Pirates Podcast To Be Named Later – Ep. 2: Trade Keller?

Pirates Podcast To Be Named Later – Ep. 2: Trade Keller?

Hey guys, welcome to the Pirates podcast to be named later here on DK Pittsburgh Sports. Chris Hock and Jose Negron here to talk Pirates baseball with you. Uh here again like episode two rebooted version of the podcast. Jose, we got a lot of things to talk about when it comes to the Pirates. Uh winter meetings are coming up really really soon. There is going to be I I would assume where there continues to be smoke. There’s fire. who knows where the fire is actually coming from, but there seems to be fire uh because there is a lot of smoke around this team and thus uh we have we have to talk about it. And the one thing that I think we really needed to get into today, um, and we can go at length, uh, for the entire episode about this if we need to, just just to see where it goes, is do the Pirates trade Mitch Keller to recoup 17 million in payroll and apply that or allocate that to the offense because we know if this team is going to possibly do anything, It’s going to they have to be better offensively. They have to be able to hit. Yeah, I think that’s probably the biggest question mark surrounding this off seasonason is, you know, whether they do approach uh trading Mitch Keller or not. Um, and I kind of can see both sides of it. You know, I can see the the the side of, okay, do we want to trade a guy who, you know, you have what you have in in Paul SK. Obviously, he’s a he’s a Sai Young winner for for a reason, but do you want to and I think you brought this up, you know, uh last week as well. Do you want to take away from the depth? Do you want to take away a guy who is going to provide 180 plus innings, 30 plus starts per year? Um when behind Paul Ske and Mitch Keller, there’s, you know, not a lot of question marks, but there’s some unproven guys. There are guys that have smaller samples with, you know, Braxton Ashcraft, Bubba Chandler, Mike Burroughs, you know, Johan Ovum even has some question marks with, you know, the injuries in the past and things like that. So, uh, I I get that side of it. I’m still kind of on the side of I think it’s, uh, the right thing to do to trade a guy like Mitch Keller if you’re going to get the right asset in return. if you’re going to get a bat that is going to actually improve this lineup um in addition to being able to use like you said the allocated uh money from what you’re saving uh you know from from him getting traded to use toward another bat then I think it’s it’s a wise decision something that you should consider but you don’t just trade Mitch Keller to trade him you need to trade him for something that’s going to change the complexion of this lineup because he’s one you’re probably your most valuable asset in terms of what you could uh trade for another hitter. So, it has to be done for the right price. Yeah. And and even if the hitter that they would get in a in a trade isn’t like if it’s not a direct like I’m trading Mitch Keller for this hitter in particular. If you at least clear that salary and then use that freed up salary to then go get you know one of the big bats or a big bat in free agency then that that is a way to look at it too. The one thing I did, and I just pulled it up here on baseball reference, over the past four seasons, Mitch Keller has logged 159 innings, 194 and a third innings, 178 innings, and 176 in the third innings. That’s a lot of innings. I mean, that’s a lot. Now, old school baseball people will be like, “Oh, if you didn’t get to go to to 200, it’s not a lot of innings.” In today’s game, it is. Yeah. today. In today’s game, you you get over uh 170 innings out of a starting pitcher. U you you got you got length, you got uh a guy who was proven that he can take the ball every fifth day and give you a chance to win with the I’m just saying like with with the rotation that the Pirates are about to have, which is very exciting. You have Paul SK, the NLI Young winner, best pitcher in baseball. You have Braxton Ashcraft and Bubba Chandler. Two very exciting young arms who can possibly be legitimate arms in this rotation. Uh Jared Jones might be coming back and while we both kind of agree that he probably fits that closer role a little bit better, there’s no telling on what the Pirates are going to do with him. So, we’ll just call him a starter for right now, right? Mike Burroughs is going to be there. The names that I’m listing right here, while some of them are very exciting, they’re all really young and or they’re coming off of a major injury. You’re not going to get a lot of innings out of these guys. You have to have the ability to have at least two guys, and Paul Skins is one of them, but have another guy who can give you five or six innings every single time they go out, or your bullpen is just going to be absolutely torn up the entire season. Yeah. And and I think that’s why, you know, if if you if they do go this route and they say, “Okay, this is this is worth it.” You know, we have enough belief in, you know, these other arms that they can kind of fill that void. It has to be a sure thing. Like you can’t like this can’t be a deal where you’re tra and I think during the off season it it it’s different than if they would have traded him at the trade deadline, right? Like if you’re trading a guy at the trade deadline, it’s it it’s it’s more buyers versus sellers. So if you’re trading a guy like Mitch Keller, you’re probably looking to get a prospect package or packages similar to what the pirates got for guys like David Bednar and uh you know, Caleb Ferguson, Key Brian Hayes. Like that’s those are the types of deals that you get with buyers versus sellers at the deadline. If you do it now, there’s more of a chance that you’re trading from an area of depth and an area of a strength to to improve in an area that it’s weaker. So, you know, if you make a deal with the Orioles or the Red Sox or teams that need pitching, um the Red Sox might be a little less in that category now after getting Sunny Gray, but I think they could probably still use a guy like Mitch Keller. Yeah. If you trade with these guys, you can do you can go about this in a way that’s going to benefit both sides. Um, so again, you know, you don’t need to trade Mitch Keller. If you want Mitch Keller to be a pirate in 2026, he will be a pirate in 2026. But if it makes sense and it’s going to um if if the positives are going to outweigh the negatives, then okay, you consider a little bit more. I I I do I I do see I see both sides of it. I think that’s why we have the conversation because you know at least you would think the conversations are happening internally as well that as they’re preparing for the winter meetings and as they’re preparing for clubs to approach them about Mitch Keller because say what you want about him there is always value for a guy who can do the things that Mitch Keller does. Yeah. And when you look at what the Pirates have been able to do in terms of getting these cheaper veteran types that can come in and give you innings, and again, I’m going to go season by season here. 2022 season, they brought in Jose Canana. Until they traded him at the deadline, he gave 103 innings over 20 starts and was a had a 1.9 BR. That’s insanely valuable for what they got. I don’t remember what the contract was for that season, but it was a very very valuable uh uh acquisition there. Uh 23, I want to say, was it Martin Perez that they got in 23 or was that 24? Perez was 24. Perez and Marco Gonzalez are with 24. Okay. So, and then yes, 24 was was Martine Perez and and like you said, Marco Gonzalez, but Martine Perez, while the the performance wasn’t quite as good as Canana, obviously, uh 83 innings, 16 starts, a 520 erra wasn’t as great. But then last year with Andrew Heeney, like they typically find these guys that can give you innings, but none of these guys maybe outside of Canana pitched at at a at a level that Mi Mitch Keller does pretty much every year. And so when you look at the Pirates strength right now, the rotation’s obviously it. You got skins, you’ve got Keller, and then you’ve got some exciting arms to get excited about that can really contribute. And you’ve got multiple, you got more than three options, which is what you always want to have going into a season. You’re going to have to essentially, if you can go into a season with nine guys, eight or nine guys who can start in the majors right away, you’ve got a deep you you’ve got a good starting point for having depth at the starting uh starting uh pitcher spot. And so I think even like you said to your point, if you go and you trade Mitch Keller and it would have to have just as much of an impact, if not a larger impact on the lineup, which I would probably say if you trade Mitch Keller, you better use that 17 million to get yourself two really, really good bats. that 17 million can go toward a total of 30 to 35 million to get two really good hitters. You’ve got to have an impact. I mean, think about it like percentage-wise. How much of how much is one pitcher in a rotation? Well, it’s 20%. What could be the closest thing to 20% of your lineup? Probably two hitters. You’ve got to make sure that you have just as much of an impact on the offensive side as you do as you would would have if Keller was in your rotation because I think he’s that valuable. Yeah. And I I think to to your point of, you know, using those allocated funds to to do more, you know, I think last year the the one of the good things about the Spencer Horowitz trade was the fact that okay, they don’t have to go out and sign a first baseman. They don’t have to go in in the the free agent route. They can get a guy who’s under cont or who’s um under team control for a few years and they can allocate their funds in different areas. is and I remember asking Ben Cherington about that during the winter meetings last year and you know he even said you know yeah we want to you know do different things with um you know the the resources that we we have left and it just enough wasn’t done like they didn’t do enough in order to make that Spencer Horowitz trade even better by going out and signing other bats around him you know like we we’ve said it time and time again like you know if they would have done more than that they could have probably been have been in a much better position ition this past season because again this offense didn’t need to be much better in order to potentially be a playoff team. So, um you know, and I understand, you know, uh I I see, you know, Denny’s comments about, you know, uh guys spending time on on the injured list and I I completely get that. That’s another factor in this is because you got guys like Braxton Ashcraft and Mike Burroughs, Johan Ovo, Jared Jones coming back who, you know, have some injury concerns and and there the the one thing I’ll give the Pirates credit for that they’ve done well over these last couple years is the way that they’ve handled their pitchers and handled their young pitchers. And I I know that’s a a topic of, you know, criticism for a lot of people. I think they’ve done a good job of that and and kind of just looking after guys like Ashcraft and Burroughs who’ve who’ve had those arm uh injury issues and you know so it’s it’s a big risk. It’s a big risk if you’re going to trade a guy like Mitch Keller, but if you don’t, um, obviously makes your pitching staff a lot stronger. Um, and you’re not, you know, kind of going away from that. And, and there are other, I’m sure, other young pitchers that maybe they could consider trading. But if you don’t do any of that and you don’t get away from it, like they have to spend. They have to do what they apparently keep saying that they’re going to do. They have to be aggressive. They have to do the things that they need to in order to get three bats into this lineup that are going to make a significant difference. At DK Pittsburgh Sports, we take pride in coverage that connects our city’s fans to their favorite teams. Now that connection’s stronger than ever. Introducing our all-new state-of-the-art app. Find expert inside reporting and original podcasts. Check live box scores, track the latest stats, chat it up with our community of thousands of fans, all in one place. The new app from DK Pittsburgh Sports. Coverage that connects. I think you’re muted, Chris. Whoopsie. The beauty of doing a live show. Welcome back to the Pirates Podcast. My name later. Uh good stuff as as always. Again, that’s the beauty of doing live live shows. You’re there’s always going to be something. It’s fun, man. I didn’t want to I didn’t want to say it. Oh, no. Say it. Say it. I’m I’m I’m playing producer here, too. So, I’m I probably knocked the mute button. Didn’t even mean to. So, it happens. Um yeah. So, let’s get into uh Travis Williams talking a little bit. I’ve got some of the stuff that he said. Um he was there was a recent thing where all three teams in town uh were uh doing a an event around Thanksgiving giving away turkeys and stuff and uh Travis Williams the uh president uh business operations. Correct. Correct. Yeah. Uh Travis Williams was speaking there and uh he said quote, “Our expectations are that we win and we make the playoffs. In order to do that, we have to we we knew we had to be aggressive in the offseason. We’re committed to that. So, that requires you to be really active in the free agent market and the trade market and that that activity is happening now. He also said uh the three words that fans have been saying quite a bit. Talk is cheap. So, let’s see because what winter meetings start a week from today, correct? In Orlando. Yep. So activity is going to be picking up here whether it be actual transactions that take place because you know so far the baseball offseason has been pretty pretty you know there have only been a couple of uh a couple of moves that have been whoa whoa that kind of happened but everything else has been your your typical run-of-the-mill okay we’re going to protect these guys for the rule five draft uh we’re going to you know obviously the non-tender deadline has come and gone typical things like that that all 30 clubs are doing we haven’t seen a lot of you big free agent signings or big we’ve had the one big trade between the Rangers and Mets. The activity will be picking up. I would expect given the smoke around the Pirates that the Pirates will continue to be talked about and be brought up. anything that you’re hearing a week out from the winter meetings and it could be absolutely nothing but anything that you’re hearing anything you’re anticipating going into Orlando because the Pirates whether what what they’re setting their payroll at regardless they do have money to spend based off of the moves that they made of offloading Bednar and Krian Hayes and all these guys they do have money to spend right now. Do you anticipate anything really really happening over the next week or so? Yeah, I think I think if it if it does happen and and they’re really for real about all of this and again, you know, they keep saying talk is cheap. They keep saying, you know, there needs to be action. They need to execute um and have that execution. I think it starts at the winter meetings. I mean, last year some minor deals, nothing really crazy. You had obviously the the Spencer Horowitz trade. Um but I think it’s all going to start next week. Um, not saying that, you know, for sure there’s going to be a monumental signing or, you know, crazy trade next week. You know, we’ll we’ll see what happens there. But, you know, they keep saying these things and you keep seeing, you know, all these reports and it’s kind of like, okay, well, they keep talking about it, but again, believe it when you see it. You know, it’s it’s one thing to talk about it and and say that we’re trying. Um, trying isn’t going to get three bats into in in Pirates uniforms next year. Um, and and trying is not going to uh improve this lineup and make it go from being one of the worst in Major League Baseball to uh, you know, good enough. So, um, yeah, it’s going to be very interesting next week. Uh, my second winter meetings. Last year was a very interesting experience. Um, going uh to to Dallas last year for for the winter meetings. This year it’s in Orlando. So, um, yeah, I mean, that’s where it’s all going to have to start. We’re going to see even throughout Major League Baseball, you know, that’s where I believe I I I think that’s when Juan Sto signed with the Mets last year. Oh, there have definitely been huge signings that have happened at the Winter Meetings. Yeah. Yeah. that’s when all the crazy stuff kind of kind of happens and really when I everything kind of kicks into full gear and and even if you know things don’t get done or a whole bunch of stuff doesn’t get done at the winter meetings that usually is uh a good point for the foundation to be laid for contract signings but specifically trades. um all the GMs are in there in the same place. Uh conversations happen uh more naturally because of that. Um you begin to lay the uh like I said the foundation, the framework for certain trades. um that that’s you know and then you’ll see you know you will see from the time the winter meetings come to an end until usually around Christmas time you’ll see a few more moves really be made like significant moves be made and sometimes those can be trades sometimes those can leak into you know beyond the new year but usually especially for the teams that are going to be the most active they’re going to get their stuff done that just because like when you get on the other side of the when when the calendar turns over into the next year, then you start have to worry about players who are arbitration eligible. You’ve got to, you know, get, you know, that there’s that deadline you have to get sorted out. You would like to get all those guys signed before that deadline. If not, you are going to be going to arbitration or at least you’re scheduled to go to arbitration. So, that’s got to get taken care of. And for a club like the Pirates, I mean, I covered a club in the Rangers that I don’t know if they have or not since I, but while I was on the beat through 2022, they just didn’t go to arbitration with any players. Like, it just did not happen. The the whole storyline every time that deadline was coming up was they haven’t gone to arbitration with a player since Lee Stevens in 1999. like that was always the but then you have clubs like the Pirates who are definitely not afraid to go to arbitration and that will affect what your payroll is and so you’d like to be able to get as much of your shopping done at the winter meetings or shortly thereafter so that you have a better idea of where your payroll is going to be at when you do get to those deadlines. Okay, we didn’t get contracts done with this player, this player, this player. Now we have to expect a good arbitration. We can still negotiate. we can still get it done and avoid arbitration. But yeah, um and it was a good thing, you know, they they did avoid arbitration with all their eligible guys. Um they I think it was what Holderman, Moretta, um were the two kind of big ones that were DFAD, but um yeah, I mean they know they know they have Dennis Santana for for this season. They know they have Justin Lawrence. They have some bullpen pieces. So they they they have that idea of like, all right, well, we we have a little bit of a, you know, we figure this out of, okay, we have two key relievers. Isaac Matson’s going to be a backend, you know, guy for us as well going into the next season. So, you kind of have an idea of what you’re going to be looking for at the winter meetings. Um, the conversations you want to have and, um, you know, see what can happen. I I think they they have to set the tone here. you know, do something here that’ll kind of set the tone for the rest of the offseason instead of, you know, doing those those kind of simple moves and then, you know, you kind of wait till the last minute to sign, you know, the guys that are going to be filling these voids in your lineup and in your rotation. Well, so and just to kind of give people uh some clarity on what kind of money the Pirates will have to spend uh uh you know DK on on his uh not just you know talked about on his daily shot of Pirates this morning, but has reported uh a couple of different times on our app uh our DK Pittsburgh Sports app that the Pirates can spend up to $110 million this year on payroll. Then further digging, further reporting, DK reported that they’re going to operate at between like 95 to like 98.99 kind of flirting with that $100 million mark. But if a certain bat were to play out for them, whether it be a free agent, a trade, whatever it is, with certain approval, you could then push payroll up to 110 mill 110 million. And so if now we can sit here and we could talk about what Ben Cherington would do. We can try to predict what Ben Cherington would do, what he would prefer to do. What I would rather do is say if I’m Ben Cherington, if I’m the GM, I would get the really big bat done first, even if that kind of puts you up against that initial operating number right away. And the reason why I say that is, well, right now the Pirates are sitting at about 6162 million in uh projected payroll when you consider all of the guaranteed contracts that are on the books. When I say all of them, I mean like the couple of guaranteed contracts are on the book. I think it’s like four now. When you consider the arbitration guys, when you consider the pre-arb guys that end up signing, they’re at about 6162 million right now. If you were to sign a Kyle Schwarber to $30 million a year, you’re just you’re now you’re getting into the low 90s. Now you’re like, “Okay, I’m already flirting with this and I just spent it on one bat.” And by the way, I really, really, really don’t want to trade Mitch Keller. I really would prefer to not trade Mitch Keller because I’d prefer to keep him in my rotation. And I also might think, as DK also reported, that Paul Ske might not be very happy if we traded Mitch Keller because that’s there’s that to consider, too. So, I still need two more bats and I’m really really going to need your approval to get up to $110 million. That’s what I would be doing if I’m Ben Sherington. Yeah. But that gives you the idea of, okay, if they’re sitting in the low 60s right now, 61 62 million, and they’re only going to operate up to about 98 99 million, well, there’s your math. There’s your 30 to $40 million that’s been talked about uh for for for weeks now when it comes to what the Pirates are going to spend. So, I I think they should like I I think we’re in agreeance. Three bets. Do you think so? Three. Yeah. Mhm. Okay. That’s hard to do. That’s hard to do if you’re looking to get impactful bats with the It sounds like a lot of money, but it’s really not. Yeah. I I look at it as, you know, you you need to fill that void in left field, fill the void at third base, and then either you get a right fielder to kind of push Brian Reynolds over to DH, or you get a DH. you know, I mean, if the if a Kyle Schwarber deal would somehow happen, and I’m still very hesitant that it’s happening. Me, too. Me, too. Um, and by very hesitant, I’m like 100% hesitant that it’s it’s going it’s not going to happen. Um, so, but but you know, imagine the the message it sends to the fan base if you are still shopping in those higher tier of free agents. Yeah. If you don’t get a Kyle Schwarber, if you were to go and get a Cody Bellinger or a um trying to think of, you know, just some of those Yanio Suarez or Yeah. Like Suarez in like the middle tier, you know, kind of upper tier like one of those guys like that that sends the message and if if you do like you said and you you make that deal first, you start out setting the tone there. Imagine the message that sends to the fan base of, “Okay, we got a bat that’s going to make our lineup better. We’re going to make some other moves that aren’t going to be as major, but you’re doing what you say you need to do. You know, you’re being aggressive. You’re going out there and you’re getting guys that will actually improve your lineup, and you’re doing it without having to trade Mitch Keller.” I think I think everybody can agree that’s the the best way to do it is spend without having to give up uh, you know, assets. Um, with me thinking, you know, trade Mitch Keller, it’s more because, okay, if you’re not going to spend the money, then that’s the best way to the best avenue to go about it. Get a controllable bat um for a guy like Keller. But if you could do it the other way, then yeah, that’s that’s great, you know, but um yeah, I agree with you in terms of like make that deal first, you know, make the splash and then kind of fill in the pieces, you know, fill in those voids over at third or left. I think it’s force ownership’s hand. I mean because listen if if if if ownership is setting these parameters on Ben Harrington like like seriously like saying like listen this is what we would prefer to operate at but we would allow you to get up to this month to this number. It’s kind of like the soft cap in the NBA. You’re really only allowed to spend up to this to this number but if you wanted to pay a little extra we would allow you but even then that’s going to have a threshold. So if I’m Ben Cherington, I’m going to challenge ownership on that. I’m going to make ownership like listen, if ownership is laying out all these parameters, that is those are signs that they don’t trust you. Like seriously, like those are signs they don’t trust you. And so if I feel like my job is in jeopardy, I’m going to do everything that it takes to do what I can to keep my job. Yep. And that requires putting a better product on the field. That requires getting better hitters. And that requires because the hitting development’s not happening. So you might have to dip your toe or maybe several toes into the free agency pool to get hitters that even you can’t screw up. Yeah. You know, and the for unfortunately for the Pirates, those guys cost a lot of money. And so yeah, I I think you kind of have to force ownership’s hand at that point. Uh the one thing I wanted to get to before we before we hopped off here was, you know, similar names are being thrown around. You know, Kyle Schwarber was thrown around in a New York Post uh report along with uh Jeff McNeel, who the Mets were trying to trade, Nick Castanos, who the Phillies were trying to trade, and JT Riomuto. Um I’m a little bit intrigued on the Cardinals wanting to part with uh certain uh pieces as they seem to be heading for a rebuild. Um, Brendan Donovan, Lars Nupar, Nolan Gorman, and Alec Berles are potentially available. Now, Newbar and Gorman are for sure, but Donovan and Berles are like, that needs to be quite a bit of a of a it’s got to be a I mean, the specifically Berles, the report in the New York Times was they won’t move Berles unless they’re quote blown away by an offer unquote, right? Are you could something like that happen when you’re looking at a trade within the division? Because I think that’s the big bugaboo when it comes to would the Cardinals even be willing to give away, you know, a newbar or a Gorman to a division rival? Yeah, I mean that’s kind of the big part about it is like it depends on what the the ask and return is, you know? I mean, I I wouldn’t want to trade a guy like Mitch Keller for any of those guys in particular. Um, you know, so like if you’re going to trade young pitching, you know, I don’t know. It’s tough because then like, oh man, I got to face Braxen Ashcraft all season or face or or for the next several years. Yeah. Or that’s the other part of it. A guy who’s going to be like, you know, especially with them trading Sunny Gray, like they’re going to be looking for some young pitching. And the Pirates, I think, have what they would want. You know, even if you’re going to make a like, like you said, Berles and Donovan are going to be a little bit more. You’re going to have a pretty hefty package that’s going to have to go back in return. But, you know, a Nolan Gorman might not be as expensive. I know he’s coming off, you know, some tough years. Um, you know, he was kind of expected to be, I think, way better than he has been, um, as a former top prospect. So, you know, maybe you can make something like that happen with uh, you know, a prospect hall or, you know, throw in a major league pitcher in there and get a guy like Gorman who could be your starting third baseman. I mean, he’s a guy who has solid power. Um, you know, hit 27 home runs in 2023. Um, but his power numbers have gone down 194 the last two seasons. He strikes out at a pretty decent rate as well and he’s only a 218 career hitter in 426 career games. So, does he does he really change things for you? Um, I mean, I think he can be a an asset to the lineup, but it depends on what you put around him. Again, you know, like Nolan Gorman can’t be your biggest asset of the offseason. Like, if you go out if you go out and get one of those top tier free agents like you mentioned and then add a Nolan Gorman to the mix and and have him be one of those three bats. Okay. A little intriguing maybe. I I’m gonna I’m gonna go about it this way. Who would you rather have in the Pirates lineup? Nolan Gorman. And you have to consider that’s not just in a vacuum like the player. You have to consider the means by which you’d have to acquire them, right? Trade whatever you would need to get to the Cardinals for Nolan Nolan Gorman or sign now free agent Adole Garcia. Oh, both are coming off seasons. Gorman had a 666 OPS and Garcia had a 665 OPS. Yeah. So, their hitting production was pretty similar. Gorman had 14 home runs. Garcia had 19. Gorman batted 205. Garcia batted 227. Um, Gorman got on base, his on base was 296. Garcia’s was 271. Here’s the big difference between the two. Gorman’s uh be war was 0.1. Garcia’s was 2.7. Mhm. So, I would rather have Garcia because number one, all I have to do to get him is to give him some money. Yeah. That’s all you have to do. Second, even if he doesn’t hit again, this cannot be your big acquisition. This cannot be we’re showing up at Pirate Fest and the big acquisition of the offseason was Adulus Garcia who Yes. a couple of years ago was an ALC a a alcs MVP. He was an absolute monster terrorizing the Astros in that series. He went into the World Series, hit a walk-off homer in game one. The only reason why he didn’t possibly also go on to win World Series MVPs cuz he got hurt. He was a postseason hero in Texas, but he’s fallen off over the past couple seasons. And he got and he got well I think he got non-tendered because he’s heading into the final year of of arbitration. Okay. And he was due like $12 million and given the given the production you’re not giving him $12 million. Yeah. So you’re going to then non-tender him. And there’s there’s still a possibility. I don’t even want to rule it out. I haven’t talked to anybody. I haven’t talked to anybody on the Ranger side things in a long time. But I wouldn’t rule out the Rangers resigning him to a cheaper contract. I mean, they listen, that’s a guy who was a castoff from, ironically enough, the Cardinals, and the Rangers literally bought him. They acquired him uh for cash considerations. They bought him from the Cardinals and turned him into a postseason hero. So, yeah, they could keep him. But if I’m the Pirates and I could say, “Hey, listen. I’ll offer you I don’t know what the pro projected contract would be, but I’ll offer you, you know, five million bucks to come be our starting right fielder every day. You know, near three- win player last year. I mean, yeah, he’s not hitting the way he used to, but maybe a change of ser will do some things. Maybe that’ll be enough for him to be like, it’s a one-year deal. I can go prove it and then I can go back into free agency and I can sign a much larger contract, you know? I don’t know. Sometimes sometimes those I mean I wouldn’t consider him a lottery ticket because he’s had success at the big league level and it’s not as you know far off but but age is a factor. He’s in he’s now like beyond 32 years old. Yeah. Um he’s there’s mileage on that. He still has a cannon for an arm from the outfield. He can still throw the guys throw guys out. And I think that’s why right field would be probably ideal because he number one he’s won a gold glove in right field. But also, you think about the shorter right field at PNC Park, the ability for him to throw runners out at third and home. It’s going to be there. So, uh, yeah, I I I that’s what that would be one of the bats I would consider going after. And I think I’d rather do that than make a trade with the Cardinals to get a player that might not pan out to be nearly as good. Yeah, I’ I’d rather not have to deal with the Cardinals if I’m tired because I I don’t want to have to give them something that might uh You don’t want to You don’t You don’t want to give them the same thing that like the Pirates gave the Cubs when they traded Ramas Ramirez. Yeah. You don’t want another Ramos Ramirez situation to be happening. That is the danger of trading within the division. You don’t want to ever give them that younger player that can turn into somebody that just terrorizes you for the next however many years. What year was that? 2003. Yeah, I think so. It might have been earlier than that. 9-year-old Jose was devastated. Ramis Ramirez was traded uh in Yeah. in 2003. Uh he was and now he had already played for the Pirates for a few a few seasons. So it’s not like he he was this young guy who still had to prove himself. No, he was already an established player in 2001. He batted 300. He had 34 home runs, had 112 RBI’s. This was still a tail end of the steroid era. So I’m not making any claims or anything, but I’m just saying numbers back then. Everybody was doing that pretty much. every well everybody was also putting I mean again when you look at the numbers Brian Giles put up back then you like you’re like oh my god like they those are some stupid numbers man like you had to think that that dude was that dude was juicing yeah and and I think you know you look back look at the Cardinals and you know I just I I wouldn’t give up significant assets for guys like Donovan or Burgles and yeah I mean even you know a guy like Nolan Gorman’s you know, if you if you can if you could get a guy like Adulles Garcia, I think that would be a much more uh just logical thing to do like in terms of, you know, just adding to your your lineup and adding to your roster. It just you’re not giving up anything. You’re going to have to, you know, if you if you could sign him to a $5 million deal, like absolutely like Oh, yeah. He might cost more than that. I I’m I’m But but but even if that is it, like you just gave 5 million to Tommy Fam, like you know, why not give it to to Doles Garcia and see what he can do? Well, let’s see. What was Tommy What was Tommy Fam’s number numbers the season before he played for the Pirates? Um, see, 2024, now he played for three different teams. Um, 674 OPS. So, similar numbers to what Garcia put up. Uh, and then the in 23. Oh, no, sorry. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then in 23, uh, Fam was, uh, a little bit better. He had a 774 OPS. I mean, you can go back to Garcia’s 23 season. And again, it just, it gets really stupid. Uh, he was a, it wasn’t just regular season with him. Like, his regular season numbers were were good. He had an 836 OPS. He was an all-star. He won a gold glove. like he had 39 home runs that year. He had 107 RBI. He was a four and a half win player, but then he goes on to the postseason and like like I said, like absolutely owns the Astros. But past two seasons, he’s not been that player. He’s had a 684 OPS and 665 OPS. Um his defensive metrics haven’t been as good as they were. I mean, shooting 24 his BR was only.3. like he just he wasn’t as impactful of a player and that was he was he was a.3B war and he hit 25 homers like that means you like did not walk he had he had 45 walks he had 45 walks in 154 games that’s not a lot um yeah and he walked even less last year he’s a guy though that he can hit the ball the ballpark and he’s a good clubhouse guy he’s a good clubhouse guy too that I that I can attest to. You look at what the Pirates are are lacking in its power. It’s it’s it’s that presence in a lineup where you look at a guy like you know if you had a guy like like I don’t want to just say Garcia, but if you look at a a guy that was in that upper tier of free agents like you know a Shore or a Cody Bellinger or something like those are guys that you know have history and they’re proven hitters who instill a little bit of fear in in like you know your fan base like you So, how many times did the Pirates go on the road this year and and you know, you’d see the lineup on the scoreboard. How many times are the opposing fans like actually a Who’s that guy? Yeah. Well, yeah. like, you know, so like I think that that’s something that they need and and if you could get uh you know, he said, if you get one of those top tier guys to to to sign first and you can make those moves around and you can get a guy like Garcia, you could go out and you know, get a guy to play third base, whether that’s Suarez or or whoever whoever it might be, like you look at the lineup a little bit differently and that’s exactly what this team needs is they need this lineup to just there needs to be more proven guys in there cuz there’s just not like it’s just there there’s so much you can’t say good things about what they were able to do offensively this past season like none like I I I can’t really think of any at all like it’s it was so it it was so bad to to watch because you know and and I’m not going to say that they didn’t have some moments they had some moments where you looked it looked like okay there’s some promise here but there was never like a um a feeling of having hope that they would turn the page age and and be good offensively through a prolonged stretch. So, um you need Reynolds and Cruz to be better. Obviously, that goes without saying. They need to Yeah, that’s part of this. Yeah, it’s it’s 100% part of it. It magnifies everything else. Um you know, but yeah, if if you can get some of those guys in here, it it it’ll change things. But but that’s also and this could be because I know we got to wrap it up, but like that could be part of it too because when when you bring in these guys that instill fear in a in the opposition that also protects the guys that you already have that protects O’Neal Cruz that protects Brian Reynolds. I mean, how many times did we see whoever was batting behind O’Neal Cruz and it just be another guy that the pitcher is just going to be like, you know what, I’m totally fine not throwing anything in the strike zone to a to let’s say Garcia. We’ve been talking about him so much. I’m not going to throw anything in the strike zone to O’Neal Cruz because if I throw it in the strike zone, there’s always the chance that he’s going to hit this thing 122 miles an hour and I’ll be, you know, the pitcher that gave up the Statcast record, you know, the new Statcast record. There’s But I can throw every single pitch out of the strike zone. And if I walk him, I walk him. I could get the next guy out. No big deal. And if I get O’Neal to chase enough pitches, then I can strike him out. But I’ve never thrown him a competitive pitch and I don’t have to. That stuff has to stop. You have to start making the opposition pay for dancing around your best hitters. And the best way to do that is to go get these at least one guy who you can put right behind O’Neal Cruz and say, “Listen, we believe in O’Neal Cruz, the hitter. We believe him in him so much that we’re going to put a guy behind him that you don’t want to face. You don’t want to face Kyle Schwarber. You don’t want to face a guy who is going to hit 56 homers and walk a whole bunch, too. So, best take your chances of pitching to O’Neal so you don’t have to pitch to that guy. You know, that’s what you need. That’s what this lineup needs. That’s what O’Neal needs. You really need to find out what you have in O’Neal Cruz and put him in the best situation possible. And I understand like there are going to be people that the whole, you know, idiot Conor rookie says, you know, the Cruz mental errors always felt brutal and Steel City Ryan says Cruz needs to be held accountable for taking plays off. I’m not debating any of that stuff. I remember cover I was covering the one game where the ball goes past him in center. He just stood there and looked at it while one of the other guys chased it down. It’s like you that can’t happen. Yeah. I think it’s also a little easier to get these guys to buy in when they feel that there’s something going on in that clubhouse and they feel like there’s a buyin from not just the players but from above to like we are going to put a product on the field that’s going to compete. If you do that and that dude still has those issues and he’s still not buying in all the way, that’s a entirely different discussion. But as much as you would like to see O’Neal do those things better, it’s not like the the the front office has done the best job of putting him in the best situation either. I I you literally like just took the words out of my mouth was, you know, just the the being in a position to succeed, you know, like that’s that’s as much as he does 100% need to be accountable for the the mental errors, the sometimes you could just say like it’s it’s a lack of dasical approach to the game, whether it’s defensively or at the plate. Um, he needs to be put in a in a position where he can be O’Neal Cruz. like he needs to be in a position where he can you know hit home runs and he can steal bases and it matters like you know he he he’ll go up there and if he looks lacadasical and if he looks like he you know doesn’t care or whatever like I I I the guy cares. I think these guys all do care. It it’s just I agree. Yeah. You know it it probably is frustrating when you’re going up to the plate every single time and probably don’t have anybody on base or you know just different things that are are in these guys’ mind. you know, like they it’s just not a good position for these guys to be themselves and and be the version of themselves that’s going to actually help this team be better. Yeah. All right. Well, that’s going to do it for this episode. We kind of went over uh time uh but we also got a late start, so I wanted to, you know, make sure that we gave you guys plenty of the the Pirates talk today. So, we appreciate you guys tuning in and watching. Uh I I did get some some uh some comments on our app for those watching on our app right now. Uh which you can get for free uh in in any app store uh or like Google Play or or the App Store on iOS. And we have a couple of comments already saying, you know, guys, just name the pod already because the name of the podcast is the Pirates Podcast to be named later. That is that that is the that’s the that’s the joke. Yeah. It’s it’s literally a play on words of a player to be named later. Well, this is a podcast to be named later. Like, we may never know who that player is going to be or what that podcast is going to be. That’s the That’s the joke. Yeah, we’re good. Yeah, we’re good. This is the name. This is That’s actually the other way cuz what I I Yeah. So, I get it. It’s right here. Right. Right. because we see like like right now like I’m looking like this is to my right but for everybody else it’s going the other way which is f it’s just funny how that works great great logo too by the way it’s a great logo it’s a great logo uh thanks to Dolly on that one anyway uh I got to do double shot here over on our Steelers channel uh here in just a little bit Jose’s covering Penguins tonight on our app uh we’re we’re we’re busy guys so we’re going to go we’ll catch you guys later we’ll see you uh next week from Orlando talking uh baseball from the winter meetings. Well, Jose will be there. I’ll still be in Pittsburgh. See you guys.

In this episode of the Pirates Podcast To Be Named Later, Chris Halicke and José Negron of DK Pittsburgh Sports discuss whether or not the Pirates should seriously entertain trading Mitch Keller in an effort to acquire more hitting.

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