I hate to bench Walsh because he’s done a good job in that role. But tonight, in this matchup specifically, I felt like it called for Hower and what he did down the stretch of that game. And Walsh was doing a good job, especially with that Ugo combination. We finally saw Ugo again tonight late. There was a Walsh Ugo thing off the bench that was working really well before they, you know, threw Walsh up to the starting lineup. That’s what they’re trying to figure out right now clearly like where do Walsh might not How’s her fit? Everything else looks like it’s in the right place. We’ve had our frustrations with Simons. Feels like they’re getting what they probably close to can out of him. Like I we I we’d all love a little bit more there, but that situation feels a little bit more figured out than this Hower Walsh my not thing, which right now those are the guys who are getting jerked around to your point, John. And Baylor’s eating some of Sam’s minutes, too. Like we’re talking about Jordan, but Baylor’s in the rotation. There have been many games where they’ve he’s actually played more than Sam, which I never would have expected two months ago that that was going to be the case. And I think part of that is that Baylor is shooting better than Sam, which is kind of hard to believe. But the other part of it is that defensively I think he has a little bit of an advantage as far over Sam. I think so. Okay. I think a little bit. I I mean the numbers say that. The numbers say that and that’s why I’m hesitant because it’s like it’s a small sample, but I lean I lean in that direction at least right now. That’s some creation from him too. He can dribble. He can create. Sam did a little of that tonight. I’ll give him some credit for that. But it’s tough right now. Yeah. Uh Jimmy Sherrod, before we close it out, um you guys have been on the Pine for a little bit. What What do you got? I mean, we’re just letting the kids go to work, John. Let the kids go to work. No, I I mean, I I I love the fact that, you know, the Celtics have some options that have each shown signs of being really good and signs of being like, “Oh my god, I now I know why that guy hardly ever plays.” I still go back to them just maximizing what these guys do. Well, there’s just they they don’t have a lot of options and most of them aren’t very good. But they’ve got to be able to come as close as they can night in night out to reaching their full potential. And when they don’t do that, you got to ask yourself why. Is it just them kind of coming back to earth a little bit? Or are there some things that Joe Mazula can do to help better position? There’s an element of you can’t bring that intensity and focus every single night. Like it it has to be at a maximum for this team to succeed. That was a lot of folks conversation, right? When you don’t, but here’s the thing, Bobby. When you don’t have it that night, as a coach, you should be able to see that and recognize that. And when you do recognize that, what can you do to at least try to jump start? Like on like a game like this, I don’t advocate for Ugo to play every single game. But on a night when you’re needing some kind of spark, this is the kind of night where you throw him out there for maybe 25 30 minutes versus having, let’s say, Minot out there or Jordan Wash or someone else. I I I just I want to see them mix it up a little bit more like that on those nights when the energy is clearly not where it needs to be in order for them to compete. Go with the guys that you know in that particular scenario and situation who can help you. That’s all. Yeah. I mean I mean I said a I said a lot of my piece at the beginning of the show before they came on, but I mean I just go back to what I’ve been saying is you know the league the NBA is all about talent. It’s not about anything really else other than that. and the teams that are the most talented and have the best players and then I guess the healthiest players by the end of the season ultimately win the NBA finals. Uh that’s kind of how it always goes when everything shakes out. This team, the two guys at the top, I said this earlier, I’ve questioned, you know, we’re all we’re all questioning the guys at the bottom and who’s going to be with this team in the next couple seasons. I’m more concerned about the top than I am at the bottom. the bottom guys just rotate through and, you know, make do with who you got, fill out the roster, fill out the rotation. I kind of feel like that’s what we’re looking at with the with some of those guys at the bottom. But when I’m looking at the top, I’m starting to wonder, you know, when Tatum does come back, whether it’s this season or next season, who is going to be uh, you know, a compliment of that player, assuming Tatum can get back to where he was or at least close, you know, is Derrick White going to be able to just slide back into the role that he was when he he when he was a Derek White that we all knew? If that’s the case, then great. Um, Jaylen Brown and Tatum, you know, we can have multiple conversations about that. I’m sure we will someday. See you guys later. Um Oh, they’re back. Okay. Um but um I’m starting to wonder as as the season goes on, that’s kind of what I care about more. I don’t like what I’ve seen from White. I don’t like what I’ve seen from Pritchard. depending on the game. I mean, there’s some some things that I have liked from Jaylen Brown this year, but I think the overall like the umbrella of Jaylen Brown, I’m having a little bit of concerns about on whether or not like that, you know, John’s mentioned it before, but the athleticism need to see that back from Jaylen Brown or else um he is going to have to rely on the on the shot a little bit more. I’m just not sure if he’s that type of player. he’s gotten by with his athlet athleticism over the years. And he can get to his mid-range game and try to work that into his game again, that’s great. But if the athleticism’s gone, or not gone, but if it’s just not what it was, then I think that’s something you got to look at uh years down the road. So, my questions are going to morph as the season goes on. I just I have a lot I’m more concerned about the players at the top than I am players at the bottom. I like we can talk about May not and Walsh and all these guys until our heads are blue, but at the end of the day, those players probably don’t have a huge role on any team uh that has like championship aspirations. It doesn’t mean that they don’t get playing time, but we’re talking like deep rotation guys there. So, that’s kind of it is like across the board, right, Jimmy? Like it starts with White right now, is White a number two or is he number a number two on a playin team? You know what I mean? is like that’s that’s kind of it. That’s that’s the whole everybody punching above their weight. I have a quick question for Noah. Noah, if Jaden Springer was on this team, would he be playing ahead of Simons based on what we’ve seen with everyone else? What a question. Um, sure. You get 90 points. I think so. I don’t think so because they they really never went with him and I think they they picked Jordan. They picked those guys over him. I don’t I don’t know. Jaden Springer might just be because he’s not even in the NBA right now. Where is he? He’s not in the NBA right now. So Jaden Springer might just be a dream for me at this point. John called him the best defensive player of all time on the Celtics. Like and then he was out of the league. What? What were the odds on a Jaden Springer that Birmingham? Okay. He’s in LA. He’s in the G- League. Okay. Yeah. I don’t think so. I mean, listen, they have a they have the problem right now for like minutes. It should be that there’s like three or four of those kinds of players, right? There’s the Ugo and Jordan and Josh. They’re all kind of supposed to do that. They obviously all have different strengths and weaknesses, but you know, um, you know what you guys could, you know how you guys could get what you want? You know how we could get 30 minutes? Just just hear me out. Okay. Like No, I’m saying right now, what do we want to see? We would love to see more We’d love to see more Ugo, right? Stop. All of us. We’d love to see more Ugo. We’d love to see more We’d love to see more Walsh, right? to see whether or not he can turn into something. You’d like to see May not maybe even Baylor get his minutes up there. Do you know how you know how you do that? It’s called It’s called tanking. Okay. It’s not going to happen. Don, it’s not going to happen. Everyone is saying it, but everyone’s saying it, but they’re not saying it. Play Ugo more. Play Walsh more. Play this guy more if you want to play. I’m not saying that for the record. Not you. I’m talking about the chat. Okay, the chat. Well, the chat’s I think the problem is that the we’re the amount of minutes we won combined is like way more than is available in a game. Even if you saw Jaylen like people want to see Sam play, they want to see Ugo play 25 minutes. Like it’s there’s only so many minutes to go around. It makes the losing more palatable is all I’m saying. Because when you see when you lose when you lose when you lose with Derek White looking bad and sad, you know, or Jaylen Brown, you know, looking, you know, whatever. Those are bad losses. Like when you lose with the kids, you’re like, I got to see the kids. You know what I realiz I was looking at cuz they’ve been the healthiest team in the league probably to start this year. Like one game missed from an injury. Jaylen’s minutes are down a little bit. Derek’s minutes are down a little bit compared to last year. You wouldn’t have thought that would be the case with Tatum out, but they are managing those guys to some degree. We saw the 10-minute thing in the first half against Brooklyn, whatever that was. Um, White, they have not overdone it with him. Obviously, he misses a big part of the second half of this game. So there is some of that going on whether due to health reasons whether due to trying to keep the Joe was talking at practice the other day 11 12 guys rotating and part of it is and part of it is what you know when inevitably there are some injuries we’re not going to be fighting over these minutes as much because now let’s say you’re down two three of those guys now it’s like the other guys that’s why I don’t worry about anyone everyone even bush no one wants no one wants to see injuries clip it clip it and save Inevitable. She said inevitable. She just guaranteed She can’t guarantee a win, but she can guarantee injuries. Okay. Okay. Okay. Noah, this is the end. How long How long are we into this show? Feels like it’s about time. We’re done. We’re done. We’re done. We’re done. Noah’s like, “Wrap it up. Wrap it up. We’re done.” Are we close to Star Wars? What does that mean? No. No, we’re not. Amit. Amit. Albert worked like one of his patented like 37 hour days and like he was producing the show and at the end of it he was like this he’s like this show’s longer than a Star Wars. So can I say one more thing? This is a blame guy type of game though. Tell tell Noah off camera because she wants to she wants to wrap this. All right. What is your thing? Keep it short. You can say it. Nick Claxton’s awesome. He’d look great on He’s also such a good antagonist. I will let you say that. That’s what you want to say. That’s what I want to say. Would you give up like two? I was worried it was going to be a long thing, so that was good. That was my biggest takeaway from today. Man, does he rock. He does rock. He rocks. They do. Yeah. Good coach, too. I like him. Yeah. I underestimated you, Net. Sorry. The next two and 15 games, though. Another story. What What I will say is this upcoming stretch of games is tough, but there’s 0% chance they lose that Washington game. That’s a certainty. Um, so we do Okay, I won’t say anything. We do feel good about that. Uh, and we do feel good about uh all of you guys hanging out and uh watching us after a loss uh to the Brooklyn Nets. It is what it is. It happens. You tell them we’re we’re moving over to the main account. John, no. We we are, but I’m just trying to get out of here. The stream’s moving. All right. Stream’s moving. Moving. It’s moving. It’s moving. It’s moving. It moved. For some people, they’re on the right one. No, no, no, no. I’m just kidding. I feel like I just got shot when you said that. End the show. End the show. The stream is moving. We are going to take off, but we do appreciate you guys hanging out. We’ll see you on Sunday. Patriots Sunday, too. A Patriots Sunday. I’ll be pulling double duty there. Uh check us out. Patriots postgame show. Following the Bengals. Maybe we’ll get Trags on the show. That’ll be fun. Um and uh Oh, that would be amazing. And then Celtics after that. So, we’ll see you guys later. Have a good night, everyone. Peace.

CLNS Media’s John Zannis, Jimmy Toscano, and A. Sherrod Blakely break down Boston’s 113-105 loss to the Brooklyn Nets, with Noa Dalzell and Bobby Manning checking in from TD Garden with more postgame reaction.

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