Why Mark Williams Is The Suns’ MAKE-OR-BREAK Piece

Why Mark Williams Is The Suns’ MAKE-OR-BREAK Piece

Eric’s been off the show for exactly one day, and that’s all it took for us to do another deep dive. Psychos and sickos, welcome to another edition of the PHNX Suns podcast here in the studio. E K fueled by Circle K. Uh I am Gerald Borgay. This is Steven Bridgen Garner. I promise I was not trying to rhyme as much as I just did in that intro there. Uh I am taking over as the sort of host for the show doing all the ad reads over the next couple of weeks with Eric earning some muchdeserved vacation time. Uh joined as always by my partner in crime here, Steven Pidgeon Garner for I guess the next few weeks are kind of like a a throwback to take that for data day. Stephen, how you doing today? I’m doing great. Joe’s playing combo guard. Um, so that’s always fun. I missed a bunch of point guard talk, which yeah, uh, we’ll get to that soon. But yeah, I’m excited to dive into the details on everything that is Mark Williams. Um, a very intriguing prospect, another player that is only 23 years old, has multiple years of experience. And one of my favorite things about Mark is that I’ve known a little bit about Mark because of his sister. His sister plays for the Chicago Sky. Oh, that’s right. a perennial defensive player of the year candidate at her best and she’s generally still one of the better front court pieces. There’s a lot of overlap between the ways that both of those two play and the dynamics that they put forth on the game. So, always fun to kind of dive into the weeds on that. Yeah. No, absolutely. So, for those of you tuning in, today is going to mostly be a Mark Williams ccentric episode. We’ve got a special guest who’s going to help us out with that and then at the very end of the show, we’ll take a look at the latest on Jonathan Kaminga that we heard from Sham Shirania today. But without further ado, let’s not keep him in the back room any longer. We are bringing in James Plowight who covers the Charlotte Hornets for Culture and for Buzzbeat Pod. James, how you doing today? I’m doing great, guys. Thanks a lot for having me on. Absolutely. We’re very glad to have you. One of the best in the business at covering the Hornets. And uh honestly, while I was researching this Mark Williams piece that I wrote over at gophnx.com today, I actually found your article about Mark Williams and his defensive regression. So, we’re going to get into all that. We’re going to get into the offense, the defense, all of that sort of thing, but uh James, just your initial impressions of the year that Mark Williams had last season. We’ll bring up the stats in a minute, but what stands out to you the most about the year that Mark Williams is coming off of right now? So coming into the year, Mark Wilms is probably one of the most anticipated players on the entire roster. Like there was a lot of positive momentum. Um the feeling that he was going to bounce back from the back injury and the flashes that he’ shown in the first two years were really promising as a defensive enforcer. Had some offensive skill as well. It didn’t turn out that way. Like I I did a complete 180 on his defensive potential from if you’d have asked me this time last year, I’d have been singing his praises. And by the end of the season, you were really wondering about like how is this guy gonna anchor a defense? Now, look, not the best situation in Charlotte with the guys out ahead of him on the perimeter. Um, but but even that, there was like more to it. You could just tell. Um, but there wasn’t moments without progress. Like massively improved as a ball handler, decision maker. Um, rebounded the ball at a high level still. Um, still played like with a high motor. Um, so there wasn’t that progress, but when you’re a center, you need to be able to defend the paint effectively, especially if you’re like a low skill player, and he was unable to do that. And that was a big concern going into year three where it looked like it was regressing, not getting better. James, I’m curious um just to kind of counter uh get into the get into the u the places where he kind of leaves a little bit more to be desired. What’s one of your kind of overarching favorite parts about Mark’s game that you feel like would translate well to a team with a unique guard from everything that LaMelo Ball is, but one that can certainly get the ball to a rim running kind of vertical spacing type of center. Yeah, he’s got incredible hands around the rim on the paint like catching passes like you can throw bad passes, you know, inaccurate alley oops and he can catch and kind of twist and finish all in one motion. Always has like a picture in his mind of exactly where the basket is. So you catch it, he’s like got his back to it and he’ll just kind of like spin up and get up there. And because he’s, you know, 7 foot one with a 99 wingspan, it doesn’t take him long to get up there. Um, I think that’s one of his biggest things just like and sometimes like he’d even attack the rim and like throw the ball off the backboard, go get the offensive rebound himself and finish it in. So once he got two feet in the paint, it was kind of good night. Um, and that was one of the I think the big things is especially playing with LaMelo Ball that works because of his creativity and his passing. Um, so I think that’s one of the the really big areas offensively. He’s just a great play finisher. like one of the best I’ve seen in the league. That’s one of the things that stood out to me watching his film as well was just the fact that like he’s not honestly the leaping isn’t like super explosive, but because like you mentioned, he’s got that 9 foot n standing reach, the 7 foot seven wingspan, like he can just go and elevate over people with those long arms of his and finish alleyoops and that sort of thing. Um, let’s take a look at what the the stat showed us from last year. You look at the raw numbers, career year in many respects, uh 15.3 points, 10.2 rebounds, 2.5 assists, 1.2 blocks per game. Those were all career highs. Shot 60% from the field uh as the Suns included in their press release by averaging 1510 on 60% shooting. He was one of three players in the league to reach those thresholds along with Giannis and Eva Kazubat. Um only averaged 26.6 minutes per game, which is kind of my segue into the main question. and concern with Mark Williams is obviously the durability, the availability, the injury stuff. Um, you know, you look at his first three years in the league, he’s played a grand total of 106 games over those three seasons. I think last year was 44. Um, James, based on what you’ve seen from covering this team, how concerning is it that he’s basically only played a half season at best through three years in his career? It’s concerning and and you could probably look at it whichever way you want. Glass half empty, glass half full. He’s had four injuries, all different injuries in his career. In high school, I think he tore his miniscus. As a rookie, he did a thumb ligament on a dunk. As a sophomore, he had the back issue which didn’t need surgery and was eventually rehabbed. And then he had the foot sprain on the day of Hornets media day last season. So, they’ve all been different injuries, right? So I guess it’s not like Joel Embiid where he’s got one knee which is obviously a chronic problem which is never going to get better. They’ve all kind of been different things but obviously the Lakers rescended the trade because of supposed you know inaccurate medicals. How much you want to believe that or not depends I guess how much you believe in Lakers conspiracy theories and not. Um but there’s definitely concern and the big thing is he’s a really slow healer. I mean, some of these injuries, the back, the foot sprain, when that foot sprain happened, people talking about media day being like, “Oh, he’ll be back in a few weeks here and he was out like two months at the start of the season. We couldn’t, no one could believe it.” And that’s one of the big concerns. He’s definitely a slow healer. So, whenever he picks up anything, it really seems to affect with them and linger. He basically didn’t play back to backs, I think, for the whole of last season um to try in an effort to try and manage that. So, you kind of got to almost like factor that in. Um, so it it’s definitely odd. I mean, he came into last year or or the year before even bragging about putting on so much weight as a rookie cuz he was like quite skinny. Uh but he was also really light on his feet for someone who’s 7 foot one and he was switching out on the perimeter and he came into a sophomore year bragging about putting all this weight on and then he had the back issue and he looked a lot less mobile, a lot less athletic and I don’t know if that was a good decision looking back on like adding all that extra muscle, that extra weight. Um so he’s not really had a full healthy offseason here in a little while. Uh apart from I hope it is this one right here. Um, but there was also some like contradictory stuff about his health last summer where he was saying he’d been healthy all summer, but then other players would say quotes that kind of contradicted that. So there there’s definitely been some like guarding, I think, cuz he he really doesn’t want this injury-prone label. He said that to the media, like he does not want to be known as that. Um, so I think there’s also a little bit of like deflecting about sometimes the nature of how serious these injuries are. Yeah, for sure. I definitely kind of got wind of that from across the map all the way over here in Phoenix. Uh going into going into the last couple of seasons now actually with them. Um I guess we can kind of get to looking at the offense and the defense. Um generally speaking, uh James, let’s start with the offense. Looking at Mark Williams, obviously a player that has a ton of size, has a ton of potential, obviously health withstanding. Um, let’s kind of hit on some of the things that stand out most to you, whether it be positive or room for improvement for him on the offensive end. Yeah. So, I spoke about the hands earlier. I think that’s one of the strengths. The other big development thing last year was actually his like play making and understanding and decision-m and offense. He basically tripled his assist percentage and they really used him as like a dribble, handoff, short roll playmaker. So like teams would blitz LaMelo, they’d give it to him and he’d make some really interesting passes like even bounce passes to like corner shooters between defenders. Um just showed for someone of his size like quite unique uh ability to to play make and pass the ball. He had some really high assist games especially earlier in the year. I think teams adjusted a little bit because they knew he could pass the ball. So I think that’s one thing that has been definitely a skill that has come online in the last 12 months. Um after that you’re talking about like motor on the offensive glass just a handful. Draws a ton of fouls. Uh especially going for offensive rebounds. Gets to the free throw line pretty well from that. Uh but he’s not a guy who’s necessarily going to like beat mismatches. So like the Lakers would put Dorian Finny Smith on Mark Williams. Couldn’t really post him up. Couldn’t leverage him. Has quite high hips so kind of get struggles to like move people and doesn’t really have a handle to speak of. Um, he showed some mid-range flashes. I I wouldn’t think it’s something that’s probably going to be part of his NBA game as like a where the defense actually care about him shooting or not, but Steve Clifford when he was a rookie was like, “Hey, this guy’s going to shoot threes in the NBA. He’s going to shoot them.” Um, so there’s always kind of been a little bit of a flirting with that three-point shot, although he’s never really done it on high volume in Charlotte, but there’s some, I guess, underlying background belief that maybe he could shoot it at some point. That’s interesting because I I was looking at like obviously you look at the the shot chart from last year and I think it was something like only like 16 15 shots that were outside the paint as a whole. Um so obviously a lot of what he’s doing is finishing around the basket pick and roll type stuff. Um and he’s very effective at doing that. But I wanted to kind of get your read because going through the film I noticed like he he likes that hook shot that he has. He’s had he can do it with either hand. He also has a little bit of a floater. Um you look at the efficiency. I think he only shot 43 on hook shots and like 38% on floaters. Um but it was something that he did regularly based on the film. James, do you have any opinion on on that? Whether that’s a skill that as a 23-year-old he can kind of continue to build on because it felt like when he caught the ball in that short role there, he wasn’t always sure of how to attack it. he could find the kick out or he could pull up for the floater, but kind of moving in between that intermediary space was a little bit of a challenge for him and and I feel like that floater might be an important thing to develop for him. Yeah, it’s a little bit like a flip shot uh which he has there and it comes down to lack of handle I think at times because he gets caught like 10 feet out and knows you can kind of like dribble into the tight space and kind of get all the way to the rim to throw something up. Um, if I’m honest, I’m probably not really a big believer on it being a regular thing. Um, especially if he’s up against stronger guys because they get into his body and as soon as you’re getting kind of like that little push off balance low down in your base when you’re trying to throw those like touch shots, you really need to have that balance for those to be effective. Uh, I think for the Hornets team that struggled for offensive anything last year, uh, he was probably given more remitt to take some of those shots. I probably think in a in a bigger setting with more offensive skill around him, like he will probably pass out of those more often. I think that’s probably a little bit more situational. So, I I wouldn’t say I’m a huge believer, but he you’re right, he does have like more touch with some of those. And like I said, with the playmaking for someone who’s 7 foot one, normally those guys are just pure athletes, right? Very low skill. He has a little bit more than you would think for someone of his size. I think something else that stands out to me when watching when watching Mark’s film and obviously watching him in real time last year is uh it’s funny to mention it, but it’s the like you talked about the comfortability in the middle area of the floor and how he was kind of given a little bit more freelance to do it because of the context of the team he was playing with. Is it outlandish to think that he is someone that could grow into being someone that takes those kind of below the free throw line shots whether it’s just Devin Booker or Jaylen Green gets double team pocket pass he takes one dribble the defense hasn’t tried to plug him so he just pulls up for uncontested like 12-footer instead of always having to be laten to specifically around a restricted area. I think he would like to do it. I don’t think you’re going to get arguments. That’s the start point. You got to be confident enough and comfortable enough to get the get to the efficiency. Yeah. And to your point, I think he does. I think he would have confidence like he he he’s one of those like he wouldn’t take them a lot in Charlotte because he’s wanting to play to the the game plan which is, you know, rim and threes like all the other NBA teams, maybe not so much Phoenix. Um but yeah, so I I think absolutely again we’ve not seen any volume to know if it’ll go in, but he he’s like made a few. They have a he has a good release. his good mechanics. He shoots a good ball from the free throw line. Um I I’m a believer that he could develop that at some point. Um and especially right as he goes on to his like more experienced years here. But the biggest thing for me is like he he’s never been on the floor consistently enough to kind of almost earn his place in the team to take those kind of shots because he was always injured and he was always trying to fit into the team which had been playing. So, if he can stay healthy, I think he will kind of feel more of the flow and feel more encouraged to take those. Last one I had for you on the offensive front was obviously we talked about his ability to finish around the rim. That’s one of the things that he’s best at. How is he has as a screener and being able to navigate those pick and roll situations? Because obviously in Phoenix, you know, with Devin Booker, with Kevin Durant and Bradley Beal gone, Devin Booker is going to get blitzed quite a bit off the ball and that playmaking is going to help, but how is he in terms of being able to, you know, flip screens, set good screens, and find his way into space on those roles? Um, good on the roles, less so on some of the screens. like he’s just not a big guy like wide guy to to create a lot of separation. So, um like Nick Richards was a better screener even though we pick out like three or four fouls per game on moving screens. We are well aware, trust me. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Steve Clifford is still having a sweat drip down his forehead from shouting Nick Richard setting screens. Um but but like he was a like Nick Richards is a better screener than Mark Williams. Um, so he was not someone who I would say was especially great at getting separation um on offense for his teammates. He was often would slip early actually out those screens to try and like get to the rim, use that, you know, wingspan, use that reach to be able to get balls up high if he slips out early. So that was what he preferred to do more. And I think that’s also one of the things like you look at that lamelo ball needs someone who can kind of free him up a little bit more. Even though Mark Williams is great as a lob target to get LaMelo space, that wasn’t something that he absolutely excelled at. For sure. Last thing I want to touch on with Mark, uh, we talked about him finishing at the rim, finishing at the rim in multiple capacities. What about in transition? Because I think this Suns team, and I think this is a perfect kind of transition to defense after it, but this Suns team is certainly looking to play a lot more active style of defense than they did last season. and uh spend more time in that context of transition. So, how does he kind of play into a transition space and template, whether it be him rim running or filling the lane at times or just being able to finish in that context? Yeah, I mean, coming in as a rookie, his offensive transition ability was one of the things I was really excited about because at Duke, he got out in transition a lot and I remember those old Mike Schmidt sitdown film breakdowns that used to happen. He he did a section specifically on Mark Williams ability to get out and run in transition. He’s like saying look 7-1 you’re getting out fluid in the court. It just never really translated to Charlotte. Now last year the Hornets played with the lowest pace in the entire NBA which is pretty shocking when you have lamelo ball for for 50 odd games. But Mark Williams certainly didn’t help that either. It rarely showed. I mean obviously there’s times but if you play in a bunch of games there’s always going to be times that you get out in transition. I wouldn’t describe it as a a headline feature of his game that if you’d not brought it up to me, I wouldn’t have even mentioned it. But he as a younger player, as a rookie and Duke, that was something he was known for. So maybe he just didn’t do it in Charlotte because, you know, he didn’t feel it was worth putting the effort in. Maybe it was some of the injuries that he didn’t want to exert himself to that level. Um maybe it was the play style that the Hornets more or unorganized and they wanted to play slower so they didn’t get out and run. Um, I’m not 100% sure, but it wasn’t a great feature of his first three years. Yeah, that makes sense because I I was looking at the numbers and I think he was like a hundth percentile in points per possession in transition, but the frequency was much much lower than that. Um, James, let’s go ahead and transition to the defensive end. Thank you everyone in the chat for being here with us. Big Watts, Nate for you, beer is good 45. Um, we’ve got almost 200 people here in the chat, but not as many likes. So, make sure to hit that like button. uh and hit the like button for our guests. He’s fantastic breaking all this Hornet stuff down for us for Mark Williams. Uh James, on the defensive end, the one thing that we’re going to ask about obviously is well, at least for me, we got to start with the drop coverage. Is it fair to say that it was predominantly deep drop coverage with Mark Williams on the defensive end? This last year, yes. As a rookie, they actually used Mark Williams the opposite way. They used him as like their switch defender to be more aggressive. And that was one thing Steve Clifford said that he really liked about Mark Williams when he got ahead of Mason Plumbley and they traded him away at the deadline and Mark Williams started the rest of the rookie year was that defensive versatility that Mark had. Um, but things changed and none of us really know why. Was it the health that slowed him down? Was it that extra weight I talked about? Was it the injuries? Um, I I don’t know. like he lost that defensive versatility as he kind of got further away from his rookie season. So yeah, he was predominantly a a drop guy or sometimes would step up to the level and um I mean last year they actually cross match quite a lot. So if there was like a center, they would put him on a non-shooting player and kind of let Mark Williams roam because he would just get eaten up by guys like Jonas Valenunis and you know any other strong beefy interior player just basically took Mark Williams out the play and would get into foul trouble and all sorts of challenges there. So um they deployed him mostly in drop or if it was a poor matchup then sometimes they would like deploy him completely on a non-shooter. That’s fascinating because I do remember him being on the perimeter a lot more early in his career and then I was looking through film last year and I was like, where did all of that go? So, I’m glad you clarified that, James. And that’s that’s exactly what I was about to ask about because um needless to say um Steve Clifford and Charles Lee are very very um evolved with their approach on the defensive end of the floor. uh they go with some non-traditional ways in which they feature the centers and I mean last season even against the against the the Suns we saw Mark Williams guarding Ryan Dunn right and it was intentional because they’re saying if Ryan Dunn wants to shoot threes by all means go ahead but we’re going to keep our big guy as close to the paint as we can so that anytime someone does turn a corner you got to deal with somebody with a 99 standard reach that has a behemoth type of wingspan and is also thirsty to get any block and is jumping at the first opportunity to do it. So, um, I guess my question for you within that, what was his discipline like when he was in those crossmatching scenarios? Because I feel like with the way that the Suns are at the four right now, I imagine they’re going to be trying to use their fours on fives and stashing Mark on nine shooters in a similar way with that cross matching scheme that you just got done speaking to. Yeah, he was okay in that role. Um the problem was, you know, whoever else was having to guard the center was completely outmatched. And it kind of depends on what your wider roster is in terms of like if you’ve got a four who can really comfortably defend fives, then then that’s like okay. Um so so he but he was okay in that role as like a a a roaming shot blocker. I mean I’ll say like one point what was he 1.2 blocks per game I think last year which was a careerhigh. I mean, he’s 7-1 with the longest standing reach in, I think, maybe NBA history. That that’s not an impressive number. I know it’s a career high, but that’s a massive disappointment. When he came out of Duke, like people were talking about who’s the better shot blocker, Mark Williams or Walker Kesler, and it’s just not even a conversation anymore. He’s like just doesn’t affect shots around the rim. And you know, sometimes those players who are like low block numbers, but they affect everything around the rim. He’s not that either. I mean last year guys like Cory Kiss but Desmond Bane would just drive straight into Mark Williams. He’s right there in position. You think, “Oh, this is getting swatted into another planet.” And they would just find a way to finish over him and guys didn’t feel him and they didn’t fear him either. Um so a lot of the interior stats around his rim defense, some of the stats actually look like there was improvements last year. I’m being honest, there’s some red herring to that. And I wrote that in I think that piece that you read earlier. It did not match the eye test that time and time again. You saw Mark Williams getting beat on the inside sometimes where he wasn’t the primary defender. So I don’t think the advanced stats were like market against him. But you think, hey, you should be in position to come and help here and he just wasn’t as impactive as you’d hope he would be. That’s good to know cuz you just look at the block highlights and you know he’s swatting him into the stance, but there’s a lot more shots go up on the rim. Yeah, he does. out my timeline, you’ll see enough videos of me going, “How did Mark Williams not affect this shot right here?” Right. No, that’s fascinating cuz and and I did want to ask you about this because even going through the block highlights, a lot of them he’s getting the ball at the absolute peak where it’s like flirting very closely with goalending territory. Was was goalending something that came up quite a bit for him? It was. It was. He’s seems to be a little bit of a slow reactive jumper. And I think this is one of the big things, right? Like it doesn’t matter how tall or long you are. If you’re jumping whatever it is half a second other than someone else who’s a much quicker jumper that’s just going to like affect it. Um and he wasn’t able to seem to kind of get his arms out quick enough at the right angles or if he would put his arms high then people could kind of blow past him and get him moving or or people could put the shoulder into his chest and move him. So yeah absolutely goending was a challenge for him. I think something else that stands out to me in a positive light on the defensive end is the kind of space he was operating in in terms of uh his defensive rebound percentage. Uh so the rebound rate for him was at 25%. Uh that was on par with players like uh Anthony Davis, Victor Wyama, Jaylen Duran, and also Isaiah Hardenstein. So very good company to be involved with especially if you’re speaking to last season and how a lot of those players were playing. How did you see him kind of fare even with considering sometimes he would be away from the basket because of a crossmatching scheme in terms of working his way back to help his team on the defensive glass? Yeah, it was one of the most impressive things about his game. He had a really good motor and for someone who isn’t necessarily strong like often you you think great rebounders are those like really low center of gravity strong guys and that’s not what he is but he just finds a way to really go up and attack the boards and high point the ball and and get them and the Hornets were a good rebounding team last year and they were normally pretty good under Steve Clifford as well and Mark Williams was a big part of that. So, that is one thing that I I’m not worried about is that he is going to help this team on the defensive glass in ways that they probably struggled a little bit last year. Um cuz yeah, he just has a good motor on that end and a good knack for reading the ball off the rim, which is not something that will show up in the stat sheet, but he was he was pretty good at that. Is there anything if you’re trying to sell Suns fans or offer offer some copium opium here defensively? Is there anything that you can point to? Like obviously we could talk about he’s still 23, maybe a change of scenery, maybe, you know, slimming down or being healthy or whatever, yada yada yada. Is there anything else when you look at his actual game defensively um that Suns fans can maybe cling to for hope on that end of the floor? The two things I would point to are one that this this might be his first healthy offse, right? like and and we can’t pretend how much like having confidence in your body. He talked about it at times last year like months on where he was like I can finally begin to feel like I’m trusting my body again and like you only say that once you feel you’ve overcome it and then you start to think back and go wow how much was this guy like playing through injuries or not feeling 100%. and and that’s where I think some of like defensive versatility, some of the speed stuff that we talked about, some of the perimeter defense, that’s that where that kind of went. So, I think that’s one side, just like getting further away from those injuries and having confidence. Uh, the other thing is probably just being in a better defensive system. Like he had to play behind Miles Bridges, LaMelo Ball, um, like Josh Green was the best defender on this team last year, but like he was the only good perimeter defender. Um, so like there was a lot to clean up in Charlotte for Mark Williams. Um, so it’s fair enough I think to sometimes attribute some of his, hey, how come you didn’t get there earlier? Well, he probably shouldn’t have had to be in that spot, but someone missed a rotation or someone got blown by and he wasn’t expecting it to happen because he thought looked like it was like a balanced defensive play. So, I think those are the two big things I would say. Um, yeah, the the isolation defense I have to say is like really worrying. And that’s almost I know we’ve not talked about it yet, but I think he he got he fouled on 23% of his defensive isolation possessions, which was the second worst rate in the entire NBA behind only Donovan Klingan who was a rookie. So like that is one thing and that’s partly sometimes why they cross match them onto guys like Ryan Dunn is because Ryan Dunn’s not going to isolate. So, it’s it’s like a way to protect him from that. But he had several games where kind of like guys would really go at him. Um, but I do think like I say early in his career, he had like a game-winning block and Trey Young on one of the games. Like it was an absolutely huge play. Um, I feel like there is hope because he’s shown he can do it. He can get back there. But every year you get further away from what he flashed in his first and second year, you feel like it’s maybe less and less likely to get there. That makes sense. Last one I had for you was more of an off-the-court thing. I I saw I think Zach Low was talking about it on his show in terms of like the goals that Charles Lee was trying to set with each player before the season and Mark Williams showed up with a like an index card in four quadrants with his own kind of goals that he had for himself and and kind of spoke to his maturity on that. What is Mark Williams like off the court in terms of being like a locker room guy or or a personality, I guess? Yeah, I mean I’ve interviewed Mark in person a couple of times and he’s a softly spoken giant like mildmannered really really nice guy um really easy to be around really easy to talk to he’s not a commanding presence which I think sometimes again as a center that’s one thing he struggle on especially early like I don’t think it comes naturally to him to be the talker and the quarterback of the defense which you you need to be is that center um but he’s definitely someone who pays attention He’s good and film. He picks things up quickly. That’s something that Charles Lee talked a lot last year like even when he wasn’t playing, they talk about Mark Williams would come over and pick up on something and Charles Lee would be like, “Hey, that’s a really high level thing he’s just picked up on there.” So, he’s got a good IQ. Um, he likes he does pay attention to stats. Like I remember he said end of last year that um in March that that according to the NBA he was like in the 90 plus percentile in like rim defensive field goal percentage and and that wasn’t the case earlier in the year. So that’s like something that he actively pays attention and tracks again which isn’t just blocks per game. It’s a little bit more of a nuance stat that takes into account his um his impact a little bit and and maybe that’s another reason for optimism right that was March last year. Uh so he was he felt like and after that quote he even said uh you know I’m getting back into the feel of trusting my body and that was the end of last year. So if he can pick that up that 90th percentile mark which he quoted and carry that into this year again maybe that is another positive thing that he can get back to. Yeah that’s that’s a big thing that I’m looking forward to and kind of speaking with him too. Uh one of my favorite things about his sister older sister. um very articulate, very very very smart. Like you can tell like they just oo they have the smartness about their aura. Uh so going into it, you can tell that they’re always well prepared and they’ll give you a thorough answer if you do your job as a person asking questions. So um I think he’s a a good character fit for everything that the Suns are trying to transition towards as far as off the court stuff goes as well. So um also I’ll just mention because James mentioned it, context matters, guys. M you got somebody that has not been with us before that’s also mentioning that too. So they get tired of hearing me say it because I mention it almost every podcast. But I’m glad someone else is mentioning it too. Yeah. No, absolutely. Well, did you have anything else for James? Thank you so much, James, for joining us on the show. Everybody go check out his work if you’re interested in the Hornets perspective over at Culture or the Buzzbeat Pod. You can follow him on Twitter, British_sons. James, thank you so much for taking the time today. No worries, guys. And yeah, if you want to follow Mason Punley’s career after Phoenix, come and follow my work. I’ll be covering him all year over on uh for the Hornets. There you go, guys. You cannot miss this opportunity. James, thanks again. Have a good one. No worries. Thanks, guys. That was great. Uh thank you everyone for being here with us again. We’re going to do a little bit more Mark Williams talk to wrap things up and then we’re going to talk a little bit about Jonathan Kaminga right after our first break. Stephen, if you’re looking for fun things to do in Phoenix, I cannot recommend more. Going to Phoenix Raceway for the NASCAR Championship weekend, October 31st through November 2nd. Now, I know it’s a it’s a ways away. It’s Halloween. Suns will probably have a game there, but they won’t have a game all weekend long. And if you’ve been in Phoenix long enough, you’ve seen it all when it comes to biggest sporting events. Uh, but if you haven’t experienced NASCAR Championship weekend, it is something that’s very unique. Uh it’s it’s the type of sport you have to really experience in person because it gives you kind of the level of access that you really don’t get in any other sporting event. Um you’re talking about cars going 200 mph right in front of your face. Not right in front of your face, but like very close. Uh and you get to witness four champions crowned in a 3-day span. It’s pretty electric. And the state-of-the-art uh course that they have there is really cool after months. It starts in February, I think their season does, and then it all comes down to this one weekend in Phoenix. So, it’s a lot of fun. Uh, so don’t miss your chance to witness NASCAR Championship weekend in person coming to Phoenix Raceway October 31st through November 2nd. Tickets for Sunday’s Cup Series Championship race sellout every year. So, you need to move fast to get yours before they’re gone. And here’s the kicker. NASCAR is taking championship weekend on the road starting in 2026. So, this is your last chance to catch it in Phoenix for quite some time. Uh, tickets, hospitality, and upgrades are still available. Get yours now at phoenixraway.com. Uh, and if you do go out to Phoenix Raceway, it’ll be October, so it’ll be a little bit cooler. But when you leave home, you’re going to want to change your thermostat. You’re going to want to make sure that you remember to do that, especially now during the summer, because if you forget to do that when you’re away, you either come back and the house is way too hot or you’re racking up a bill for AC that you don’t need while you’re in the house. And the best way to avoid doing that is with a smart thermostat from APS. Uh, you can check with your APS rate plan to help you automatically adjust the temperature in your home. And for every one degree that you raise your thermostat, you could save up to 2 to 3% on your cooling costs. We know how expensive AC can get during the summer. So, you’re going to want to look into that with a smart thermostat. That makes it easy because, like I said, if you’re away from home, you forgot to adjust the temperature. You can do that from your smartphone or your device with a smart thermostat. Right now, APS customers may be eligible for smart thermostats for as low as $0 when you enroll in the APS Cool Rewards program. If you already have a smart thermostat at home, see if it’s eligible to enroll in Core Rewards. Plus, free install is available at marketplace.aps.com. Must be an APS customer and pay shipping and taxes. Other restrictions apply. Go to marketplace.aps.com for more information. Last thing I had for you, I alluded to it earlier, but I do have a new article on Mark Williams up on the website gophx.com. It is for dieards only. Going to continue rolling through these. We’ve done Jaylen Green. We’ve done Rashir Fleming. We’ve done Mark Williams. Now we’re going to be doing Kobe Bryant tomorrow. But I can promise you nobody in the written space at least is diving into these breakdowns in quite the same way, just like we do it on the show, just like Stephen does it with his video breakdowns. So if you want to become a diehard, there’s an added bonus. It’s not just my stuff, guys. It’s the fact that Cardinals Training Camp is here. So this is our best Die Hard deal of the year. Join today for just $36 a year. It’s normally $79.99, so more than half off there. Uh, it’s $3 a month for all full access Cardinals coverage. You get a free t-shirt when you sign up. You get access to our exclusive Discord, which doesn’t just have a Suns channel. It’s got cards. It’s got everything. Even the dead coyotes, they’re still in there. They still got hockey fans in the desert in our Discord. Um, and you also get merch and event discounts uh on tickets. So, Cardinal season starts now, so make your move. GoPnX.com/intro-offer-social. Gerald asked you all to become die hards. I’m demanding you. Get in alignment. Get in alignment. You want an alignment shirt. If you sign up to become a die hard, you might have a chance at getting one of those. So, you want to just get that, but you also want to get all of the extra content that we do for you all. Yes. Alignment alert. Arrington. Correct. Yes. Um, you want to get all of the extra content that we do produce on the the uh behind our pay walls. you want to take great advantage of that, especially if you all are always tapping in with the podcast. So, yeah, and about 75% of my written content is die hard content only. So, it is behind that payw wall. So, take advantage of this sale while it lasts if you want more offseason coverage and leading up to the next season because it is going to be a fun one. We’ve got lots of youth and excitement in the air. So, you’re going to want to be able to read all of the stuff that we do, have access to all the extra stuff we do in the Discord for our dieards only. Uh, Stephen, let’s put a bow on this Mark Williams conversation because we do have a couple of stats that I pulled up while I was doing this breakdown. Let’s start with by taking a look at around the rim. I was not kidding when I said that his offense is predominantly around the rim. I think it was, like I said, it was all but 15 of his shots came from within the painted area. Some technically mid-range, but all in the paint. Uh, the good news is, like James was telling us, he was pretty much automatic when it came to dunks and alleyoops. Shot nearly 92% on dunk attempts and alleyoops, which is just insane. It was one of those things where you saw that dude go up with his tree trunk arms. You’re not challenging it. It’s an automatic. Uh, he he shot 71.7% at the rim, which as we know, uh, rim efficiency has been a problem at the center spot recent years. Uh, only shot 55.2% on layups. And this kind of goes with something that I spoke to that when he caught the ball in the short roll, if his runway was kind of blocked, it was kind of like a DeAndre Aton thing where he was either pulling up for that floater, kicking it out somewhere else, or he kind of like shortcircuited, had some awkward moves. I have clips of all these things in the article. Um, and the other thing, he does kind of need a pass first point guard to set him up, especially in pick and rolls. He was assisted on 80.7% of his made field goals. Uh what from those numbers stands out to you when it comes to Mark Williams and the way he operates around the rim? It’s definitely the finishing around the rim first, foremost, secondarily, thirdly, fifthly, fourthly, all of those all of those because we saw so many opportunities where the Suns left significant 10 to 12, 14 points off the board simply because they didn’t have big players that would finish after the advantage was created for them to do so. and they got a they got a timely pass from their guards last season. Um, I don’t think that’s going to be nearly as much of an issue for Mark Williams with the Suns or for the Suns in general because Mark Williams is now in town. I think there will be a lot of bodies caught between Jaylen Green, Ryan Dunn, uh, also obviously hasn’t been shy about springing on guys. Obviously, Mark Williams wants to try to dunk everything because he’s not as good at layups. Yeah. So, he wants to finish over the top of guys as much as possible. I imagine Kamar Malaw is going to want to chip in there. Rashir Fleming is going to probably attempt more dunks than anybody on the team. It’s going to be a trampoline in the paint area and I think it’s going to be a breath of fresh air because the Suns have seen a lot more finesse on opportunities that most other teams have seen dunks with. I saw I remember looking at um on Twitter after after the Mavericks went and got um they got obviously drafted Lively and then they brought in Daniel Gaffford and it turned into Dunk City because every pass that Luca Dantage and Kyrie Irving were making was resulting in dunks. That’s going to be a breath of fresh air for the Suns and the type of pressure on the rim that that’s going to put is going to also lead to free throws because naturally there’s a lot of contact involved. Yeah. No, absolutely. That’s a good point. the I I think it was a very I can’t remember who the duo was, but there was like a duo in the NBA. It might have been the Mavs duo that last year had more alleyoops by themselves or one player had more alleyoops by themselves than the entire Suns roster, which you know when you got Nerkich barely trying to jump over a sheet of paper that that’s going to be a thing. But now we’re in an era with a lot more athletes, a lot more springy guys. Mark Williams, not like I said, not an explosive leaper, but when you have a 99 standing reach, it doesn’t really matter as much. Um, let’s take a look at something that’s related to this, the pick and roll numbers, because like I said, a lot of his offense came from pick and rolls or dump offs. Basically, put him in the dunker spot. He’s going to get easy buckets that way. But a lot of it was pick and rolls. He was in the 97th percentile in pick and roll or pop or slip frequency if you factor all those three things in. So, a lot of pick and rolls. Um I think Oh, I think we have a couple of different stats on this particular sheet. But, uh the point is I think he was 90th percentile in points per possession out of pick and rolls as the roller as well. So, that’s one thing that I think he can help with. But if you look at the Suns roster, it’s kind of slim pickings in terms of setting him up for success. It’s basically Devin Booker, hopefully Jaylen Green, maybe Colin Gillespie in terms of guys that can actually run a pick and roll with him. And that’s a that’s a roster flaw right now. That’s why I value like we did Tieran yesterday, Ben Simmons as much as I do. Yes, he is a player with flaws, but he has some strengths that fit like a puzzle piece in addressing needs that the Suns need uh that the Suns need to address on the defensive end and the offensive end. And I feel like if you can kind of take yourself away from worrying about uh front court spacing as much and you kind of alter your kind of approach to looking at the team on offense, if Ben Simmons has it in his hands, you don’t have to worry about him spacing because he can go and get a paint touch whenever he wants to. that’s going to lead to offense with Mark Williams or anyone else that’s on the court with them. Um, but to that point though, they do need someone else that can feed him the ball. I don’t think that’s going to be a strength of Jaylen Greens. Maybe on a on a on appearance, but it’s not going to be a steady diet of it. Deon Booker, how often is he going to be able to get it to him on the roll versus a short roll because he’s getting doubleteamed? Yeah. And naturally, if teams also know that short roll playmaking isn’t a strength. He’s capable, but it’s not a strength of Mark Williams game, that’s gonna all that’s just gonna lead to teams wanting to double team Booker more because now you’re putting someone in a situation that’s not their strength. So, it’s a way to kind of take away flow from the offense. So, I want to see him be better with that. There’s definitely room. I think the context is better with the Suns than it was with Charlotte last season. Um, and that should lead itself to improvement for him. Yeah, I I think putting him in pick and rolls with Deon Booker is going to be good because and we’ll talk about the point book conversation that came up today tomorrow for that show. So, make sure to tune in for that. I think he’ll be fine on that front. I do worry outside of that pick and roll duo how that’s going to look because um especially with what James was saying about him not being the world’s best or most physical screen shetter when it comes to maintaining contact. That’s a concern. He did rank in the 90th percentile in screen assist per 75 possessions. Um, but the basketball index has another screen evaluation stat that has him in like the 30s or 40s in terms of the actual effectiveness of his screen. So, that kind of echoes what James was saying. Uh, last thing that we got to take a look at the defensive numbers as well. Um, you look at him and like James was saying like the block numbers seem good like 1.2 blocks per game that seems good. It’s probably not as good as it should be for a guy with his measurables. So if you look at the rim protection stats here, 90th percentile in rim contest per 75, 90th percentile in blocks per 75, 92nd in screener mobile defense, which is basically uh containing the ball off of screens there. Only the 42nd percentile in defensive field goal percentage versus expected. So basically, I think opponents shot 02% better at the rim against Mark Williams than they normally would. Now, some of these numbers are flawed because like James said, when it comes to some of these the way that they evaluate these metrics, sometimes a blowby doesn’t count against these numbers. So, that’s something you have to factor in. The one that made me laugh was because we talked about how much he was in the drop. They have this stat called pick and roll coverage aggression. He’s in the first percentile. Like the only number lower than that is zero, Stephen. Yeah. That means he was in the paint all the time. Both both feet in the paint. That’s exactly what that means. And that’s that’s kind of offense and defense for him basically. It seems like the the rare odd occasion where he probably wasn’t in the paint was probably if they were going against a team with a pull-up threat guard where the screens are being set higher up the court. So naturally, you don’t want your drop to be 40 feet away from the point of the screen. Mh. So he steps up a half foot, one foot in in the paint, one foot out, and then still getting back to back to being on the porch around the room. Yeah. So with Mark, the block numbers look good. They need to be a little bit better for a guy with his met because you look at the block highlights. They’re sensational. Yes. Like he is absolutely deflating balls and opponents and, you know, opponents families in the stands with what he’s doing to those shots. But they were few and far between, especially when you consider how often he was not on the court. Um, so that’s going to be something. Staying out of foul trouble, that’s going to be another thing. Holding up on switches and dealing with pick and pop bigs. Those are all going to be challenges for Mark Williams. And you’re hoping that being healthy, maybe being a little bit slimmer and more mobile will help with that, especially under a coach like Jordan. Uh, Stephen, I know you had some numbers that you pulled up as well. Yeah, Eritton, we can go ahead and get to those now. Um, just kind of my little scouting report. We’ll have more coming on him uh via via film session in the next coming handful of weeks. But just kind of looking ahead, some of the things that stood out to me, 23 years old, no different than Jaylen Green. So you got two players matching timeline in terms of age, in terms of experience in the league as well. They can kind of grow skill development wise and chemistry wise together. I think that part is extremely important. U mentioned the three years of experience. Last season, you mentioned careerh high in multiple respects. That 15.3 points ranked 13th amongst centers last season. So that’s a very important number considering how often he’s probably going to give the ball in similar situations with the Suns. Other big thing we mentioned with James, I’ll bring it back up. That 25 and a half% uh defensive rebound percentage was 10th amongst main rotation centers. Important because the Suns were not good at putting a period on their defensive possessions and allowing for that to kind of transition to the offense. You want to win the margins. If you want to get more shots on goal, take away those extra opportunities from your opponents. Another one, 67 or 64.7 true shooting percentage. That was uh 10th amongst main rotation centers. Obviously, you want to see him kind of diversify the shot profile some, but if he’s getting those same type of shots and opportunities around the rim and the Suns are getting those points or getting to the free throw line versus not getting those points at all, that kind of shifts things and it honestly it changes their win loss record at the end of last season as well. The other big one I want to look at with them, um, for centers, uh, for centers in the main rotation last season, 6.9 field goal attempts in the restricted area, that was tied for second amongst general centers. So, not even just starting caliber centers, amongst all centers. Okay, that rim pressure again, even if he’s not getting the ball, the threat of him getting it there and finishing on the efficiency that he’s shown to is going to naturally create cash and shoot opportunities around the horn for other players as defenses rotate from double team and Devin Booker and Jaylen Green. So, they got some things they’re working with there. If he can kind of maintain, there’s things to build off of. Yeah, absolutely. Well, I’m glad we could put a little bit of bow onto this deep dive into Mark Williams. That felt like a an episode straight out of our take for that for data days. Um, guest. Yes. Like I said, thanks again to James Plowight for coming on, giving us some insight. Great guest. Um, and if you want more, you can go to gophnx.com to read my deep dive. We get into the passing, the rebounding, the rim finishing, strengths, weaknesses, uh, and the injury component as well because I think it should be mentioned that this is a very important piece for the Suns that hasn’t really we haven’t really talked about Mark Williams as much because of everything that’s going on. And I think that’s important because not only is he your starting center with Kaman Malawatch maybe not looking ready just yet to be your franchise center but also approaching a contract year where you’re trying to figure out how to rebuild this thing on the fly like Mark Williams staying healthy and being able to properly evaluate him is going to be crucial for this Suns team this year. Uh any final thoughts before we take our final break Stephen? Uh yeah last thing I’ll say um bring back the Ben Simmons point but also a point that I brought up with Rashir Fleming. if they can guard fives, whether it’s just switching or just generally being able to outright guard fives, that protects Mark Williams and keeps him around the rim, which is where he’s at his best defensively. Absolutely. Well, that’s enough Mark Williams talk. We’re going to talk about the latest with Jonathan Kaminga right after our final break. Guys, I want to tell you about Pure Edibles. If you have 99 problems, Pure Edibles has a dispensary in this state for every single one of them, plus 31 more. That’s 130 dispensaries if you want to do the math, get into some analytics. Uh, and their pure gummies are not covered in sugar like all their competitors. It’s a full-fledged candy company. So, they offer gummies, they offer kicks, which is like their version of Starburst. Love Starburst. They got chews, soft candies like caramel, and then hard candies as well. 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We’ve talked pretty in depth, I think, about the different options with the Warriors, how a signing trade would look based on what amount you sign him to if you were to figure out a sign and trade, whether it would be Grayson or Reus or Nick Richards, what combination it would take. I think we should mention again that the Suns do not have a tradable first round pick. So, that kind of hurts your negotiating stance. You really want your this other trade partner to want your role players. and Brett Seagull, who came on the show last week, said basically that, you know, they’re they’re looking at offers for Grayson Royce. They’re figuring out what they could turn them into, but the Warriors are not interested in Grayson because of his contract. I I don’t think it’s that big of a contract. It’s only like 16 17 million a year for the next three years. But apparently for the Warriors, they’re not interested in that. So, we did get word from Sham Shirania today that the Suns have been quote aggressive in pursuing a sign and trade for Jonathan Kuminga and have made concrete offers while offering him a starting caliber role. But the Warriors are not interested in Phoenix’s offers, which you know, again, Brett told us that last week. Stephen, your thoughts on the latest in the Kaminga sign and trade saga. So, just for learning purposes, you all. So, let’s put our learning caps on. Gerald, I’m going to tap back into your um understanding of the CBA and salary cap. So, the Suns do, let’s say they find a miraculous way to entice the Warriors into Grayson Allen, let’s just say, and they’re able to push this sign and trade idea across the finish line. Sure. What are the implications that that ultimately has for the Suns after they just undid a lot of the wrongs that they had going on by way of uh finding a way off of Bradley Bill’s contract at least in a significant portion of it. Yeah. So again, it depends on the amount that you sign him for. But if you acquire a player by sign and trade, no matter what the amount is, you have to sign him to at least a three-year contract. So you can’t do like a one year or twoear signing trade. So he’s on the books for at least three to four years. In addition to that, when you acquire a player by sign and trade, if you are above the cap and below the first tax apron, it hard caps you at the first tax apron, which is 195.9 million. So, if you get hardcapped at that amount, you cannot cross 195.9 million in salary for the rest of the year. So, they’re not I think they’re about 8.9 million below that amount right now. So whatever they signed Jonathan Kaminga for in terms of how the math works out, you could not be taking on like an extra 9 million in cap space through that deal. Otherwise, you would be at that apron. That would hard cap you and the deal wouldn’t be able to go through. So that’s something to keep in mind. Uh, and for those wondering, when you’re looking at that first year salary in terms of the math and the financials and what they can take back based on who they’re sending out, if it’s just Grayson Allen straight up going to the Warriors, the that first year of salary would have to be in the 19 to $24 million range. Personally, I think the Warriors would just sign him for that amount because their camp has been closer to 20 million based on what we’ve heard. Kaminga has been closer to 30 million. So, if it’s 19 to$24 million, I think for the Warriors, they would probably count that as a win and just keep him. Um, if it’s in the 25 to$29 million range for that first year, uh, Allen plus Nick Richards is what it would look like. Um, and if it’s 25 to30 million, Allen plus Royce O’Neal works, but only if Royce O’Neal is absorbed into the Warriors uh, non-T taxpayer mid-level exception. Gotch. So, these are all things to keep in mind as we’re talking about these deals because I don’t think any of these other guys are on the table. Like, they’re not going to wheel and deal Jaylen Green for Jonathan Kuminga. I am personally I I just don’t like the deal. If if you include being hardcapped, if you include the fact that they don’t have a pick, so it feels unlikely. If you include the fact that like they spent a lot of the summer ducking the aprons and now they’re getting close to that hard cap. Mhm. I I I just don’t feel good enough about the fit of Kaminga to be interested in that personally. For sure. So now this is me asking an actual question from me, not just for the masses to learn. This is actually me. So if they are to go the route of sending to the Warriors, u Grayson Allen and Nick Richards. Of course, the Warriors have been linked to Al Horford. Yes. If the Suns bring in Kaminga, is there a way for the Suns to pivot to Al Horford based off of what you can kind of assume he might be getting on the market? Potentially. I think I mean for starters, we should acknowledge the fact that like from the Warriors perspective, they probably would just rather figure out what they’re doing with Kuminga and then sign Al Horford rather than have Nick Richards. But in this scenario, if they did suddenly want Nick Richards and say, “Nah, we’re good on 40year-old Al Horford.” basically. Um I think the Suns would be able to do it, but it does depend on the amount that they sign Kaminga for and they would have limited avenues to do it. You’re probably dipping into the MLE, but you do have to be aware of that hard cap because Grayson and Nick Richards outgoing salary would be about 21.8 million. So if you’re signing Kaminga to 30 million for that first year, there goes that that buffer that you had between them and the first tax apron. And at that point, you can’t go above it even with the MLE to sign an Al Horford or anybody else. So, that’s something to keep an eye on. And I do think as much as we’re talking about sign and trade scenarios, if they don’t get something done, I would not be surprised if they go into the season with that 15th roster spot open. Yeah, cuz like we talked about yesterday, Jordan Goodwin, non-G guaranteed deal, the contract that they claim off waiverss. Jared Butler, we reported non-g guaranteed deal. him and Goodwin are going to be competing for kind of that third starting or that third point guard spot in training camp. So that still leaves the 15th roster spot, but the Suns are barely above the luxury tax, I believe, right now. Um so if they do go with Goodwin and they don’t guarantee his contract, that’s an easy way to dip below the luxury tax before the season ends, then you avoid um you know joining that repeater tax, which the tax brackets changed this year. They got a lot more expensive. So, I know this is all very heavy financial talk, but these are things that are part of the calculus going on behind the scenes. And also, if you are in the luxury tax, your MLE drops from 14.1 million to like 5 million. So, you know, later in the season, if someone gets bought out or if you want to make a trade and absorb someone into your MLE, you’re probably going to want more space rather than 5 million or whatever it is. Yes. Um, so these are all things to keep in mind. I know a lot of people are very high on Kaminga. I was surprised how many people in our comments were high on Josh Kitty after the show. Me too. Um, but that hard caffing stuff is is serious business. I I really I think the Suns have to feel very strongly about the person they’re bringing in and the fit short-term and long term to do that to themselves when they just waved and stretched Bradley Beal to kind of get out of this cap hell that they found themselves in. For sure. So I guess with all of that and kind of taking it all in, I just feel like I think there is something there with Jonathan Kaminga. The question is though, is it worth it for the Suns to roll the dice, have the restraints that come with bringing him in via signing trade and then having to find other ways to go about creatively building out the rest of the roster and going forward. I just don’t know. I just don’t know if it’s worth it. Yeah, I think that’s kind of what it comes down to at this present moment. I would tell them just stand pat. You’ve done great work with the facilities that you have had this off season. Maybe just be patient, wait for the next opportunity to come up and then maybe that makes more sense for you. Yeah. No, absolutely. Want to thank all of our TV listeners. You can uh follow us at gophx.com. The party never stops over there. That means it’s time for overtime. Uh, pretty much just in time to say goodbye. But, uh, Stephen, any final thoughts on the Kaminga situation? Anything we didn’t touch on with the Mark Williams stuff before we uh, let everyone go? No, I think we I think we pretty much said about as much as you can about Mark Williams. Yeah, we really did. And I think we dove into the the kaminga of it all as well. Um, I think we did some good work. Yeah, absolutely. It’s been a great week. We are coming back for one more show tomorrow. Again, Eric is on vacation for the time being, so it’s just me, Stephen, and the freckled Mamba behind the Mac. Shout out to him for putting together all these beautiful looking graphics and thumbnails uh that we have on our show. Uh you can follow him, freckled Mamba on Twitter. You can follow me at Gerald Borgay. You can follow Stephen, Stephen PG3. Make sure to hit the like button on the way out. We didn’t hit our like goal of 100, but we’re close. So, make sure to give us a like. Make sure to go check out my new article over at gophnx.com. Enough talking for me. Let’s make like shepherds and get the flock out of here. See you guys tomorrow.

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Mark Williams is the Phoenix Suns’ new starting center, but the 23-year-old may also be their biggest make-or-break piece for the upcoming season! On the latest PHNX Suns Podcast, Gerald Bourguet and Stephen Pridgeon-Garner break down Williams’ game on the offensive and defensive end and give their reasons why he’s so important to the Suns’ short-term success due to his injury history and long-term success due to the fact he’s in a contract year. Charlotte Hornets beat writer James Plowright joins the show as well to give his perspective on the strengths and weaknesses of Mark Williams’ game on both ends of the floor. Finally, it may be time to circle back to the Point Book conversation now that it’d been reported that Jalen Green will be the Suns’ point guard instead of Devin Booker.

0:00 – Intro
2:40 – James Plowright Joins the Show to Talk Mark Williams!
6:25 – The Durability…
9:40 – The Offense
19:30 – The Defense
37:30 – Putting a Bow on the Mark Williams Conversation
52:00 – Lets Talk Jonathan Kuminga

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