FIRST TAKE | “Cade Cunningham is on a roll” – Brian Windhorst believes Pistons can make NBA Finals

FIRST TAKE | “Cade Cunningham is on a roll” – Brian Windhorst believes Pistons can make NBA Finals

Uh I’m having like uh warm feelings of nostalgia because the Pistons who you know in my youth were good and in my young years when in my 20s when I was just a a young kid trying to make deadline at the Palace of Auburn Hills with a buzz cut. With a buzzcut number two didn’t have to worry. Could get it in any city, Vinnie. Just go in and say number two. Didn’t have to worry. You can do it yourself. Trust me on that one. Uh, I won the Pistons Wednesday night are going for a team record, their 14th win on ESPN against the Celtics, going for their first their their longest winning streak ever. And the the other two times they won 13 games. One was in 0304, my first year covering the NBA when they won the title. The other one was, I think, in 8990. Huh. I believe I believe Have they Have they not won 14 in a row already? I thought they were one and two, right? I think they’re 13. Was it 13? 13. It’s that that 90 team went 25 and one. They won 12 straight, lost the game, and then won 13 straight. Pretty good. So, yeah, that’s that’s these guys ain’t that. These guys aren’t that. It’s a little different. Check yourself. They’re 15 and two. Um, so you’ve had some interesting report. So, okay. as we do in the media. Um, you know, people sort of had the Pistons sort of in the middle of the pack. Oh, but they were a nice story last year and now like nobody had them 15 and two. I mean, you know, maybe they did. You know, if Cade wants to say he had himself 15 and two, who am I to say? But now they’re 15-2. Folks like us in the media are like, “All right, well, maybe they’re going to win the East this year and maybe they’ve they could use expiring contracts and stuff to upgrade their roster.” So, you’ve had some reporting about this, Vince. Um, you have lived in in in cover lived in Detroit and covered the Pistons for a long time. What do you think the Pistons plan is uh as they approach what is a new reality of them being the number one team in the East? This is a whole new different type of reality for Tom Gors like two years ago this time he had us jumping on a Zoom like on Christmas Eve to apologize for a soontobe 28game losing streak. So, so to say uh that this is new territory is is very understating. I think this though I do believe that ownership at least has an appetite if they are willing if the front office is willing to go for it. The front the ownership has been like oh yeah we can go let’s go get Blake Griffin. Remember that deal was a blockbuster deal in 2017 because they thought they had finally gotten a star and Stan Van Gundy and everything else and Blake was signed to a long-term deal with the Clippers and everything. So they haven’t been afraid of making big moves. I think they have learned now you have to be a little more prudent. But when you look at the treasure trove of young players, not just Kate Cunningham, Jay Ny is back. Assar Thompson is playing well. Ron Holland, don’t forget Jaylen Durren is going to be up for a big time extension that you have to budget for. So the question you have to ask yourself is, do we have the appetite to be able to handle all of our young players? similar to Oklahoma City but not quite like Oklahoma City or do we want to let’s say see what it costs for Lowry marketing which I think I think a the starting point for that would be aar Thompson and the answer for that from Detroit standpoint is no but they don’t but no no no no they’re not no not that but I’m saying you mentioned Larry Markin there are other potential targets I honestly I think it would actually probably cost less in terms of what you’ve got to give up to get Anthony Davis because as Bonimps wants to chime in, it will cost more in terms of his salary. This is this true. Bon I’m sure Bontimps is probably not a huge fan of Anthony Davis coming to a contender and helping a contender. Like I think I mean I actually think Dan Anthony Davis fit with Detroit is okay. I mean, I I think, you know, I think it depends on what the Pistons are trying to do, right? But I think, like you were saying, Vinnie, Tom Gors has never been afraid to spend money. And I I think if you talk to people either in past regimes or the current one, like resources are never really a question. And like, he’s always back. I mean, look, he just spent $80 million to go get Monty Williams, right? Mention the Blake Griffin deal. like he he’s proven he’s will but I mean it like in Austin say it’s not like you know it’s not like this is a market where you go in there go well are they going to be willing to pay the tax like he’s going to pay the tax. I think like you said the question is how do you allocate your resources and I I do think the AD thing I think is interesting to me if they do end up looking at trying to upgrade because like we’ve talked about if you’re trading for Lowry Markin or say Jiren Jackson Jr. becomes available or one of these other long-term mid 20 to late 20s guys in the in the range we’re talking about, right? Memphis, Utah, they’ll they’re going to be asking for a ton. Like, as we’ve laid out, if Dallas ends up trading Anthony Davis, the market’s not going to be great. So, you might be able to get a guy like Anthony Davis for a relatively small current price. And yes, you have the next two years at a big number, but you’re still just gradually working into paying Assar Thompson, paying Ron Holland, paying Jaylen Duran, paying paying uh Jaden Ivy, and you might be able to massage that and make that work. And also, by the way, get a really good player and have a chance in a like, I would argue as wide openen a conference as we’ve ever seen to really make a run if you’re Detroit with the group they have. I I don’t want to offend people in Memphis. I’ve got a lot of friends there. I’m always wellreceived and very popular with their fan base. But I gotta tell you, you said Jiren Jackson Jr. and my heart skipped a beat. Michigan State Jiren Jackson Jr. on that Pistons team. Oh man. Oh, that’s something. You could talk me into the Pistons maybe throwing a bunch of stuff in the pot there now. But listen, just signed a contract with with the Grizzlies. You know, my I I don’t want to get ahead of ourselves on that one. I just got a little excited. I’m a little weary on that one just because when you look at the hole, the one hole that this team does have, I don’t think it’s defensively, right? You’re talking about a top three, top four team in defensive efficiency. When you got Jaylen Durren defending the realm, Isaiah Stewart defending the rim. I feel like you’re you’re short up there. They’re not one of the top 10 teams at three-point shooting. Like when they’ve gotten in trouble this year, they haven’t gotten in a lot of trouble. When they’ve gotten in trouble this year in short stretches, it’s because they don’t have enough space to make shots or they don’t have enough space for K Cunningham to move. Now, granted, some of that could be the injuries. Tobias Harris’s miss time. Na’vi just got back on the floor. So, I think it’s very you have to be very careful about not seeing it through before adding and making the big splash. Like part of part of people there want to see all of this marinate before going all in because once you go all in, the clock starts ticking on JBerstav, the clock starts ticking on Tan Langden. you can afford to let your young players and and Tim talks about this all the time about, you know, it it sounds like pocket watching, but the Pistons are in a very advantageous position financially right now. Even if you have to play your young players, you’re still paying them on rookie rookie scale extension prices. think if the Pistons do anything, I think unless you’re getting one of the MVP candidates, okay, you know, um I don’t think you’re going to be able to pull Jaylen Duran or Assar Thompson out of there, okay? Um and so you got to plan on paying them. So, um uh Jaylen Duran will be a restricted free agent next summer. Um he and the Pistons had discussions uh this last fall. Um the word going around the NBA is that uh Duran wanted something per year that started with a three. The Pistons weren’t willing to go that high and in fact none of the guys who got extensions this fall uh by times who got the most money it was um Keegan Murray was like 27 28 and I I would say universally around the league that that was seen as an ass that didn’t really make a lot of sense. If I’m advising Jay Durham, I would say uh stick with that price, buddy. Coming down based on what he’s done. Well, he’s come out and played great, which is a great problem for the Pistons staff. Okay, so we’ll see. Well, he has to finish it off and all this stuff, but you know, that’s not going to be cheap. Uh Kate Cunningham hit supermax or hit the Rose provision, whatever you want to call it. His contract is now starting next year is over 50 million going forward a year. Congratulations to him. He has earned it. Um, and then you got a Sar Thompson who has one year left after this year and then you’re gonna have to pay him. Now I don’t know what that price will be but it’s not going to be 11 million a year which is what he’s at. So right when you’re like now look if you’re the Pistons and you think you can win the championship this year or you could have a shot at this year. Bonts what’s the Daryl my sort of 5% rule. Yeah. If they think they’re 5% how would he know? Well, we like I like the concept even if it’s you know I’m just joking. It was just it was just out there. I’m sorry. I’m sorry. Anyway, I’m just saying this like the 95 that bit him a lot. Yeah. Well, the 95 is 95. While everyone’s trying to put a player on the Pistons roster, keep in mind, you know, whether that guy makes 50 million or in the case of Anthony Davis makes 60 million in, you know, in a year or two, just keep in mind the Pistons got to got to make sure they take care of the guys that they put them together to do this. Now, I don’t think this he’s never claimed this, but the Messiah Yuiri rule that I know that I’ve talked to Messiah about, you know, the lesson that he learned as he tried to build contenders is if you’re going to win it, you got to absolutely do everything you can to maximize the talent. So, you know, the Messiah rule is you go get that player. Then you got the Sam Prey rule, which is I don’t need to necessarily get that player just because you say that I need another player might think my team might be good enough. And Sam Prey didn’t go out and do that. Although they went on Gu Isaiah Hartenstein. I was going to say they went and got Alice Caruso and Isaiah Hartenstein and then they won. They didn’t get a superstar, but they got guys that fit the exact Well, what you’re talking about is super Well, and this is what I’m saying. You’re talking, you know, not you specifically, but you’re talking about Anthony Davis Larry Mark and those are allstar level players. Well, and Vinnie, I you’re as and listen, you’re a resident Detroit guy. Um I and looking at the Pistons, the thing that I Vinnie’s, trust me, Vinnie’s always going to be a resident Detroit guy. You will say that. Um the thing that I think Detroit needs more than even necessarily one of these bigs is like you hinted at it before, but it’s just a flatout second scoring option next to Cade. like and I I would almost say like ironically I know he’s hurt right now but I think the guy on the Mavs that if he became available I think would be a way better fit for the Pistons would be to get Kyrie Irving and put him next to Kate Cunningham. I’m not saying Kyrie’s getting traded, but like well to me I think that if they like this it’s sort of the discussion we had all last year with Oklahoma City where the question was was Jaylen Williams who had a rough playoff series against Dallas two years ago going to be able to step up when it was required in the playoffs. Now, he obviously was awesome in the playoffs, had the 40 piece in the finals, helped them win the title, but like if you typically look at these teams, you need to have two perimeter scorers. They’ve obviously got Cade. Jaylen Dur has been a 20point a game guy in the paint, but he’s doing that on sort of, you know, workmanlike stuff. You’re not going to have him as a real second option, I don’t think, in the playoffs. So like whatever they end up doing if they do make a swing in the trade market, I think that’s the the weakness that I think they have to address is to get a guy to go with Cade so it’s not on all on Cade to try to do it in the playoffs against big- time opponents. Well, and Vinnie, where are they on Ivy? Like, you know, are they holding out hope that Jay Nivy can prove himself in that role now that he’s back? That’s the thing, Tim, is that Jay Navy is still their guy. Like, they didn’t Traca did the smartest thing that I think any GM could have come in and done after a team won just 14 games. He didn’t look at these guys and say, “Hey, you’re a bunch of losers. I’m going to trade you off because the Guju is bad.” He just surrounded them with veterans and said, “Hey, let’s just see.” Remember, these aren’t like like like great star level veterans. It’s stable. Tobias Harris, Tim Hardaway Jr., Malik Beasley, and then the young guys got to grow on their own. So, there’s nothing Beasley. Yes. Well, yes. And Beasley. And Beasley there. But there’s nothing that leads me to think that they’re not going to give Jaden Ivy, who shot 43% last year on catch and shoot threes on small volume, to see if he’s the guy that can create his own shot. Like to me it’s less about it’s less about what you can do with Kade. It’s more about what you can do without Kade. To be less Kade dependent. I mean to have a guy who doesn’t have to eat off of Kade Cunningham. Like a name that intrigues me and I haven’t talked about this with the Pistons, but I know that this guy is starting to get out there a little bit. Like we’re looking at these big names, Kyrie or Anthony Davis or Larry Markin. What a guy guy like Kobe White in Chicago on an affordable contract and we and Chicago is starting to sniff around just a little bit and it’s hard to make a trade in the division. It’s hard to make a trade up I94. It’s hard to make a trade with two hated rivals like that. At least they used to be. But I think it’s those sort of moves around the fringes that be awesome for the Pistons. Not to interrupt, but that he’d be great. And here’s the other thing for me and I’m a big his history guy. Modern NBA history. So, I mean, 40 years, there has never or there’s been one team in the history that I can think of that went from not winning a single playoff series to winning the championship or at least getting to the finals the very next year, and that was the 0708 Celtics who went from being historically bad to getting Ray Allen and Kevin Garnett on draft night. Even Oklahoma City last year, they had the experience of winning next year. So, I don’t think there’s any rush on these guys saying we got to get to the finals now. I don’t think they’re afraid of Boston with Jason Tatum down the line. I think they’re trying to build a sustainable model of something that if we can contend right now, cool. But let’s just see how this thing simmers in the meantime. Well, and and when you mention the Thunder and I think there is a comparison here in the sense of went through a rebuild, bunch of homegrown talent that is is blossoming. Do you speed things up with a superstar? How much do you factor in the future payroll? and and part of Prey’s calculus there was like, hey, let’s see what we’ve got. Let’s see if we’ve got the the star core already in place. Let’s give these guys a chance. And obviously, they they proved that they did. I think you can also look at at the Rockets and the one thing the Rockets did not want to do was take a big swing at a star that would shorten their runway. you know, they weren’t going to give up what they considered to be their star, potential star foundation. Look, as much lip services they gave us, clearly Jaylen Green wasn’t part of that. They managed to kind of have make a have your cake and eat it too move with KD where they got that proven star, proven veteran star, and they got him to take a little bit less on an extension. They got to do it without giving up anything that they felt was going to shorten their runway as a contender. So, you know, the the Hersel Walker deal is up. Like, do I mean I hope people understand what I’m trying to say when I say like no or Rudy Goar. How about that? The Hershel Walker deal. People around here understand the Hersel Walker trade. I got it. I got you. People under 40. People under 40 do not though. So I do think you should explain it. That’s why I said Rudy Gobear like the days of giving or Mikuel Bridges, right? The days of giving all your players and all your picks for one guy in today’s salary cap climate, second apron, you know, climate. You got to be able to maintain your picks and you got to be able to hit on your picks, especially if you’re not like the Lakers or the or not even the Knicks. The Lakers are the only team that can afford to not hit on their picks and wind up having Luca Donis fall into their lap or have LeBron James fall into their lap. Everybody else has to be smart and strategic about this. So there you’re not even if you trade for Lowry Markin, you ain’t getting you Danny Ain’t getting no five picks and four players and all that. Nallcept that ain’t happening. No, I would agree with you. No, especially we’re at the era where the pace is faster and the injuries are up. Everybody’s needs depth right now. The teams that are doing really well are teams that have depth. All right, Vince, thank you so much for coming and joining us on Friendsgiving. Um, Wendy, I wish you respectful luck on Saturday afternoon. You You beat me to it. I don’t wish you guys any luck at all. I just hope that our friendship can stand the test of whatever’s going to happen on Saturday. So, Vince is a Michigan guy. I am an Ohio State fan and it’s been a rough decade, but we persevere. My whole childhood was John Cooper, Vince. I mean, I can take it. I can take it. Hello, Heisman. Ryan’s always happy when he’s grumpy anyway, so a Wasu loss is always something he can revel in, even though he is mad about it. So it’ll

FIRST TAKE | “Cade Cunningham is on a roll” – Brian Windhorst believes Pistons can make NBA Finals