BULLS POSTGAME: Coby White & Josh Giddey Combine for 50 in Bulls LOSS to Hornets | CHGO Bulls

BULLS POSTGAME: Coby White & Josh Giddey Combine for 50 in Bulls LOSS to Hornets | CHGO Bulls

What up, Bulls Nation? We’ve got live CS Bulls postgame coming up right now. The Bulls take another tough L on the chin. 123 116 is the final. They fall to the Hornets in Charlotte in an NBA Cup game that had no stakes other than a regular season game that brought the Bulls record to 9 and N. We will break it down next. Heat. Heat. What up, Bulls Nation? Welcome in to CHO Bulls Postgame, coming to you live from our studios here in West Loop, downtown Chicago. CHO Bulls Postgame presented by Migallow Ultra and Bet 365. The delicious taste of victory deserves something equally superior. Cheer on your team with Migallow Ultra and download the Bet 365 app. Use promo code choo365 when you sign up. Whatever the moment is never ordinary at bat 365 I’m peek bulls peek that’s big day bwl sports will to go on the end will underscore godly and on controls tonight it’s the one and only queen of them sar the bears beat the eagles today the bears beat the Eagles today and I know yes news flash if you are a Bears fan and a Bulls fan only one of those things matters uh but we are here to talk Bulls Nonetheless, shout out for joining us after that gross one. Hit the like button. It’s free. Even if you’re mad as a Bulls fan right now, especially if you’re mad. You have a right to be because the Bulls just lost to another bad team. They played down to their competition. Shout out Chris Farley. When are we going to stop pretending like the Bulls are better than some of these teams that they’re losing to? Cuz I’m ready to stop pretending. Yeah, they that needs to stop being said, you know, honestly. Anybody else ready to stop pretending that they’re better than these teams? That needs to stop being said until they show differently. That needs to stop being said. Um they’re proving they’re not better than any of the these teams. They’re proving that they’re either on that level with these teams. Hey, Julia. Either on that level with these teams or below that level with these teams. I mean, you just got ran by the bum ass Hornets. Like come on, man. Like don’t forget about the New Orleans Pelic. Like oh I haven’t. Not at all. Well, I was about to get on my solitical. I know go likes to step in on me. You know what I when I’m speeding a lot of money. Go. I’m already shooting, baby. The shot is up. Get the Get the rebound. Apologies. Get the rebound. Get the rebound. Get some offensive boards. There you go, baby. Get your giddy on. Those are free against the Bulls. That’s true. This is facts right here, baby. These are facts. But my god, like two and three in these last five games against these teams that when we were looking at at these next few games, we were like, “Oh, well, the Bulls have a chance to get back up in these standings, you know, with these teams.” Nope. losing to these true bum teams and being slayed by them. Giving up 70 G in the first half. Giving up 67 tonight again in the first half. That streak of 70 points allowed in the first half. Like but it’s so ridiculous. What What’s that? Did we just see 11 straight games of 120 points they’ve given up for the first That’s the first time it’s happened in 35 years. One of 11 NBA teams to do it in NBA history. Good job. Like you’re on the wrong side of history right now. Uh Bulls, they just look bad, bro. Like, and you can’t I don’t want to sit here and say that, you know, it’s because of people they’re missing. Like, people would try to throw that out, you know, like, are you missing a Coro? Are you missing this and that? No, bro. Like, it was happening while he was out here, too. You know, these things were still going on. These problems aren’t being addressed. He hasn’t been out for 11 games. Yeah. And and now these questions that I asked earlier, I’m seeing people in the chat starting to ask these same questions I was asking uh before about being tuned out. tuning got your coach about modest. Like yeah, we’ll get into modest for sure. But yeah, man. It just nothing looks like it’s clicking with each other. You got Kobe White back. Like things are supposed to look a little bit different when you get Kobe White back on the floor and back on your team. Kobe’s doing his thing. Like Kobe is out there, you know, doing his thing. Giddy is out there doing his thing. But defensively, they just look putrid. They can’t defend the three. They can’t defend the mid-range. They can’t defend. They damn sure can’t defend inside. can’t defend in the transition, like can’t defend in the half court, can’t defend in the full court, like can’t defend on the bench. Like, nothing is working, you know, especially defensive wise for the Bulls. They have a lot of issues they need to attend to, goat. And it’s just it feels like for me it starts on the defensive end, but it can honestly start anywhere for this team right now. I mean, the defense is the one thing that you like have to be able to take with you every night. like you can’t just afford to and it’s not so much like a effort thing or like a competitiveness thing. I think it’s just like a lack of talent. Like we talk about this on offense all the time. They need a star player. They need like a top 15 guy. They need a you know all-star caliber player. And by the way, I think even that would probably not be enough. But they just like they can’t rely on working hard and like thinking that’s going to lead them to a bunch of wins. Like they they’re just not talented enough. I think it’s a roster construction issue. I think they are doing everything they they can, but at the end of the day, there’s just not enough there. And I don’t think that this is like who the Bulls are necessarily. Like I think they’re not going to they’ve lost they they’re three and seven in their last 10 games. I don’t think they’re going to win 30% of their games moving forward. I think they’ll probably go through stretches where they catch lightning in a bottle and maybe not win five in a row, but maybe rattle off a couple of wins and look really good and look really compelling. And we’ll sit here and say, “Oh, have they figured it out yet?” And then they’ll go through a stretch like this where they look pretty bad. They’re playing down to the level of their opponent and they’re not defensive rebounding. I thought that was better today, but the fourth quarter that was an issue. Yeah. Um I actually wrote about this in the instant reaction, so I’ll bring it up. They held the Hornets to five offensive rebounds in the first three quarters combined. They given up seven uh 18.75 offensive rebounds per game over the last four, 75 total. Um so they were doing pretty good through three quarters and then in the fourth quarter they gave up five more and that just so happened to be part of the nail in the coffin. So, it’s like all these little areas where you can’t just let go of the rope and not execute on all of the tiny things you need to execute. And I think the stuff about like margin for error and they can’t like afford to not like it’s not just one area. It’s every single area of the game where they need to be pretty much close to perfect in every single category throughout every single minute of all 48 every single night. And it’s an impossible task. I mean, you’re just not going to be able to do that. But can you do that more than your opponents? And the last 10 games, the answer has been absolutely not. They just have not done it. they played a half, they’ve, you know, made a late run to get themselves in or just hit a game-winning shot or, you know, somebody else has missed a game-winning shot or the the Blazers fell apart in the last minute after overtaking them. It’s like they’re getting lucky in some of these games. They’re getting unlucky in some of them. At the end of the day, that happens throughout an NBA season, but can they get to a level more consistently of like the stuff that we saw in the first half of the year, first five games of the year, I should say. Um, and they just they haven’t looked anything close to that. Yeah, nowhere near it, man. Uh Johnny in the chat saying Modis is mis coached. They neutered his best traits and are trying to make him a spot up three player which isn’t what he wants to do or excels at doing. And meanwhile uh Liam said that uh another modest midame another game of Bulls fans not carrying because he’s so young. Oh and Giddy needs to play better defense yada yada yada. Well I mean Giddy is one of all of the Bulls who needs to play better defense. Modest included. Yes, correct. This team collectively on the defensive end is trash and has been for a dozen games now. You’ve given up 120 plus in 11 straight games. That is not on one player. It’s also not on one player, Isaac Aoro. Missing the last few of that again dozen. Right. I’m sorry. Getting Aoro back and or getting Zack Collins healthy for the first time this season is not going to fix this. Yeah. As far as you know, uh, critiquing Modis’ game and or worrying about the fact that the Bulls coaching staff is neutering him. That’s an interesting thought because he did play 30 minutes tonight and only took eight shots. Kobe took 23. Josh Giddy 16, Vu 11, and your other starter Kevin Herder took four. Modis bricked five threes that he took tonight, all five of them. Was three of three inside the ark. Did did get to the free throw line, but not a ton. Uh, two of four at the line. But another game where Manis just looks passive for long stretches and it’s I guess a question of how good did Bulls fans want and expect him to be. how big of a part of their offense do you want did did you expect him to be like we know that the defense is a problem until that changes we don’t need to you know be that dead horse but Bulls fans care about the development of Modis right right now and do you feel like he andor the coaching staff are doing things incorrectly right now Dave do I feel like they’re doing things incorrectly I wouldn’t word it that way okay I don’t feel like it’s incorrect but I don’t agree with some of the things that they’re doing I can say it like that um And for me, it just really stems from that mid-range. And I don’t want to sound like a broken record, but play it again, Sam. U that mid-range is an important part of his game, an important part of Modis’s game. I went back and I watched stuff he was doing last season and I watched stuff he was doing um with the G- League Ignite when he was scoring and things like that. There was mid-range there, you know, there was a comfort level of mid-range, mid-range there. And it feels like he was doing that to get to that comfort level of getting to the bucket of taking those three-point shots. And it’s like some people have to do certain things so they can, you know, get into the flow of the game. Some guys it’s getting to the free throw line and it gets them into the flow. Whatever your thing is, it just felt like that from Modest from just from again, it’s just me observing and and watching. And it feels like since he hasn’t done that, ever since I heard him say that about Billy on the young man in the three, I promise you, I’ve been watching with an eagle eye to see if that young man has been taking mid-range shots. And I and that was what, five games ago. I’ve seen one one. And it wasn’t really a mid-range shot. It was just kind of a hook kind of layup kind of thing. So, there was no real shot that that he took, you know, to get him into that kind of flow and things like that. It it really does remind me, and I don’t want it to be this, but it reminds me of what I saw from Lowry when when they when he was here. Getting go shoot your threes, get to the bucket, get these rebounds, you know what I mean? But be a part of it, but not just really the one of the focal points, you know what I mean, of the offense. If you score and you’re doing well, great. That’s awesome. But, you know, not be that real guy like that. just stemming off of hearing Modis and what he wants and how he says and things he wants in his career. That’s not how it needs to be done. You know, Modest is a guy like, “Yo, man, I want to be the best.” Well, the best don’t, you know, sit in a corner all day. You know, the best don’t just shoot threes and have, you know, only two moves to that game, which is go inside or shoot threes. They have other parts of their game, other facets of their game that allow them to be to that level. I’ve just seen a change in in that this season and it alarms me, man. Like because I don’t I want to see if he’s going to fail, fail your way is how I look at it. Like if there’s something wrong with the game, yeah, change that. You know what I mean? Like, okay, well, that’s not working for you. Cool. That’s all right. Flip that. That doesn’t work for me that way, great. But man, if it was a part of his game that was just really a true part of it and it’s taking it away. I don’t know, man. It just it really bothers me. And I’m going, of course, you know, there are people much smarter than me that do these things, but you know, just from what I’m I’m observing and what I’m looking at, I just simply don’t I don’t like it. Well, let me just say to that that um in that section of the podcast, Mus was talking about his like welcome to the NBA moment. So, yes, correct. That was to me something that Billy said last season, like at the start of his career. Correct. So, correct. Correct. I don’t know that that would necessarily have as much to do with his shot selection. I’m I’m just stemming it from ever since I saw him say that. That’s what you’ve been thinking. That’s what I’ve been thinking and it made me watch more this season what he’s doing. That’s what I’m saying. Yes, I know it definitely came in his rookie year and he was very specific about the shot and Stephano put up you know what I mean what it was what the shot was. So it was just very specific to that but it’s just that ever since he said that I started watching it more and one and legitimately just one one shot. No, I mean I think that’s like it’s a tough balance to strike, right? Because you don’t want to like take guys out of their game. Like that’s what we praised Billy about is like being adaptable to his talent. Yeah. And so if you’re saying that a player is not allowed to do something that he feels comfortable is that adapting to your talent. For me, I think you just need to be at a certain level of good if you want to take those shots. Um, and we don’t have to like get into the whole thing again, but just I don’t really feel like it’s been too much of a had too much of an impact on the recent performance. To me, I just think he’s been kind of not as impactful on the game. Like, we just haven’t really seen him put he’s had a couple of dunks here and there. He’s made a couple of threes here and there. Tonight, he he was 0 for five, but like I just don’t really feel like he’s he’s been able to like hit his shots. He hasn’t really been he’s turning the ball over. is not like I think he needs to get more into that into the flow of the offense and I think we talk about the identity and like the way that they’ve been playing lately. I don’t think the team has been there. And so I think Modis has the best the best opportunity for Modis to excel is for him to be a part of the Bulls offense the way that they were looking during the first five games and in preseason. And the Bulls have not looked like that as a group. And so I think to me you can draw a line to say if the team plays to that style, Modest is going to play well. If they don’t, he’s going to have a hard time because he’s having to do a little bit too much with the ball in his hands or he’s creating or he’s sitting in the corner and waiting. Like I I agree that that’s not the best use of him, but I think the best use of him is to get back to that style of play that they showed success with. So I think the big question is like why can’t they do that? And I think it goes back to the defensive side. If you’re taking the ball out from under the basket every single time, you can’t get out on the break. If you’re having to send five bodies back to the defensive glass because you keep on giving up 15, 18, 21, 25 offensive rebounds in a game, you’re not getting out on the break. And so for me, it’s like you got to do all the little things that happen throughout the course of each possession, not give up the runway to the rim. That prevents you from having to pull help over that prevents you from having to be out of rotation scrambling, find a guy to box out. Now everybody’s got to go box out and they can’t get on the run. Like there’s so many things I think that lead to each of those possessions in a way where like the offense for me is very much informed by what happens to them on the defensive side and they have not been able to stop anybody. So I agree that Modis has not looked great. I agree that he is not as involved as I would like him to be, but for me it starts with the defense. And I don’t think Modis has been that great on defense either. Like he’s blocking a couple shots, but he’s part of the problem in terms of letting guys get to the rim and not breaking everything down. So, I think everybody, Modis included, needs to be better defensively and that will help them get better offensively. Uh Merrick Joe in the chat saying Mus needs his feet in the paint, cutting in mid-range. He’s 610 and athletic for God’s sake. Uh with that, let us knock out our first ad break. We’ll come back on the other side. dive into more thoughts from tonight’s game. Uh take a look at some specific players. Let us know who you want us to talk about, what you want us to talk about. Throw us a super chat if you’re feeling generous tonight despite the outcome. Hey, the Bulls may have lost. The Bears are nine and three. Nine and three. Nine and three. Throw us a super chat if you want us to talk about the Bears on tonight’s Bulls postgame show. Either way, hit the like button. It’s free. Here’s some ads. It’s a thing. Yep. Being good is fine. Sure. Everybody likes it. Sure. You can be great. Nine and three, but great. No, no, no. Eagles Eagles great. They’re, you know, they can be great, but the Bears are ultra 93. It’s only one way you can be ultra. Be a member of the Chicago Bears or sip a frosty cold Michelob Ultra. Cuz your lips can a bottle, baby. It’s full throttle. Well, Big Dave, why the bears so good? And why is Michelob Ultra what makes it ultra? Well, bears are bearsing cuz Ben Johnson likes taking his shirt off and twisting around his head like a helicopter, baby. That’s why. And the other question, 2.6 carbs, 95 calories of superior smooth taste worth playing for. It’s the official American beer sponsor of your Chicago Bulls. So, you can grab a Micheloblo cuz no matter what you’re playing for, you make it superior. And you do that with Michelob Ultra. You be ultra magnetic. Today’s show also brought to you by Bet 365. And with that early payout offer, you’re a winner if your football team goes up by 17 points with an instant payout on straight bets and parley selections marked as winners. So download that bet 365 app. Use promo code CHGO365 when you sign up. They’ve got something for every NFL night of the season. Thursday Night Football, $10 safety net bet. Sunday Night Football, $365,000 jackpot. Get in on that. 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The word of the bird and on them streets is that we have our CHO Black Friday sale going on right now. Shout out to the dieards who took advantage of the early access earlier in the week. And shout out to you not yet dieards, soon to be dieards who have started taking advantage of it yesterday and today. It’s running throughout the weekend right into Cyber Monday. Save up to 90% on select items and 30% sitewide, plus some pre-sale items you can claim dibs on right now that just dropped. And uh shout out to everybody who’s already chipped in. Uh things are selling like hot cakes everywhere. And you can do it too. Sarah, did you throw the uh the merch link in there? Look at that. I made it pretty easy on the ball. Buy our stuff. Just click the link. It is Black Friday. There you go. There is the link to our All City Network store in the chat. Take advantage. The sale ends Sunday and then Cyber Monday. Don’t sleep though. Uh you doing any holiday shopping, Dave, with the with the Black Fridays? Uh sure. Yeah. No, I did have to do something. It was my brother’s birthday today, so I had to get him something today. So, happy birthday, bro. Love you dearly, brother. Happy birthday, bro. Isn’t he a big fan of our Subzero hoodie? He is a huge fan of our Subzero hoodie. Uh, huge fan of the Bulls. Huge fan of the Bears. A lot of my sports fandom comes strictly from him. Uh, a lot of that comes from him. Uh, huge influence on my life. Continues to be. Shout out to bro. Everybody, get your shopping done now. New shirt. New shirt. New shirt alert. New shirt alert. Oh, dropping soon. Look at it, guys. We got a shirt. We got a shirt. Oh, man. A I like it cuz all three of us contributed. That’s why I like it like that. Yes. All three of us got up in there. Yeah. Well done. Well done. I like it. I like it a lot. Red, white, and black, baby. Look at those colors. Emma says it’s Emma, what are you? Go home. What are you still doing here? Blackhawks are here. She’s doing her job. Bless your heart. Wait, wait. So, are you are you saying if it was just us left here that you would be home, but because the Hawks are here? That’s exactly what she’s saying. I’m waiting for that game to end. This game ended, I would be home. Okay. Okay. You’re right. We won’t tell anyone. You can go. Oh my goodness. Uh, shout out to Joe Mama who threw us a 499 super chat. Uh, saying, “The most frightening scene in The Exorcist isn’t the crucifix scene. It’s how I feel when Pee Will dribbles and hurles towards the rim. Oh, that’s a good super chat. Um, yeah, P Will did have himself some some Pew Will moments trying to put the ball on the floor today. Oh, good. 13 minutes though. That’s pretty good. I mean, heck yeah. I guess. I guess. Word. Uh, I mean, three offensive rebounds, five total. Five rebounds is Yeah. Call the news. Shout out to him. Oh my goodness. Yeah. Good job. Good job, I suppose. Yeah, it was it was bad. Yeah, he’s he still asked. And somebody in the chat earlier on said like, “My gosh, Pat can’t do anything. Not NBA player.” And then the person right under them in the chat said the like they need to extend Patrick Williams. He’s the only person out there making threes and playing defense every night. That’s debatable. He plays defense sometimes. He makes threes sometimes. He was one of three behind the arc tonight. Yeah. Great job. Yeah. Um, but after dribbling it off his uh foot, he came back down. Yeah, it was after the Oh, dear God, Pat turnover that he came back down the floor and hit a three. So, kudos to him for hanging in there. More lead, please. But, like, I mean, when you talk about reliable three-point shooting, the Bulls have been a team that’s fluctuating, I think, with their three-point offense. I think tonight that disparity is what cost them the game cuz you’re right, they did have some poorly timed u letting go of the rope on the defensive boards tonight. Goat allowing those five offensive rebounds in the fourth quarter after only five through the first three and just crucial stops that they needed to have trying to come from behind a little bit. But when you when you look at it like they outscored the Hornets in fast break still despite those slippages on the boards. uh and they outscored them in the paint. Free throw line, they were six makes shy of uh the Hornets 20 to the Bulls 16. The Hornets made 15 threes, the Bulls made eight. That’s a 21-point separation. And that’s a very familiar story from days gone by when we would sit here and talk about the Bulls losing behind the three-point line every night, night in and night out. That hasn’t been the case as much. And I did see somebody in the chat earlier talking about the Bulls chucking up shots or taking bad threes tonight. or or too many bad threes. They only took 36. Yeah, they I I would say that there were some not great threes. Javon Carter took a couple of questionable ones tonight. Ball took a couple. Uh it was but like 36 that is an average if not kind of like on the lower side of average as far as three-point attempts per game. But we keep talking about the Bulls getting good looks. Billy Donovan has been harbing about shot quality, but I mean they they had a a pretty terrible eight of 36. You shot 22% behind the three-point line. It’s hard to win in today’s NBA when you do that. That is part of what contributed to the Bulls 5 and0 start cuz their opponents were chucking up bricks. Yeah, it’s interesting. They like the first uh No, nobody remembers. Sorry, I was just locked in on some stats here, man. Sorry about that. I was locked in on basketball. Um, the first 11 games of the year, the Bulls did not attempt more than 43 threes. They hit 40 twice. The rest was in the 30s or 20s. The last, what is it, seven games, 50 three-point attempts, 53, 49, 43, 44, 50, right? And then today back to 36. So, I would have to go back and like rewatch all of them to really get a sense of whether or not they were quality. But I do think that there’s something to be said for the idea that they’re probably doing a better job getting downhill, trying to get to the rim and trying to finish. And then the three-point shot being like the well, if you can’t get this, then look for that. So like the second option, um there’s going to be nights where you’re not hitting threes. The Bulls are 37 38% three-point shooting team. They have been all year. Tonight 22%, eight of 36. It’s going to be tough to win on those nights. It was an example though where I I agree with you, Matt, like the free throws were pretty even, the turnover was pretty even, the offensive rebounding pretty even. and it was just like they couldn’t hit shots. And as we’ve talked about before, at the end of the day, that’s really what it’s all about. And so if you’re just missing shots, um I did think they did a good job getting to the rim and finishing there, but uh 22% on threes, like you’re making seven fewer threes than your opponent. That’s 21 points. You’re just down in the hole. Yeah, it it’s a problem. And it feels like different ways they found different ways to like kind of lose. Like of course there’s been a consistency in the losing just like there’s a consistency in winning for what you’re doing on the floor. But it just feels like sometimes I can point to a different thing each time and say, “Oh yeah, that’s a huge reason.” So tonight it’s like three-point shooting. Uh I please remember offensive rebounding. You know what I mean? It’s a huge piece. Uh free throw uh attempt discrepancy. Uh the Bulls are towards the bottom in opponents uh free throw shooting attempts. Like if they’re not 30th, they’re like 29th. Like it’s not great. Um of course the way that these teams are getting more attempts at their field goals, like Bulls are 30th, you know what I mean? opponent’s field goal attempts. So, you saw it again tonight that soon as the Hornets came out, I mean, the first five, you know, I mean, went straight to the Hornets and they just continue the attempts and more attempts and more attempts and more shots. And of course, that comes also with the offensive rebounding that they get that. But then the three-point shooting that’s happening for the other team as well. So, even if you do get that rebound, you’re missing it because you’re not hitting your shots. There’s just a myriad of ways to be bad. And it feels like the Bulls are are keyed in on all those ways right now and it just isn’t clicking and it just isn’t truly working for them right now. Uh I don’t know the answer to it. Honestly, if I did, I would say it loud, very loud. But it’s just a whole a whole way the entire repertoire of the way to lose games like they’ve been doing. Yeah, that’s what B was saying the other night. It’s like you can do everything right and still miss a shot. You can have the perfect offensive possession and still miss the shot. Or you can play 23.9 great seconds of defense. Everybody executes perfectly. Everybody gets to their rotation. Everybody slides, but they make a shot. And that’s what happens sometimes. And that’s why it’s like I didn’t feel like the offensive rebounding was egregious tonight like it was against the Blazers. I didn’t feel like they were putting the Hornets to the line every single possession. It was like who made more shots? And you know, actually the Bulls made more shots. It just so happens that three is greater than two. And so that’s what math says. The thing is like all those things can be true. And I think the answer is they’re just not that talented. Like they’re not a super talented team. And so they have to rely on being perfect in all these areas. And so when you’re losing in, as you’re saying, Dave, a myriad of different ways, any one of those can unravel you. Yes. And I think that’s the issue with not being a talented team. Mhm. Don’t disagree. It’s it’s a tough pill to swallow if you believed differently, I think. Okay. And you know, we’re not even to the 20 game mark yet, but we are closing in on being a quarter way through this season. Mhm. Crazy. The Bulls are nine and nine. Familiar territory. They’ve got some really impressive W’s. They do. And they’ve got some stinky doodoo L’s. Doo. What does that all add up to? A doo. A mid team with a mid coach and mid talent on the floor. Some of us thought that would be the case. We’ll see if it changes, but right now, this last stretch of games, that very much seems to be the case. And it’s it’s not just one bad shooting night or oh, such so and so player played bad defense tonight. No, it’s everybody’s playing bad defense for a dozen games now and you you had a worse shooting night than your opponent on a night when neither team said, “Let’s play defense.” Yeah, that’s literally what happened. It’s true. And I mean, at the beginning, I was like, “Oh man, this is going to be 150 148.” Like, it just felt like that. But it feels like well said 22%. Yeah, we got you. No, we won’t do that. Oh, but yeah, even when when they were winning games, it’s like, you know, finding ways to win and finding ways to lose like and we talked a lot about them playing up and playing down, you know, to their opponent and having those big games, you know, you found they were like, man, we get up for this stuff. Like, yo, can’t wait. We got to come out. We got to battle these teams. Can’t wait to play the Nuggets, you know, get ready for for the Bucks or whoever, you know, whatever. good team. Even in their losses, like the effort wasn’t questioned, you know what I mean? Like, okay, fine. You lost to Giannis. All right, you lose to Giannis, bro. But the effort wasn’t questioned. You lost to Orlando. That’s a solid team. Lost to the Knicks after, you know, beating them. But none of that was questioned as far as the effort of that team was concerned. It was just losses. Now you’re playing teams where you’re like, “Okay, you should be able to get off, you know what I mean, your your bad uh situation, you know, and just get some wins.” And now I’m questioning effort when you’re playing these teams here because people are giving them, you know, kind of writing in the wins, you know what I mean? In pencil, pen, whatever you use, blood. But it feels like when they got here and got to the game, they felt entitled, you know, and like, “Okay, we’re gonna get this. It’s fine. We’re gonna have this.” Nope. These teams are coming out to win. They hadn’t won the Hornets hadn’t won in like what two weeks. Like it had been a while since they had won a game. The Utah Jazz weren’t weren’t winning games. You know what I mean? Like we watched Washington almost take one from them and they hadn’t won since GOAT was born. Like it’s been a long time, but it feels like they just continue to do this and we continue to talk about why is it like that? And for me it goes to preparation, you know, and being ready to play those teams. And that some stuff for me falls on players and coaches when you’re not prepared to play and or or you come out with an with an idea like, “Oh yeah, we about to run this team.” Like they ain’t got nothing for us. We cool. Well, who’s going to run? Who’s running for you? You know what I mean? Like who’s doing it for you? Like it’s not working that way. And these teams are turning to the Bulls and saying, “No, you don’t know how to play defense. No, you can’t stop these three-point shots. No, we’re getting all of these rebounds. There’s nothing you’re going to be able to do about it. And these losing teams are playing in that effort way and attacking the Bulls in that effort kind of way. And the Bulls aren’t doing it back to them, man. And they’re walking away with LS. I think the most simple way I can put this is on the season, the Bulls are 23rd on defense. Over the last two weeks, they’re 25th. Okay, that’s not good. That’s very bad. And it’s like hard to win games like that. And in order to do that, in order to overcome that or compensate for that, you just have to be really good on offense, right? Yes. They’re 16th on offense over the last two weeks, 18th on the year. Like, they’re just not good enough on offense to overcome how bad they are on defense. And like I think that’s just going to be kind of how it is until they start to figure something else out. Y’all got to lose. Yeah. Uh all right, let’s knock out our second ad break right there. When we come back, still more thoughts on tonight’s game. We got a couple of super chats. We will get to those. Plus, uh I saw somebody in the chat just say, “Start talking about trades.” Well, we have a segment for you. We got we got we got a little teaser from our chat with Tim Leggler from earlier this week talking about a very specific trade. Um ad haters, brace yourselves. Uh hit the like button while you listen to these words for our friends and sponsors. It’s free. CA Show Bowls is brought to you by Sunnyside Cannabis Dispensary. Our friends at Sunnyside are here to elevate your football season. Sunnyside is your home for judgment free cannabis shopping. They’ve got a crazy selection with over a 100 different strains to choose from. That’s right. I said 100. He said it. 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Hit that like button if you didn’t do it during the ad break. Uh something else that we can plug, we got a couple of fun things coming up around the corner here at CHO Bulls. The Bulls are playing Orlando, who they beat all the way back in October, game two of the season. They are playing the Magic again on Monday. Yes. After this holiday weekend, we are going to do a live watch along for that their show. uh live game um tip off I believe that’s uh going to be is that is that a home? Is that a seven? Let’s see here. No, we’re at the Magic. We’re at Magic. So that’s a 6:30 tip. So we’ll be right here brightey and bushy tailed uh for a live watch along to watch that with y’all. Hang out with us in the chat, watch the game together, and then of course we will have some postgame thoughts on on the back end of that per usual. But so that’s coming up on Monday of this coming week. And then Thursday of this coming week, we are doing a fun event in person. Yeah. Yeah. Out at the Players uh bar and pub in Prospect Heights. Yeah. Some we call them Papa Shot Showdown, a happy hour with us, the GOAT tournament presented by our friends of course at Miglo Ultra. Uh so come on out if you’re in the area or if you feel like making a trek for a little Thursday. A little thirsty Thursday. Little Thursday. Thursday pre-week hang. I’ll be a little thirsty. Players pub and grill 1250 South River Road in Prospect Heights starting at 700 p.m. Chicago time. We will be there free to attend. Don’t need to RSVP, but you can hit us up in the chat on Twitter, in the Die Hard Discord, wherever. Let us know that you’re coming and come enjoy some nice beverages. Get get a few shots up. Get some shots up. We talk about the Bulls three-point shooting problem. That’s it. I call this the Will the Got Lee tournament, ladies and gentlemen. There’s nobody who has been a greater Papa Shot, player, champion, however you want to put it, than this fine gentleman over here. I can’t wait to see that skill be put on display. He is about that life. Y’all better bring. Although point of contention, I will say, did Dalen not beat you when he came to hang out with us in Studio F? My point is an NBA player had to come up in here. They had to bring a ringer up in here. Another point of contention. Oh, wait. I didn’t beat him. I beat you when we were out in Vegas, right? Yeah. So, no, no, no. Yes. At uh uh Summer League. Yeah. Yes. Correct. Yeah. Yeah. I knew I beat somebody. Become a member. Beat somebody else. Somebody took that aloe, baby. Become a member of our YouTube channel and you can go watch that video of Dylan giving me the work. And speaking of becoming a member of things, why not become a diehard right now? $36 signup offer. Uh use promo code GO goat goat to get access to all of Goat’s great writing and coverage of your beloved Chicago Bulls. Uh, plus the free shirt of your choice at sign up. You can pick the brand new modest design. We have Chicago’s own. Um, and uh, 20% off every other time you shop in Emer store after the Black Friday sale is over. We already got savings on savings and whatnotss. And then of course tailgates, everything else we do fun events wise discounts for die hards. Become a diehard. Promo code go. Uh, sorry, I just read a super chat. I was trying to figure Would you like to read it out loud instead of just to yourself? Sure, I can do that. Go for us. Uh Joe Mama. Oh, it’s AK. AK. Shout out to you, sir. Appreciate it. Uh P will rookie year show promise second year. Uh not so much. Modest rookie year show promise. Second year he’s in regression. Is it an organ organizational problem? I really effing hope not is my answer right now. See why I say that. I really effing hope not is my answer right now. Okay. I will say I I was never as high on Pat when I was believing in him to a degree as I am high on Modis. I hope that I continue to feel that way about Modis. Mhm. It’s it’s 18 games. Sure. I’m I’m I’m holding on to my modest stock. I’m not going to sell my Modest Mella stock after a little dip, you know, um early on in his sophomore NBA season. M I am concerned about some things and some things it’s like yo he’s he’s a 21-year-old player entering year two um you know we were talking with legs um in that same mini pod episode about and he was talking about just like growing into his grown man’s NBA body and the physicality in this league at times presenting a challenge for him on both ends of the floor we also see him use that physicality size sprite uh and and some craftiness on the ball now to get to the rim at But it’s not whenever whenever and it’s like he gets cooked on defense sometimes. So file is it an organizational problem generally across the board? I’d say yeah. Is it specifically a problem that makes me worry about Modis right now? Not yet is my answer. That’s safe to say. Uh organizational sure. I mean you you could call it that. Again I’m I’m a firm believer when something is working everybody gets it. And then when something’s not working, everybody kind of gets it. Um, so you can say that, but again, it’s so early. And I think that’s why I’m at I don’t have that feeling of concern or just like, oh man, like I’m a little disappointed. I wanted to see more. I wanted to see a little bit more from him. But I don’t just have that feeling of, oh god, you know, sell everything, get off the boat. This is the worst ever. I don’t have that feeling yet. maybe pro probably because of the 18 games, but just because of the skill set that the young man has that I know that he has uh in his game. I don’t really have that yet. So, there have been some flashes. I today even he did a move where he got to the rim, you know, put it up with that left on on that center, which like I said before, that is turning into his go-to move when he’s getting to the bucket is that left-handed layup, man. Like creating space for him, create he creates that space and then gets to the rim uh with that left hand. Um, so yeah, I’m I don’t have that concern yet about his game, but yeah, I do have like, oh my god, I need to see a little more because I’m not liking what I’m seeing out there uh from him. I want to see the other things that we kind of saw more of. And that fire also of Modisellis I I want to see up a little more too. Uh that aggression uh I want to see it up a little more too. Not to say he doesn’t play with it. I just know I’ve seen it when he plays with it, you know, always and constantly all the time. And sometimes it feels like he’s still kind of figuring stuff out, finding stuff out, and maybe he’s a little tired from because Go was putting it too like guys have to attack the glass now. Everybody’s got to attack the glass and try to get these rebounds and do it that way. And he’s never been a great, you know, rebounder, but again, Mus is going to do whatever is necessary to try to get this team a win, try to get it a victory. Um, but yeah, but in those situations, I want I want to see a little bit more uh of that stuff, man. I want to I want to feel him more. I think that’s what I’m trying to say. I want to feel Modis more on the floor. I’ve said this before about him. Like, he’s had a game where I didn’t feel him out there. I want to feel him out of clay. Eat some hay. You just rhy times in a row, you know? I got it like that. But yeah, man. I I just want to feel him out there on the floor like every single time, every single night, consistently. I want to feel that Modisella’s uh impact on the floor. I mean, I think that’s really fair. I’m not ready to like say anything definitive about Modis. It’s been a stretch of games in his second year. He’s young. Um he has played better in the past and I think he will be better than this, too. Um, to me, if you’re gonna talk about like concern, I I wouldn’t say so much about like the Bulls development of young players in general, although I think that is always something that teams should be concerned about. Yes. To me, it’s their dra drafting track record as a whole. When you look at like Arurus since they’ve come in, it was Patrick Williams. Uh, it was IO was a hit for sure in the second round, but they also got Marco Simonovich that year that was a miss. You have Dalen, you have Julian Phillips who you traded multiple draft picks to move into the second round to get. Um, like they just haven’t been a good drafting team. We’ve barely seen any of Noah. Modis, I think, is has the potential to be the best player that they draft. And I think it’s obviously going to be great for the Bulls if he hits. Um, but he’s averaging like 14 points a game and starting in the NBA in his second year. I I think it comes down to expectations a little bit and like there was all this hype going into the season and so I think that kind of set people up to be disappointed when he was just like okay but I think that even if you asked you know last year if Modis like before the end of last season if you said in Madison’s second year if he’s averaging 14 and five and a half would you be happy with that? I think most people would be happy but I think to your point Dave it’s that he hasn’t you haven’t really felt his presence especially of late. So I think he’ll be better. I think the Bulls will be better. I don’t think they’re going to look like this all season. Um, but I do think that like in order for them to actually be good, in order for me to buy them as like a real team and not just a team on a hot streak or on a cold streak, they’re going to have to do it more consistently. It’s just it hasn’t been there. And I just don’t think that good teams play this inconsistent and I don’t think good players are that inconsistent either. Uh, shout out to one of our regulars, Anthony, in the chat who brings this up. Can we also critique how Billy just has Mad standing at the three-point line getting benched most of the time he makes a mistake and he has played completely different uh since Kobe came back mio um the again standing at the three-point line sometimes he also made a great baseline cut and Giddy found him for a great dunk in like the first 90 seconds of the game. That’s true. Let’s see more of that consistently and yeah if you know Modis is over for five from downtown on the night you’re gonna see that and think that’s not great. Stop chucking threes. go inside. We’ve also seen Modis have nights where he lights it up from behind the three-point line. And that’s why you can’t like measure his success off of makes and misses. Yes, there’s so much more that he has to do throughout the course of a game and all them like it’s not just modest like every defensively being in the right spots at the right time like boxing out all this stuff that like frankly everybody is letting up on right now and that’s why you’re seeing the results the way that they are. But Anony’s second point about since Kobe came back looking modest looking completely different. I pointed out earlier tonight, Kobe took 23 shots tonight. That is a lot of shots. Modus took eight. I think we talked about that being a potential silver lining of, oh, Kobe White is going to be out a while as this season gets underway. Where are the positives there? Could it be that Modis Bzelis is more involved in this Bulls offense out of the gate in year two of his career? because that’s what I was thinking about as like find the good of Kobe White not being out there because we know how lethal he can be um and how much he can create and does create on the ball um for the Bulls offense over the last couple years and especially since the Zack Lavine trade last season. And I also saw somebody else say like earlier in the chat tonight, Kobe was driving too much, trying to like shoot over seven footers too much, was forcing shots tonight too much. It’s not like he had a terrible night. 11 of 23. Yeah, could be better. But also like I I don’t think he was like wildly selfish tonight. He did only have four dimes, but I believe he started the season with three straight games, but at least seven assists. So it’s not like Kobe’s going out there ruining the Bulls offensive flow and just turning into a chucker. Yeah. Like Yeah, I totally reject that. Yeah, I think that’s just I think that’s not true. Yeah, I agree. Go ahead. No, I just I don’t think that’s true at all. I think that first of all, they need him to be a scorer. Like they don’t have a scorer on this team. I don’t know, maybe I’m wrong. At the end of the day, I think you need more points than your opponent in order to win. So, they need they need somebody to be a scorer and coach the best one on the team that can do that. Freezing cold takes. He’s he’s also I think been really really good at getting to the rim. Like one of six from three. I’m not worried about that. I know what kind of shooter Kobe is. To me, like I thought he was pretty good getting the rim. His body control and finishing and strength and balance, like all this stuff where he’s able to change pace, stay on balance, and finish through contact. I want to see him get to the line more. he was only two of three. Um, but they I don’t think that like they when I say that their offense has not been up to the standard that it was before. I don’t necessarily mean that it’s been like iso ball or that they haven’t like resembled that. I still think that they’re trying to do a lot of those same things. It’s just not with the same force. It’s not with the same tempo getting into screening actions, moving the ball around. They’re still doing it. It’s just not as snappy. And I think when you lump that in with the idea that they’re not getting as much in transition, they’re having to take the ball out. They’re just moving a little bit more slow. It’s like they’re just a half step slow of what they were at the start of the season. I think a big thing could be just like is it possible to play at the pace that they want to play throughout the course of a season or is that going to be something that’s just too exhausting? Yes, they have depth. Yes, they, you know, are a very well-conditioned team. Yes, they’ve trained for it. But at the end of the day, we haven’t seen that same level in a while, especially consistently. So, I think that could be an issue, but I’m not worried about Kobe at all. And I don’t even think he’s like taken time to integrate himself into I think he’s just been really good and it you can play well and not win. Like, I think two things can be true. No, it happens. I wrote about it uh in in our breakdown of this game tonight in our instant reactions just how happy I am to have Kobe White out there on the floor and how good it is to have somebody I can say, “Oh, here’s the basketball. We’re not scoring right now. Can you please go score for us, sir?” Oh, is this person immediately our team’s best scorer? Yeah. immediately when he walks out. Like this is Kobe White, bro. Like he’s balling. All right. No, absolutely not. He fits right in seamlessly. With that, we’ve got to knock out one last quick ad break when we come back on the other side. Final thoughts on tonight’s game, plus tease a little chat we had with Tim Leggler earlier this week about all things Bulls. Don’t want to miss it. Hit the like. It’s free. We’ll be right back. CH Bulls is brought to you by Branded Bills. Whether you need snapbacks, truckers, fitteds, shout out big Dave, beanies, or TE’s, Brandon Bills has you covered with performance and style. Looking for some gear to make your brand stand apart from the crowd? Brandon Bills has you covered with the best custom headwear. Start your order and their dedicated team will help you create the exact custom apparel you need. They have a partnership with 40 different colleges, including 10 Big 10 schools as a part of their campus collection. The Big 10 schools include Ohio State, Minnesota, Illinois, Let’s Go Ali, Indiana, Iowa, Maryland, Michigan State, Penn State, Purdue, and USC. 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It’s just an amazing, helpful, wonderful tool. I love it so, so much, man. You can get control over your finances with Monarch Money. You can use the code cho@ monarchmoney.com in your browser for half off your first year. That’s 50% off your first year with monarch.com. Use the code cho Bulls postgame rolling along Friday night breaking down the tough loss uh to the Hornets. Shout out to Grant Attakus, another one of our regulars in the chat who said, “Burn this team down. Let’s just reset while next year’s draft looks good.” So, somebody else in the chat earlier tonight say, you know, Boozer uh Boozer Jr. looked pretty good out there on that UC floor in that college action last night. Sure did. Imagine Stacy. Boozy, boozy, boozy, boozy, boozy, boozy. Uh, we did have another couple super chats we didn’t get to yet. Uh, let’s knock those out. Chop me. Uh, with a $15 super chat from HK, appreciate you. Say, Billy’s Forgard lineup is puzzling. Carter, fourth quarter minutes, question mark. Uh, how many minutes did Javon play in the fourth? It couldn’t have been that many cuz I think he only played like 10 on the night. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, play a ton. He also I thought I watched him take and make take and miss two threes tonight. He only took one miss but two shots. I mean I I do wonder if there’s some line of thinking within Billy’s brain of like look our defense is trash right now. It’s not going to get any trashier because Javon Carter’s out there and he might hit us some shots. 548 in the fourth quarter. I mean it’s kind of wild. Yeah, that is wild. It’s a solid that mean but like what what else does that say though? Because that is one of the other things along with losing behind the three-point line tonight. The Bulls lost this game because they their bench lost to the Hornets bench like and so maybe Billy was grasping at some straws in the fourth quarter. Who wants to step up and decide that we should not lose this game? Buer want to play Carter. How about you? No, I think that’s spot on. I was going to bring that up as well. Um Trey Jones played well. 16 points, four assists, five steals. Uh I was not great tonight in terms of shooting. Two of seven from the field, five points. Javon Carter had two points, Patrick had five, and Jaylen had Smith. This was like a huge strength of the team. Everybody’s talking about the best bench in the league and all this stuff. Like again, it’s the consistency and there’s going to be nights where you just don’t hit your shots. I think a lot of it is just that. Um, but just very lethargic and I feel like you you typically could rely or at least in the first 15 games or whatever it may have been, you could rely on the bench to come in and provide that spark and it didn’t really feel like they had that. in this game. Uh you look at the plus minus and you know most of the starters are in the plus and most of the bench are in the minus and that’s not what you want to see from a team that relies so heavily on their depth, right? Yeah. Very heavily on it, man. And it’s just weird for you to even say those words that they lost. You know what I’m saying? Their bench scoring loss tonight to another team, especially a 4 and4 team on top of that. Um but yeah, but that’s what we saw. And so we know that if that’s how the Bulls have been winning games as of late is their bench. When teams attack that now, then what do you do? You know, this is why I’ve enjoyed Kobe White. You know what I’m saying? So much being out there. And also Josh Giddy. Let me give Josh Giddy love. I I haven’t spoke about Josh Giddy and the game that he had tonight again for the Bulls, man. He was he was really good. I mean, 25 huge points uh for them. He got to the line seven times. He was six or seven. Kudos from the uh free throw line, man. but three of seven from three uh as well. Uh six of 16, but 11 rebounds and the and the nine assists that that he had all defensive rebounds, too. Like, you know, get that’s the superpower. I’mma get it in. I’mma go. But yeah, he has absolutely been consistent uh for the Bulls with his numbers and what he’s doing for the team. So, yeah, he he’s the starter. He gets things started. He gets things going for them and he gets to the bucket and he scores when they need him. And he does not quit at all. like that dude plays until the final buzzer. So, I can say that about him. I can say it about Trey Jones. You know what I’m saying? For sure. Those guys don’t quit. They they play to the final buzzer, man. So, no, Giddy had a really really really good game. And I’ve been talking a lot about consistency on this podcast today. Like, I think Giddy’s been the most consistent player on the team. He has not had really any dud games. He hasn’t really been benched in the fourth. Like, he’s been really solid and really consistent all year playing this way. So, um totally agree. I’m glad we shouted him out because he had a really nice game and I think that’s a big step for him individually too is to be able to play like this consistently because that was the question we had was like okay you have the defense you have the shooting but like can this drive sustainable winning and him playing consistently to this style again you’re not going to win every night there’s you can’t but like can you play this way and maybe that can lead to winning or you are part of a formula that is a winning formula and I think him playing to this level on a nightto-ight basis is a big piece of huge. And big again, big shout out to Trey Jones. Five steals uh for Trey Jones tonight, man. Somebody was trying to play defense. Shout out to Trey and shout out to Josh. He did uh he he did play well tonight. Um uh we we had one more super chat. We needed to shout out Sarah uh before we get to legs. Uh our guy AK with a 999 super chat saying to win you need talent and team effort. The more this team loses, the sooner Acme’s faulty strategy of collecting other teams spare parts can be put to rest. It’s roster construction. But as Billy’s contract is safe, um I see no lies in anything that our friend aka said in that way you worded that. Like other team spare parts like that is it’s like a junkyard. We do not we do not require this kid anymore. Who wants him? Aka I me teach me. We do not require this Isaac Aoro anymore. Who wants Oh. Oh. Oh. Please me. Oh, please pick me. Only player for player swaps though. That’s my one rule. What’s the one rule, baby? Mm- We don’t do it like that. Uh I I agree with AK. Uh it’s about talent and Razer construction. Um Billy Donovan again has his flaws. We talk about that all the time. Yeah. But I also somebody somebody in the chat just said like Billy if Billy’s grabs in straws that’s not doing the same thing over and over. Playing Javon Carter four, five minutes of the fourth quarter. That’s not the same thing over and over. That would be different. That would be an adjustment. The other night he tried small ball, pad of the vibe, didn’t work. Yeah. Started Jayen uh Jaylen Smith at halftime. No adjustment. Billy makes adjustments. Billy tries lots of things. There’s just only so much he can do with his what’s that? Spare parts. Spare parts don’t win in the NBA. Uh all right, with that and our time remaining, we wanted to give a little sneak peek at our chat with Tim Leggler earlier this week. Uh he’s going to be chatting with us every other week or so throughout the entire NBA season. Shout out to him for doing that with us and his busy schedule. Check him out also with our guy Adam Mars all all cities all NBA podcast on the daily. Uh we talked about a lot of things we did, but we talked about the Anthony David trade room because of course we did wanted to get legs thoughts on it. Sarah Bayer, take it away. Legs on the go talk hotline. There are a handful of teams in this league or less that fall into a category that I would say, man, you might want to really explore that. I think Chicago is one of those teams. And here’s why. I do think there are limitations on the upside of their roster. It’s not other than Buzzelis who who knows he’s so young, but that’s going to be that’s going to be a few years down the road before he hits that level. Whether he does or doesn’t, we won’t know that for a few years. You look at their roster and you go, where is like that additional growth going to come from over the next year or two that you go, okay, now we can get into the category with some of these teams that have climbed in the East like Orlando, Detroit. Can we get up there with with the Knicks and the Cavs? Can we be in that category Boston, Indiana, when they get healthy next year? Anthony Davis could be worth taking the risk for a team like Chicago because his upside when he does play and is healthy and I know that’s a huge if is different than anything else you have on your roster. So for a team like Chicago where I think there’s limited additional upside individually across the board of your roster, Anthony Davis might be something that’s worth exploring. Now, if you have a team that’s got, you know, got it going a little bit and they’re like good and now they’re thinking they want to contend and is Anthony Davis the right guy, but you got to give up two young guys that are starting for you that have incredible potential to take that risk. I don’t know if it’s worth it for a team like Chicago. I look at the roster and I just don’t know who on that roster do you look at and say two three years from now other than Buzzel is a guy that you could say could take a huge leap and now we’re right in the mix in the East. I don’t think they have that kind of roster. Anthony Davis potentially could give it but he comes with tremendous risk. Does he play 30 games at some point where the whole thing gets like you know derailed? That’s the risk and that’s what you have to weigh and I think that’s what they’re going to be looking at. That was uh our chat with the one and only Tim Leggler. You can also catch him doing NBA on ESPN, part of that 18 broadcast crew. Um they called uh what was it? Rockets Warriors on Wednesday night. Yeah. Day before Thanksgiving. Um great great stuff. Talked about a lot of things. Talked about Modest. Talked about Kobe. Talked about this bull’s up and down start. Sarah Bear threw the link to the entire mini pod episode that we did with Legs earlier this week in that chat so you can go watch the whole thing after we wrap up postgame if you haven’t caught it yet. Uh thoughts, gentlemen? I see like brace yourselves. Well, too late to brace yourselves Bulls fans who don’t love the AK or the AK the AD trade idea. I think Legler speaks a lot of truths there including the one at the end which is we all know that there’s a big injury risk attached to this. Yeah, it’s a risk. You know what I mean? Just like any other trade you’ll take, it’s a risk you’re taking. But obviously, the health of him is is an absolute risk. But again, it’s why it’s why I asked him the question because I was like, I need somebody else to break this down outside of us cuz you know, obviously, you know, we’re idiots according to people. But, you know, well, let’s hear from Tim Leggler, who is not that. and Tim Leggler like him breaking it down in that same kind of way that we were saying like dude no we don’t want to give up two stars or two of your young guys with that upside potential or anything like that but you know what do you have on your team that is in any way an equivalent to what he can bring you even like just name it I would love to hear it and it’s doesn’t exist out there so yeah man it it makes sense to me that they should explore it before goat weighs in real quick just a reminder as we head to overtime in post game. If you are watching on one of our various streaming partners uh and platforms, thanks for tuning in. If you want the bonus coverage, just head to allc.com. Uh Goat, your thoughts on Lexus thoughts there. I mean, I’m glad that he didn’t call me dumb. Um you know, I think if you were to think about like what are the options here? What what what are the possible outcomes that the Bulls could go? I think like selling off some parts for rebuilding or maybe mortgaging out your cap space to other teams to take on bad contracts to get picks. um consolidating some bad contracts. Uh you know, I I think I’d probably rather go that route in terms of like loading up on assets and like going towards the bottom. I don’t think that this team is like good enough to really fight. If they had gone on like a, you know, better start after that 5-0 start and like continue to play well, I think we’d be talking about a different thing. So, I think that’s one of the pathways you could go to the bottom and like use your potential flexibility and cap space to get some draft picks and like think about this upcoming draft which has like three star level talent at the top. Um, or you could continue on doing what you’re doing and just like building slowly, not really investing, not really stripping it down, but continue on this path to evaluate what you have, see how good Giddy can get, see how good Modis can get over the next couple years, and then make a decision, a more patient approach. Or you could be a little bit more aggressive and try to push some chips in. I think like to me the middle route is just like I get it and I think generally speaking I’m willing to be patient, but I don’t feel like I I guess I feel like I have enough of an answer about what this team is now to where I don’t really need to be patient. Like I know they’re not good enough. So, if you’re unwilling to go this route and like kind of sharp it down and get some extra picks and your options are just be patient or try to push some chips in for a player like Anthony Davis, I think that probably makes some sense. Um, I would not give up Kobe. I would not give up two, three first round picks. I would give up the Blazers pick and maybe one more. Um, see if you can get off of Patrick Williams contract in there. I’m not like using this as an opportunity to like think Anthony Davis is the difference between the Bulls and a championship, right? But I think it’s like a step that you can take to maybe get to the next step. Maybe you make the playoffs this year with him and then you’re able to like actually get some experience of like highle competitive basketball as opposed to just regular season competitive basketball. Maybe you’re able to win a series and like actually have a fun productive year and then maybe you make another move and that pushes you further ahead. So to me, if you’re making me rank choice then I would probably go like rebuild. I still think that’s probably the best path. Then push some chips in, but not too many for Anthony Davis and then keep on going forward and maybe waiting and seeing because I think the flexibility is going to run out and then where are you? You’re just kind of like re running it back with the same team. It’s just like we know what this is. I think they’re a good team. I don’t think they’re a great team. I think they’re going to have LOLs. I think they’re going to have moments where they rattle off a few wins and people get excited about it. But at the end of the day, I think this is who they are until they get a star player. I think Anthony Davis is a star player that fits really well next to Giddy, next to Kobe, next to Modis who could actually make them a pretty solid defense, if not a great defense right away and then you’re erasing a lot of these questions that we’ve been talking about all show. Yeah. No, I love how you said that, man. Especially the flexibility uh of that because flexibility also hinges on potential and at some point in time that’s going to run out. You know that those things run out and you have to capitalize, you know what I’m saying, on that. So the flexibility is expiring. Like you think about contracts as expiring contracts, the flexibility is expiring because once those contracts expire, then you got to make decisions with it. And would you rather resign Herder and Collins and you know Javon or whoever? Javon’s not a free agent. Oh yes, he is. Um in any event, like you could either resign your guys or maybe like make some fringe moves and get the next Jaylen Smith or you could like make a real move and like try to be better. And I feel like that to be would be preferable. I also think I get like people don’t want to do that. I get that people are averse to, you know, putting chips into the middle for this team, but I I’ve watched this team long enough to like be pretty comfortable with understanding who they are and what their ceiling is. And it’s been the same since CHGO Bulls started. So like I’ I’d be more interested in like seeing a more competitive version. Um, or I would be more interested in them like leaning into an opportunity to get someone in the draft, which they have not yet been able to do. Uh, Mr. Bad Guy in the chat, AD isn’t worth the risk. Eric J93 AD is a no for me. Uh now if AD and the Mazag agree to buy out and the Bulls sign him on a decent deal, wouldn’t mind that. Uh Jeff Cassins, if we could trade Kobe and Vu as the core components of an AD trade and not give up much draft capital, I do that. Doubt Dallas would. Chicago Bulls nation too. They won’t tank. They won’t take risk. That equals playin and a drafting and drafting between 13 and 18th pick every year. By the way, I think that’s exactly the path that will happen. Yeah. Exact. So, Timothy Jones saying, “Uh, AD is absolutely worth the risk.” Johnny, hell no on AD. Would rather stay the course, i.e. tank without trying to tank, get a decent draft pick. Um, Grant Attekus, we’ve been doing the middle route for 5 years. Hit the reset, please. So, that to me is all of those comments that came in. We appreciate all of them. They’re all valid in their own way. You’re entitled to your opinion. Ain’t worth the risk when you’re talking about AD specifically. What risk? What are you risking? What? What are you risking? Seriously, that’s exactly Oh, dear God. Oh, we might we might not qualify for that 910 playin game for the fourth year in a row. What the hell risk is that? Oh, we we can’t risk giving up draft capital while bitching about AK’s draft status and resume on the other side of your mouth. Oh, I Kobe’s not a winner. Kobe’s not going to win this win this league for the Bulls. We shouldn’t resign him. V is trash. Trade him Bulls. Well, no, we can’t trade them for Anthony Davis. Like, what? Make it make sense, Bulls fans. What is your reason for not wanting to give it a try and then make it make sense? Like, dude, AD’s playing in this Mavs Lakers game as we speak right now. I understand the injury risk, but if your alternative is stay the course, the course is mid for the rest of time. Yes, AD stays healthy, it works out, and the Bulls are better than without Anthony Davis cuz when healthy, he’s still one of the best players in the freaking league. Or he he gets acquired by the Bulls in trade. He doesn’t stay healthy, they bought him out and their draft pick is a little more valuable next time around. Like I and like again I’m not some huge Anthony Davis fan and some huge fan of this trade but when Bulls fans are like no we must stand 10 toes down on what we have. We got a N9 team that just lost to Buzz City and the Pelicants. All right. Is that something you really want to hold so dear God hold on for for dear life tightly to Bulls Nation? What are you holding on to? We got nothing. We got another play tournament appearance on deck. Yeah. Who else is sick of those? Cuz I am freaking sick of those. Oh god. We got to hold on to our super valuable assets and roster pieces. Get the hell out of here with that crap. Why not try something else? Nine and three bears. Nine and three bears. Brought him back. That was a reg. That’s like an inception. in the spinny top. Make a lot of heads. There it is. Like look at the spinny top. Matt, there it is. Nine and three bears, man. He does have a good point. Yes, absolutely, Jeff. Absolutely. What are you holding on to, guys? What are you holding on to? I agree more with Matt, honestly. Matt and I think pretty I think on the team. You know why? The bear. It’s because you’re smart. Great minds think alike. That’s why I do think that like it’s going to be very interesting to monitor this trade deadline and next summer. I’ve been saying this for a while, but like this is the bull’s chance to make a move. I think part of it comes down to like when do you have the flexibility in order to do some of these things? Like over the last couple years, I think we all wanted them to make a move at some point, whether it was a trade away or try to add to this team that they had constructed, but they had zero flexibility. They couldn’t move any pieces because it would make them worse. And they couldn’t trade any pieces because they were already out future draft. They had nowhere to go. And so you have this flexibility. That’s great. But it’s not like you wait for a couple years and then you like okay I know what I have in Gideon modest now I can make that move by then the contracts will be resigned like they won’t have the flexibility. So like the timing element of it I think there is sort of some pressure and urgency with that. But I also think that the Bulls front office right now is just not in a position where they’re willing to take any risks. And I think that’s a dangerous place to be when you’re not willing to make the team better even though you do have the flexibility. That’s where you’re showing some true colors. And I think that’s why this trade deadline and this summer in particular are going to really tell you something about okay, they got their extensions. They know they’re locked in here. Like they don’t have anything to worry about job security-wise. They have the flexibility. They have all their future draft picks. Like they they have the ability to make a move. And so now if they don’t now it’s like okay well then what are you doing here? What are what is the plan? Where are you going? Um somebody just said uh Tommer in the chat tomorrow in the chat they really had us to 5 and0. This team ain’t it. Eco Bean after these past three games the Bulls must make trades. Meanwhile, Juan Miller saying take talking like AD will stay healthy is like talking as if the Bulls will go into luxury tax. No one talking as if AD will for sure stay healthy about the fact that it is a huge inherent risk that you’d be taking. But again, it’s the upside versus what you’re giving up. And like when it comes to I I get Bulls fans have the PTSD about injuries and whatnot, but again it’s the risk of what could you be gaining versus where where are you staying, which I just don’t really um understand. Like I I don’t I don’t either, man. I don’t Well, we’ll see. I mean, the trade deadline’s still a ways away. We We got time. We’ll see um what else happens as the Bulls try and get themselves out of this little funk they’re in. Time in another game. Yeah, that’s right. I also think like by the time the trade deadline comes around, this narrative about the team is going to be very much different than what it is tonight. Okay. You know, probably ideally, hopefully, right? But like there’s a lot of season in between now and the trade deadline. A lot’s going to happen. whether it’s a lot more of the same and you really feel like if this is who they are in on February 5th and they’re 500 team and you’re like frustrated about them every single night because they’re playing this caliber of basketball I probably am not like investing a bunch of picks into an older player but if they have a chance to like you know maybe make it outside of the playin uh and be a real big boy playoff team then like maybe it is worth it and and if you are a Bulls fan who thinks that they should shake up this roster before the inseason trade deadline and like Well, I don’t love Anthony Davis because of the attached injury risk. I get that. But if that’s the only reason not to do it, and then you are trying to argue with yourself that you would rather stay put with this roster than take that risk that well, like we’ll get a better player, get a different think about why AD is on the trade block right now essentially this early in the season. He’s a veteran who has an injury risk. He has some money still coming his way and he’s on a team that had such a bad start that they are looking towards Cooper flagging that future of theirs less so Anthony Davis and oh by the way just fired the front office and are starting ov that’s stuck in mediocrity hell like always and wanting to change course. You got to deal with the realistic options that are available to you. No, let’s get one of those non-injury risk superstar players who’s on a team friendly contract. Why can’t we get one of them and take Patrick Williams? Cuz they don’t goddamn exist. That’s why. All right, let’s get out of here. Um, appreciate you, Juan. You rock. Uh, thank you everybody for the chats, the super chats, the likes, and everything else. Uh, appreciate you engaging with us every night, even on the ugly ones like tonight. Especially the ugly ones. That’s right. Uh, Instagram reactions up now. Give him a read free all coo.com. Become a diehard. Use promo code goat go a to sign up with the $36 signup offer so you can read all goats. Great stuff. Um covering the steam. Follow him. Will goly big day bow bports. I’m bull_pack. We are cow bulls queen controls. Sarah bear. It’s black Friday still. It is still black Friday for another 90 minutes. Yeah. Another 90 minutes of Black Friday. What do they call the Sunday between Black Friday? The Saturday Sunday between Black Friday and Cyber Monday. Is there a name for that? Just waiting for Cyber Monday. waiting for a weekend of shopping. Yes, exactly. Yeah. So, head uh head to the store. The link is still posted on our YouTube channel. Uh so easy and click it and buy things. Very simple. Yeah, very simple. It’s right there. Uh shout out also to the other queen of the controls, the one and only Katy Duffy. Ah, yes. Who blessed us with an appearance tonight. She dipped out before postgame started. She She didn’t get to believe us by being a god. You know, she wasn’t uh she was in her cute little ghost outfit. She wasn’t a figment of our imagination. She was here. She was here. She says she misses y’all. Oh, did you cry? No. I give her a great big hug, though. It was a surprise. I didn’t know she was coming. I didn’t know she was coming in. Delightful. Me neither. So good to see her. Uh y’all tune in to the athletic uh NFL show. Yes. Doing great work over there. Thanks, baby. Uh all right. Uh guess what? We get to try again tomorrow. Yeah. against the bad team Pacers. Yeah. Uh who I think just beat up the Zards. So Bulls only beat the Zards by one. We’ll see how that one unfolds. Uh hit the like button on your way out if you haven’t done it yet. Have a great night. Have a great start to your weekend. We will see you for Saturday night. Bulls postgame action. See you right. Be good. Peace like the mayor.

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The CHGO Bulls crew breaks down the Chicago Bulls’ 123-116 loss to the Charlotte Hornets in Emirates NBA Cup action on Friday night. Both teams were already eliminated from advancing before tonight’s contest, but it still counts as a regular-season loss for the Bulls. And another loss to a “bad team.” Coby White and Josh Giddey both scored 25, but the Bulls’ defense remains a massive problem. Peck, Big Dave and Will Gottlieb try to figure out how the Bulls move forward after falling to 9-9 on the season.

00:00 Start
01:30 First reactions
08:00 Matas Buzelis
20:45 Patrick Williams & bad shots
37:00 Matas Buzelis concerns?
44:30 Coby White
49:00 Billy Donovan & lineup
52:00 Josh Giddey
56:30 Tim Legler on Anthony Davis

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