Can The Maple Leafs Save This Season? | JD Bunkis Podcast
[Music] Welcome to the JD Bungus podcast. Beliefs are in last place. Last, not like in a Ricky Bobby way, not like in a if you’re not first, you’re last. Like, no. In the Atlantic right now, the Leafs are last. And yeah, the standings are bunched up. JD, they’re only six points on a second. Yeah, I will admit that that piece of it doesn’t make it feel as urgent as in years past, right? If you’re just doing standings watch, American Thanksgiving is this week. It’s Thursday, which means the Leafs have one game to put themselves into a playoff spot. Otherwise, they are in the dreaded something along the lines of 80%. Does anybody even know that stat? It’s but it’s like 80% of teams that are not in the playoffs by American Thanksgiving don’t end up making it or it’s 80% of the teams that are in end up making it. Who knows? We just know that it’s been an important marker for the NHL and it’s one of our little milestones that we keep. And at this point given that again it is Thursday, the Leafs play one game. You can even you and I the I would guess I would guess just a little guess that the vast majority of my audience is not engineers and mathematicians. We could do that. Armen just said it. 76.6% of teams. This is from the sound of hockey. Bla1 Grubic. What a name. Bla1 Grubic. Great name. Listen, you get a stat from Bla1 Grubic and you trust it. You trust stats from Bla1 Grubic. The Leafs now, according to Money Puck, have a better shot at the first overall pick as of today percentage-wise than they do of making the postseason. I think it’s a little over 8% that they had hit on the first overall pick given where they are right now. And it’s about 6.8 little less than 7% that they make the postseason. I don’t think that those numbers are accurate. I think that the the percentage for the pick is in terms of what it would be today. I don’t think that the percentage for the playoffs is that because again the standings I don’t think that it’s taking that quite into account. Maybe it is. But I’ve been saying this to you for weeks and I’ve been dealing with the push back that comes with having opinions about this hockey team and especially a hockey team that over the last decade has been prone oh beyond that but this core specifically has really dealt with a lot of weather vein opinions about them because they’ve shown an incredible amount of highs. and then some horrific lows. And something that comes with watching what is essentially the same team over and over and over again, one that has yet to go on a run, is that you start to you start to get a little frustrated. You start to get a little apathetic. And you can you can really drill down the feeling of, well, these guys are never going to do anything because I’ve seen it for so long and it’s been the same problems. And I’m I’m totally with that. But what is becoming more and more clear is that it’s difficult to envision themselves pulling out of this and becoming contenders because to me that that’s the bar. If you’re really trying to argue the Leafs are a playoff team, sure we can still do that. You can give me the Austin Matthews argument. You can give me the Matthew Ny argument. You can tell me about the blue line being banged up. I would say that it would be a different story had the Leafs looked materially different with those guys all in the lineup. In fact, I would argue that they’ve played some of their better games as of late. like two of their most recent games where they collected three points I thought were more in line with what they’re kind of supposed to look like than say the game against Montreal or some of the games that have happened when they did have basically their entire team at full strength. Also, I’m I’m reluctant to give them massive reprieve on things like injuries when you have stuff like Stlars being out and he’s an injury-prone player or Chris Tanv being out who’s 37 years old and part of the deal with getting him on that kind of a contract was yeah, it it might not age well and it comes with some risk. But part of the reason why I don’t think that they’re going to come out of this and part of the reason why I don’t think that they are going to be able to overcome what I believe are massive flaws with the roster. And I’m going to get into more of that stuff, the X’s and O stuff with Christopher today at 10 because he has obviously a far more educated eye than I do when it comes to these things. And and there are often times where I I I speak on stuff and I go, man, I don’t I don’t know if I know enough about that. But when it comes to things like body language and leadership and the way that you present yourself, I think I have a pretty good handle on those things. And the way the Leafs are presenting themselves right now from a leadership standpoint, it’s just not it for me. And I mentioned this on a Leafs talk earlier, what, like maybe a week ago, less than a while that it was the game where Neander scored the overtime goal. I said, you know, I’m not sure how we’re supposed to judge this player anymore because there’s obviously a large group of fans that will defend him to the hilt and believe that he is in some way unfairly criticized because he used to be and that there’s a certain pocket of fans that just pick someone to hate or pick someone to blame for the Leaf struggles. And clearly Knander has absorbed some of those fans. But he’s putting up points. But I think that the game itself overall throughout these stretches merits some conversation of like what you need in these spots from guys that make $11 million and how there’s sort of a component to him where it’s like hey if it’s just in the points column then we forget everything else which to if that’s your opinion fine I don’t think it’s a crazy opinion but I’m watching the post game after that loss to Montreal and it’s just dreadful like it was a horrible loss that’s a second period where they got embarrassed in a way that a team in the National Hockey League shouldn’t, especially one that has Stanley Cup aspirations, that is in a Stanley Cup window where the other team has the puck for the entirety of the period, is snapping it around on you and honestly making you look like you are a team full of guys who are moving in mud and the game has basically passed them by. You don’t have an answer. There was no answer to what Montreal was able to do with their speed, with their support from the blue line. you’re watching their defenseman go and collect pucks, jump up in the rush, carry the play. Toronto just doesn’t have that. Even when they are fully healthy, they don’t have that. The speed of the Montreal Canadians, the passing of the Montreal Canadians. You saw a group that was young, exciting, fast, energetic, but also plays with enthusiasm. And that is something that we have seen from the Leafs in the past, but it is something that has been very much lacking this year. And you had a end where throughout the game there were a few moments where guys really stood up and said enough is enough. Joseph Wool snapped. Troy Stetcher got upset. Dakota Mermis got pissed off and decided to throw down his gloves and take on the the smaller Arborjack. I didn’t see it from the main guys. I think Tavar has actually looked a little worn down for the first time all season, but I’m watching the post game and listen man, I get that this market is difficult. It is. There’s more pressure here. So, when things go bad, there’s going to be more attention. There’s going to be more conversation. There’s going to be more noise. You have to you you can’t be showing up to the podium in an 82 game season and going nuts every single time. That’s not the expectation from me, and it shouldn’t be the expectation from you. But if there’s not going to be any urgency on the ice, can you see a little bit of urgency from your leadership core off of it? Like again, William Knander wears an A when Matthews is out of these games. And I’m watching him in the post game and it’s like he’s talking about how they dominated the first few minutes of the hockey game against Montreal in a what was an embarrassing night against a divisional rival who looks as though they have passed them by and is also beat up. And it’s this like lethargy in the way that they speak and the way that they act and the body language of the group that it just does not inspire confidence. It doesn’t inspire the idea that these guys are feeling the weight of the desperation that is already becoming this season. And it’s why in my opinion this is going to be one of the most important stretches of Austin Matthews’s career as a Maple Leaf. He’s honing in on the goals record. He hasn’t looked like the same guy. Yeah, he’s a good defensive player. He’s absolutely going to help this team. But if he is not able to come back and lead by example on and off the ice, the questions about his captaincy and the questions about his window as the captain of the Maple Leafs are, I think, going to start to turn because I don’t think you’re going to get it from William Nander. You’ve seen some moments where he’s gotten upset on the bench and that he’s spoken frankly. I think that Tavvarz will do it. He will speak with accountability, but it it doesn’t come with that same it doesn’t come with that same gravitas. Matthews has to be the guy. He’s going to have to be the one that pulls them out of this. He comes back this week and it’s going to be a massively massively massively important stretch for the Toronto Maple Leafs who again sit in last place. Um Brady Quinn is our Monday morning insider, uh former NFL QB and of course works with Fox. Uh what’s up Brady? How are we doing? I’m doing well. How you doing? Uh I’m doing okay. the hockey team here is in last place, but uh I enjoyed the football yesterday. Uh let’s just start with the the easy one. Who changed your mind the most this weekend? Um probably the Chiefs just with that win, the way they did it, uh changed my mind in the sense of like I don’t feel like this is going to be one of those years where we get to the postseason. They’re not going to be a part of the conversation. you know, they may have to go the long hard way to get there, but I thought in the fourth quarter, it was a combination of things, but in the fourth quarter, you saw vintage Patrick Mahomes being able to bring his team back into that game and ultimately win the game in overtime. But I think the other thing that made me optimistic about their ability to get to the postseason and maybe do something is the fact that they finally weren’t trying to beat their heads against the wall and they ran the football with Kareem Hunt with 30 carries alone just for him which is taking what the defense has given you. You know now again I don’t know why if you go back to how the Chiefs came back into it and the Colts you know stopped dropping eight, stopped rushing three and keeping a spy for Mahomes to get outside the pocket. uh because it felt like that was effective. Then in the second half, they got away from that in particular in the fourth quarter which allowed, you know, more one-on-one matchups and Rishi Rice and others to to start to make plays. Uh but again, Kansas City took advantage of what they were given. They did that throughout the game, running the football, I thought somewhat effectively, and then also in the fourth quarter been able to come back into that game. So to me, the Chiefs, if there are any doubts in my mind, it was an example of versus a good team, I think, in the Colts who’s going to be a playoff team. There it is. Like there’s the vintage Chiefs that we’ve seen. They still got it. They still have the ability to do that this season. So I actually came out of that game kind of feeling the opposite way about the Chiefs. Like, yeah, they ran the ball and Kareem Hunt was effective to a certain degree, but he’s just not I’m not afraid of Kareem Hunt. And I I agree with your assessment that to me it was more of like the Colts kind of gave that ball game away. They staked themselves out to a lead and then didn’t really particularly play very well for large stretches of it. Basically the third and fourth quarters I thought the Colts kind of went to sleep, which was surprising because they’re a well coached team coming off of a buy. And the thing that I think scares me the most about Kansas City is like, okay, so they they drew up this game script where they were going to run the ball and they were going to complete those short passes and you got Tony Romo going on and on and on about outside the number. Like he’s like, you got to go outside the numbers. You got to go outside the numbers. There’s a entire broadcast of the game. But then I’m kind of looking at it being like he is kind of right. Like he is sort of like that seems to be there for the Chiefs. But the thing that continuously gives me a little bit of the the spookiness is Patrick Mahomes doesn’t just feel as scary with coming up with a a deep ball play, a massive play. And there’s a couple of times where he tries to stretch the field and it’s just not there. And they don’t have the explosive plays. And it feels to me like the Chiefs are a team now which every single drive has to be this like methodical 75 yards down the field. When they get to the red zone, it doesn’t feel like they have the same weapons. And I’m watching a lot of these other groups that can just explode and have these chunk plays and that feels completely absent from the Chiefs game now. And I do wonder if like you can win in 2025 when you don’t have a group that can generate those types of of those types of passing plays or even in the run game where they can just gash you. Like Kareem Hunt, what was his longest run in the game? 10 yards. Did he have a 10- yard run? It was something like that. Like they they don’t seem to have these game-breaking options that other contenders seem to have. Yeah, I guess I’d go as far. I mean, who do you consider even contenders right now? Because the Bills surely don’t have that. Yeah. Who’s who’s their game-breaking option? James Cook. Well, say, yeah, maybe he’s out of the backfield, but outside of Josh Allen taking off and running, no one in the wide receiver group scares you. Yeah. I mean, you can go on down the line to through a number of teams. I mean, I guess we were going to say Tyler Warren or Jonathan Taylor scares you. I mean, I’ll go back to this. This game to me was about seeing if the Chiefs could win a game where they had to run the football because it was dictated to them and they had to stop the run and they did both those things. And so you can look at it, I think, both ways and and say, “Well, the Colts kind of gave that away.” And I was interested to see why they went away from kind of protecting their quarterbacks, um, not putting them on islands and not playing that match zone or man-to-man coverage. I don’t have no idea why they adjusted in the second half, but it was so effective. Mhm. But a lot of the stuff you’re talking about is really what we’ve seen from the Chiefs since Tyreek Hill has left. Like the the it’s hard to take the top off a defense now if you’re Patrick Mahomes because that’s the one thing that everyone’s coaching throughout the course of the week in preparation that they’re not going to give up. They’re not going to give up the big play down the field. You’re you’re going to be deeper than the deepest and you’re going to put keep everything in front of you. And as far as those plays that happen when Patrick Mahomes gets outside the pocket and creates, every single team now isn’t dropping eight in coverage. They’re dropping seven. and they’re leaving one as a spy and they’re rushing three and those three aren’t even necessarily trying to always get to Mahomes. They’re trying to eventually try to flush them outside the pocket to whoever that whole player is. So, I kind of look at how teams have adjusted and it’s almost like they get bored with what’s working and get away from it or maybe they felt the pressure of the moment like the defense because to your point the offense wasn’t doing anything in the second half, they needed to do something. they need to apply more pressure or try to find a way of making a play to be able to seal that game because most teams go into playing Kansas City thinking Kansas City is not going to beat themselves. So, we have to make a play to beat them. Otherwise, we’re going to end up in a scenario where Patrick Mahomes has the ball at the end of the game and he’s going to find a way of driving down to win. And that’s essentially what we saw in this one. So, uh I think you can it’s fair to look at it both ways and maybe it was a bit revealing of really what the Colts ultimately are. They’re a team that is going to be in the playoffs, but you know, can they beat one of the best teams with one of the best quarterbacks uh in the league? Probably not. You know, I think when you when you think about like Pittsburgh, for example, too, now no longer leading the AFC North, if Rogers is in the playoffs, every team’s going to be scared to play that team because of his experience of what we’ve seen him do before in the playoffs. Yeah, I’m I’m never going to stop respecting Patrick Mahomes. Or if I was like, I I’m I’m a sports better. I don’t want to bet against Mahomes if he’s got the ball in the fourth quarter and the ability to go down and tie or win the ball game. Like that’s always going to to scare me. But there is something to be said about just his overall presence and the feel of his impact on games that is different to me. Like I I don’t view Mahomes as playing at the level of some of the best quarterback play that we’re watching in the NFL right now. And it kind of leads me into the team that changed my opinion the most this weekend where they’re facing the Chiefs on Thanksgiving. It’s the Dallas Cowboys who really impressed me, man. You get punched in the mouth like that, you get multiple turnovers. You’re down 21 nothing. Really? I’m in. I’m in. I’m in. Let me just say this, okay? Everybody made fun of Jerry, right? They’re like, Jerry wants to stop the run. Jerry wants to stop the run. And guess what? He’s got three guys in the middle of his defensive line who were making plays all game long. Two of which that he just acquired. And they were able to slow down Philly’s run and force them to pass. They couldn’t really generate anything going on like that. They they force a couple of turnovers. They grab George Pickins who’s like a Jerry Jones distress asset 10 run one, right? Like that’s his move. He wants to go to another organization, see a guy who you’ve given up on that has a ton of talent, bring him into Dallas and make it work and it’s working. And they’ve just got some explosive game breakers. How many balls did CD Lamb drop in this game? Like what’s the score of this game if CD Lamb is just like normal CD Lamb catching what I thought were a bunch of routine passes? Dak is playing well. the defense stops the run. They’re kind of scary to me. Like in a wideopen NFL, if they can get hot, look out for the Dallas Cowboys. I’m in. I’m apologizing to Jerry. GM of the year, executive of the year. So, I’m going to I’m going to talk about this game from the other side of things. Yeah, that game as a Philadelphia Eagles fan was incredibly disappointing for sure because the Cowboys defense is so bad. I mean, next to the Bengals, they’re they’re probably right up there. And you talked about the turnovers that generated. I mean, the Saquon Barkley fumble in plus territory, they were lucky to come away with that. They get no points out of that drive. And then again, on a on a return, on a return, on a punt return, you get another a layup, another fumble right there, putting you in scoring position and they can’t get it in for a first and goal. I mean, there I had major concerns about Dallas only because I picked them to win that game. But at the same time, watching that those scenarios play out, this is where you should be able to close out a game. This is where you should be able to punch that in. The fact that they couldn’t and and you could say, “Well, yeah, CD Lamb dropped the pass.” Okay. I mean, I didn’t even like the play calling. I mean, you basically run to get down to like the one or two and then you throw three straight times and you’re not able to get in the end zone. I mean, at no point you don’t think you could do something to let Dak run it in like we saw him do earlier in the game or any anything else? I mean, I just I came away with that thinking that more Philly gave away that game than Dallas necessarily won it. And obviously, I’m giving Dallas credit. And again, I I picked them. I was excited about the win for Dallas, but the reality is is that team feels more like fool’s gold in the way they won that game. And Herz taking a sack late in the game the way he did. There’s just so many things I think you could point to that are more concerning right now for Philly because I do think that’s a talented roster that can actually make a run. But how they can’t put up more points against that defense and they can’t figure out a way of not allowing Dallas to come back in that game. I mean, they had that game dead to rights and then they just get shut down. To me, that’s been more of what we’ve seen from Philly and Jaylen Herz and this offense than anything else. I look again, Dallas gets the win, but to me that was a collapse by Philly. Yeah. So, first of all, that’s my favorite kind of game where Vegas loses on both sides of it because now we have a lot of early payout books where a team goes up 21 nothing and they got to pay out that winner and then Dallas comes back and wins and I go nice. Everybody wins. Everybody beats the book in that football game. I hear what you’re saying and I think that there’s a lot of merit to the Jayen Herz conversation in particular which is going into that game. There’s these grumblings, these little reports that it’s not just AJ Brown that’s frustrated with Jaylen Herz. It’s his teammates outside of that that are frustrated. It’s the coaches that are frustrated with the play. And he gave kind of like a PR response to those doubts, right? Where he’s like, I believe in myself. Nobody’s said that to me. Nobody’s come up to me and said that. And I’m like, well, clearly AJ Brown has. Like, there’s no way in hell that you guys haven’t had a conversation over the last two years. But he comes out and at first he’s finding AJ Brown on everything, right? Like Brown’s involved. He almost has a second touchdown catch on that one play where he steps out of bounds and touches the ball to the pylon. Um, and I’m thinking, okay, he’s slinging around the yard. He runs it in on a quarterback option. That was nice. It felt like the entire Jaylen Herz package. And then from that point forward, there was nothing. Like I can’t point to three plays that Jaylen Herd’s made outside of the the the Eagles going up 21 nothing that I was impressed by. And I guess it seems like your level of concern for his play and then when you compound it with the way that his teammates are talking about him would be pretty severe. I I think there’s a uh I keep going back to Kevin Matulla as the new play caller and as as you try to find your identity as a play call in the NFL, one of the most difficult things is to find the identity of your team. What do you do well? And typically you find that out about halfway through the season. You start to figure out things that you thought you could do going into the season, whether or not you’re capable of doing that. It could be due to injuries. It could be due to just, you know, lack of having guys who can actually do what we we thought they could do on film. So that plays a little bit of a role in settling into what you do well. And then really the second half of the season, you should be able at this point in time be able to excel. And I think most teams are able to define that as you talked about early in games. Why? because you script those plays. You know, most play callers will script anywhere from 10 to 20 plays and you’ll have every situation from third down, red zone uh involved as part of that where you have those calls that you really like early in the games, you know, dialed up for those situations when they first happen. The problem is what happens when you go off script? Can you make those adjustments throughout the course of the game, drive by drive, not just waiting till halftime like everyone thinks? You go grab your juice box and an orange and that’s where you’re making your adjustments. you’re making adjustments on after every single drive. And what I think a lot of firsttime play callers or play callers who are inexperienced that if a level struggle with is that right there being able to figure out throughout the course of the game the type of game that they need to play and that they can execute throughout the next three quarters of the game. And so typically you see those pops where first drive or first couple of drives in the first quarter. than you see coming out of halftime where they do have a little extra time for the coaching staff to get together, draw up those openers and then that first drive in the third quarter ends up typically being one where they move the ball be a little bit more successful but outside of that it’s a game of adjustments and that’s one of the things that I feel like Philly has really struggled to do throughout the course of this season but in particular too and I don’t know you know with with Patula calling the plays and maybe it’s Jaylen Herz a bit executing as well but whatever you want to draw to they’ve got some major issues offensively continuing to find a rhythm and play in a complete game. Well, I just we’ve talked about this a million times, but I like teams that can win in a variety of different ways. And it’s clear that the Eagles can win on the backs of their defense. I don’t know what their offense can do to really like feel as though they’re dominant when Saquon Barkley’s not hum. And he hasn’t been the same guy this year, right? Like it just the rushing attack has not been the same for the Eagles. And I don’t trust them in a game where they need to go score forcore with somebody. I don’t trust them in a game where if they’re playing from behind that Jaylen Herz is going to be able to come up with a bunch of big plays and get them back into a ball game. And that’s sort of why like I’m giving Dallas a little bit more credit here. And maybe why you even pick them is like yeah, I don’t view Dallas as a dominant rushing attack. That’s there’s that’s not who they are. But at least they’ve got a few things where they can they can create a splash play with their rushing attack. And then down the field with Sidi and with Ferguson and with Pickkins, I I do get the sense that they can come back in a game like that, that they do have the offense to be able to put themselves back in position. I also don’t think that they can win on the backs of their defense routinely. So, it’s like they have the same flaws as the Eagles, but when I’m putting them into like the same group of the the tiered teams in the NFC and that kind of like secondary group of contenders, I I can at least see a little bit of the vision for the Cowboys and it working out. And that brings me to this, which is like, are we just ready to say I know you’ve had concerns about whether or not he can stay healthy, which is a fair critique, but if the Rams are healthy, they’re are they not now the very clear number one contender in the NFL? Like I feel like they’ve gapped themselves from the rest of the league at this point. Yeah, I think you know they are the the they’re the top team overall. Matt Stafford should be the MVP. And I think the, you know, addition of Devonte Adams to Puka Nakua within a system that, um, you know, you can find ways of getting separation for guys and a lot of complimentary pieces, but Stafford’s playing as high of a levels I think he’s ever played in his career. Uh, it’s kind of shocking, too, on a side note, just to think about like he’s just recently been able to get over 500 for his career wins as a quarterback. It’s just all those years in Detroit and how he’s been able to overcome that. But I digress. That’s the only team that I look at right now and say uh it they should be favored versus anyone right now. Now I I don’t know if I’m going to feel that way at the end of the season depending on how things develop. I mean almost like the Rams like you kind of get scared like are things going too good too soon but they look to be the most dominant the best team right now and that would be the team that I suspect will have the number one overall seed to buy should be hosting the NFC championship game and you would think would be excited to go up to Santa Clara a place they’re very familiar with within their division to go play for the Super Bowl. At least at least how things are looking right now. I think they can win every single way. I think that they’re the best coach team in the NFL and their offense I don’t know. So yeah, they’ve got this incredible pass rush that affects just about everybody now. Like made Darnold back into the I’m seeing ghost for interception guy, but also just there’s no team in the NFL quite like them right now in my opinion that keeps defenses as offbalance as they do where like I have no idea what’s coming and it feels like there’s just a variety of different ways that they can chunk you up. I I I think too just comparing them to anyone else in the NFC like how consistent this offense has been. I don’t know there’s been many weeks we’ve looked at them and said uh oh like it was a step back or you know maybe you’d say like Stafford struggled a bit. It it feels like it’s been this way for the entirety of the season even in some of their losses too when you go back through it. So um to that point like I just I feel like they’re the most complete team and there’s a lot of teams in the AFC where I feel like there’s more parody and maybe some more depth. uh if you’re looking at after whoever you think that top team is, which would be the New England Patriots right now, um there’s just a lot of people not buy, you know, what the AFC is presenting right now. But again, there’s still plenty of time left for these teams to get stuff together. It’s one of the reasons why I kind of look at the Chiefs and I’m just not selling um on what they’re capable of being because of history, what we’ve seen, uh even though they do have some things they got to work on and improve upon. Yeah, I I’m I’m not selling on the Chiefs and the idea that they can be a scary playoff team or that they’re not in the mix of worst team that you could face if you earn yourself like a a home field advantage. You worked your ass off all season along and you only lose like four games and your reward is to play the Chiefs. That sucks. I just don’t view them as like I have in the past where I look at their problems and say, “Don’t worry, come playoff time, all this stuff is going to be gone and I’m going to feel like they’re the clear favorites.” That’s the difference to me is like could I see them still making it to a Super Bowl in this AFC? Of course. Do I think that they’re a write-off? No. There was a moment in that game where I thought, “Oh my god, they’re going to lose their sixth game and like you lose one more. You might be done.” Are you going to be able to run the table with this group? Like I guess that’s sort of where I’m at with the difference of the Chiefs is that I don’t have the same feeling like you’re an idiot if you’re staking yourself out to say the Chiefs don’t look the same as they have in years past, which we they did to us multiple multiple times, right, through these these tough stretches. I I would say the simplest way of describing them right now is they don’t feel like they have that bite. Defensively, there’s not as much of a bite from their pass rush. offensively. You talked about the lack of big plays, but even with some of their weapons, there’s not that bite, that reliable one where like, you know, not to use a team that’s got a losing record as an example, but like every single week if you have to play the Browns and Miles Garrett on the defensive front, like that’s a problem for you. Like, you know what he’s bringing every single game. despite the fact that that team is what three and eight at this point in time the season offensively preparing for them is is a handful because you always have to constantly worry about where he’s at what he’s doing and you know he’s going to get his production based on what he’s done so far this year. So um I just I don’t feel like there is that anymore. Like Chris Jones isn’t the same player that he once was and Carlopthus isn’t as much pressure as he once did. So um I I just I look at this team and I feel like they don’t have the same bite they used to. So, I want to go through a couple of quarterbacks that I think are struggling now. And we got to start with JJ McCarthy because literally no one has been worse. And literally no one has been only sorry, one guy has been worse since 2000 if you’re evaluating by uh EPA. So, this is a stat that came from I want to get this right. I think it’s Danny High of the Ringer. Yeah. Out of 852 quarterbacks uh in EPA per drop back among qualified passers since 2000, only one player is below McCarthy, and that’s Jammarcus Russell. Uh he also gave this quote heading into this week. This is McCarthy. Quote, “Before coming here, I was taught to play quarterback a very different way. How hard is it to rewire? It’s very hard.” End quote. Um so yeah, by the way, EPA’s expected points added. Um is it salvageable with JJ McCarthy? Like it looks so bad, man. and the accuracy is as bad as it can possibly be. The confidence looks awful. He’s given these kind of quotes. It’s a team around him that I think had Super Bowl aspirations and seems to have the body language of a team that is like extremely frustrated with his play. Where do you even begin with JJ McCarthy? That it was always going to take time. Um I I think when you look at how much he started and played, how successful he was, that was one part of the conversation for the intangibles that you liked about him as a prospect, but he really didn’t have he didn’t really have to ever carry his team throwing the football. Now, he did have to make some clutch throws, clutch plays, which, you know, that kind of comes along with the position, especially when you’re at a high-profile program in college, but you know, he missed his rookie year, and now he got into this season, he was a little banged up. I mean, this was always going to be a year where I think we’re going to go through some rough patches and and we’re there now. But to your point, that’s not where the team’s at, you know, and maybe you’d say last year this team overachieved a bit because no one had those expectations for Sam Darnold to play as well as he did. I mean, they kind of fell into that a little bit. U and and so this year, you know, now you’re going through the growing plays of really what is a rookie quarterback and having to deal with that. But to your point, I do think there’s a major concern about his accuracy. I think there’s a major concern about his consistency and throwing the football at all levels and being accurate with the ball placement and everything that comes along with that. You know, is that fixable? Is that able are you able to improve upon that? Of course, you you got to keep, you know, so much, you know, the same around him and give him continuity. So then he’s a lot more confident and comfortable in seeing where he’s throwing and and understanding where everyone’s supposed to be out there. So to me, like I wouldn’t throw in the towel on him yet. I think is going to get to year three and then we’re going to see. So, I think they have to see what they have through him the rest of the season and probably into next year and give him an off seasonason, give him a pres everything where he’s healthy and we actually see what he is capable of developing into because I do think if you pull the rip cord on him early, no one knows this better probably than the Minnesota Vikings for what they were able to do with Darnold last year is there’s too many other examples of guys now that are talented like a Darnold, like a Baker Mayfield who teams that drafted and pulled the rip cord early on them and then you see what they develop into later on when they are in the right situation circumstance. So, I do think this is a great spot for JJ McCarthy to be in, but he’s going to have to have a really strong callous skin because if he doesn’t improve his level of play, everyone’s going to talk and say the exact same thing you are, that they should move on from him or throw in the towel. I’m just not a believer in that yet for how little he’s played in this league. Um, I I do think some of the things that he’s doing out there involve his eyes not being in the right spot where they need to be, which then translates to your feet not being in the right spot where you need to be, and then you’re not throwing accurately. So, all those things can be trained and are fixable, but it comes with reps. There’s no substitution for experience and reps at the quarterback position, and that’s going to be the tough spot for him. I think I’m just a little bit more concerned by it that he’s with a coach that gets the most out of quarterbacks. Like it’d be one thing if this guy was playing for and I I guess the Cleveland Browns, right? Like or the New York Jets are a better example of just an organization that is mishandled quarterback after quarterback and you feel like, oh man, this poor kid. He’s just not surrounded by people that give him a shot. The weapons are there. The line play has been there. The coach is obviously there. And when you’re not seeing any progress week over week, I’m with you that you’re not pulling the rip cord and saying his career is done without another healthy offseason and then an opportunity for him to come into camp next year. Hopefully with someone that he has to compete with. I would actually view it a little similarly to what they did with Anthony Richardson this year where they bring in Daniel Jones. And I know they had Jones, but I’m saying like you bring in somebody that has some pedigree because right now their backup is Brett Ripen. So it’s kind of tough to say we’re benching you for him. like this is our third string quarterback. But I also counter that by going, do you really want him to lose all of his confidence? Like do you want him to keep going out there week after week? Like this week he had what, 89 yards, two interceptions, gets hit a ton. It looks horrible. It’s gotten kind of to the point for me where I’m like, if you actually believe in him, you might need to sit him for some of these games in the regular season and remove some of those reps. I just I’m not a believer in that. Like I feel like at some point you have to see what you have in him and you’re going to learn a lot about him going through those tough times. I think it’s interesting you bring up the Anthony Richardson comparison with you know Daniel Jones coming in and how they’ve they kind of had to compete for it because to me with Richardson you know there’s no concern about the talent and what he was capable of. The problem was the lack of consistency and being able to play at a high level and you know some other of the intangibles that I think everyone expects of the leader of that team. you got to be the first guy in, last one out, you know, and if that’s not happening, that’s a red flag. You know, you mentioned some other things that he did over the course of last season that, you know, coming off the play or taking a play off last year, which is I never heard of. Y those are concerns for JJ McCarthy, right? I think everyone’s hoping he’s going to be the guy and maybe it just takes one of those performances where you say, “There, it clicked.” And it doesn’t feel like that’s happened for him this season. So again, I don’t want to like rush to uh judge him after six starts in his career, even though it has been ugly. He’s turned the football over too much, which is something, by the way, he really never did during his time at Michigan. But to your point about this situation he’s set up for, this is as good of as good of a situation as you will find. But sometimes it just takes that game, that moment to kind of build back up that confidence to get him going and into a rhythm again. And and look, if it doesn’t, I’m with you. I fully I fully expect them to bring in someone to compete with him. And if he continually looks like this in the spring and in training camp, I wouldn’t be shocked at all if he didn’t lose out on that quarterback battle. I mean, the the reality is the team’s got this window right now with the way the defense is built and with the playmakers they’ve got on offense that they’ve got to seize the opportunity to try to compete and go win because the Packers are only going to get better. I mean, you look at the division. Detroit’s only going to get better. You know, they have an opportunity right now to try to make a run at this. Unfortunately, this year it might be a little bit too late unless he really turns things around. No, I think yeah, this year is too late. Um it’s not happening. I’ll stake myself on that one. Like I just there’s no way that it’s going to pivot this this drastically. I will push back to the Lions are always going to get better though. Like I actually one of my strongest opinions coming out of this week was watching Lions and I go the window’s closed. Like you’re not winning anything. Um they’ve got Gibbs who’s incredible. They got Aman Staint Brown who’s amazing. Jared Goff to me looks a lot like old Jared Goff uh without his offensive coordinator. It’s clear that there’s been a step back there and their defense like I think Jameus Winston’s actually playing great. This is two weeks in a row now where he’s been awesome. He throws the one tough interception each game which you’re going to get with Jamus. But overall the the Giants offense has look completely re-energized from a passing attack with him. So like some credit to Jamus and the Giants for what they drew up. But if you need overtime and frankly a lot of luck to win in overtime against the New York Giants when you’re supposed to be in a title window and you’ve had some of the performances that you’ve had this season against contenders, I just I don’t see it with the Lions. I I don’t see a team that is all of a sudden going to turn things around and feel like they did the last couple of years, which is that they can beat anybody and if they’re in a Super Bowl, it’s going to be no surprise to anyone. I would be flatout shocked if they made a Super Bowl this year. Like, and going forward, I don’t know. I don’t see how it’s materially getting better. I think they missed their shot. Uh potentially. I’d like to not, you know, again, I’d like to not put myself in that position where I’m just going to write them off again. Um given some of the changes that they’ve had to make this year. I mean, Dan Campbell taking over the play calling to me has helped them at least get a little bit of an uptick in their offensive production. I do think the Giants defense too is maybe better than you’re giving them credit for a two-in team. Um they can get after it up front. They they’ll they present some mismatch issues issues for you. So, you know, depending on the week, depending on the team, uh, that could be a problem. Uh, and again, the Giants team is is playing for nothing at this point. Maybe Mike Cafka is trying to make a case for him being the next head coach. So, they’re kind of throwing the kitchen sink at you. And as much as we want to give credit for, you know, Jamus and changing the offense, it’s been a little bit Mike Cafka, too, and some of the things he’s opened up for this offense that have been somewhat of a surprise uh with how they’re going about finding ways getting trick plays in there and testing some of these defenses. But I the golf conversation is real because it does feel like all of a sudden he’s he’s not playing as high of a level consistently enough as he was in the past. And I don’t know if that’s a lack of comfort with what they’re doing from a a pass game standpoint because clearly the running game’s there. Mhm. Uh it just comes down to, you know, maybe he’s not as comfortable with what Dan Campbell’s putting out there as a play caller as he was with Ben Johnson where when you talk to Ben Johnson about really what he did with Jared Goff was there was this sense of trust in one another and and and Ben made very clear to Jared Goff, you know, he was his guy and he believed in him when you can make the case that not many other people did. I mean, the Rams surely didn’t when he first got there. So, uh, there was just a different relationship, I think, between the play call and the quarterback. And I’m sure there’s an element of that, too, with Dan Campbell, but he just hasn’t been doing it quite enough. And I do wonder if they’re seeing the same things out there, you know, or if Dan Campbell’s seeing things a little bit differently when Jared Goff feels comfortable what he’s out there, what he’s throwing up against. Yeah, I listen, I love the Lions. I thought it’s been a great story the last couple of years. I root for them. Uh, I root for their fans because of how long the drought has been. I just I just don’t have faith in golf anymore. I don’t have faith. Have you ever have you ever thought their defense though was playing at a championship level? No, never. I mean, even even during even during that run, like that was to me always their Achilles heel was they kind of had to win in shootouts. And if you want to look at this past week, it felt a little bit of that as that game went into overtime. I’m like, “All right, like they’re going to have to win this a little higher scoring game than we’re accustomed to seeing them.” But that’s always like to me it’s not even so much when you talk about golf, that’s a portion of it. It’s still their defense where I just don’t believe their defense is going to be able to get a stop to get off the field when they need to the most. Their defense uh doesn’t seem to generate nearly enough pass rush. And the the difference I would argue of like this year’s D versus others is that we’ve always had like the Aiden Hutchinson conversation, right? Like oh and they’re going to add and once they add some other D end and it’s Aiden Hutchinson and somebody it’s like Aiden Hutchinson’s healthy and they could not get to Jamus basically all game long. He was sitting back in the pocket. He’s able to find Wandell Robinson a million different times, a million different ways. That tight end for the Giants, by the way, is a somebody. Like, that guy that guy can play. He’s nasty. Like, I’m I’m afraid of him if I’m betting against that team. But it’s like all they do is have one Brian Branch illegal hit a game and then a lot of just gouge plays where their secondary looks completely mixed up. Like I don’t know who the DB is that gave up the touchdown pass to Jameus Winston, but if Jameus Winston is just like stiff arming you and walking all over you to to get a touchdown score, I think that your secondary is lacking. Well, and Jameus Winston saying he could play a tight end too, you know, at some point. So when Jackson D comes back, maybe maybe you see that Theo Johnson who you mentioned, you know, how he looks and and and and Jameus Winston and they’re together in a you know, two two tight end set or something because he he’s he still feels like he’s got a little bit of athleticism there. Last one. Uh, I got to bring this up. Did you see the Liam Cohen decision at the end of the Jaguars game? Uh, I didn’t. Which one are you referring to? There was a number of decisions as that game kind of went down the line. The Jaguars have the ball. They get a stop. They get the ball in field goal range. They’re up three points. They, their opponent has run out of timeouts. Instead of kicking a field goal to go up six with a minute 32 to play, he decides to go for it on fourth down. they don’t convert and guess what the game ends up going to overtime because kickers can kick in this league and you basically from that position need like 30 yards and I will say I actually came away from this one a little impressed with Trevor Lawrence because he was dreadful and he he had three interceptions two of which that I just I really did not like one of them is a deflection whatever not so much on him but he drives down the field he scores he had a couple of nice scoring drives and I go that’s a sign of progress to me is when you can overcome adversity and you’re not playing well no you’re the other way. I I’m just I looked at the Jacksonville Jaguars as the team like I least want to see the Jaguars wins who playoffs. Yeah. Well, it just I just I watch them every week and I’m like, all right, like these are like I’d much rather see Kansas City get in. Who’s on the outside looking in right now? There’s a number of teams behind behind, you know, the Chargers and uh even Houston. Houston right now who wouldn’t be in the playoff picture. They’re a team that I think you look at the front, you look at what they’ve done so far with CJ Strat out. I’d rather see them in the playoffs if they can make their way in. It just I’m not as big of a believer in the Jaguars. But in regards to the decision, I feel like coaches in the NFL have gotten like fourth down happy. That’s where I want to go with it. Where Yeah. And and and I’m not sure what to make of that. I mean, look, fourth and one in plus territory. They got stuffed on third and one, by the way. Like stuffed. I know. and and and I’m sure there’s an analytics department that’s saying you gotta go for it because you get it, you you end the game and it’s over. And if you give them the ball back, you know, and who knows what the new kickoff rule, you know, you’re basically, you know, they’re going to be getting the ball at the 30 35 depending on where the return comes out to and all that. I I’m with you in the sense that it’s almost like coaches have forgot like the kicking game’s still available to them. It’s still there. That was one that like I’m not going to down that hill for because I think they should be able to get a yard. And then if they can’t, okay, the team’s got to drive, you know, 60 yards, let’s say 50 yards to feel like they’re in at least field goal range and feel like they can attempt to tie it up, which they did. So, credit to them. But I I guess the general point is you kick that, you miss it for any reason, you still end up in the same spot. And if you kick it, make it, and they’re driving down the field, they score a touchdown, kick a PT to win it. Now, now, now I would say, why don’t you go for on fourth and one? So, that’s just that that one is not one I’m willing to like die on a hill on. If it was fourth and five, a little bit different feeling, right? Fourth and four, a little bit different feeling. Fourth and one, you should be able to get that first down. Fourth and one, you run a bootleg that goes nowhere. Uh, and it’s one of those things, we talked about this, where you’ve got to have it factored into your analytics. Jags defense was actually playing all right, like pretty decent in that game, getting a bit of a pass rush. You’re facing Jacobe Brassette and a Cardinals team that I think has won three games. Like, if you don’t feel as though you can keep them out of the end zone with a minute 30 and a six-point lead, then you shouldn’t be in the playoffs anyway. I I hated that one. That one was like And again, it worked against them, so it’s an immediate uh Well, look at it. It the result played out this way, but I got a buddy who’s a Jaguars fan, shockingly. works here. And I texted him in the moment being like, I can’t I I can’t understand this decision. Like, this is the fourth down happy thing where so many coaches, to me anyways, feel like this outside pressure of if you’re not going in for on every fourth and short in plus territory, you’re a coward. Or you’re saying something about your offense that’s greater. And I’m like, it feels like it’s gone the other way. Like in the NBA where the the two point like uh the two-point jump shot where guys are in the middle of the key where they were taking that shot, every coach was like, don’t do this. Don’t do this. don’t do this. And then all of a sudden certain guys like the the Phoenix Suns went on this run because Chris Paul is so incredible from that range and defenses are conceding that to him and it works. And I’m the same way now with the field goal kicking where I’m like just kick the field goal. Like just just take the three points. You’re probably going to win in that situation. Just do it. My god. Uh anyway, uh I’ll let you run. Thanks as always for making time, man. I appreciate it. I’ll see you next week. Always fun. See you next week. Have a happy Thanksgiving. Yeah, you too. Uh I already have my Thanksgiving. All right. scar. Uh, all right. Quick break. I want to talk about uh my favorite basketball game of the season so far. So, maybe the Emirates Cup is hot. Maybe it matters. Maybe it’s cool. Will will we care in Toronto? Maybe Raptors make it can win the NBA Cup. played an extra regular season game. Are you pumped up? One NBA Cup game that definitely had a ton of juice was played this Friday. It was the Houston Rockets against the Denver Nuggets. And it was by far the best NBA game of the season. I don’t even know what I would throw it up against in terms of at least what I was I’ve watched. Maybe Armen feels differently. Maybe they’re I’m I’m going to talk a little bit more about this game later in the week with uh Zack Harper, but the NBA right now it kind of sucks because you’re looking at every single team on any given night and they’re missing multiple stars. You never know who’s in the lineup. It’s the only sport like football, you check it because you’re fantasy league and the gambling aspect, but the NBA, you don’t you don’t know what you’re going to get. You turn on a game and there’s usually a star or two missing and go, “All right, all right, game time decision. Injuries are way up.” They’ve certainly should be having a conversation about the number of games played in the league. They’re not going to do that. They’re going to continue to put these guys through the pace and space era where these calf injuries keep happening and tell you that like, “Oh, it’s a fluke. It’s a coincidence.” Like, no, no, no. It’s the style of play and the amount of games that they have. That’s the reason why they’re getting hurt. Obviously, it’s overuse. But Rockets Nuggets, it’s both teams at full strength. Basically, Nuggets missing a couple of guys, but they’ve got their stars and there was a weight to it. And I miss that in regular season games. I miss watching the NBA and feeling like this really matters. And we’ll see. I kind of think Raptors Cavs is going to have that, by the way. I think tonight is a is a big one because the Raptors are on the come up. Cleveland has been beaten by them a couple of times. Now they’ve got their full team. Raptors have beaten a bunch of bad teams and need to prove themselves against a good one. So, this one’s super exciting, but the difference is the Nuggets and the Rockets are playing for a title. They are playing for basically the number one contender belt against the Oklahoma City Thunder. And watching that game, I got so encouraged thinking, you know, they might have a shot. The Rockets are slightly better than I expected them to be. And everyone that was optimistic about Denver’s off season should feel good about that. Joic was unbelievable. The There’s a pass he made in the third quarter that went viral that I’m sure a lot of you have seen and the guy he passed it to missed the shot, but my god, the number one mustsee TV and I would say all of sports if you’re doing an individual one individual player you get to watch, you have to watch a full season of Joic is my pick. He’s ahead of McDavid. He’s ahead of anybody that you put Mlin Celbrini. Any like not even close. He’s ahead of any quarterback right now. Like Josh Allen, you’re taking Josh Allen ahead of Nikolai Joic. You’re nuts. There’s nobody. He’s the number one option. I can’t wait to go see him. I’m coming back early from Christmas vacation to make sure that I go to the Jokic game against the Raptors because I just I got to see him live. But the NBA, the Western Conference, those top three teams, that’s in a good place. I think Oklahoma City has a chance to break the wins record this year. Like, they’re just going to win routinely. They can just do it without bunch of guys from their lineup. It doesn’t matter. They’re so much better than the next best team. But Rockets, Nuggets, that game was amazing. And those two teams are deep. Those two teams can make shots. They’ve got multiple creators. and Oklahoma City. It It’s actually interesting. It’s not just going to be a runaway. Those two teams represent hope for the rest of us. I’d love if they had to face both of them throughout the course of the postseason. Anyways, quick break, come back and talk about the Leafs with Christopher Stig. So, the question for the Leafs right now is where do you even begin? and they would say, “Well, we are getting guys back in the lineup, right? The same guys that are a part of this. I don’t know what the timeline is going to look like on McCabe. They were murky about that as they always are with injuries. They’re beat up, not fully healthy.” You’d get a bigger benefit of the doubt if there were flashes of what it’s supposed to look like when you’re at your best, when you’re imposing what is your identity. Every team’s got to have an identity, right? And we saw that with Montreal. They snap the puck around. They’re quick. Their blue line gets engaged. They are terrifying offensively. Bunch of high-skll guys, young guys, youth energy. Leafs look beaten down. Leafs look like a bunch of guys who are strangers to one another, who don’t particularly care about one another and who play without passion or again identity. And now they look exactly like that team because they are in last place. Yeah, standings muddied. Yep. Long season to go, but where do you begin? Christopher Stig of the Clever app, which he created, the Clever Super League. Uh, two-time Stanley Cup champion. He joins me now. What’s up, buddy? How are you? Yeah, I’m looking at this lineup. It’s a little bleak. It’s It looks like the Leafs you played with. It does. Yeah, I think we talked about that the other day when we brought in Daryl Boyce to help. Uh, obviously solid player and help, but yeah, there is uh it’s a little murky looking up and down, right? So that let’s just do that. Like where do you start? Because okay get healthier that’s nice but where do you start with what you have? Oh like I think a big thing we’ve always talked about with this team is identity and role and like what is one specific simple thing or place you can start with that gives some line an identity. I mean you would think that the knander to line right they’re the guys that are going to score. Knander doesn’t really feel like defending at all, but what is that? What is those players underneath those top guys that can, you know, they can jam it up, they can give offense. And honestly, for me, I look at the lineup, too. I still don’t want Max Doi in the middle. I think he goes through an identity crisis because he goes from wing to center and you got to play the game differently. I’ve kind of been through that before. I’d like to see a guy like Scott Lton head up with him, play defense on the defensive side of the puck, let him kind of go for it, and then start to let certain guys build their identity throughout the lineup. But again, when you’re mixing and matching all the time and you’re hoping this line works and hoping that line works and you don’t really have two guys even on a line that are solid pieces and you can always kind of flip that third piece around, it makes it uh it it makes it hard to win and it makes it hard to get consistency with certain lines. And then also building an identity per lineer for your team. Yeah, I think that they might have found two of those guys with lot and Lorent, but Lton’s too far down the lineup and I don’t know if you want to play Lorent that few or that many minutes like I I don’t know if that’s you got to. Yeah, you got to, right? Especially where you are right now. But at least like when you’re talking about pairings and feeling like an identity, that’s one those are two guys that have played kind of well. They’re Ontario guys. They care about the Leafs. You see a little bit of jam in their game. you see a little puck pursuit. They they’re reliable in the Dzone. Like I I said this the other night on lease talk that Lton’s never going to live up to the trade because they gave up a first and a real prospect for him. So he’s going to be viewed through that lens, but ultimately he’s delivering on the player that I think he’s supposed to be. The the other part of it that you’re talking about, that’s where I have my difficulty is I go, “All right, when your team is banged up and you’re missing guys, that gives other people opportunities, right? like this is an opportunity for Dakota Joshua and yeah, you don’t like dooies fit down the middle. I don’t think anybody does, but out of necessity, they just they had to do it. They don’t have any other center. They don’t got guys in the minors. They lost David Camp to a ugly divorce. They just they needed him to play that position and needed him to step up and do something for him. So, you could give him time to figure it out on the wing, fine. Like, they kind of need him to because he’s the fifth highest paid forward on the team. But the Joshua’s, the Machellis, the Bobby McMahon’s, the rest of these guys that are supposed to take those minutes, supposed to play with that urgency of thinking like, man, I can I I’m getting 16 tonight. When these guys come back, I’m I’m down to 13. I’m down to 12 minutes. This is my real chance to shine. None of them have really stepped up. None of them have really produced something that’s outside of what they have normally done. And I’m looking at that and that is a red flag to me. That’s one where I go, I don’t know if you’ve got the horses. If when these guys are getting added minutes, there’s not a single guy that you look at and go, “Well, what are you supposed to do with him when you’re fully healthy?” Because clearly he’s earned more minutes. Like Robertson’s been that guy for them this season. Cowan’s had moments, but the other pieces that they brought in here to complement the rest of this lineup, I just I don’t see it, man. Yeah. And like again, I’m looking at the lineup. You got Dakota Joshua, right, the other day with Max and Robertson. Like, why not throw Lot and McMahon and and Joshua together and just keep him as a staple? Again, you’re talking about the next man up mentality, and they just don’t have the horses generally for the next man up mentality. They don’t even have the guys in the miners to come up to have that next man up mentality. So, what you have is a a group that has an identity crisis. You don’t have enough bottom end talent that when they get added minutes, they can add to, I guess, the equation of winning. Um, and that is a serious concern. But where I just look at the lineup is start to identify multiple guys. Don’t move them from their positions. Give them a specific role and identity what they got to do. I know when guys go out of the lineup, so you’re talking about Joshua now, he’s on the second line and he’s supposed to add offense. Some guys can’t do that. Some guys, even when there’s guys out of the lineup, some guys can’t go up and add more. They got to stay where they’re at. But you also do got to tinker and see which guys can add more with more minutes and and more opportunity. And with this lineup, like I said, I’m just looking at it. It’s it’s pretty bleak. And when you don’t have the next man up mentality, there’s generally a bit of a culture issue too in the sense of uh your identity as a team and winning because generally for short stretches with injury, if you’re a good hockey team, you should be able to bypass that short stretch. It shouldn’t be this apparent that guys are missing. Yeah. You’re not seeing that at all. And I think that at this point it’s pretty easy. You know, I you get uncomfortable at times speaking about what a team’s culture is because you’re not there behind the scenes, right? Like Yeah. I’m not speaking of like they’re bad people. It’s just like the winning culture, the winning, how you play every shift, but that’s it is like you open those conversations though when you play this way. like you open those conversations when I’m watching postgame interviews and it’s William Knander and it’s him talking about the first nine minutes where the Leafs played well and this kind of somber attitude. The Leafs do this thing over and over again whenever they’re struggling and whenever they’re pressed by the media, it’s like they don’t go into defensive backs against the wall, nobody believes in us, like we’re going to show you mode. They go into like this like woe is me, low energy thing. And I get it because it’s 82 games and you have to manage your energy when you’re speaking to these guys and like I know you don’t want to get too high, you don’t want to get too low. That’s sort of the mentality of a champion, but when you’re in last place, you’re behind the Buffalo Sabres and you get body bagged on Saturday night by your biggest rival. I kind of want to see a little FU attitude. Like I kind of want to see a little bit of like, hey, we know what we have here. Like we’re going to show people wrong. Like we’re going to do something about this. We’re we’re getting this right. What you’re seeing is not acceptable. We’re going to go out here and prove. Like there’s nothing of that. And and it would be one thing if I saw it on the ice and I went like, “Oh, okay.” Like, “This is who they are personalitywise, but on the ice they do it a certain way.” I I just don’t see it anywhere, man. And when you talk about culture, it just it does it feels like one that is completely lost. I I don’t see where they’re supposed to point to that and say like that’s where we are. That’s who we are. Well, and you’re talking about too high, too low. So, clearly not getting too high or too low isn’t working. Like you said, how many years have we been asking for in the playoff run? Someone to step up and say they’re pissed off. Yes. Someone to get angry, someone to shake the bus a little bit. Whether it shakes the foundation and puts people on notice, whether it’s a coach or a GM, but specifically your star players. Like, yes, it’s nice to be settled and everything’s always not too high or too low. I’ve played on top teams where sometimes you’re just straight up riding the roller coaster, right? because you’re a highly charged, emotional team. If you have a tough loss, guys get pissed off. They get pissed off at each other. Guess what? You buckle down. You’re a man. You make up wake up the next day and you go play again and your buddies. But again, when you win, you get a little high at times. It’s just you you do got to feel that emotion and that passion each and every day, especially throughout an 82 game season. Yes, you can’t do it all year. It’s unmanageable. But at times, you want to see these guys ratcheted up their intensity. Ratchet up the emotion. Tell the media to beat it. Like Damen Cox coming at them every day, you know, tell him to beat it, you know, like I’m just saying like get emotional at the guys that are, I guess, talking trash about you. Yes. Right. Say something that shows that you care. Say something that shows a little uh ticked off attitude. But like I said, I’ve been on teams that are great teams that yes, you you generally find a way to keep the the ride settled, but at times when it’s not good, guys get emotional, right? And does everyone get along at that time? No. But you find your way back to getting along through hard work and and being honest. Well, you’re not going to be getting along uh because you might not be on the same team if things keep going this way. Like there’s no option other than a soft sell for the Leafs. Like at the very least if they can but the bottom guys can’t do that. It’s the top guys. Well yeah dude listen there was a couple of guys in that Montreal game like and I pointed out to this already but Stetcher gets pissed off and Mermis who’s an AHL callup throws down and has a fight and it’s the guys that are supposed to be there that aren’t really doing anything. Wool snaps, but this is like they’ve already had a goalender speak up and that was Anthony Stolars earlier in the season. And I just don’t know if that carries the same weight when the goalie says something versus like if unless you’re Patrick Wah, right? Like you got to be like the face of the franchise, I think, to have that same impact on the skaters. Maybe you disagree, but I just I like I I need to see that from the main guys. And that’s why when Matthews comes back, and I think that he’ll be back on Wednesday night, I feel as though this is like an actual hinge moment in his career where you’re going, “All right, man. You’re one of the greatest goal scorers of all time. No one has ever doubted your skill. No one has ever doubted your passion for the game.” Because one of the things about Matthews that gets said by every single person around the league is during offseasons, he works his bag off. That this is not somebody that like takes it lightly. That he’s just a talented guy who sort of floats around. like that’s not his attitude. Um, in fact, there’s like a lot of people that think that he hurt himself because he works out so hard in the offse. Um, but if he doesn’t grab the reigns of this thing as the captain and if he is not like the emotional driver, I don’t know if anybody else can be and it puts like a huge spotlight on him when he comes back. Yeah. Well, clearly these last few games without him has shown that. But the big piece of Matthews coming back is like like you said, what’s the storyline? What’s the story? Like I was listening to 590 a little earlier today and they’re like, “Ah, Trevan screwed up by not signing Marner and he did not do this and now they’re losing because of this and and and I’m kind of listening to it like okay, if you’re Matthews and you’re a player like this is kind of a moment like you said where you got to put the team on your back and take them back because everyone’s talking about Marner’s the guy is the reason this team isn’t winning or this reason.” So why not be part of the success? Why not be a guy that gets, like you said, a little bit pissed off, put the team on your back and take them back and kind of get you guys out of this ditch. Even though, let’s go back to Marner second. I think if Mner was even here, I don’t think it matters how they’re playing and the identity crisis they have throughout their lineup and the bottom guys and everything, but that’s the storyline, right? That’s like heard it for two days now. Marner’s not here. Uh they’re not they’re they’re like T1 screwed this up and he did this and all that. So again, you’re right. This is a big moment in Matthew’s career, especially when they’re sitting at the bottom. All they’re talking about how great Marner was and how they lose him. For him to come in, play his best hockey ever, put the team on his back and start to show when he’s engaged and when he’s at the top of his game, he can carry a hockey club. Man, are they a better team with Mitch Mner right now instead of Dakota, Joshua, and Machelli? Like, duh. Like, totally. Yeah. Is the power play better? For sure. Is the penalty kill better? For sure. But is it at the point right now where you look at them and say if they had Mitch Mner they’d be a contender? If you’re saying that you’re out of your mind. And if you’re seeing like, hey, they don’t play with enough passion. Hey, they don’t play with enough energy. Hey, they don’t play with enough FU to their game, like to their identity. Mitch Mner’s not changing any of those things. And like, by the way, can’t change the back end. Yeah, exactly. And and not just not just that, it’s like Mner, by the way, quietly is not having the greatest season over in Vegas. He’s on pace for I think like somewhere like less than 90 points which for him is not very good. His team’s been kind of meh. He had a horrible turnover the other night that cost his team the the win in overtime. Like it’s this is he doesn’t get the same minutes there either because the team’s deep 24 minutes. I’ll hear all that. I’ll do the I’ll do the post Marner breakup conversation. Yeah, it’s a whole other thing. But no, but I but what you’re saying is right that people are already doing that. They’re like, “This is the reason if they just would have had Mitch.” It’s like, “This is way too early to be having this conversation.” But back to like where I think he does matter is the Matthews part because ultimately I know these guys respect business decisions and I know that these guys knew Marner well enough to say like, you know what, this guy didn’t like it here. He wanted to start his family somewhere else. That’s a major component in his decision-making. Like all the respect to the guy. I’m sure that no one isn’t friends with him anymore because he left for Vegas. That being said, if you’re Matthews, Marner decided instead of playing the rest of his career as your winger, instead of sticking it out and saying like, you know what, we will get over the hump. It’s cuz it’s with you and I, like I get to be with you, he decided, I got a better shot going and winning with Jack Eel out in Vegas and not paying state taxes. And if you’re Matthews, like, don’t you want to have a little bit of that breakup energy, right? Like somebody dumps you and what do you do? You go to the gym right away. You’re like, man, I’m going to get ripped. I’m going to I am going to be cut. And someday down the line, you might see a photo of me or somebody might come up to you in your circle and be like, “Oh, have you seen JD? He looks great. He’s doing so well. He’s crushing it at work. He looks so fit. He looks so happy without you.” You want to win the breakup. And if you’re Matthews, like you should be the number one guy who wants to win the breakup. Not the Leafs fans. Like, what do you have to lose? You’re already the losers. Like, you were already sucking. You were already an embarrassment. If you’re Matthews, this should be personal for you. You should be coming back and being like, the idea that there is a word circulating that Mitch Marner created some of who you are as a player. You would want to be just fired up to stamp that out immediately. Well, like I said, that’s like the the I guess the everything’s lining up for him to come back and shut down every story line is essentially what this is. He’s hurt. The team struggled. Everyone’s talking about Marner. They need Matthews. They Matthews can’t play without Mner. Like I’m saying like him coming back and putting the team on his back and even if they’re not winning day one, but just showing some, you know, resilience and fight and doing what he can do at his best level and then start to get the team trending in the right direction and showing everyone he is, you know, the alpha, the guy we follow. this is the man that we want to, you know, follow into battle and the guy we trust in the big situations. Like this this is his storyline to take and run with it however he wants to. I’m not saying if it doesn’t go well he’s not trying. He’s one of the greatest players in the game, but this is a big time to dig deep and really change a lot of these storylines that have been pushed upon. I think it’s massive. Like I really think it’s as important a stretch of his entire career because again if it goes the other way you’re start like if he doesn’t look like that guy there’s going to be a whole bunch of people pissed off that they gave him the captaincy because like what’s the point of giving I know that a lot of it is ceremonial. I know that some of it is to sell sweaters. I know that being the captain today is not quite what it meant you know 20 years ago to an organization but you you got to you got to lead this team like it’s your job. You’re the highest paid player. the guy that you were with was your co-pilot left you. They gave you the captaincy instead of the guy that’s from here who’s been playing well, by the way. Um, you’re within 10 goals of breaking the franchise’s all-time goalc scoring record. It’s it like I’ve never I’ve always thought like the pressure on him was huge, but that it was spread throughout the lineup that it was like, “Oh, there’s also pressure on Mitch Mner. Oh, there’s also pressure on John Tvar. Oh, there’s also pressure on William Knander.” how it really does feel far more centered on just like this one guy specifically. The the other question becomes though like I think it also shows you how much pressure had because that that microscope’s now moved, right? It’s moved and like you said it’s amplified on two to three guys rather than four now. Yeah. And Mner did eat a lot of that. Marner ate a lot of that. Like there’s a there’s a lot but like Yeah. No, listen, Marner ate a lot of that and like if you’re talking about just things he absorbed, it was like some of the penalty kill stuff, some of the power play stuff, some of the minutes like Knander, we’re having more conversations about his defensive play than ever. And that’s because he needs to play a more important role for the team, one that used to be occupied by Mitch, right? Like Knander could come in for his 18 minutes a night and just basically cheat and try to get offense and like was measured purely upon that. Now we’re back to having conversations about more complete game because there is a shield gone. So like again I’m not trying to ignore the fact that like Marner is gone, but I do think that the conversation with him has been oversized in terms of what the impact was. Uh like they didn’t go from being first in the Atlantic to last in the Atlantic because Mitch Marner left. Like they went there because it looks like they got old, slow, quick. They don’t have an identity and a lot of the pieces that they brought in to supplement that talent have not really been doing anything. And when I look at this, like this is sort of where I want to get into more of the X’s and O’s with you. When I try to envision them starting to have success, like yes, Matthews and N are going to be important for the forwards, but like how they get the puck to those forwards seems like a herculean task. And even when they’ve been healthy, they haven’t been able to do it. And now you’re removing three like staples from your defense core. uh and leaning on Benois and Mermis and now a pretty diminished version of Morgan Riley. Like Oliver Larson has been amazing. I want to leave him out of this cuz like he’s on pace to finish with one of his best seasons of his career and I think that he’s playing with Jam, but like you watch Montreal, right? And so much of these that that period was just what their blueliners can do and then you superimpose Toronto on them and you go like they’re just absolutely not capable of doing something like that. No, they just don’t have the horses on the back end to do I mean, think about, you know, Dobson and you got Hudson and you got all these guys. They would be all of Toronto’s best, most creative DM man, right? If they were on Toronto’s side. So, I, you know, we talked about them being two, I guess, you could read a book every time you watch the Toronto Maple Leafs play essentially on how you think they’re going to play. You know exactly what they do at exact time. But they also don’t. So they’re not being creative with inside their system, I don’t think, because it’s too monotonous. They just keep going through the same thing over and over. How many times do you see the forwards get clear line rushes off great plays from a D man or a great individual effort? Right. You’re not seeing a lot of football season. Yeah. You’re not seeing a lot of guys with time and space. You, like I said, you don’t see them take the puck back in the neutral zone. Find guys. You watch Montreal, man. Like they take the puck back. And now this might not always work for Montreal. They got to learn to play two different ways. They got to be able to play the way they did and they got to be able to grind it down to get in the playoffs to do well. But back to them, their creativity all starts from the back end. You got guys switching on the back end. They’re causing confusion for the the lead forwards. They’re kicking it out. They’re punting it back in the middle. They’re driving down. Like how many one-touch passes did they have that just drew so many guys in and it cleared up space for them time and space on the other side of the ice? They just looked like a more complete team because their back end is so dangerous at bringing the puck up and also like creating oneman breakouts. It’s kind of what Riley used to do a little bit more, right? But imagine having like four of him or three of him, three guys that can do it consistently when they’re on the ice time and time again. Even Mat, right? He’s a one-man breakout. So when you look at the Leafs decor, like is Simone Benois going to beat a guy, come up the ice, kick it out, drive it down. Is he going to rag it back and drag two guys to him and saucer it to a centerman? Kind of we were talking about Duncan Keith, the best third assist Dman in the league. Like how many and when you’re a forward and this is I’ve been on teams with good D and bad D. When you’re on a team that doesn’t have elite Dman that get you the puck in time and space as a forward you start to not even go through your routes almost anymore because you know you’re not getting the puck right. You basically know all the routes. you know everything and you know where it’s pretty much going all the time where you need guys that paint outside the lines, right? You need some guys that paint outside the lines that do something different that might be a little more risky but gets you the puck in time and space and and it gives you more opportunity to score. But I just watched like all the interchanging of Montreal’s players like the D down the wall, guys coming up the wall, the D in the neutral zone crisscross and like they cause so much confusion because they have the talent, they have the coach that’s teaching them it and then they execute on it a lot. Now for Montreal’s side, they’re going to have to learn to play two different ways. But it’s it was impressive to see, but you don’t see any of that from the Leafs. No. Right. On side. Yeah. But you also don’t see the other side for the Leafs. Like it’d be one thing if you thought, okay, that playoff style that you’re talking about, that grind it down style was working for them at times, but you’re not. Like they don’t play with any sort of team identity to the point where like I don’t and I said this to you, I I don’t know, we were talking on the phone this weekend or if it was in a text, but it’s gotten to the point now where I don’t know what it is supposed to look like. Like I don’t even know what the vision or the team is supposed to be in terms of the actual application anymore. Yeah. I think with like you’re talking about the Leafs pound it and grind it down and go north and all this like if you’re going to play that way it’s hard to play that way 82 games. That’s why we’ve talked about in the NHL for years. You got to need a you’re going to need a team that wins the regular season because you’re going to need to go into you know Carolina on a Tuesday night where you have no energy and you can’t be grinding it and pound it down. You’re going to have to rely on your skill guys to get the job done or your specialty teams to get the job done for your team. Like throughout the regular season, you have to win at skill. You have to win specialty teams. You have to grind it down some nights. You have to just play so many different facets of the game. And like you said, what is the Leafs game right now? Clearly skill and breaking the puck out and creating time and space from their back end isn’t the key, right? Their forwards aren’t executing, but also because they’re probably not getting the puck with time and space. They don’t have the ability to. And then if you look at like, you know, the other top teams, they figure out a way to do it throughout the regular season. and then while building in that physical facet of their game for the playoffs, right? And that’s so it’s like you can’t just be a one-trick pony, especially in today’s NHL with all the skill. It’s like, okay, let’s go let’s go north and grind them down. Physically, that’s not possible for 82 games. It’s just not not even just that, like you’re looking at a group of guys, and this should be even part of the conversation where like injuries continue to pop up for them. So when you’re trying to be like a dump it in and grind it down kind of team at this point you have to like if we’re doing the Matthews conversation like you have to wonder if he can withstand an 82 game schedule doing something like that like at that pace 100% with that that many minutes that kind of pace that kind of style of play and I just don’t know how simple it’s going to be in terms of to make adjustments for the coaching staff to say like all right we’re going to be able to try to implement something that’s different again when you have roster personnel that might not fit hit that. But also guys that again interchangeable, yes, because nobody’s really doing anything. But you just said it, guys are trying to find their role on this team and be taught what exactly it is that they’re expected every single night. and from the forward group specifically like that that identity crisis that you’re talking about that feels so pervasive amongst the the guys that I mentioned the group that they brought in other wingers that they have where I feel like a part of it is like you’re a player and you’re searching for something but you can’t even just start with one little thing to build off of. Yeah. Well, that’s that’s the hope generally when you’re in this this uh type of a crisis as a team. You’re always looking at one specific thing that you could do better, right? That builds your game. You don’t try to look and boil the entire ocean. You’re trying to watch or think of one specific thing that you could get better at. Think about the coaching for the Leafs right now. Like, what is Craig Buru thinking? Like, you can’t boil the ocean. What’s one specific area that we could get better at that helps us get closer to the wind column time and time again. So when you’re looking at the identity crisis back to that with all the players, it’s, you know, bring them in, figure out lines, not like lines of three, but lines of two where two guys can work with each other. There’s interchangeable pieces on the side and each line starts to draw an identity. You’re only out in Dzone faceoffs. You ain’t going out in the ozone load. I’m sorry. Right? If you’re with Max Doi, you might if Max Doi is on your wing. once uh Matthews comes back, you know, who’s he going with and what are their specific roles per line. I think if you start to get in to uh you know, start to create the identity around the lines, not so much, like I said, about all three players on the line, but two, and you give them, you know, a little bit more clarity on what they exactly need to do, I think that, you know, this team could start to turn around. But I think about, you know, I don’t envy the Leafs coaching staff right now at at trying to pinpoint one specific area that that is a cause for concern. One of the things that I really hope they do is we got this brief look before N and Wah both got hurt of a line that was N Wah and Cowan. And I’d like to see them go with a group like if they don’t stick with Lton there, which I’m okay with, but trying N with Lton and Cowan and then giving Matthews, you could give Matthews Knander, like I’m fine with that because Tvaris seems to be capable of carrying sort of whoever’s out with them. He’s played well with McMahon, you can give him Robertson, whatever. But spreading out the talent in a way that they haven’t done in years past. And asking like each one of these lines like, “Hey, you got to do something now.” and and making those pairs and whether it’s like NY with Lton uh you know uh Robertson with Tavvar’s knander with Matthews give me a little bit of a look where you’re going to stick with it for a while put Neand like I’ve said this for a few years just put Knander on the third line I think back to you know when we’ve won Stanley Cups Patrick Kane only had 80 points that year right knander’s not doing it I don’t think he’s buying into that you know but yeah I know but it’s just like the other guys n and them it’s like Yeah, you guys are getting a lot of points right now. Yeah, because we kind of fluffed you up when you’re playing together. But we got to get you guys deeper in the lineup and get some identity and help deeper in the lineup, right? If they buy into that, it could work, right? Like, hey, Neander, you’re on the third line. I’ve said that about Marner at times in the past. Maybe get him as a different look on the third line. Make them buy into, hey, you might not finish the season with 90 or 100 points. You also got six years at 11 million. I mean, right? But maybe you get 80 points this year, but we get into the playoffs. I just worry like when I think about him last year, they needed to let him play on both power play units. He got like the full two minutes every single time because he wanted more ice. He wants more ice. He wants more ice. And and I it’s very obvious at this point like he wants it to be as offensive as possible. That’s where he finds his own game. That’s where he finds his own identity. and that Bube a guy who’s already like I again I don’t like saying it feels like you’re losing the room because I don’t know being in the room but when I see a group of guys play with that little enthusiasm it’s hard to take it and go like when you’re saying don’t boil the ocean start with one little thing the the first thing I would be saying to these guys is like play with energy play with like passion like skate hard and you I we had a clip of Bub saying this to them the other night where he’s like hammering them at practice and you got to just get there. You got to skate there. It’s an effort play. That’s where they start is just the energy to me is like feel like a more energetic team. If you’re putting Knander down in the third line and you’re asking him to grind it out at this point of the year when you’re when you’re struggling, I I think he he checks out on you. I’m not really saying exactly that. Maybe it’s like, you know, Tarz goes to the third line, give him a little more role identity on what he would need to do there. I’ve always kind of laughed at uh when people are like, “You got to work harder. Your team has to work harder.” That just tells me you have no answers. At the end of the day, they’re in the NHL for the most part besides Neander, everyone works hard. They all defend for the most part. They all compete. What is the reason? give me like more concrete reasons why we’re struggling rather than ah they got to compete or work harder is kind of the way I look at it because with confidence with those things starting to build if you start to win and you start to find your game effort comes because it’s just more free flow free flowing sorry more natural right I don’t think these guys aren’t trying I don’t think it’s effort but you’re saying like get there and you’re saying Craig says that too I think that’s a little I think that’s a little bit of a cop out I think at actually figuring out what the actual issues are. And if you’re inside that room, you know exactly what it is. We’re just guessing at it. But I think the effort piece should be secondary to like what are actually the things that are not allowing us to get on pucks fast enough. Why are we not having the opportunity to forche hard enough? Where’s the puck starting 30 seconds ago and why is it back in their hands again? Right? So what what what’s the other stuff that goes into it rather than just effort? Yeah. I think the problem with that is that when we’re discussing it, it’s clear it’s like they don’t have the guys on the back end to be able Yeah. to be able to make any sort of play to be able to make any sort of breakout to even just like win puck battles. Even like there was this one idea that hey, they got bigger and they got meaner and they got tougher. They’re at least going to be able to stop cycles. Hey, they’re going to be maybe a touch worse off the rush, but if you’re in their zone, you’re not going to get to the front of the net with any ease. And you just mentioned it’s like the counter to that is what Montreal showed them in the second period, which is like they snap it around. And yeah, they’re not fully healthy there, but just like none of those guys can move. And there’s wide open lanes. There’s wide open looks at the net over and over again to the point where yeah, the the goalie is getting pulled because even though he’s standing on his head, he’s given up a bunch of goals because the other team is so dominant against you. Like I think that you could blame you could blame the D2 on those goals, but like there’s a there’s a structural crisis a bit too on the D side. If you see all these interchanges happening and guys don’t know where they’re going also on the forward side, I could say that too, right? Well, yeah, but of course that’s going to be the case. Like first of all, they do have like littered throughout their lineup guys that are not extremely strong on that side of the puck. And then to your point about roles always changing and jobs always changing, that’s it too is like you’re playing with a different guy every night. How are you supposed to be able to build any sort of chemistry with that person or know what your responsibilities are ultimately always supposed to be. Yeah. Or your identity. Like I said, I’ve talked about we talked about Max Doi the other day and I was similar at the at the time where I’d play center sometimes. I’d play wing. If I was on wing, I was more of a puck pursuit winger. you know, try to make plays and then if you get put at center, you can’t really play that way with that type of identity because you generally got to be the high guy. You got to sit back. So, you can’t play with that much pace. And as a centerman, I was more of a facilitator similar to like a doi, you know what I mean? So, like I’m just going to use doi as the as kind of like what maybe other players are feeling, but if he’s playing center and he can only play this way and then he gets put at wing for one game and he can’t find his identity in one game, it won’t happen. you got to give them five, 10 games to start to figure it out, right? So, I think when you’re changing positions, you’re changing lines, you’re changing people you play with and then you’re you’re getting uncomfortable with new players, you’re not playing the way you know you can play and you’re not figuring out what your identity is because you’re in different positions all the time, right? And there is players that have valuable skill sets that can play different positions, but it does sometimes take them a little bit of time to figure out when they’re playing the new position what their identity is. Yeah. And right now, they don’t really have that time. All right, last one. What was your impression lately of East Cow? That kid’s going to be a stud. I think like I I really like Eastston’s brain. I think he’s starting to figure out where to go on the ice to get the puck more. I think he’s figuring out what to do. like, you know, you watch him in London, World Juniors, and it was a lot of one-on-one kind of hope plays, stuff like that. Eastston is really starting to understand when and when not to make plays. And obviously, you’re going to still see a lot of those uh issues come up because he’s a creative, high-skll winger, playmaker at the at the end of the day, he can rip the puck, too. But you’re just seeing how he can go anywhere on the ice and and do stuff that other players can’t, right? Especially when he’s given opportunity with good players. I think he’s a guy that uh you know, you’re going to see maybe a little bit of tail off it as the season goes on or he could get better if you put him with the Matthews. I don’t know. Like his game could really go either way. But I really like how this kid plays. His competes high and then it’s just, you know, making him understand as he starts to age into the league when and when not to do certain things. Might play with Gavin McKenna like might might be an opportunity for him. Oh yeah, Gavin. McKenna, McKenna, Matthews, and Cal. Yeah, it’s like the way that they’re going like they got a shot. It’s 8% as of today that they land that first overall pick. Again, Chris Christie, you can download. I’d be taking Bearhoff. Yeah, of course. But of course you would. That’s like But that that’s like honestly I know that there’s a case, but I’m from White Horse Yukon. There’s nothing other than that pick. Like that’s a submitted pick. Uh again, you can download the Clever app for free. Highly recommend. Again, anybody that’s involved in athletics, you should check it out. Two time Stanley Cup champ. Thanks for making time, man. Yeah, thank you. See you, buddy. Uh, Christopherste. Um, yeah, I like what he said about the effort thing because he’s right there. Dave said it, but we always say it on the outside who are watching this thing like, “Oh, are they playing hard enough? Are they playing hard enough? Are they playing hard enough?” And I know that again from this job and from seeing the people around me is people generally work hard when they’re seeing results. like when there’s a process that actually is showing them something, they’re more likely to be motivated. And so if you’re saying like they got to work harder, they got to work harder, you are papering over what the major issues are with this team structurally and from a roster composition standpoint of what guys are even able to do, what’s being asked of them, why they’re not executing, and that will be incumbent on the coaching staff to figure out how they’re going to be able to figure that out. Otherwise, yeah, it’s going to be asked of somebody else. Um, who wants to win a bunch of cash while doing the best thing this holiday season? Sports 59 of the fan is all in supporting the 50/50 fortune for sick kids. It’s a 50/50, so the more money we raise, the more kids we can help. And the more holiday cash you can win. The current take-home prize is guaranteed to be $100,000. You can buy your tickets at 5050 fortune.ca CA or text the word money to 59590 and we’ll send the link right to your phone. 18 plus, please play responsibly. Standard message and data rates apply. Lottery license RAF1518410. Quick break. We’ll come back and hit what we missed. Armen is here. It’s time for what we missed. ESPN’s Jeff Passen reported yesterday that the New York Mets and Texas Rangers are finalizing a trade that would send second baseman Marcus Simeon to the Mets and outfielder Brandon NMO in return to the Rangers. Did you have a thought on the trade? Yeah. Uh I my main thought actually centers around the Blue Jays because a move like this on paper doesn’t really make a lot of sense for the Mets. Semi-M has had two down years. He still has a lot of money left on his deal, less than NMO, but the Mets aren’t trying to shave long-term money and take a step back. And if they wanted to acquire a second baseman, they could have just gotten in on like the Palanco sweep stakes and blown a team out of the water and acquired him. This scares me a little because it sends the message that Steve Cohen, the richest owner in all of baseball, a guy who has been completely unafraid to splash the pot and whose team missed the postseason last year, would be interested in replacing Brandon NMO with one of the outfielders that is on the free agent market. And it’s hard to think unless that there’s a fun avenue and then there’s a sad avenue. The fun avenue is that he loves to screw over the New York Yankees and that he’s pushing more money in the pot on Cody Bellinger and making it far more difficult for the Yankees to resign him and saying like, “Nope, we want Bellinger. That’s our actual NMO replacement.” But to me, it would say more that they’re getting in on the Kyle Tucker sweep stakes. And if you’re a Blue Jays fan, that scares you because, well, anybody being in the market for Kyle Tucker makes it less likely that you’re in there. But to me, to me, and this is just again speaking to some people and uh trying to garner some thoughts on the situation from people who have even been on this show and some private conversations I’ve had, the way that I read the Blue Jays are in on Kyle Tucker sweep stakes are like he is and would be a priority over Bobette, But they’re not going to go into crazy banana lands money for this player. It’s not like George Springer where during that off seasonason the Jays were going to get George Springer and they were going to they were going to out bid teams and they did. They outbid the Mets. They went an extra year on Springer’s contract and nobody else ended up doing that. They outbid teams on Hunen Ryu. Like they’re lower tier of free agent than what Kyle Tucker is. Kyle Tucker could still conceivably get $400 million. And I think in that world, it’s going to be really tough for the Jays to make that work. The world in which the Jays are the quote unquote favorites for Kyle Tucker is where a market doesn’t materialize in the way that Tucker’s camp originally hoped and that the Blue Jays, all things being equal with some of these other teams, are willing to go into like uncomfortable money territory. but that they also represent winning and culture and other things that are important to this guy that he might covet and that they would be front runners if the market doesn’t get crazy. And if the Mets are in there and they make this move because they really want to go crazy for Kyle Tucker, my guess would be that they would have the financial flexibility to outbid the Toronto Blue Jays for that guy. Now granted, it doesn’t feel as it doesn’t feel as desperate for for Kyle Tucker as it does, I would say, normal years with one free agent that you think could really change the Blue Jays lineup because you still feel comfortable that they would be very much in the Bob Bashette market and that they would be able to land him. But I that being said, if the Mets are there for Kyle Tucker and if they are and again like this is just all guessing like this is just me guessing, but if they push a bunch of money in for Kyle Tucker, my guess would be more teams would be pivoting towards Bobette saying, “Hey, there’s him, there’s Bregman. There’s only so many names that are on the market that are guaranteed x amount of hits for you and it might make Bose’s market a little bit more competitive, which would backfire on the Blue Jays in terms of letting him get to this point. So, it makes things scarier. Like, it just does. The Mets being involved on major players makes things scarier for the Toronto Blue Jays. What’s next? John Morat and Klay Thompson got in a bit of a squabbbling match, bit of an altercation, talking trash back and forth um with their two very bad teams on Saturday night. Jaw ended up pointing his finger in Clay’s face, call it saying, “You a bum now.” Which was the main takeaway people got and he also interrupted Cam Spencer’s uh postgame interview saying, “Tell him who the best shooter was. It wasn’t bro from Golden State.” So obviously a lot of people are getting on job. What takeaways did you have? I know we talked about Jaw on Friday too before that stuff happened. So yeah. Um so Jaw is 26 years old. By that time Clay had already been to the finals twice, had an Olympic gold. Uh most points scored in a quarter and yeah was part of a 73 and N9 team. So for Jaw to do like the whole you a bum now it’s lame and especially in a game where you’re not playing and you’re not involved in any of it. Like what was what was John doing in that situation? That’s that’s the problem I have with this guy is people make mistakes and for John Morant some of the stuff that he has done in my opinion has been overblown like in a in a vacuum I don’t care that a guy who gets suspended for making you know gun gestures throws a fake grenade and people are like oh look he’s making light of this I’m like oh what do you want him to do like he’s a young 20’s millionaire playing basketball. And unless it’s something like hyperaggressive, then I’m just not I’m not overly concerned about it. What scares me with Jaw is that he just doesn’t seem to get it at all. And there doesn’t seem to be any personal accountability for what is going on with his career. And whether it’s the murmurss of wanting to get out of Memphis, whether it’s the repeat screw-ups, whether it’s like getting in a guy like like I love trash talk, bro. you know this that I I think that there’s not enough of it in professional sports, but I don’t think that’s what anybody’s clamoring for. I don’t think anybody’s clamoring for a guy that’s in sweats that plays basically no basketball games who’s constantly a problem for his organization who’s feuding with his coach to be sticking his finger in Klay Thompson’s face like who is Klay Thompson in the league to trash talk. That’s not that’s not you going head-to-head with somebody and Jon on the floor. I want to see you go toe-to-toe with Anthony Edwards and the two of you guys be John on the floor and then after the game if you’re like he’s a bum. I like that cuz you did something. But for you to just be going at a guy with accolades and try to say he’s washed up when How old’s Clay now? 36. Sounds about right. 36 sounds about 35. Yeah, somewhere in that range. Sorry to Clay if I have this wrong. He’s probably even a little younger than that because I I just get it wrong with players now all the time. I don’t know anybody’s age anymore. But when Jaw was talking that trash a few years ago, even saying some outlander stuff like we got next. That was one of the things that stuck with me so much because I’m like a young hungry team coming up. I like playing the Warrior. I loved it. It’s like we got next and then we haven’t heard from you. Yeah. But you did nothing. He said, “I’m good in the West, brother. You can’t win a playoff game in the West.” So, it’s just kind of it’s one of those things where you don’t want to put rules on trash talking. It’s like trash talk more. Like you said, we love it. But like that’s one of the ones where it’s just like no but it doesn’t work. You lose you just lose any respect any that you have left. But it doesn’t work if you’re talking trash and not doing something. Like I thought Dylan Brooks was fun against LeBron. But then he gets body bagged by LeBron and he won’t speak to the media and he he ducks it and he goes away. And from that moment forward you’re like yeah man I don’t really want to hear it. Like I I don’t I don’t care that if you’re riding high that you’re talking trash. Same thing with John Morant where you’re like you got to be in a position to say those things for it to carry weight or have it be interesting. And right now he’s just not in a point with his career where I find anything that he does interesting because there’s no onc court application that I think is remotely intriguing. So that sucked. I just didn’t I didn’t like it. It rubbed me the wrong way. And I liked what Klay had to say after the game. I thought it was uh poignant and solid. But yeah, for Jaw Morant, like it doesn’t matter how many Klay Thompsons tell you what’s going on and you spoiling your your prime and all this different stuff. It has to come within at some point. And that’s the part that worries with me, Jaw, is that I don’t see that part. Subscribe to this podcast. Leave five stars. We’ll see you tomorrow. [Music]
JD Bunkis has former NFL QB and Fox NFL analyst Brady Quinn talk the biggest storylines after Sunday’s NFL action. Chris Versteeg joins the show to talk about the Toronto Maple Leafs’ struggles. Producer Armen then joins JD to cover all we missed.
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0:00 – Leaf’s vs Canadians
10:32 – Brady Quinn
47:11 – Raptors NBA Cup Reaction
51:28 – Chris Versteeg
1:28:54 – Marcus Semien Trade
1:33:33 – Ja Morant vs Klay Thompson Drama
——————-
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JD Bunkis Podcast – November 24, 2025
#NHL #Hockey #Podcast
47 comments
Contenders, eh? 😂
Typical American doesn’t know Canada already had their thanksgiving.
This team has close to zero shot at a championship.
Tanking gets them a shot at a high end player that might help them soon enough to impact the Matthews window.
If a championship is the goal the right move is sell and make sure you keep that 1st this year.
But the goal is playoff gate $ and so we're going make the shortsighted decision and scrape and claw our way to mediocrity.
Leafs are cup or bust but the question is, can they even get out of the second round LOL
MLSE botched the whole build back in 2022-23 before the NMCs kicked in. Then the Leafs knew the core wasn't going to have any kind of break out, that they were what they showed themselves to be, highly talented and skilled, but soft. So that was the time to retool, when they had great asset value. Dubas knew their time was up and wanted to make a change, MSLE said NO and fired him. The only logical reason to fire him at that moment in time was to get to the playoffs a couple more times before those contracts expired (Profit not winning). Enter Treliving, Now, my personal opinion here is that cash strapped Treliving went out and got himself gritty but old, slow and injury prone players, that when healthy play well,just not well enough to win it all. Now the injury depleted Leaf's are in freefall and with their D failing the goalies are in danger of even more injures. This era has been a total waste of good assets that set the Leafs back another 10 years. I am 70 now and been a fan since 62, I hold NO hope of ever seeing them win another championship. This is 100% on MLSE's management incompetence. The only path forward is to blow it up, dump the whole lot and press reset. Don't get your hopes up because MLSE's management priority is not about building champs.
Only 6 points out of first. The rest of the atlantic is only 4.
Matthews isnt going to do anything.
The points behind are really not relevant. It is the number of teams ahead of you and the number of games in hand or behind meaning team A is 4 points ahead and has played one less game. Even if you have three teams like that and not 8, the teams ahead have to lose each game they have in hand while you win all of your games. When there are several teams ahead keep in mind they play each other so the teams ahead are always getting points. So every time you lose teams ahead are moving further ahead. It is not like running where you can pass every body.
If youre last, youre last.
Don’t allow Treliving to do anything not even changing the toilet paper FIRE him immediately I am certain there are still people out there won’t agree the urgency until he completely kill the team completely inside out
Spoiler alert. No it won’t get better for the leafs “as is…”
I can't believe u said willy won't bring them out of it. Willy has no interest in being that guy. 34 either.
I will say this How many teams out of the 76% were teams that weren't gonna make the playoffs at the beginning of the season.. I'd like to know the percentage of the teams that everyone thought was gonna make the playoffs at the beginning of the season
I really hate saying this but the game seven collapse in the playoffs was the worst out of all their game seven losses… Florida destroyed Toronto's defence ….n Games seven Toronto basically didn't touch the puck in the first period And now this year other teams are doing the same thing…. That loss has destroyed this team… I am a huge fan and this really saddens me but they're not recovering from this !!!!!!! Big changes are needed
in the Marier Matthews era they've never had a first class defence back there…. would have made such a huge difference in all theoe playoff series…. and they wouldn't be where they are now
this should be the team right now
What the Maple Leafs could look like with draft picks they traded and kept!
Roman Josi D 2008 – (traded pic)
Morgan Rielly D 2012 –
Dougie Hamilton D 2011 – (traded pic)
Luke Schenn D 2008 – (traded Player)
or
Erik Karlsson D 2008 – (moved up for Luke Schenn and missed out on Erik Karlsson)
Nazem Kadri C 2009 – (traded Player)
Tyler Seguin C 2010 – (traded pic)
Fraser Minten C 2022 – (traded Player)
Auston Matthews C 2016 –
Zach Hyman. LW 2015 – (traded Player)
Matthew Knies LW 2021 –
Nicholas Robertson LW 2019 –
Connor Brown RW 2012 – (traded Player)
Rickard Rakell RW 2012 – (traded pic)
William Nylander RW 2015 –
Mitch Marner RW 2015 – (left)
Easton Cowan RW 2023 –
John Gibson G 2013 – (traded pic)
Joseph Woll G 2016 –
JD….Matthews can play all world and out of his mind iand they're not going anywhere with that defence brother
Everyone knew this team was going to start slow with the new additions, than about 10 games in everyone starts dropping like flies. The start ain’t that surprising. It’ll be if they get out of this doe
criticism is warranted but sometimes misplaced….. I'm sure these players get mad just not in front of the media… Is that the players or is that the organization?
58:38 you guys had these conversations the past 9 years. No matter where there at in the standings
How can it get better?!
This Leafs talk has been exhausting this season. I can't believe I am saying this but I low key am just looking forward to baseball next season. I am done with this team and I think it needs blowing up and a DNA change.
Warriors vs Spurs bro
Look at the positives. At least Leafs can't suck anymore. The Canucks seems to be worst 😂. Time to trade Mathews and everyone
No
Lol no
Funny…I'm an Electrical Engineer and I love this podcast.
I don't believe Marner left TO bc he wanted to play with Eichel over Matthews. I doubt that unless the two of them didn't get along behind the scenes. Marner was complaining a lot about the fans stalking him. Though it sounds more like the guy got involved with the wrong ppl. Personal level or professional. The harassment that was reported sounded like it was too personal. Not something fans would do. Yes players do experience harassment from fans but what he was saying sounds it was more personal. Just my opinion though.
Frazier and a 2026 1st round pick thanks Leafs Go B’s
Trade everyone to the teams dumb enough to hire Chiarelli and Burkie. Also fire Tree, and most of the front office. (Idiots that sign off/support his dumb moves). Get a real good goalie so Berube's strategy of getting caved doesnt look so bad. Or fire him and hire a blow up doll. 😂😂😂
The notion Matthews can’t play without Marner ignores the FACT that he’s 1.27 points per game in games without Marner vs 1.15 with Marner!
The Leafs haven’t had an elite GM in his prime since 1991-97 Cliff Fletcher. When you compare the best teams the last decade vs Toronto in terms of GM/FO moves, depth outside the top 4-5 best players, defense, culture, goaltending etc it’s not close!
Keep blaming some of the best players in Leafs his history ever though!
bro where are you looking. the camera is to your left, it looks so weird lol.
mathews is just dogging it for the olympics same as he did last year for the BS frozen four
hes a damn fraud
10 years of ineptitude.
Tank
Brad hasn’t righted the ship but, to be fair, Shanny gave him a topheavy ship that was taking on water.
Treliving and Berube 🤡🤡🤡
1-6 on the road with a 4.57 GA/GP and they have already played 15 games at home with a pretty soft schedule.
Effort isn’t a cop out. It’s actually a given. That’s at least one thing you can do when you aren’t very good. Wanna try and stay in a game. Work your ass off.
I dont like how you lead with leafs and them immediately your first guest is on and its all football. Just makes me change the video
Too many east west guys
More pressure in Toronto than Montréal? 😯 Seriously??? 🤣 If that is Toronto's excuse, the team doesn't deserve to win.
MATTHEWS IS THE CANCER !!!!!!!
Who’s JD Bunkis just wondering
This Leaf defense was apprantly good enough to won the division last year but somehow they’ve become bush keague this year. Could it be that the forwards on this team are terrible at backchecking and don’t care? Mariner picked up the slack for guys like Willy, Tavares and Domi who didn’t care. And when you add guys like Macelli (and lose Marner) to those defensively challenged forwards then there is extreme pressure on the defense to compensate and they’re taking all the blame when the forwards are just as guilty.
JD,… brother what Mitch got no credit for was how HE ran the room…. he ran the music, he was the cheerleader talking guys up! The guys, including Mathews, miss him…. and everyone realized if Mitch can be allowed/encouraged to leave,,,, anyone can!
The post game hasn’t changed in 10 years.