Do the Buffalo Sabres still feel the 1999 Stanley Cup loss to Dallas? | DLLS Stars Podcast

Do the Buffalo Sabres still feel the 1999 Stanley Cup loss to Dallas? | DLLS Stars Podcast

We should already be on. We’re 10 seconds into the show. We’re live now. Right now, I have to stop. You’re supposed to say you’re live. We’re live. Well, shoes are off. LS and I are Are we on the show right now? Nice. LS and I are barefoot because we’re in the podcast studio today. Was Brett Hull’s foot in the crease? Should the goal have been allowed? All of those questions can be answered with yes. We’re going to bring on some Buffalo Sabres guests today to not just talk about 1999, but also the current Buffalo Sabres and a lot of struggles, but maybe some brighter futures. Let’s start it here. DLS [Music] Cat said she’s going to unmute our mics and we are here. DLS stars, it is Wednesday, September 3rd. More importantly, it is Buffalo Sabres Day on the other 31. We got a break from it yesterday to hang out with Nathan Bastion. If you missed that show, please go watch crazy stories about his expansion draft to Seattle and plenty more. But today, we’re moving on to the Buffalo Sabres and we’re going to bring on our guest Joe Yan from Bleacher Report. Joe, thanks for joining us. How are you? I’m doing great, guys. It’s nice to be here with you. And uh yeah, I heard rumors 1999 was going to come up. I don’t know how that keeps coming up after all this time. It’s crazy. I heard you say, Sam, we’re moving on. Yeah, we are. Well, let’s move the Let’s move on. We’re going to move on, but we’re also going to talk about that as well. You want to How about this? Let me ask Let me ask you, take over. Do you want to start with that? Yeah, start with that. Let’s start with 1999 and get it out of the way, Joe. Okay. Let me before we bring up anything, your take on the 1999 bread hole game six goal that won the Stanley Cup for the Dallas Stars. Uh it was the one year out of a hundred that it probably shouldn’t have been a goal, but every but it would have been a goal in all the other hundred years. So, you know, like whatever it it was one of the dumbest rules that ever got put into hockey and that it was so dumb they took it away like five seconds after uh after Brett Hull scored. So, you know, whatever. like people here. Listen, I’m not I’m not from Buffalo. I didn’t grow up a Sabres fan. So, uh I don’t have the same burning, you know, part of my brain that that gets so mad about it all the time. But, um my my main memory of that game was I fell asleep on my girlfriend’s couch and woke up to Gary Thorne saying, “Oh, hang on a minute.” And then showing the replay over and over again. And I’m like, “Well, that’s not a goal.” Well, not this year anyways. And didn’t matter. watching Mike Madano skate around with the cup. So, it didn’t it didn’t matter. So, it’s you know, it was done and over with. Done and over with. And I I like to move on, but every time anything’s posted, it’s like, “Congratulations to the 20-y year anniversary or whatever, there’s some Buffalo fans in the comments. Wasn’t a goal. Shouldn’t have been allowed.” So, let’s go through it right now real quick. Cat, pop up the screenshots. The rule is Now, can Joe see this? The rule was Joe can see this. The rule was that when the puck if the puck was not in the crease or the player did not have possession of the puck, you cannot go in the crease or the goal is disallowed. So here’s the original shot. I believe it was from the wall from my from Madonna or Letin. Puck comes in the crease. Hix makes the save. Go ahead Cat to the next one. Holes in there. He gets Who was that again that tried to clear him out? Do you remember? Number 19. 19. Nice puck. Oh god. So next one. Cat. Hosic scrambling. You can see here Brett Hull kicking the puck. So the the explanations that I read possession said that this kick was what gave Brett Hole possession of the puck. So go ahead to the next one. He makes a great play to kick it to his stick. This is the famous picture right here that everybody looks at the skate in the crease, the puck not in the crease. But as we just said, they deemed that he had possession of the puck at this moment. Gets it to his stick and then the next one is history as he scores. The Stars win game six and win the Stanley Cup 1999. The reviews went on forever. I watched a ton of videos on this last night. They had the stars already in the room drinking beer out of the Stanley Cup while the Sabres refused to leave the room. So much chaos going on. It was just a a crazy moment. So Joe, let me ask you this. Why do you think, and the answer might be obvious, why do you think Buffalo fans still jump in this? Because it’s not like this was a play that if it went the other way, Buffalo wins the Stanley Cup, right? It’s that it was game six, Buffalo needed to win two more. So, why is this still burning so deep in Buffalo fans minds? Uh, it plays into a few different things for for Buffalo fans. Um, there’s always a feeling that the referees are out to get them. Uh, if you pay attention to to Twitter or any social media during a Bills game and there’s a questionable call, there’s been more than a few of them the last few playoffs for the Bills uh that got fans all up in arms about stuff. So you it plays into that sort of I don’t know if it’s an insecurity or whatever, but there’s that side of it. It’s also that’s as close as the Sabres have ever come to winning the cup. I mean, when they were there in the 70s and they were against the Flyers, that was not that was not a close series, but um but they’re there in 99 and they had the greatest goalie in hockey and Dominic Hashik. And you know, when you’ve got that guy to kind of neutralize everything, that that that makes you believe you can you can win all of it. And you know, at that time in the NHL, scoring was low and you got a guy that can stop everybody. Well, you’re going to think you’ve got the be you’ve got the best chance to win. And you really did. But um you know, you get a weird rule that only existed for one year. It plays into a lot of the conspiracy theory people uh that that happen to be involved in in Buffalo sports when it comes to fandom, but um it, you know, it that that doesn’t help. And then, you know, they’ve only made it even that far one two other times and those times were 18, 17 years ago, you know, like 18, 19 years ago. So, it’s, you know, you get a moment like that, it sticks in everybody’s mind. It’s It’s kind of like Scott Norwood missing missing the field goal in Super Bowl Super Bowl 25. All right, Luds, we’re going to move on. Let’s just Craig Lewig won that Stanley Cup, second Stanley Cup. But before we move on, I want to remind everybody Big Brothers Big Sisters month here at DLS this whole week. We’ve replaced our super chat button with a donate button. So go donate to Big Brothers Big Sisters. We have all kinds of awesome things going on this week. There is the information down in the bottom. Let’s move on from 1999. So I don’t even get the response. I’m going to respond. You can respond. Well, I’m going to You were yelling at me. No, I want to move on to something bigger, better, brighter for the Buffalo Sabres. Okay, Joe. It’s only been 14 years since they’ve been in the playoffs, right? So, we’re moving on. We’re coming to some bigger, more uh optimistic times. Yes. So, generally, I would start you out with a question about the general manager, right? But I I look at this and I go, I think it’s got to go higher than that. So, can you talk to me? What are your feelings with Terry Pagula and how he handles or doesn’t or however you feel about Pagula running or being the head of this whole program? Well, Terry’s uh I I’d love to say that we talked to Terry a lot and we hear from him a bunch, but we haven’t heard him since he fired Jason Botrol back in what 2020 I think it was. Uh he hasn’t spoken to us on the record. He’s been at different events and whatever, but uh the last interview or press conference availability he’s he’s he’s had period uh was when they fired Jason Botrol, which is u incredible, frankly. Um so, you know, I mean, they’re building a new stadium for the Bills. We, you know, the Sabres haven’t made the playoffs in in ages, so you know, there’s a lot that he could be talking about, but we don’t hear from him. We hear from Kevin Adams. We hear from Lindy Ruff. We hear from everybody else. But um when it comes to Terry, people like to compare the Bills and the Sabres and you know it’s the same ownership. How are things so different? And the thing I like to point out is that Terry didn’t grow up a Bills fan. He grew up a Sabres fan. He was a big Sabres fan. U you know, think back to when he met Jill Bear Perau after he met, you know, after he bought the team and he had tears in his eyes. That was his hero growing up. So Terry’s like having the one of your biggest fans owning the team and pulling the strings and making the calls and wanting to be in heard in on the decisions. You know, one of the reasons they fired Jason Botrol was that ownership felt like they weren’t being listened to. Kevin Adams is a guy that’s been involved with the organization in some fashion or another for years going, you know, going going back to, you know, when he was helping, you know, run the, you know, the hockey academy, running Harbor Center, the the rink next door, all this stuff. So, he’s somebody who’s very indebted to the Pigoulas and he’s a guy that pagas love. So, um, he’s also a guy that’s got to make sure that Terry’s opinions are heard and respected and for better or worse, uh, heated when it comes to decisions. So, that’s, you know, it’s he’s not the GM. He’s not like Jerry Jones, so to speak, but he has influence on a lot of the decisions that are made player-wise. So, for better or for worse, depending on how you feel about different signings and whatnot, he’s he plays a big part in it. And it’s just it gets downplayed a lot because Kevin Adams does have total control of running the show. But Terry’s voice is heard very very prominently throughout a lot of the decisions. Slide into that then for me because that would be my next question is your your thoughts on on how Kevin has built or is trying to construct this team. I think Kevin Kevin was handed a very difficult job. you know, um, you know, he was hired and he was happy to be hired, but, you know, when he took over, he had to fire tons of people. You know, he had to basically clean house of all the scouts, the, you know, the AHL coaching staff, um, the coaches, you know, everything. Everybody got swept, essentially swept out. Uh, and Kevin had to kind of build up build everything back up again. And then you factor in that, you know, Jack Eel sees all this change happening and he wants out. I know you’re running into Sam Reinhardt’s contract coming up in a couple years and he ain’t coming back. Um, you know, they had a lot of hard decisions they had to work on immediately and that’s that makes a a tough job for even the most experienced GM. I mean, imagine, you know, like a Ken Holland or somebody like that walking into that job day one, it’s like, “All right, fire everybody. By the way, your best player wants a trade. Your other best player is probably not coming back. uh you might need to trade him too. We’ve got a couple other guys that aren’t happy as well. Good luck. You know, that’s kind of what Kevin Adams has had to run into. But, you know, he’s been on the job now 5 years. This is his team. You know, this this whole team is is what he’s built. And if they weren’t guys that were drafted by him, they were guys that were good enough to keep around after the fact. You don’t trade a Raasmus Dalene unless Raasmus Dalene says he wants out, which he’s not at that point. Not yet. But not yet. if things keep going badly, you can’t blame him if he did. So, we’re not at that point yet. Dene’s a ruthless competitor. So, he’s he wants this as bad as anybody. But, you know, if they keep spinning their wheels and they keep finishing out of the playoffs. I mean, Delane might want out and then there might be another GM and a whole bunch of other people that might coming in to try to be the next person with the answers. Well, okay. Well, I was going to ask one more, but you led me right into that. is is the next person is the next person just got hired there and I’m I’m curious who hired Yarmmo Pelin if people don’t know who who was that Kevin or was that Terry Pagula and do you think it’s difficult for Kevin I mean having a guy that’s been a general manager has a good reputation kind of looking over his shoulder well they were looking for an experienced person to to kind of help out with the staff and I believe that was Kevin that was part of that. Um, they wanted another voice, another experienced person to be involved. I don’t I don’t know that that was Terry that was involved. I think if it was Terry that was leading the charge on that one, I think it would have been a more familiar face. Yarmo’s different because he’s not somebody with any Saber connections. You know, he he has no entanglements with the uh with the organization previously. He’s not a guy who, you know, played for the Sabres. He’s not a guy who has any history with the organization. He’s completely an outside voice, which would make you tend to believe that if Kevin Adams is fired, he’s the next guy in line because you’re going to have to change things up in a big way to kind of clear the air. And Yarmmo would be that guy. Um, you know, certainly Yarmmo’s history in Columbus, he’s, you know, he’s he’s found ways to be successful in a in a market that, you know, doesn’t doesn’t have a lot of heft to it. It’s kind of similar to Buffalo. Um I know the situation at Columbus is is its own brand of particular, but he did well there. Um it’s just that sometimes change is needed and that’s what that’s what happened there. But um but Yarmmo is a Yarmmo’s Yarmmo is a different kind of voice. he’s a different kind of experience there and he’s going to stay in the background so to speak like he’s not going to be sort of you know puppeteering behind the scenes but um but his insight is a lot different than the staff they’ve got on hand because those guy the the staff on hand now are all very hand you know they’re Kevin’s guys they’re handpicked or they’ve been in the organization for a very long time so those are all very familiar voices a completely different guy go ahead I’ll shut up okay no you’re good you’re We’re going to hit a break. Okay. So, I don’t even get to ask questions. Joe, we’re going to hit a break and then we will get more with Joe Uran and the Buffalo Sabres right after this. All I get to do is talk about ads. That’s my favorite thing. But this is actually a fun one for me. And it’s game time. Game time is simply the best way to get tickets. NFL season is about to start. 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The shades rated five stars be by over 300,000 people. Thanks, Craig. You’re welcome, Ch. All right, let’s bring Joe back on here. Joe, I I promised you were going to move on from 1999, and we are, but this question is going to talk about someone who was involved in that, and that’s Lindy Ruff. Uh I I’m not even going to give you a a real question here. Just take us through why they made that decision, the whole transition, and then I guess where is his leash at in this whole thing with the way that Buffalo’s going? Uh, well, I if you go back to the day they they fired Don Granado as head coach and Kevin Adams Kevin Kevin Adams described the kind of coach that he wanted to bring in, it sounded like he was describing Lindy Ruff to a tea. Uh, which makes sense because he was a he was an assistant on Lindy’s staff back in 2012, 2011, 2012. Um, had plenty of experience with him and knew him for years already. Um, and of course, you know, everybody in Dallas knows Lindy Ruff, you know, because he came from Buffalo to to become a Stars coach. But, um, but the his style of game, his hard-nosed, not exactly cudd cuddly personality was what they were looking for uh to kind of change the attitude in the room, I guess, or the way players were paying attention to the game itself and and and and all that. They wanted they wanted their young guys to kind of grow up and the the players even said after Don was fired that they wanted more accountability. They wanted somebody that was going to hold their feet to the fire and well they got their wish and a lot of guys didn’t really adjust to it very quickly and struggled with it last season. And um you know for a lot of those young guys that was a going from Don Granado to to Lindy Ruff is a 180 degree change of everything. Like that’s you know Don’s a players coach. He’s, you know, he’s a teacher. He’s a guiding hand. Lindy is a is a taskmaster. It’s do your job or you’re not playing, period. And that kind of adjustment was really tough. And Lindy even admitted to us that he was kind of going easy on the guys the first few weeks of the season cuz he wanted to get a feel for their personalities and, you know, how much they could take and how much, you know, how much they can’t take. And I think, you know, if it was classic old school indie, we would have seen a lot of lineup changes very early in the season and some guys getting benched a lot sooner than they did. But, uh, he tried to be fair and try to do that. But, you know, once losses started piling up, you kind of run out of time to make those choices. And, you know, once guys seem to snap around to what he wanted and what he’s looking for and what he needs from them, things kind of changed. the second half of the season they were a much better team. The problem was they had an 010 and3 run in November and December that ended the season for them essentially that put them so far back. They couldn’t come back from that. And seeing Lindy to be at a loss for words as those lo losses mounted was stunning honestly because you know he’s a guy that you know after losses he’s not going to exactly you know hold back his feelings but he was just he didn’t have answers for for how to fix what was going wrong at that time but you know the second half of the year things changed and you’re hoping that that carries over into this season but there’s still a lot of things that need to get straightened up. the goalending, the special teams, all that stuff has to get a lot better for them to be a playoff team. I’m glad you brought up Lindy. I I I had a couple little chats with Lindy when he was here. There were some things that I was uh commenting on that he didn’t prefer to hear, I think, and called me into the office and wanted to show me videos of how how they play and things like that. So, Joe, this team, they can score goals, right? They’re in the they’re in the top 10 uh in the league. I think last year again it is about the other end of the rink and like you mentioned you know goalending and everything else and it was kind of similar to some things that were happening here at at one point and I had I had made a comment like you know when your goalending isn’t where you expect it to be. I think you have to tweak your game a little bit. you don’t exploit your weaknesses, which was a goalending issue here for a period of time or a time in particular, and I didn’t understand opening the game up. So, I guess when it comes to me for a Lindy question, and you mentioned it right in the beginning about having the dominator there, you know, you got a good goalie, you can play a certain way because they clean up a lot of the mess. Does he make an adjustment to play a little bit better in his own zone or coming back the other way or does it just get directed at the goalender or is it more what’s happening in front of them and from a systemic, you know, situation? Well, I think part of how they’re fixing that is is the changes they’ve made on defense this year. You know, you trade JJ Burko away to get Michael Kessle ring. Uh he’s a big guy, big shot, lays the body, will fight occasionally. That’s the exact kind of guy that they’ve been they’ve been wanting to have on defense here in Buffalo. I think probably since 1999, frankly, because there haven’t been a lot of those big thumper type of defenseman. Not that Kessle Ring’s a thumper, but like he hits hard. He’s 6’5, 6’6, so he’s he covers a lot of space and and he’ll fight. So like that covers that covers all the needs for what Savers fans want. But you throw him in there, you add Connor Timonss to the group and, you know, you take out, you trade away uh Connor Clifton, you’ve got a different sort of makeup for the defensive group and one that hopefully helps Owen Power break out a little bit more because he’s been good at the little things that you don’t see in the box score, but the box score stuff isn’t there, and fans hate it, and he doesn’t play physically defensively, so fans hate that, too. Uh, but Dene does all that stuff. He’s an elite defenseman, so they’re fine there. But, um, to have better play in the defensive end, to be tougher around the net, clear guys away, all the all the dirty work stuff, they needed guys to do that to help out the goalending. And frankly, they needed to help the pen the penalty kill. Penalty kill was so bad last year, and it’s gotten worse the last couple years. power play needs to be better, but uh defensively speaking, Ukulelean could use the help in his own end to help him clean things up. You could see him get frustrated last year watching some of the decisions made around his net. And when you see that body language go for a goalie where he’s just like, h, come on guys, that’s bad. That’s that’s really bad. And we saw that we saw that a few times from him in the second half of the season. And um I think fixing that is going to go a long way to helping out. And if it doesn’t help, it could be tough because you know it’s it’s Lucin, it’s Alex Lion, and you got Deon Levi still hanging around in the AHL. So he’s he’s waiting for his chance, too. Glad you brought up Owen Power. I don’t know. Did you know Owen Power played college hockey? I was going to warn you about this. So if there’s any college people on the roster, Sam goes, I was going to ask about it whether you brought it up or not, but Owen Power, uh big name player from Michigan in the Big 10. Had all kinds of accolades in the Big 10. and I think he has three full seasons now. What What’s his ceiling and what are the expectations around Buffalo for him right now? Fans would love to see him be more physical. Um, but I’ve been trying to tell the fans for years that’s never been his game. It’s literally never been his game. You know, he was told at a young age, you can’t be physical. You’re going to be in the penalty box all game long because he was bigger than everybody when he was younger. So, he just said, you know what? I’m also faster. I’m also better with the puck than everybody. So, I’ll just skate by everyone and make plays, which turned out to be really good for him. Um, I want to see more of that from him now. I want to see the confidence there in his game where he can he can do those things and not have to worry about it. A lot of times he’s so cognizant of where his defense partner is and what his responsibilities are and supposed to be that sometimes he’s too cognizant of what his defense partner should be doing, too. And he’s like, “Uhoh, that guy’s in deep. I better get back, right? No, no, no, no, no, no. Don’t do that. You stay up and tell your partner to get their rear end back there and play defense instead. So, I think that’s the hope with bringing in Kessle Ring and Timmons that one of those two guys are going to be able to be the right-handed shot partner so that he can stay on the left side and essentially take the big step that we saw take a couple years ago. I think I think there’s still a huge upside for for P’s game. It’s not like he’s been bad. I mean, we’re talking like a 3540 point season. You want to see more, but he’s also fighting for fighting with Dalene for ice time and power play minutes and all that stuff and that’s really tough to do when you’ve got Raasmus Dene there. So, and Bo Byum’s still there, too. So, it’s, you know, it’s it’s a little bit of a crowded house, but uh to me that Power does all the other little things so well. you know, he’s he’s got the long reach. He can deny entries. He can he’s so good positionally. He shuts down passes and shots just as likely, but he’s not pushing guys out of the crease. He’s not, you know, dunking guys in the corner. He’s not doing any of that stuff. So, people think he’s not doing his job. He does everything else. He’s great. Uh, Joe, you mentioned Byron before and and I I was thinking about him and and I was just curious, is it is it surprising to you that he signed a two-year deal and maybe that was on his end or maybe the team’s end. I’m curious about the length of that. The other thing is I I think I was listening to an interview, he might have been doing it with with Marty Baron and and sometimes I like to listen what how players say things and you know he was talking about getting an opportunity here, getting an opportunity there, but there was one line that caught my attention. He said something like, “I I I’ve got a lot more to give.” And so I I’m not Is he asking for more opportunity or more ice time? And did do you think that has anything to do with the length of the contract? I think he definitely wants more ice time. Um, and I think he’ll get it. I think he’ll be back on uh Dalene’s uh pairing again this year, just with the other moves that they made. It just kind of makes sense to me because Byron had his best play of the season while he played with Dene, which let’s be fair, Dene helps make everybody look a lot better by being an extremely great defenseman. So, um, but it allowed Byum to be a little bit more like what I think we expected him to be when he was when he was drafted, uh, you know, with a top five pick. I think that’s what everybody kind of wanted from him is to kind of push the game, be a little physical, and just, you know, just play the game the way he wants to. Um, I think he wants to have that power play time. He kind of has to fight with power for it on the second power play. You know, teams have gone away from having two defenseman on the power play. So, it’s a little awkward when when you see teams do it, and they tried it last year, just didn’t work. But, there’s a lot of things that didn’t work on the power play. Um, but in Byron’s case, the the the two-year deal to me just made sense business-wise. Um, maybe not for the Sabres sake because you’re talking about, you know, if things aren’t going well, you’re talking about trading them in a year, year and a half maybe at the deadline because it walks them right to unrestricted free agency. And that’s not ideal for anybody except for Bo Byum because now he might be able to really clean up in a couple of years on a free agent deal or an extension with Buffalo if it really goes goes well here. But um it was an awkward summer because the the feeling once the season ended and we spoke with him really felt like he was going to be traded for a forward upgrade and it never materialized and then Purka was traded for a defenseman and we’re like okay what’s going on here? we this none of this computes and yeah they resigned Byum and he’s good like it’s not like he’s a bad player he’s a very good player but um you do wonder how they’re going to replace some of the offense lost from Burka but you’re you’re asking your younger forwards to to kind of step up and grow up a bit there too all right Joe last one for you here something we’ve been doing with all of our guests on this series uh from your perspective being Buffalo what do you think of the Dallas Stars going into 202526 I think I’m going to go into my third straight year at Bleacher Report picking them to win the Stanley Cup final. Well, stop doing it then. I You know what? I’m starting to feel guilty. Um it’s I I said it two years ago that when I picked them that year, um that this was a team that is built to win and they’re, you know, they’re ready to do it now. Now that they’ve got Rontinan involved and I know the Robertson thing is going to be talked about forever until something happens there either he resigns or there’s a move which be crazy to move them but I get it. Um they’re loaded. Dallas is absolutely loaded. I think they I I think that the the the questions for them are on defense outside of Harley and he’s skinn obviously, but um you want the depth to be a little bit better there. But Jayer so good and he even had like a slightly off season last year, but he was still great. Casey De Smith helped, you know, make up for some of that, you know, you playoffs. Forget whatever happened in the playoffs there. But um but this is a team that’s got so much talent and you know they they’ve still got guys coming up through the AHL that can make it there. It’s just the West is a murder slog in the playoffs. I mean just the division alone is is absolutely sinister. I mean you’re fighting to win to finish first and if you don’t finish first you’re playing Winnipeg or Colorado. Maybe now you’re playing St. Louis. Maybe you’re playing Utah in the first round and it’s like, oh geez, like we got to get past these guys and then we got to play Winnipeg, St. Louis, who somebody somebody else really good and then you’re playing Vegas or Edmonton or, you know, LA if they could ever beat Edmonton, I guess maybe, which doesn’t seem likely. Anyways, but like it it is such an evil road to try to get to the cup final that I understand why Dallas hasn’t gotten over the hump, but at the same point I’m like just get there once because I know they can win it. All right, Joe, anything else? No, that’s great. I was going to ask something. I know we’re going to bleed into the other one, so I’m just going to leave it alone. Yes, we we have a we get notorious of dragging on here once in a while because we we love having you, Joe. You were great. Uh, thanks so much and thanks for being a good sport about the whole 1999 conversation. Rachel Lindsay is next and maybe we won’t have to talk to her about it, but Joe, thanks so much for hopping on with us. Thank you, Joe. Appreciate it, guys. Thanks. All right, there goes Joe of Bleacher Report. Next up is Rachel Lindsay of Buffalo News and more Buffalo Sabres talk right after this. Before we get to that Cowboys trip you guys are dying to hear me talk about. No, I said before cat, before we get to it, we’re gonna talk about something more important and that’s Big Brothers Big Sisters. This whole month, let’s first of all, All City Network has partnered with Big Brothers Big Sisters, which is amazing. They do some incredible things. I’m going to read something off their website real quick. Their mission is to create and support onetoone mentoring relationships that ignite the power and promise of youth. 96% of their littles maintain or improve their grades. 93% intend to finish high school. 71% maintain or improve relationship with their parents. And 97% of littles say their relationship with their big is very important to them. So why not donate? We’ve replaced our super chat button with a donate button below. So go ahead and find that. We have all the information link in the description. Big Brothers Big Sisters all week, all month here at DLS and all city. So make sure you support. Now we can talk about the DLS Cowboys trip. DLS is headed to Las Vegas with true fan travel for a once-ina-lifetime experience. The Cowboys and DLS Sports are headed to Vegas for the first time ever to play the Las Vegas Raiders at Allegiance Stadium on Monday Night Football. True fan travels bringing the ultimate Dallas Dieard experience to Sin City with even with self-travel packages available. Join hundreds of passionate fans for a legendary weekend with Cowboys Pride, unbeatable nightlife, and a stadium takeover at Allegiant for Monday Night Football. Expect exclusive fan events, premium accommodations, and unmatched game day energy while staying at the luxurious Mandandalay Bay. Amazing trip, three nights stay at the at the Mandalay Bay, game tickets, VIP parties, and plenty of exclusive stuff with the DLS crew and diehard fans. This is how Dallas does Vegas. So, make sure you book now at truefantra.com and get there for what should be a good game. 31 to 24 Ardell says for the Raiders. Let’s move on. Now, we have our guest. We have Rachel Lindsay of Buffalo News coming in to join the show. Rachel, how are you? Welcome. Hi, guys. How’s it going? It’s good to see Craig Lewig. Craig, a lady never tells, but I remember watching you when you won a Stanley Cup with the Montreal Canadians and you had those massive shinuards to block shots. All right. All right. Let’s take all every other question off the table. I remember. Let’s just talk about Craig Lewig for the next 30 minutes. Rachel, why why do you got to start like that? Why not? Hey, you got to be recognized. I’m trying to make you feel important. So, those were the good old days, right? Right. Right. Okay. Well, let’s You haven’t had many good old days in Buffalo there, have you? Oh, no. No. Um, full disclosure, this is my first year covering the Sabres. I covered college football for the last 10, 12 years. And when I took the Sabres beat, everybody said, they said two things to me. Oh, congratulations. That’s great. You’re covering the NHL. Or, you sure you want to get into this? I said, well, I said I covered some pretty bad college football teams. I covered, you know, some pretty bad hockey teams when I was covering college in the AHL. Used to cover the Sabres minor league teams as well, but I’m glad to be back covering hockey. Something is a sport I’ve always enjoyed. Well, Rachel, we we were talking to Joe about this also. You know, 14 years without, you know, playing a playoff game. Um, where where do you think that there could be a tweak anywhere, whether it’s management, coaching, players, systems? Is there is there anything that you can point to? Don’t say all of the above, but is is there an area that right? Yes. Is there an area there that you you think that they should where they should start when it comes to improvement or tweaking something? You know, where do we begin? You know, not everywhere, but I I my first thought is one uh Paka Lucan. He’s got to raise his game, play consistently. I’m going to think that’s getting my ear warm today. They’ve got to be consistency in goal. They also have to establish a hierarchy in goal. There’s UPL. They’ve signed Alex Lion. Always want to get a good consistent number two. Devin Levi is the goalie of the future, but it might help him to get that one more year of consistent reps in the AHL to build up because he had a very strong AHL year. But in the few games that he was in in the NHL wasn’t great. You know, as the Sabres went, he went and vice versa. Not good. You know, I I think they got it’s got a starting goal. I also think uh Ryan Mloud, the Sabres showed a big investment in him by signing him to that $5 million a year contract. And uh you know, he’s going to be the guy to pick up the slack where JJ Purka, you know, had it last year and then got moved to Utah as well, too. So, I think they also have to establish a leader offensively or someone who’s going to rise to the occasion a little more offensively. So, yeah, goalending, stronger offensive production. All right, Rachel, I promise I’m not piling on. These are just facts. Uh, it just sounds like you’re piling on when you say facts about Buffalo, but they have the longest active streak miss in the playoffs of any team that’s in its tie with the New York Jets 14 seasons. General open-ended question. When does this team get back to the playoffs? Oh god, that’s a question year in Buffalo. I mean, I can remember the last time they made the playoffs in 2011. I was remember watching they they were playing the Flyers and I thought, why is Rob Neer Meyer taking really bad penalties? Little did I think that was going to be the last time I ever saw the Sabres in the playoffs as well. Um, you know, I the optimist in me says they’re going to sneak in this year. You know, maybe got that last wildcard spot. the pessimist in me says, you know, tear it all down if they’re out by December. That that is the big I’m I’m hedging a little bit here, but at the same time, again, you have to be realistic and like, you know, facts don’t lie, even though they always say don’t let facts get in the way of a good story. But, you know, I I think if they’re going to make it, they’re going to they’re going to sneak in this year. Otherwise, burn it all down if it’s if it’s if it’s not if it’s not going by December. Does it make it even harder that it’s kind of getting worse? Like I’m looking over the last few years and they end with 91 points, then 84 points, then 79 points last year. So it’s it’s not necessarily getting better, which I imagine makes it even harder for fans and the organization to stay patient. Oh, another thing that factored in last year, coaching change. And organizationally, it’s been proven people are resistant to change. Scientific studies have been done by this. Organizational psychological studies have been done by this. Lindy Ruff comes in for his second tour of duty. Uh the team’s getting ready to go to Europe. Lindy had maybe a week, a week and a half to put his philos philosophies in and then the team’s got to pack up and go to Europe. I mean, they’re juggling 14 different playbooks here. It’s not easy to do. There’s this whole wave of change going in. And it took the team a long time just to get on the same page together. I would say probably the last 20, 30 games last season, but you kind of saw the rhythm going. They were also boosted by James Rymer in goal who gave them consistency and basically supplanted UPL and kind of helped build some good vibes among the you know f among the team final year. They also lost Josh Norris who was got acquired in the trade from Ottawa and was hurt. So there went that offensive production or productivity or possible productivity as well too. So yeah, I think that’s kind of what’s going to change. They’re going to have a full training camp with Lindy. uh you know some of these guys are you know playing for roster spots. You know Alex Tuck has a lot to prove this year. He’s in the final year of his contract as well too. So you know I really think this is going to be a makeorb breakak time for this team and for a lot of guys on this team. You know, Rachel, when you mentioned Montreal, it makes me think of, you know, it’s a different era and the games need to be entertaining, right? I mean, and you want to entertain the fans. And so, I remember being at a a bar. Shocker. And a fan had come up to me in Montreal and just said, “Man, you you guys are boring. I mean, games are 2:1, 3:1, you know, and I said, “Well, would you rather have us win hockey games or, you know, be a 5-3 game and and lose a hockey game?” Oh, no, no, no. we want you to, you know, we want to win hockey games and, you know, get a chance to win the Stanley Cup. And so it makes me think of Buffalo or is that getting old that they’re entertaining? They’ve almost in their games last year, there’s almost a combined 600 goals. Basically, there’s six and a half to seven goals a game. So, it’s entertainment, but is it time from the fan standpoint like if hey, if we got to dumb this game down, we just want to win. Or do you think they’re kind of in the middle of that? You know, I I wrote an article, you know, last week or two weeks ago about, have you ever seen the ESPN, the sports misery index that just came out? It’s the interactive tool that measures, you know, how long you’ve been a fan, you know, how miserable are you? I tal, you know, Buffalo Sabers fans were voted as, you know, being in agony. I talked to one guy who said, “If they just make the playoffs, that’s all I ask for. You know, I will cry if they make the playoffs.” That’s what someone said to me. But I said, “Wow, y’all are, you know, the thing is the fan base here is very passionate. It is very invested. It is, if you look at social media, they can be very frustrated as well, too. It’s almost as if seeing what’s going to happen is entertaining within itself and the winning is a bonus.” And that’s I don’t know if Saber fans have been relegated to that or if hope springs eternal every year. You know, I’m you know, I’m an optimist, but I’m also a skeptic by nature. So, I’m kind of like, oh, they’re going to do well about that. But when it comes to the fans, there is definitely an investment in the fan. I mean, in the Buffalo news, the Sabres are one of the top readership topics as well. People still care here. All right, Rachel, I’m going to talk ask you about something actually positive. I promise no negative spins to this whatsoever. The Sabres have one of the best power forwards and goal scorers in the game. Paige Thompson scores 44 this year. Tied with Alex Ovuchkin. I think it was third tied for third in the NHL. He had 47 a couple years ago. What talk to us about his development into the position and how important he is for a team that clearly needs to score goals. Hey TA and he was he was also what the leading Americanborn scorer last year as well. know he and Rasmus Dalene and Alex Tuck those are the marquee players as well and as you see by Tasa’s contract you know he’s he’s invested in this and but he can’t do it alone you know he he cannot and it’s been kind of hard you know the s there’s the salary cap limitation free agency let’s be real it wasn’t great this year sabers also need to do a better job of building around Tage in particular as well too and That’s kind of a long-term project, but we can’t go long term. I mean, it’s it’s win now or else. And let’s let’s be real, you know, you don’t win games, things are going to change. So, uh it’s Ta T is a leader. He has to be leader. Also, he helped his profile by scoring the golden goal in the world championships as well. So, everybody’s going to be looking at him right now, you know, which is actually takes a little pressure off Alex Tuck again as he’s going into the contract year also. But, you know, Tate is one of those guys. He’s got to set the tone for the rest of the roster as well, too. And guys will follow. And I think, you know, kind going off the path a little bit, acquiring guys like Josh Don and and Michael Castle Ring will kind of help buy that in. You know, I get the impression from Josh and Michael Castle Ring is that, you know, they kind of want to help turn things around. It’s not an easy thing to do in Buffalo, but if you can get those guys that are flexible, that have a little belief, they help players like Tage Thompson, not just on the ice, but in the locker room and in the cultural dynamic of the team and of a roster. All right, Rachel, we got plenty more with you next. We’re going to hit a break here on DLS. Rachel, we’ll be right back. Don’t go anywhere. First, I get to tell you guys about being a diehard. We still have a our $36 sale, football club sale going on right now. $36 if you scan that QR code right there to become a diehard. And you know what you get? You get a free t-shirt. Of course, you can pick one of these awesome ones. The 88 Club uh Dem boys and can’t even see the one on the bottom, but there are some awesome new shirts here at DLS. You can get some awesome other shirts as well. We have the DLS collection, which I’m actually wearing Otter shirt as well. And you know what? Let’s talk about that Otter shirt real quick. I do because Luds yesterday, if you missed the show, I walked into the studio yesterday wearing that shirt and was all excited because I said, “Loods, we’re matching. Wearing the same shirt, same colored pants, looking the same top to bottom, looking fly.” And LS marched into GM Ben’s office and forced him to give him a different shirt so he wouldn’t be matching. He didn’t think that I’d be hurt by that, but I told my therapist about it for an hour last night. Who’s the dumb one? Who got a new shirt? Who got You did. Did you get to keep it? Heyo. Heyo. Which one was it? It was DLS. One of the originals. But you can get the DLS collection, which I’m wearing here. We have tons of cool shirts on that with this. This is the barbecue one. I believe we have the Dallas versus all y’all. We have the crazy horrifying mascot one. Uh the Nolan Ryan, the big text. There’s tons of awesome shirts. If you become a diehard, you get awesome exclusive events. We had Bobby’s uh film event, I believe last Monday, which went super well. got some dieards into the studio. They got to sign the wall, some traditions building here that you can be a part of by becoming a diehard. You also get all of the writing from all of our teams here. Adree, you get all kinds of things. You get your own little custom card, which I still never got. Uh, so I don’t know if I’m actually a diehard or not, but I know our dieards have it. It’s a very cool card. So, become a diehard today. We also have the DLS newsletter that goes out every day in the morning giving you the latest and greatest on all of our shows, articles, and some things popping up. So, make sure you check that out. All dls.com/dhard. $36 football intro offer will not last forever. Make sure you scan that code now and become a diehard. All right, let’s bring Rachel back in for some more Buffalo Sabres talk. Luds, you’re up. Well, I’m gonna I’m gonna take off on your foolish question you just asked Rachel. You said they they need to score. They’re top 10 in scoring and they’re worse than keeping the puck out of What I mean is they do keep scoring. Okay. Well, and then I see Rachel, we we got little people here on the side that are writing stuff in. It says, “Thank goodness the Blues didn’t keep Tage Thompson.” See where Ardell wrote that? Yes. That might be a good question because who’s who’s coming on the show on Friday? uh GM Doug Armstrong. That might be a question. There you go. Anyway, Rachel, so there is a player on that team that I am uh very fond of and it’s Alex Tuck. Um I I thought the player would look really good here. Um it sounds like he wants to be a Buffalo Saber. How and what do you think they have to do to get him done so he stays there maybe to the end of his career? You know, it’s funny. I take another view of that Alex Tuck is in a very advantageous position in this final year of his contract. He can resign. I mean, I feel like I’m preaching to the choir here. I mean, Craig, you’re you’re you’re a long you you know the league, but he he can sign another deal. He can sign a short-term deal. He can, you know, again, if the team’s going south, he can say, “Trade me at the deadline.” or he can just let his contract expire and become a free become one of the prime free agents July bars or he can pull a Mitch Marner and do that as well. He has a lot of options here as well. The Savers I mean the pressure is on them to resign him. That’s the thing. Uh you know I think I think it’s winning. I I don’t think it’s just the money as well. We’re going to see the salary cap again as we know go up as well too. And I think they got to tell him, you know, also you’re a leader and I think Alex also needs to rise to the occasion to leader. But again, I’m going to go back. I I’m going to keep saying this. Alex Tuck has such a distinct advantage going into this season from his own personal security standpoint. All right, Rachel, I wasn’t sure if I should ask you, but you mentioned that you’ve been around that area for a while, so you might be the perfect person to ask. Jack Eel, the whole situation with Jack Eel, his surgery, Buffalo not allow wanting him to do the surgery, he goes to Vegas, wins the Stanley Cup, was maybe the best player in the playoffs, didn’t end up winning the K smite because of Marsha. So, take us through that scenario. Why why did Buffalo not allow him to get that surgery or not want him to get that surgery and kind of how that whole process went? You know, I I’m full disclosure, I was covering college football at the time from the news and college basketball. So, I was not keenly in tune to that situation, but in looking at it from a distance, I could see the ri the riskreward option with the Sabres and how Jack went on his own to get an opinion and said, you know, if I’m getting my facts correct, tell me. I mean, this is four or five years ago. It seems like a lifetime ago as well, too. And you know I I remember thinking it was it was a pushpull between the the franchise’s star player and the franchise and there was you know there were discussion about mismanagement and there was a question about Jack Eel’s long-term health and his long-term career as well too and I mean and also again we know the history in Buffalo. What a great situation for Buffalo to for Jack to be in to begin with as well too. So goes to Vegas, helps them win a Stanley Cup, and you know, and the reporters I’ve talked to before coming on to the beat, you know, they said that Jack has good things to say about living in Buffalo and being in Buffalo. He always asks about the Bills as well, too. Ultimately, in retrospect, it was a business decision. It was a long-term health decision. It was there was a high riskreward again as well, too. Let me ask you then this follow-up. if if if they did let him get that surgery and everything went how fine, would he still be in Buffalo or would this kind of not making the playoff situation have gotten to to a player like that and he would have moved on at some point? That’s a that’s a good question, you know, and you also have to ask about some of these guys. Well, if you know, if they haven’t made the playoffs, why is Alex Tuck still here? He’s on a contract. That’s that’s the answer. Why why is TA Johnson? Why aren’t these guys, you know, asking for trades at this point? Well, I have not gone to the locker room. I have not gotten a chance to talk to a lot of players yet. You know, again, still my first year on the beat, but there’s still a fundamental faith in here in what this group is capable of in the locker room and whatnot. That’s that’s the sense that I get as well. I don’t get the sense that people are giving up again. I get the sense from those last 25 30 games. Couple of these guys realized, hey, maybe we can build on this as well. You know, now that we got a full training again, let’s start really embracing the Wendy rough playbook. You know, you mentioned the Buffalo Bills are, you know, not bad football team, got a pretty good quarterback. Do you know what his dream is? Josh Allen’s dream play for the Buffalo Sabres. No. Oh, he wants to attend one playoff playoff game. There you go. There you go. He just wants to attend a game. Which Rachel, I asked the same thing uh of Joe. I I I want to talk about Terry Pagula a little bit like and get your opinion because, you know, I’m I guess I’m used to, you know, in this sport playoffs are what matter. You know, the 82 games are one thing, 83 on is big. And I asked Joe, I mean, like, how does he handle the last 14 years of not being a playoff team for the fans and everything else? So, just curious, does he ever, it sounds like he’s kind of a hands-off kind of owner. Let guys do their job. Um because I know some owners that would say this is unacceptable. We’re we’re changing something and they haven’t found the right thing. Where do you feel is when it comes to input and maybe not as much input staying away? You know, again, I I I am surprised at how front-facing hands off, but again, that’s we don’t know what goes on behind the scenes. I have not learned a lot of that as well. I’ll tell the one person we’re not talking about in this equation is Kim Puboula. She was very handson with the Sabres before she got sick a few years ago and it, you know, she was the one who made a lot of the decisions in the organization. You I’ve been at the news since 2018. I would say 18 to 22. Kim was very much the the point person who made the big decisions in the Sabres. And when she got sick, it’s kind of it fell under Terry’s umbrella. I mean, and Kim Kim Kim’s got a long road back. Let’s believe it or not. You know, that’s the person who that was under her that was under her umbrella. I’ve said that word twice, so I know that. But, uh, I was surprised at that. Uh, here’s the other person I think should become a more a bigger decision maker in the process to augment Kevin Adams to kind of be the no person to Kevin Adams. Yarmo Kalinan who has GM experience. They bring him in as a senior adviser as well. I read about him earlier this year back in May after he was hired. He’s a guy who’s not afraid to take risks. He is very analytical when it comes to making decisions. He’s a very good poker player. He’s also a very good pickle ball player, too. So, I think I think if this is the case, Terry’s got to allow decision makers like Kevin in conjunction with Yarmokan in conjunction with Eric Stall is another guy they brought in for player personnel. Got to develop that brain trust now for this team to be competitive. You know, maybe Yarmmo Kalan is the one who says, “No, Kevin, you might want to pull back on that. Maybe Eric Stall is the guy who says you might want to bring this guy. And Eric Stall was brought in to really forge more bonds with the players as well because you need a guy like that who’s had enough playing experience but who’s still close enough in age. He understands what these guys are going through every day. So I think if there’s going to be any kind of group brain trust if you will, it’s not going to be on Terry. Terry’s got to trust Kevin Adams the America line and Eric Stall in that group. you know, Jerry Foron, the assistant GM, to make those decisions because, as we’ve seen, Terry’s very invested in the Bills right now. And the Bills are the cash cow for family. And another one, so is Penn State hockey. Look at how much money the Pagoulas gave to get Penn State hockey going. All right, Rachel, we have a pretty exciting time coming up here in February with the Olympics, uh, NHL players going back. Very exciting, uh, for anyone of of any team, but for you specifically, there’s a few players to kind of keep an eye on. So, if you were to pick right now, which Sabres roster players would play in Italy, and what do they have to do to get there? Uh, I would put uh Tae Thompson going to Italy for the United States. Uh, I’d put Alex Tuck on the team as well, too. You know, to so these guys can get into that compell, be around other players like, you know, we don’t know. I think Matthew Kachchuck will be back around by then. you know, those those first six as well. A con, you know, the goalies haven’t been picked yet. Uh, you know, I think Connor Halabach, even though he plays for the Jets, should be on that team as well, too, to get in there. Yeah, definitely Tae Thompson and um Alex Tuck, you know, they’ve got to be Tuck’s a little more of an outlier. I think TA has done nothing but help his cause as far as making the the Olympic roster goes, but those are the two uh former Sabres, Eel as well. JJ Turker was a guy I thought was going to be for Germany if he was with the Sabres, but now he’s with Utah as well. You read their points off the last three years, didn’t you? What they what were what were they points again? Uh 79 this year, 84 last year, 91 and 22 23. Okay, Rachel, then you’ve heard those numbers. You know those numbers. Can Can the Sabres get to 92 94 points this year and make a playoffs? I don’t know where that number is, but I’m going to say it’s somewhere in that ballpark. Yes. No. Maybe. So, I just saw over I just saw an overunder for the playoffs as well. You’re my short-term memory is terrible as well, though. Uh, and I will add to that if they do for me. Let me add to that. What if they can and do what’s the biggest factor in getting to that point? In in getting to that point, uh, I’m going to say they got to develop consistency during the regular season. piece of advice that Bob Ary gave me years ago when we were talking about how much things have changed in the NHL. He said, “Got to develop consistency during the season, whether you know, goal scoring, defense, that.” And Bob Area says to me, you know, pardon my French, he says, “God, you know, you lose five or six in a row in November, you’re gonna get your ass handed to you in April when you’re trying to make the playoffs.” And I said, “It’s very good advice.” It was very much food for thought he gave me. And that always stuck with me. So the Sabres have to develop and find consistency in season. They can’t stumble out of the gates the first month. 91 was the Canadians last year. So you need to get at least 91. That was well that’s if they get and that was a pretty big gap between them and the and the senators in that wild card. All right, Rachel, thank you so much for coming on. We’re going to ask you one more question we’ve asked all of our guests on the other 31 and that is from your perspective being in Buffalo, what do you see from the Dallas Stars and their expectations in 2025 and 26? I put the Dallas Stars in the gold standard for the Western Conference in with Winnipeg, with Vegas, you know, until very recently with Edmonton as well. And I I asked this during the spring like why do they keep meeting up with Edmonton in the playoffs? But, you know, I was like, this always happens. Is is there a Twilight Zone vibe in Dallas right now? But the bar is set for the Dallas Stars. I have a little bit of a concern with new coach coming in, but the NHL is known for recycling coaches as well, but I like the foundation of this team that keeps coming in. Love Autural. I mean, he’s you build around him in Dallas. Jamie Ben, Mr. Consistency, ageless Duchain, you know, he’s one of those guys every time I see him, I said, geez, he’s still in the NHL, but I love that he’s made a career. Um, I mean, Rup Rupes, I’m going to butcher that name. terrible with pronunciations. I love the roster they have in Dallas. That’s a team I want to see every year, not just achieve, but overachieve because I believe in Dallas overachieving is the standard there, but it’s just they just hit a wall in those conference finals and this has got to be the year they break through. I thought last year was going to be the year they break through. All right, Rachel, thank you so much for joining us. That was a lot of fun. Rachel, it was great. Of course, and you’re welcome back anytime. That’s Rachel Lindsay of the Buffalo News. Good luck this year. First year on the beat. Enjoy it. Take care, Rachel. All right, lads. That’s it. Buffalo Sabres Day in the books. Is uh since we were talking about Olympic stuff, is Billy uh Garren GM? He’s the GM of USA hockey and also the Minnesota Wild. And I know that, but I meant the olymp the Yes, it was the same same four nations and Olympics was anyone who was named to those. He just said yes. Yes. Okay. But you know, we’re having Billy on too. Bill Garin will also join our show, I believe, on Tuesday. So, we have Doug Armstrong coming up on Friday. We have player from the Dallas Stars. I’m not going to say it yet, but we have a play current active player for the Dallas Stars on Monday and Bill Garin on Tuesday. But tomorrow, Vancouver Conucks day. It’ll be Luds. It’ll be Owen Newkerk sitting in this seat and Shawn Shapiro remote. I believe Sam Nestler will not be on the show because he’s uninvited when Shawn is on. Thank you guys so much for joining today. Yes. Thank you guys so much for joining today. For Craig Lewig, for Katcha. How’s that? That ain’t right. For Sam Nestler. We’ll see you guys tomorrow. Wait, how do you get a day off? [Applause] [Music]

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“The Other 31” on DLLS Stars continues Wednesday with the Buffalo Sabres, as guests Joe Yerdon and Rachel Lenzi join the show to discuss when Buffalo will finally make it back to the postseason, the 1999 Stanley Cup loss to Dallas, and more!

00:00 Intro
02:30 Joe Yerdon from Bleacher Report joins the show
03:00 Revisiting the Brett Hull goal that won the Stanley Cup
07:00 Joe’s thoughts on Terry Pegula
09:30 Kevyn Adams cleans house
12:20 Jarmo Kekalainen
17:00 Lindy Ruff
25:00 Fixing the power play
33:00 Rachel Lenzi joins the show
36:00 Sabres rebuild
42:00 Tage Thompson
48:30 Jack Eichel
55:00 Who should go to Winter Olympics?
57:00 Rachel’s thoughts on Stars

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