Hal Talks Business While the Yankees Collapse

Hal Talks Business While the Yankees Collapse

Do you think Hal Steinbrunner and the Yankees, and you want to keep it specific to Hal, that’s fine because he is the Yankees, he owns the Yankees. Do you think he prioritizes winning overall based on everything you heard yesterday, the way that he’s operated, do you think Hal prioritizes winning overall? Not as much as he should. And that to me is the problem. So, we could talk about spending, how much, but when he keeps talking from a And by the way, it’s his prerogative, but he keeps talking from a business perspective. The Yankees are a great business. His father had that obviously bought them at the value that he did. Built them up at 10 million bucks. And what are they worth now? 8 billion. 8.1 billion. So, so yeah, there’s a business sense to it. But George, and and I hate to even go down the How versus George thing, but it’s an excellent reference point. You kind of have to do it. Never once ever did I hear George Steinburner speak and think he doesn’t prioritize winning. Never once did I think of the business aspects of baseball. When I hear George speak, it was always from a fans perspective. You know, fans don’t want to hear about the business of baseball. We’re fans. We want to see the team win. And we’re the Yankees. We have the highest of expectations to spend that much. So, I think that’s the problem with Hal is he’s too businessfocused as opposed to just saying, “Damn it all, I’m going all in. I want to win. I want to prioritize winning.” Yeah. Yeah. Here’s the deal for me with Hal. You know, he does too much good, excuse me, to get crushed. Like, he does enough to get crushed, right? You know, you can’t cr If I think if you do, you’re being unfair. But what is this now? the second or the third time we’ve heard about this $100 million check to the city every every February 1st. We don’t care. I I I don’t want to hear it. Nobody wants to hear it. You know, whether it was CO, whether it’s non-COVID, you you’re worth 8.1 billion. So, it’s a very fine line. There’s been owners here where they deserved vitriol. Howal doesn’t deserve that. No, not vitriol, but but come on. No, I’m I’m saying like he keeps referencing the damn luxury tech. Dude, this is going back for years. years. You and I first started before we got together. You luxury tax how it’s we don’t want to hear about your business. We want to see results. We want to hear about you saying it’s not good enough. Not just, well, the Dodgers, you know, they they clicked on all cylinders and the Blue Jays were hot at the right time. No, no. We want to hear you frustrated and say, I cannot stand losing and I’m going to do whatever it takes to turn this team into a winner. Not looking at the book saying, “How much money did we make this year?” I don’t think we’ll ever hear that. We, you know, I love to hear it. We’re not going to hear that. And we got a little bit of the randomness yesterday. Got a little bit of that. And if you listen to the show, obviously Sal just said we play the cuts and we did. And we reacted to real time to the cuts. You know what? What bothers me about that is, all right, if they won the World Series a couple of years ago and here we are, it’s been 2 three years since like when they lost in 03 to the Marlins, right? If that was kind of the response, now obviously how was in front etc at that point but if he was and and and that was the response not that you really want to hear it but at least it’s a little more applicable because the Yankees won in 96 98 99 2000 lost in 01 lost in 03 now you want to go down the randomness road for a minute all right I I I’ll leave you to hear it a little bit don’t want to hear it now when the last time you want since uh was 2009 I listen I’ve been thinking about this a lot and we think about the payroll the payroll the payroll and one thing that house said And he’s not wrong, and I think he said this two years ago, maybe three, and it’s been circled back to and reiterated several times since. Hey, we shouldn’t need a $300 million payroll to win. He’s right. Okay. And now I was thinking about this like if I was given a chance, would I prefer a team that had elite scouting, which I don’t think the Yankees do, elite player development, which I don’t think the Yankees do. Um, but they also do always have a top three payroll. So they’ve got an elite payroll. Uh, or or a team that is more in that I’m just throwing out n numbers, you know, 7 to 12, 8 to 13 payroll range, but the Yankees never will be understood. But that was counterbalanced by elite scouting and and elite player development. Well, then I think that when house says you wouldn’t need $300 million to build the championship team, I think that there would be an element of truth to that. The problem is the Yankees go deep, but they don’t go all in and the things that we’ve spoken about for years. When their prospects get here, they’re not good defenders. They’re not great on the bases. They’re not what we thought they would be as hitters. I’m talking about the hitters, not the pitchers. pitchers have generally been really really good and now you’re looking well okay and you’re not going to go that extra 60 $70 million to get the Japanese star or maybe a Kyle Tucker or maybe a Tucker and a Bellinger or a Tucker and a Bregman and get rid of McMahon whatever it might be. Well, now you have a team that’s going to win a lot of games and not win any championships. That’s where we’re at. Well, do you need to spend 300 million to have a good team? No, not if you’ve got the scouting and the player development, which they don’t. But but they also develop they spend a lot of money in the scouting and player development maybe more so than anybody else. And if I were to ask you do you think the Yankees biggest problem is not spending ab not spending enough? I think they spend it wrong too much. That’s that’s the problem. So that’s a different story. But if that’s going to be your argument from how well we don’t need to spend $300 million to build a winner, then why are you continuing to employ the people who continually fall short? And if you just say well we won 94 games and it’s a crapshoot. I think he’s buying the crapshoot nonsense. The other counter to that because there is a lot of fans just saying, “Well, we want more. We want more.” And there’s a reason to it. It’s not the do there’s not a fluke that the Dodgers happen to win back-to-back World Series and they spend the most. What harm? So, while we could all agree that you shouldn’t need to spend $300 million or more to have a successful team, I mean, that has been proven. It’s not opinion. It’s fact. It’s been proven. That’s true. But let me ask you this. What harm does spending more do for somebody who can afford to do it? What harm can it do? There’s no way anybody can tell me, “Well, oh, no, no, no. You shouldn’t. You shouldn’t go out there and spend more money. That’s going to hurt you. Oh, no, no, no. Buyer beware. That’s going to hurt you spending more money. You can’t it can’t hurt you.” The Yankees used to spend a lot more than everybody else. And they also didn’t spend it wisely every single dollar. But they moved on from their mistakes. And now we live in a spot where the Yankees are shoving the mistakes down your throat. Whether it’s Gallow or Hicks or Lameu, pick a guy, they continue to ride these guys out. even John Carl Stanton not as a a stake on those levels. But the Yankees biggest issue is the bulb club is not constructed properly. That’s not a financial thing. Although the finances could help get rid of some of those issues the way you the way the Mets have done that over the years. Now again they haven’t built a successful team to the level that the Yankees have, but at least they’re trying by paying some guys to go away, eating some salary back in the day. Okay, whatever. And obviously they spend a lot of money and I expect them to spend more money. It doesn’t equate to wins. Only won 83 games, but it doesn’t mean that spending money is going to hurt you. And also, if your argument that to me, this is the main point, Hal has two choices. Either spend more to compensate for the inability to get over the hump or get people in here who are going to spend what you allow them to spend better. That’s that’s kind of where I was going and that’s not going to happen. So, you know, we can scream all day. I mean, we’ve had a million conversations, some very loud ones about Brian Kman and here we are still no championship. And you know, Brian Cashman is back here. You know, it’s it’s interesting too because I was looking at the top 10 payrolls. I’m going to run through all of it here. I’m not even going to give you numbers, just the plays, right? So, the Mets had the highest payroll, no playoffs. Dodgers had the second highest. They won the World Series. And then you get a little bit of a mixed bag with the Phillies and the Yankees and some and the Cubs with early uh playoff exits. The Rangers had the sixth obviously shedding money with the Cimeian deal. Uh try to do that maybe with other players. We’ll see if they deal Seagar. Six, you know, sixth highest no playoffs. Braves a lot of injuries. eighth highest, no playoffs. So, you do get a little bit of a mixed bag. But that’s the thing, like if I put myself in house shoes, I could sit here and say I would spend $440 million if I was the owner of the Yankees. And honestly, me being me, I might. I mean, I I really might. But I don’t have access to the finances. I believe there’s an element of truth to what he’s saying. I I do think that people think maybe the Yankees make more, but then they do, but nobody wants to hear that. If I was how, but I here’s what I definitely would do. I would sit down with Cashman and say, “Brian, I am cutting checks year after year after year after year. We don’t have $190 million payroll. We’re not down with the Twins or the Pirates or even the Astros at this point. Where the hell is my money going?” Like, that’s the money question. And because he never probes that deeply or I’m sure he asks, but never penalizes or punishes Cashman for not spending the money properly. Here we are. Merrygoround. It’s the same stuff, right? So, it’s it’s twfold. And they are also the New York Yankees. So, I don’t want to hear the Dodgers. There’s no excuse for me to any other team taking the number one brand in Major League Baseball away from the New York Yankees. And the Dodgers have done that. And how is to me too complacent for which with either of the two, the money, which he’s not wrong, you shouldn’t have to spend more than 300 million to build a winning team or allowing the team who continually wins 90 games. We get it. But thinking that that’s good enough and not seeing a little bit deeper through the weeds of the well we win 90 every year we get in the postseason. You have to dig a little bit deeper and say why aren’t we doing what the Dodgers are able to do and have been able to do when we were the Yankees and did that in the ’90s. you allowed them to come in on the stage and swoop the trophy and you know again you’re you’re you’re getting a second or a third or a fourth place ribbon but your your brand has been diminished because you’ve allowed the Dodgers to do that to you and other teams are trying to do do it to you as well. Like I listen the one thing this came up a little bit yesterday like the Yankees you talk about the payroll what their valuation is which is 8 billion a little bit more you know their revenue generation a year ago was $700 million which was number one in baseball and obviously we know what the payroll was which was the uh which was obviously very high okay top three top four in baseball last year but nobody really knows how much they spend on the miners and and and you brought this up and you’re right I don’t have any doubt when it comes to biomechanics and facilities and all the reading and the digital stuff and the machines that replicate the exact degree that the ball comes out of pitcher X’s name arm for the Red Sox, which they actually have. Not every team has that. I know that they put all the money in there. So, that’s not even the issue. I’m going to go back to the core issue with the New York Yankees. It’s not how it’s not what they spend. It’s not their commitment to the miners or player development. it’s that they got too many people employed who have been here for so long it’s gotten stale. The game has changed and he refuses to address that. That’s the main problem with the Yankees. And and the results while they are better than your average team are not good enough for the Yankees and I talk about well they had the dynasty in the ’90s but it wasn’t just that. They were getting to the World Series often in the 2000s as well. So even losing in 2001 and 2003 and obviously winning in 2009. Think about how many World Series appearances the Yankees had from in the ’90s from 96 on and then again in the 2000s as we just referenced and then from 2009 on they made it once and I know after they won it they made it less. That’s it. That that’s it one time in in two decades. That’s not good enough for the Yankees. And he continue How continues to just accept that it is. So I’m not saying that he needs to spend $100 million more than everybody else. Me neither. I’m not saying that he’s got to fire Brian Cashman and everybody. I’m saying he’s got to do one or the other. You you can’t just you can’t sit back and say we’re going to keep doing the same thing and cross your fingers and hope that the results are going to change. Even if you get to the World Series like they did, you know, two whatever last year, two seasons ago, even if you get to the World Series, that that proved to be a one-off. You want the constant success at top the the sport. And the Yankees just I’m sorry they’re not there when you look at the inability to consistently get to the World Series the way that the Astros have, the way that the Dodgers have. At least two other teams have done it way more often than the Yankees have been able to do. You know, real quick Z before we get these calls here. The the George dynamic is always going to kind of creep in. I know you just mentioned his name before. We try not to go too first of all so long ago. It’s a different sport and he’s not George. We know that. But one of the things about George that that drove me nuts when the Yankees were a train wreck and they were a train wreck for you know a lot of years in my childhood was his petulence was his you know reactive nature and just he was he was a loose cannon. Uh I I think one of the attributes now I’m going to compliment Hal is that he’s the opposite of that. And I think when you have owners who are too quick to fire and it’s just a recycle, recycle, new GM, new coach, new manager, new voice, new philosophy, the building becomes incredibly unstable. So, I value the stability that Hal has brought to the Yankees because while it’s been as long of a of a of a run without a world championship uh now as it was during my childhood, which is inc impossible to fathom, the low points of these Yankees aren’t nearly as low as they were with Stump, Maryland, Bucky Dent, and Dallas Green and all the names that we know if you’re old enough to have lived through that. And I I appreciate that. This is not to be not thankful at all, but you’re right. There’s two roads here now. You either have to change the people you employ. He’s not doing that this year. Or you got to go deeper and you got to spend more money. BT, it’s Al and the fan. Our friends at Town Fair Tire remind you that a Town Fair Tire you always get the guaranteed lowest price on name brand tires from Connecticut to Maine. Nobody beats Town Fair Tire. Nobody. Frank is in Monroe. Starting us off. What’s up, Frank? Good morning. This is the first time I’m calling since 1992. Who? Yeah. I just don’t have the patience. But you hit the nail on the head. Alstein doesn’t run the team. Randy Lavine has the checkbook. If they have to spend from just using a number $5 and they need another penny, Randy Lavine isn’t going to give it to them. What’s that? He’s been Stein Burner’s guy for 25 years, George. He runs it like a business and that’s who calls the shots. So So you think it’s the bottom line? Yep. Right. Right. Right. And that and that’s that’s fine, Frank. And we do appreciate you taking the call, man. Since 1992, that’s a long time in between calls. I mean, I was going to say, you know, kind of getting on that length with the Yankees between championships here. Not as bad for the Yankees as it is for Frank between calls here at the Fan, but we get the point. Yeah. Okay. Well, Lavine’s the business guy. Fine. I’m not saying that you got to ignore all business aspects of it. What we know, let’s just deal in facts here. Does anybody think the way the Yankees have operated for the last two decades for the most part has been good enough to to me it’s not because they’re held to a higher standard. So while Mets fans would take the Yankees success while many fans would take the Yankees level of success, meaning be in the playoffs more often than not, win 90 plus games every regular season, have some stars on your team, all that, it’s not good enough for the Yankees. And it would be one thing if the Yankees still were the dominant team, but just continued to fall short in the playoffs. That’s not what’s happening here. They’ve gotten passed by whether it’s the Mets or the Dodgers as far as the spending goes and they’ve gotten caught by other teams who don’t even spend as much to be more consistent better teams who go further. So there’s there’s many layers to the Yankees I don’t want to say failures. I think that’s too strong to the Yankees shortcomings and losing what once was the predominant team in Major League Baseball. Well, think about it this way, too. So, you know, you you say it and and I say it, the problem is they no longer say it and and if they do say it, they don’t act on it. If they’re not holding themselves to a higher standard, why should we I mean, honestly, though, that’s a question for everybody. Like, we sit here and we say, and and I know what you mean, and I said it, too. Yankees should be held to a higher standard than the Yankees. Well, why are we carrying the mail for the Yankees? Well, we’re not really because did you think the Yankees were going to win the World Series going into the year last year? No. Okay. Me neither. So I I mean we just but we throw that line out there very freely like we should God the Yankees should be held to a higher standard. Yeah, that sounds good, but it’s not really applied anymore in 2025. See that standard’s got to be created from within and adhered to from within. Now, going back to back in the day, it was created from within and it was adhered to from within and then it was loosely, you know, pursued from within, which I think it still is now because they obviously tried. They just don’t go as far as we think we need to as we think that they should. So, held to a higher standard. My standard is this, make the playoffs, get bounced. That’s the standard, right? But that’s but that’s just not good enough. I agree. Do you think, and especially now with Steve Cohen across town, do you think that if the Mets fail to make the postseason this year, David Sterns will still be employed by the Mets next year? I don’t I I would think I would think no after last year, if it was two years in a row, I would think no, but have to react to that, but I would probably say no. You know, for sure the manager is going to be gone. Like, they’ve already laid the groundwork. Carlos Mendoza has been here for two years. One was incredible getting to the NLCS in year one. The second was not very good. Winning 83 games and not missing the post. Fired his whole staff. You’re on alert, dude. If they don’t win now, now some could say, okay, well, cuz George had the the standards to almost an impossible level where guys who had won three championships in a row were on the hot seat didn’t deliver again. How that was back. So maybe there’s somewhere in between. Maybe that’s where Steve Cohen lies. Who knows? We’ll find out. Time will tell. He’s only been here, you know, as the owner five, six years, whatever it’s been for Steve Cohen. I feel the accountability level within the Mets organization changed since Steve Cohen has taken over. And if they don’t win, and he expects to win at the highest of levels when you’re spending as much as he does, if they don’t win, there are going to be changes made. And the Yankees, while they do have success more often than not, as far as the regular season goes, to me, it hasn’t been enough to justify keeping Brian Kman and everybody else in place, dating back to 2021. You’re talking about four or five years later now and it’s the same thing. I mean it’s it’s it’s almost becoming uh like talking about the like like Jane Bowen. I mean I look at it, you know, and I we can do this coming up. I’m going to say it this year. So there’s the owner, there’s the GM, there’s the manager, and then there’s the actual players. I’m going to I’m going to assign a little level of culpability to to really pinpoint exactly what I mean about this issue with the Yankees. PT and S on the fan. Sports talk on the fan presented by Paramount Plus. Can uh excuse me, Count on Sundays. all season long with the NFL on CBS and Paramount Plus. Obviously, you can count on them. We have plenty of football to get to throughout the course of the show. Just getting started here on this Tuesday morning. 88819.

The guys dive into a fiery debate about Hal Steinbrenner, the Yankees direction, and whether the franchise still prioritizes winning the way fans expect. Has Hal become too focused on the business side of baseball? Why does the luxury tax keep coming up? And how did the Dodgers pass the Yankees as baseball’s gold standard?

From payroll philosophy to player development failures to the long shadow of George Steinbrenner, this segment unpacks every layer of the Yankees frustrations and why fans feel the standard has slipped.

Chapters:
00:00 Hal vs George
02:20 Payroll vs player development
04:55 Why the Yankees keep falling short
08:40 Dodgers passing the Yankees
11:30 Cashman accountability
14:00 What Yankees fans really want

#yankees #mlb #halsteinbrenner #georgesteinbrenner #briancashman #wfan #btandsal #newyorkyankees #yankeesrant #mlbtalk #yankeesoffseason

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