Did Cardinals Hitting Coach Brant Brown Call Out Jordan Walker? Or Is It What He Needed To Hear?

Did Cardinals Hitting Coach Brant Brown Call Out Jordan Walker? Or Is It What He Needed To Hear?

Cardinals split the first two against the Nomadic Athletics and we’ll see if they can get the series win on Wednesday. But want to talk today about Jordan Walker in the comments made by his hitting coach Brandt Brown on KOX. It’s all coming up on Bshave Daily. [Music] What’s going on everyone and welcome into this edition of Bshave Daily. Brendan Schaefer talking Cardinals baseball on Wednesday, September 3rd, 2025. Cardinals got the two to1 win on Tuesday night, knocking off the Athletics after a brutal game one of this series in which Sunny Gray gave up a touchdown. The pitching much better last night. Miles Michaels, I tell you what, this guy is always good at home. He hasn’t given up more than three runs in a home start since June the 10th. And prior to that, I think it was not since April that happened previously. He has been really good at home. It’s been terrible on the road, but he’s genuinely been pretty good at home. Six innings, one run allowed yesterday. Drops the erra down to 4.89. So, he is at least below five. Matt Swanson, Jojo Romero came on for the final three innings. Scoreless and the Cardinal get the win by virtue of an Ivon Herrera home run. It’s good to see him moving back in the right direction because he had started the season so hot and then really gradually began to tail off. had a couple of injury stints in there as well, but there was a point a couple weeks ago when his OPS was down to like I think I saw 776 maybe at at his lowest and now it’s back up to 818. where he settles in as a hitter, I think, is going to be a really interesting long-term conversation for the Cardinals because I think I do think he profiles as one of the organization’s top bats, but like you almost have to consider that and take that for granted and say that’s just a fact of life in order to then say, “All right, he’s worth an everyday spot as our DH in 2026 or he’s worth moving somebody else out so that he can fit into the outfield. field in left field in 2026. But if his bat, you know, is not that kind of bat, if what we see this year is more of a flash in the pan, well, that could get awkward quick. But I don’t think that’s the case. I think we have seen, and like even going back to last year, if Von Herrera had an 800 OPS, he’s above 800 for this season. I think he’s one of the most, if not the most high upside, high floor, just a really good hitter. Back to ball skills, has power, has a couple of home runs this week. He’s done he’s done some good things, but we want to talk about another batter today. Hard to spend a ton of time talking about the day-to-day of this team right now. So, when there’s a storyline like this one that emerged yesterday with the appearance by Cardinals hitting coach Brent Brown on the Gas House Gang on KOX, it was asked a great question. Ollie Marl of course does the Tuesday gas house game with those guys which I continue to say I appreciate and I think Cardinal fans hopefully appreciate that they get that that candid side of Oy Marmal where like Bernie Miklas goes on there STL Sports Central’s Bernie Miklas does his podcasts and his written work for us over at STL Sports Central he will ask the kind of question that Cardinal fans want to hear asked and because of his graitas the fact that he has done this for a long time and has good relationships, he can ask it and get a get a genuine answer from guys. And that’s what happened yesterday with the question he he posed to Cardinal City coach Brandt Brown about Jordan Walker, who as we sit here today through 304 at bats is hitting 220 on the season with a 587 OPS. Jordan Walker is as of the moment, I mean, even less productive in particular in the power department than he was last year. which was a a 619 OPS season for Jordan. So, let’s talk about it. And by talking about it, we’ll just jump in with the quote. I mean, we’ll we’ll play this clip from Gas House King. You can hear him, I believe, every day on KOX, but on Tuesdays is when Oie Marvel jumps on. Yesterday, Brent Brown joined as well. And I just feel like this was something Cardinals fans were talking about, so wanted to weigh in and and see kind of where we’re at with Jordan Walker. Here’s a question. You’ll hear it from Bernie Mikas and then the answer from Cardinal sitting coach Brandt Brown yesterday on Camax. I wanted to ask you about Jordan Walker and I don’t really need to u you know ask a a lengthy question because we know the situation. Um he’s looked good at times this year, but then it sort of just falls back into that hole he’s been in and he’s in one of those holes now. tell us what you see with him and and uh all the work that you two have been doing together and and what progress you see if any and what what’s it going to take for him to be more consistent. Um I mean just on a on his like daily structure level is at some point in time he’s going to have to devote kind of more focus on preparation. Um it’s we’ve had long conversations with this is not only looking at film on the starter but also being able to come in and the first day of a series like just take a look at all the bullpen guys like all the information and videos available. Um just just so we’re not like you know getting snuck up on when a guy comes in. When Jordan Walker is ready to be good like I feel like it’s going to be up to him. Like we all know the potential. Um I don’t even think he knows like the ceiling. And to all these words is like we always talk about this is like okay well this is what they’re doing to you and this is what you want to do but if you can’t do what you want to do like what are we going to do about it? You know how are we going to counterattack? Um, so just trying to continue to make the point of like how preparation, how movement patterns, um, how, you know, can we counterattack? Like we’re going to have to give up something to get something. So for a while, you know, until we can show them that we can do this, like they’re going to stay there. And then once you start to do it, well then guess what? You know, you get to come back to what you want to do because they’re gonna have to do something else. So like it’s just a constant game, you know, it’s a big gambit of Zigging and Zagen. And I just think that, you know, he’s still in Zigg mode and like the Zag mode is just like it’s a stones throw away. It’s there. You know, we just have to, you know, try to keep working and have him commit to it. So, kind of cut a little bit of that together from KOX and the answer that Brandt Brown gave talking about Jordan Walker. And that is some interesting stuff. I don’t think it’s explosive particularly, but I know that people have a reaction to it because a lot of what is being described there does feel rather basic, especially some of the stuff at the beginning where he says, “Look, come in and look at what the opposing starter is going to do, but also like before a series, here’s who’s in their bullpen. Here’s what these guys are going to try to do to you.” and then discussing more at the end the zigg and zag nature of that. Another phrase that you hear is it’s like a cat-and- mouse game, right? We know what Jordan Walker does and what he wants to do to be most successful. Drive the baseball. Okay, the pitcher is going to approach you in a way that makes that difficult to do. You’ve got to demonstrate to him that you can meet him where he is and turn that around. Either, hey, lay off the stuff that’s not in the zone because he’s going to try to get you to chase. That’s a lot of times what we see Jordan do. That loan away slider has been a kryptonite for him. But okay, now suddenly you’re laying off the pitches that just are junk, right? And and the pitches you are going to offer at are going to be the competitive ones. But now you’re in a 2-1 count, you’re in a 3-1 count, you’re in a three- 0 count. All right, pitchers are either going to have to walk you or they’re going to have to respect that they have to throw you a strike. And there’s probably a lot more that goes into it than that. But that’s sort of what comes to mind when I think of Jordan Walker. you know, he’s spending too much time flailing at pitches that are not even really competitive pitches. And if pitchers know they can do that to you and it’s going to work, well, why would they do anything different? So, that’s where the zigg and zag that I feel like Brandt Brown is talking about comes from. And it’s just very interesting to hear it laid out by the hitting coach. You know, we we don’t hear a ton from Brandt Brown. We we talk a lot about him. Certainly earlier in the season, we were giving him a lot of credit for having the Cardinal offense where it was. It’s tailed off I think since then in terms of the consistency but obviously you know there’s a philosophy that’s being deployed and that the Cardinal are trying to get with all their guys but but specific to this conversation about Jordan Walker. They I mean you hear you hear a statement like that and it seems to me that a lot of the onus is being put on the player there. Like I said you can maybe say well that sounds a little bit basic. Why wouldn’t he be doing some of those things? But I think when you kind of take a step back and imagine, all right, Jordan Walker, first round pick, comes up, is just mashing everywhere he goes. It it wasn’t by virtue of his ability to read a scouting report that made Jordan Walker great in single A and double A, right? It wasn’t it wasn’t scouting reports that made him great back in high school. It was he was just that much better than everybody that he was facing. Here he is, arrives into the big leagues a few years ago and suddenly, you know, his natural talent can get him pretty far that first year, even though he did have to go back to Memphis for a spell. I think that was honestly more about his defense than it was his offense at the time. I know that they said they wanted him to hit the ball in the air and that was something they were working on with him. And I I regret that the Cardinals did that. I mean, I regret that they that that was such a focus because I wonder how much did that just permanently sort of tied Duran Walker into knots to say, “Man, I’ve done what I’ve done to this point.” And I’ve been very successful doing it. And even offensively, it’s not like he was having a terrible season. I think he had an OPS around 700 that first time he was sent down. But it was after two games or two days in San Francisco where he didn’t play right field in that spacious outfield that then the third day, if I’m remembering this correctly, the Cardinals sent him down. And it was, you know, that’s why I attributed it. I’m like, I know what they’re saying about his offense as I think we just got a little bit of a glimpse to my son’s first appearance on the podcast in the background calling for mom. But I I I I think about that season for Jordan Walker in 2023. He finished I know the number by heart. It’s a 787 OPS in 2023. That is what Jordan Walker finished the season with at the big league level. Came back, was productive, and I mean what the Cardinals wouldn’t give at this point for a 787 OPS. I would take that from anybody in the lineup. You could take the guys who are above that down and the guys who are below that up and everybody could be a 787 and you’re going to be one of the most productive offenses in baseball, if not the most, because that’s just a really good above league average contributor. And if you had eight or nine of those, you’d be you’d be in business. The problem for Jordan Walker is exactly what Brandt Brown alluded to. The adjustment that pitchers make to you, you have to be able to adjust back. And it seems like we get it in fits and starts from Jordan Walker, but it’s not consistent. It doesn’t carry from series to series. Is that because he’s, you know, what one pitching staff is trying to do to him, he’s able to combat, but the next makes a different adjustment that he’s not really equipped at this point in time to handle. What is the explanation for that? Is it the lack of consistency of his playing time? Because obviously, you know, that’s a factor in this as well. We’ve we’ve talked a lot about how once Nolan Gorman got to play regularly, we saw that big step forward from him in the consistency. The problem is though with Jordan, it really feels like it’s dayto-day. There will be a day where it looks like he’s just completely lost. and we are grasping trying to find and identify something positive from his game, from his day, so that we can latch on to that and say, “Here comes Jordan Walker.” And we’ve done it a number of times. I’ve certainly done it. I want Jordan Walker to be successful. Sue me. But I think if we step back and realize it’s going to take more than just a day or two of progress, it’s going to take maybe it sounds like a fundamental change because as Brand Brown said, once Jordan Walker is ready to be good in this league, he will be. I mean, that’s that’s really interesting to me to hear once Jordan Walker’s ready to be good and and do the things that it’s going to take for him to be good. It’s as much as this comes off as like, man, they’re really putting the onus on Walker. I mean, they’re really throwing the gauntlet down. He also said that’s a stones throw away. He’s a stones throw away from being able to do these things in the in the opinion of the Cardinals, but they, you know, it has to happen or you’re not going to get anywhere. And it feels like an appropriate time. Like I wonder like Brent Brown, you know, has not done those types of interviews often to my recollection and it feels like kind of an appropriate time to do like a public throw down the gauntlet on Jordan Walker. I don’t know how a kid reacts to that, but we can’t put the kid gloves on Jordan Walker or anybody else just because they’re 23 years old at this point. Third year in the big leagues. I mean, is it a little bit uncomfortable to have a guy, you know, your hidden coach talking about you like that on local radio on the the flagship of the St. Louis Cardinals? Sure. Yeah, I could see that. You know what else is uncomfortable? A 587 OPS or whatever I said he’s got. That’s uncomfortable because that doesn’t you don’t get bestowed playing time with those types of numbers. his OPS is 200 points lower than it was in 2023, which was, you know, kind of an incomplete season in and of itself. And and he struck out 104 times that year in 465 plate appearances. This year, he struck out 104 times, the same number, in 137 fewer play appearances. I mean, it’s he has regressed over the last two years. There’s no question about that. He has the physical tools. Is the mental side of it at this point so overwhelming that he is like it’s got to be to an extent overwhelming to be again the best player on every team you’ve been on and then you get to this point and you can’t seem to break through and you’ve got a lot of people in your ear telling you different things. You’re young, right? There’s a lot of stuff going on in life. It’s just I’m not I’m not ready to say Jordan Walker is not ever going to pan out, but what is going to be the change that that gets him to the point where he can get there and does it happen in St. Louis? I think becomes a very valid question. Like I said, maybe interesting timing for the beginning of September to hear, you know, Brent Brown kind of put that to Jordan Walker because I get the feeling that it’s a lot of what they’ve been telling him privately and now it’s set out publicly. Now, you could look at this in a bit of a through a critical lens and say, “Well, does it benefit Grant Brown and Olly Marl and the the the public perception of things to have this out public to where it’s now kind of more on the player than it is on the coaches to fix him, right? It’s like, hey, we’re telling him what to do. He’s just not if he does it, he’s going to get there. If he doesn’t do it, he’s, you know, we can’t make him listen.” Like that’s kind of an interesting PR thing, but I don’t listen to those quotes and feel like Brandt Brown is hanging Jordan Walker out to dry necessarily. But he is definitely being blunt, telling it like it is, at least how it feels like it is. Like, did anybody hear anything Brent Brown said there and say, “Oh man, that’s how could he say that about Jordan Walker? That doesn’t No, I don’t think anybody’s reacting that way. They’re surprised maybe that it’s that they’re that they’re seeing that that they’re hearing that and who they’re hearing it from and and you know that they’re hearing it on public St. Louis sports radio on the flagship. But like does anybody hear that and and combine it with having watched Jordan Walker play and say, “Oh, I don’t see what they’re talking about.” No. I I feel like it makes perfect sense what he’s saying. I feel bad. It’s it’s an uncomfortable situation because you you know you want to see Jordan Walker succeed, but right now he’s not even playing well enough to be able to get that quote unquote runway in the lineup. There’s other guy now. Do you have to start Nathan Church over Walker and right field? No, you don’t. I wouldn’t do that one singular more time. You know, Ollie probably disagrees with that because he did it yesterday. But I I I don’t I like Nathan Church from a defensive perspective. And maybe they’re just trying to maybe they feel like he’s he’s Michael Cian 2.0 or 1.5 and they’re trying to discern, hey, which of these guys do we keep or because we really don’t need them both as organizational depth and so they want to play church more knowing that with Walker, you know, it may not get fixed this September. It may need to be a decision of if we’re going to ride with him for another year and give this another try, we’re just going to have to be very stubborn about the the low ball trade offers we receive in in the winter. We’re not going to fix Jordan Walker magically in four weeks of September. And so it doesn’t really matter what he does now because it’s going to be a completely different story by the time he gets to spring in February. Yeah, maybe. Whereas with Church, they’re like, “We need to identify is this guy worth the 40man spot or do we need to cut him loose or is does he show enough promise where we cut loose instead and have that sort of backup defense glove first outfielder who hits from the left side behind Victor Scott? Victor’s the same thing, but I think Victor has more offensive upside ultimately and is is a better defender than the other two, even though the other two are very good. So maybe that’s a reason that you play more Nathan Church because we’ve talked about needing to evaluate certain guys and you know with Jimmy Crooks they’re going to look at him every other day. With Church they’re trying to give him every opportunity that they can to to evaluate. That’s fine. But with Walker it’s it is interesting timing like how does he respond to that in a way that we can evaluate over the next four four weeks before the season ends. So what the Cardinals do there with Jordan Walker remains to be seen. how much he plays down the stretch and and and I think more importantly what happens in the offseason. I think the physical tools are such that you want to cling to it with Jordan Walker. Like he’s a classic buy low if you’re 29 other MLB teams. If you’re the Cardinals, he’s the one guy that I would say I’m not going to sell low. Um I I’m not going to gift him playing time for 2026. And I don’t give a damn if he has to start in Memphis. Um, I I it’s not to say I want to see the Cardinals hold him hostage, but I want to see the Cardinals I want to see the Cardinals be able to break through with him. Whatever it takes. Some tough love. Maybe it is some tough love. Maybe this was the start of that. Maybe it’s something that’s been happening behind the scenes and he hasn’t responded to it the way they want. I’m just specul. I don’t know. But it’s notable that this interview happens. And look, I don’t know that Brandt Brown said, “All right, I’m gonna come on to this show and I know that somebody’s going to ask me about Walker and I’m ready to talk about him.” I’m not I’m not getting the tinfoil hat on to that to that to that perspective to that extent, but I just feel like it is notable that this happens because it is a crossroads with Jordan Walker. But I just don’t think if you’re the Cardinals, you can you can field calls on him and say, “Yeah, we’ll just take whatever, you know, we’re we’re setting out to move him and whatever we get is what we get. We’re just going to move on.” I don’t know that I would do that. In fact, I know that I wouldn’t because I would want to be stubborn about this particular player and and use him almost as the the beacon to say, “Hey, see this new version of the Cardinals, Hin Bloom, Surfolio, you know, the different different folks at the Larry Day, that’s more on the minor league side, but like our coaching staff as well, Ollie Marmal, Brandt Brown, like everybody, DASO, John J, all these guys, we’re we’re going to come together and and turn this around for Walker and that’s going to be our our beacon in our proof of concept that we’re heading in the right direction now isn’t work. Maybe a lot of pressure to put on one guy, but I I do think that that could serve to benefit the Cardinals if they can say, “Man, we know that this guy has physical tools.” Right now, it’s p it’s pitch selection. It’s needing to put in the work, which I would hope I would hope to think he’s putting in the work on the side, the extra stuff that it takes to be great. But would Brent Brown say all that if if they felt he was doing enough? Guess not. So there’s no level of oh well man that’s a really that’s really harsh to say to Jordan Walker. Like how could they say that? I think we are way past that point year three. I’m not one of those that says you know you have to give up on him because he hasn’t produced. I’m also not one of those that would say you know it doesn’t matter that Jordan Walker hasn’t produced. He’s only 23 years old and and there’s still so much time. like there is, but also I this this how how many years do we get to use that as a a reason for his slow going is the fact that well he came up at 21 years old or whatever it was 20 years old like at first that’s a nice kind of crutch to lean on at at this point he’s just one of the players that’s been around for several years and it’s on all of them to figure it out. Alec Burles had to come up and figure it out. A little bit older, you know, had more had college experience that Jordan didn’t have. And so you do maybe find an extra gear of patience with a guy, but eventually, you know, you have to be able to do the things that it takes to to become the guy you want to be or you just end up not doing it. And there’s no spite in it. There’s no, you know, Cardinals hate Jordan Walker. I don’t think that’s true. hearing this from Brand Brown and maybe not just Brand Brown. I understand that that conversation on KOX sparked then with the the writers with Oliver Marmal more conversation about Walker and uh Derek Gould wrote about it. I see the tweet of his article where the quote from Ali is quote I need to see Jordan have a sense of urgency for the things that need to take place in order to give him consistent results. They are putting the onus on the player to say here’s what we need you to do. And uh you guys can let me know in the comments whether that whether that strikes you as as fair, whether that strikes you as unfair, you like it, you don’t like it, because you know you guys a lot of people come at it from the perspective of I don’t trust or like Ollie Marl or think he’s a good manager or think he’s an authority on all of this. And so you might push back and say what is who is he to say? Well, I I kind of do believe him. I kind of do think he’s in authority and I do think he knows what he’s talking about. And again, if we’re clinging to, you know, Olly, who’s Ollie to say what Jordan needs to do to be successful, Jordan can, I mean, Jordan has not handled it on his own. I mean, he has not produced to this point. And so the authorities on this coaching staff, Oie Marl, Brandt Brown, folks in this organization, I am I am inclined to go, “Yeah, see what they have to say because they see it every day. And it’s uncomfortable to maybe have this implication out there that, well, is he not is he not putting in the work to get consistent results? Why would they why would they say that about Jordan if he if he, you know, if he was doing what he needs to do? That’s a weird thing to say. Well, the results suggest that there’s there’s something lacking. I need to see Jordan have a sense of urgency for the things that need to take place in order to give him consistent results. I know that there’s a lot of negativity. people saying, “Well, this saying this affects Jordan’s trade value.” You know, I see a comment reading the comments here on Derek’s post. Someone said, “Sad that Ollie has not made these things mandatory for the whole team. I don’t know how any successful manager that doesn’t know how to communicate with players the club’s processes and goals.” And it’s like you say mandatory. This is not grade school athletics. You know, this is this is the big leagues, man. As Tim Macarver would say. I like that Derek responded to that person and said, uh, players say that that’s one of the things that Marvel makes very clear to them. He recently met individually with every player to discuss them. Like, Ollie cannot do it for these guys. I understand that it feels like a copout to say, well, you know, why can’t he inspire them to do the things that they want done the sometimes it is the personnel and if the players are told here are the expectations, here are our processes, here are our goals, here’s how you can achieve them, here’s what you need to be doing from a work standpoint. The type of work you’re doing is to say the guys aren’t working hard. the type of work, the type of going above and beyond, targeted work, targeted scouting reports, all of that. I mean, what’s the phrase? You can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make him drink. That is how it feels. That is exactly what I think is going on with the Cardinals right now. And people are going to say, “Oh my gosh, you’re just taking up for Oie Marvel, defending Ole Marvel.” That’s just fine. You know, time will tell if that’s right or wrong, but it it feels as though there’s there’s a limit to what a manager and a coaching staff can do. Coach them up, talk to them, make them, you know, but when you say, “Oh, they should make it mandatory.” What does that mean? You’re going to get detention if you don’t listen. This isn’t this isn’t high school. This isn’t He’s not their He’s not their teacher. He’s their manager at the big league level, and they’re all making millions. I definitely think the best managers have the ability to get the most out of their players. No doubt about that. But you could go back into the 10 years of of I mean Widy Herszog is actually a great example of this where when he stepped away, when he resigned, it was because he knew that he could not get the players to listen to the philosophies that he was preaching that made him successful in in in those 90s Cardinals teams. He’s like, and and ownership was a problem, too, at the time. But at a certain point, you got to know your own limits. And even the greatest managers, Hall of Fame managers, have groups that don’t make it, don’t succeed, teams that don’t win. Tony Larusa had plenty of losing seasons, not really in St. Louis, but elsewhere. But you know what he did have in St. Louis? Personnel that’s a lot better than the personnel the Cardinals have right now. At least so far. We talk a lot about it being a young team. It’s not only a young team. their veterans on the team as well. But like trying to get the most out of all these guys, Jordan Walker included. I feel I’ve seen things that suggest the Cardinal coaching staff doing those doing that. Um, you can lead a horse to water, you can’t make him drink. We will see a what the reaction is to all this because I think a lot of it’s going to be, you know, people being negative on on Ali. But I think a lot of people, this is interesting. Again, I’m just kind of plugging through the comments here to to Derrick Gold’s article about the Walker stuff, the comments on Twitter. It’s just interesting to see what people are kind of saying to him. There’s a guy named Quentyn that says, “Listening to Skipper by Scott Miller has given me a new perspective on Ollie. He seems sabermetrically inclined and open to collaborating with the front office, yet also shows an old school mentality, especially with comments like these. Interesting combo. That’s actually spot on for what I think Oliver Marl is. And and I’m just not sure people I think I think people just look at a surface level view or they see him saying something critical of Jordan and then they take up for the player and say, “Oh, well, who is Ollie to be saying that?” I don’t know. He’s not the guy with a 587 OPS at a certain point. A player and that’s not even critical. It’s just he needs to show urgency if he’s going to get where he wants to go. You got to urgently want it. All right. Is that wrong? I don’t think that’s wrong to say. I don’t think it would be necessary to say it if the things behind the scenes were happening. So, you want you want guys to be coached up like I feel like this is what that looks like. You you got y’all can let me know if I’m off base on this or not. But interesting stuff from Brandt Brown and Ollie Marvel when it comes to Jordan Walker and and we’ll see what that ends up becoming. But let me know in the comments what you guys think about this and we’ll continue talking Cardinals baseball as we wind down the season and then honestly it gets more fun again when the the offseason arrives because a lot of these decisions will have to be made about this team and Heim Bloom’s going to be the one making them. So hit that subscribe button if you enjoy Cardinals content and let me know your thoughts below. We’ll talk to you next time on Bshave Daily. Peace.

Brant Brown’s recent appearance on KMOX spelled out the details on what the St. Louis Cardinals coaches believe needs to happen for Jordan Walker to become successful. And while the interview pointed out targeted ways that Walker needs to improve, it gets lost in the shuffle a bit that the Cards hitting coach also said he thinks Walker is just a stone’s throw away from being able to achieve these things.
Where do we come down on Brown putting the onus on the player to move Walker’s own career forward? Interesting comments and timing with the season winding down. We break it all down on this episode.

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