Over/Under: Setting EXPECTATIONS for Chicago Bulls in 2025-26 | By The Horns

Over/Under: Setting EXPECTATIONS for Chicago Bulls in 2025-26 | By The Horns

What’s up everybody? Welcome into a new edition of the By the Horns podcast. And you know that we are presented by Toyota. Toyota has more all-wheel drive and four-wheel drive vehicles than any other brand. So find yours and shine on Toyota. Let’s go places. Cam Smith, you know who I’m rocking with. My man KC Johnson, CHSN Bulls Insider, as we count down the days until the start of training camp. A little under a week away, KC. So, we have Bulls media day coming up on next Monday as we record this podcast on Tuesday, September 23rd. Time is flying, but also a good in a good way because it’s like, all right, we’re getting closer to some actual basketball and preparing for this team. And speaking more in depth about this team, how you feeling on this Tuesday, Casey? All good. We got Blackhawks preseason hockey tonight. So, the winter sports are about to start invading the United Center. It’s just, you know, it’s 80 degrees outside. That’s the only thing we got to take care of. But it’s all good. Yeah, definitely all good, man. It messes with you mentally when you see, okay, all right, Blackhawks preseason starting, Bulls training camp coming up, winter sports. I’m not ready for it yet, but that’s kind of like the thing that I go through every year. It’s like, all right, I know it’s transition. NBA season, basketball season, hockey season is there, but I’m just not ready for the cold, man. And I’m a Chicagoan, and I’m like, I I I’m still not used to the cold, Casey. You know how it goes, man. Uh, being from Evston and just dealing with these winter months, but it’s on the way. We can’t avoid it. All right, here we go. Casey, let’s get into this conversation with this Bulls team as we creep closer to the start of the regular season. As I mentioned, training camp opens up next week for this Bulls group. Their first preseason game is October 7th. Regular season starts October 22nd at home against the Detroit Pistons. And every year, you know, the the experts, the people in the gambling spaces want to set certain things for certain teams and also certain individuals. So, what we’re going to talk about right now is win totals with this Bulls team and getting into that conversation of where we see this team finishing the 2526 season and the amount of wins. Now, this is a group the past couple of years have gone back to back and winning 39 games. for all those betterers out there. They’ve gone over their win total in four of the last five seasons. So, just a little context for you when you get into and listen to this conversation that Casey and I will have when it comes to the win totals for this Bulls team, Casey. Yeah, I mean, uh, uh, we thought we’d have some fun with some overunders. So, we’re going to hit the win total and then do some, uh, we’re going to surprise each other with some individual statistics and see where we each fall on overunder. Um, believe it or not, the Vegas overunder, the at least the one I saw, I’m not a gamble gambler by any means. Uh, but, uh, the the one I saw is 32 and a half wins. It’s also the one that John Hollinger wrote about in the Athletic, uh, the noted NBA national guy. Um, so let’s start there. 32 and a half wins. It seems like, uh, the Bulls are always kind of placed pretty low and as you mentioned, they’ve exceeded four out of the last five seasons. So, you’re going overunder on 32 and a half wins. I think we’re going to have the same answer on this one. Yeah, I think we will, Casey. And I am a gambler. I I will bet on things with this team. So, I I will throw that out there, but I I’m not an avid like that. Um, so I would say when it comes to this win total for this Bulls group, I’m going to go over 32 and a half wins with this Bulls team. And it’s not off of the fact of when people look at them going over and for the last five seasons and they say, “Oh, that’s because, you know, Demar Rosen, Zack Lavine, it was a different ball group.” I get that. You remove those players off of this team post not even post Allstar break when you go back to last season, but obviously Demar transition um into his role with the Sacramento Kings. Obviously, last year it was post Allstar break when Zack Lavine or excuse me, right before the All-Star break, Zack Lavine was traded um at the February trade deadline. But you look at this team, KC, the last 20 games, they went 15 and five. And you throw in the individual play of Kobe White who really expanded his role with his team and how he was scoring the basketball. Of course, Josh Giddy. We’ve talked about Josh and what he was able to do post all-star break and nearly averaging a triple double and how he just really stepped into that role as a point guard and took command of this group and they were playing a very fun brand of basketball. Now all season long they had been one of the best teams in terms of pace all season long but also one of the better three-point shooting teams in the NBA. So, those are things that I take into account throughout the season, but then also post all-star break where they maintain their spot in the top 10 in a number of offensive categories. If you want to talk about points per game, threes made per game, effective field goal percentage, true shooting percentage, like it’s a lot of categories you can throw into the mix to explain why this team won 15 of their final 20 games. So, for a group that’s going to want to hit the ground running, and for them having a chip on their shoulder, let’s let’s just be real about this, KC, with these young guys um individually, but also as a team, they want to go out and continue to prove that yes, they’re deserving of their roles. are deserving of their contracts and Josh Giddy with a four-year $100 million deal, but also there’s going to be chemistry with this team coming into the season that they really had to manufacture at a late time of the season coming off that trade deadline. When you throw in Kevin Herder and you throw in Trey Jones and Zack Collins, like Billy Donovan has done a great job, and yes, great, I don’t use that word lightly, in making sure that these guys mesh together and play well and have them really assume their new roles and really join together to uh make a better hole for this team and we saw it in the second half of the season. So, I’m going to go over 32 and a half wins. I think that they live. If people want me to get specific like, okay, Cam, they’re going to go over 32 and a half wins. You might say that they’re going to win 33 games. I really believe that they’re going to live within that 35 to 40 range uh category with wins this upcoming season. Could it possibly be possibly be 39 again? That’s possible. But I say more so I will go to 37 wins. If people want me to be on record and be specific with an exact number, I’ll say 37 wins for this Bulls team. Casey, all right, what do you got for us? Yeah, this is to me the easiest over in in gambling history. uh for multiple for multiple reasons and and we we have very little overlap in our reasoning but that that that makes for good podcasting. First of all, let’s just get to the fact the organizational uh philosophy this they’ve proven they don’t they have no interest in tanking zero interest in tanking zero interest in not competing. So they are going to try to win every game that they play. That’s number one. Number two, the East is not good and it’s actually worse than last year because of obviously the the terrible injuries. We all hate to see injuries, the significant injuries to Jason Tatum, Tyrese Hallebertton, etc. Um, so the East, you know, is wide open. So, there’s that. Um, this team, you know, it’s not a great team, but one thing it does have is a lot of depth. I mean, if you project Josh Giddy, Kobe White, let’s just throw out Isaac Aoro, Modis Buzzelis, and Nicole Vuch as your starters, that leaves a pretty significant second unit with Kevin Herder, Iodumu, Patrick Williams, Zack Collins, Dalon Terry, Julian Phillip, I mean, and the fact that Billy Donovan style of play that you cited, Cam, is to try to play fast, wear teams down with that amount of depth and that philosophy of trying to win every game, you’re just gonna sometimes overwhelm teams, particularly like if you have a schedule of favor where you know a team’s finish in a backtoback and you’ve got a day of rest. Ideally, you’re going to see the Bulls just wear teams down. So, I don’t think this is going to be even close. Um the one point that we both will hit that I totally agree with is the chemistry. This team is uh returning intact from last season. Their only offseason moves were to resign two players in Trey Jones and Josh Giddy and then add an 18-year-old project in Noah Sen who’s probably going to be a little bit in Windy City. So that chemistry that you saw form on the fly post trade deadline has had a summer off season of bonding with two team gatherings, a month of September where they’re over there already scrimmaging at the advocate center. They’re going to hit the ground running. I think that chemistry and that depth that again that to me makes it um I’m not going specific win pred prediction yet. It’s September 23rd. Way too early for me to throw out. That’s all Casey. I I I’ll go I already went out on a limb and put myself out there. So I’ll do that because you you know how it goes when you know you talk about going over win totals and people want things specific. So, I I’ll do it for our group and just say for myself, not saying that Casey Johnson is saying this, but Cam Smith is saying 37 wins for this Bulls team. So, I got I got to get more of a vibe closer to the regular season for me to throw out official for the record prediction. But I I’ll say this I’ll say this. I think it’s going to be significantly over 32 and a half. So, yeah, whether you think that’s five games, seven games, eight games, just wait for a future podcast when I drop my official win prediction, but I think it’s going to be significantly over. I don’t think 32 and a half will be close. So, we’re in agreement on the over. I’m going to surprise you with my first individual category and then you react. We’re going to throw two or three each at each other. All right. Josh Giddy, 7.5 assists per game. Are you going over or under? Casey, uh, you know, you know, I’m a point guard at heart, man. That’s the position that I played my entire life. So, I am very biased to the point guards. I’m very biased to the point guards that are more true point guards and not scoring point guards as the age that we live in when it comes to this era of basketball. I will say that Josh Giddy will be right there. I think he goes a little bit over that. I it’s tough because when you look at Josh Giddy and what he was second half of the season, but more so the jump that he made from OKC to the Bulls, he was around 4.8 assists in his last season at OKC. and you look at what he was able to do last season with his Bulls team. Um, and where he stayed and where he really lived when it came to his assistance. I believe around seven. I gota double check that. 7 7.2. He, you know, I looked this up, Cam. I this actually I did not know and I should have obviously he was top 10 in the NBA last year. He finished ninth in the league with 7.2 assists. Yes. Yes. Yes. And so that makes it very interesting when it comes to that individual stat with Josh Giddy because on some sports books you can get him at a very nice price when it comes to averaging eight or more assists per game. So I’ll just let you go out and see where that is, but actually it’s 80 to1 for Josh Giddy to uh lead the league in assists. I’m not gonna go that far, but he is seventh on the odds boards, but you can still get some plus money for him if you have him averaging eight or more assists. So, uh, for him at 7 and a half, eight, I think he’s going to be in that category for myself with this Bulls team. And again, going back to what we see and what we’ve seen from, uh, this team and this group post all-star breaking the trade deadline is that there was a chemistry there. And I brought up the true shooting percentage and the effective field goal percentage to aid my point with this Bulls team going over that win total of 32 and a half. But you’re looking at a guy that’s going to have better command of this offense. He understands what his role is coming into this season. Of course, spending time with Billy Donovan, having those talks, right? Working on his game to add more layers to it. And guys are going to be in a position when it comes to Kobe White, who we know that we can get hot in a quick second. I sum I think is going to have improved three-point percentage. Nicolvous is a guy that sometimes, this is going on season number two where we get into these, you know, season predictions and, you know, what do we expect for this team? He kind of gets lost in the shuffle a little bit. He’s still going to be in that group. So, he is a guy that you can throw the ball to and get buckets. And with Giddy being at 68 and it being such an advantage for himself against certain point guards of him being able to see the floor, but also how he thinks a couple of plays ahead from defenders, he’s going to be a dude that can really thrive in this category. So, I really feel confident on Josh Giddy and what he will be in his assists points in terms of that. I know you didn’t ask me that question specifically, Casey, but I think there’s going to be a shift in that where you don’t see more of the score Josh Giddy. I think you’re going to see his role as a facilitator grow even more. So, I’m gonna go yes, I think he goes a little bit closer to eight when it comes to that assist average. All right, so we’re in agreement. Uh, two for two so far. I’m also going over on my own category. Um, that would have placed him seventh in the NBA last year. If you go off last year, I agree with you. I don’t think I’m I’m going to go with leading the league. I mean, last year Trey Young with over 11 leading the league. Um, but I I got him in that 7.5 to eight range. Uh, a big big reason for my uh, pick is what you said. I think now that he’s been paid and he’s settling in and he knows he’s here for the long-term future, Josh’s first inclination is to set up his teammates is to defer. He I mean, he can score and we saw an aggressive guy attacking the rim more, getting downhill more, getting to the free throw line more in those last, you know, 20 25 games, but his first inclination is to defer. And he’s got plenty of weapons around him. Yep. And I think he’s going to be in pass first mode right from the jump. So, um, that’s when he’s most effective. That’s when the Bulls are most effective. And he’s really all about the team. Now that the contract stuff’s behind him, I got him in that 7.5 to eight range, which would be a career high. I mean, 7.2 last year was a careerhigh by a lot. So, right. Um, yeah, we’re we’re in agreement two for two. And also 9.3 average post all-star break as well. And you know, this Casey is a hooper. And I’ll say this as well is that when you play the style of play that the Bulls are going to continue to put out there on the court in terms of pace, that ball is not sticking. You’re moving that basketball. So whether it’s kind of outletting the ball after a make or miss uh for your opponent just trying to get it up ahead or just penetrating and dumping it off, that’s where Giddy lives and that’s where he lived in the second half of the season. So it’s going to be three to four assists that he can really get just in transition alone. And not even bringing up the half court. uh standpoint of it. So, we’re in agreement in that he’s going to live within that range of seven and a half of eight for this upcoming season. All right, Casey, here we go. I got one for you that I know will get the wheels turning and it’s going to focus in on Kobe White. We saw Kobe White average a career-high 20 points per game last season. Expanded role, he really stepped up, especially in some clutch moments. The question is, can Kobe White average or range between 23 to 25 points per game this upcoming season for this Bulls team? And to throw in a little additional question for you, could he flirt potentially with the Allstar selection? Um, Wow, that’s a that is a good one. The wheels are already um and I’m putting KC on the spot right now and that’s what this is about. surprises with these categories. Um, I’ve said he has all-star potential. I think probably he’s a year or two away just because if you start running down the East cards, it fills up very very quickly. Although obviously with Tyrese Hallebertton out for the year, there is a spot potentially open right there. Um, I’m going to go in the running. I mean, he’d have to he’d have to get in as a coach’s reserve. He’s not winning a fan vote or uh right, you know how they split it between media fans now. Um so he he’d have to get in off of a coaches reserve. I think he’ll be he’ll get some votes, but I don’t think he’ll quite make it. As far as scoring, I’m going to go under, but I’m going to say not in a bad way because I think Kobe and the Bulls are most effective when he’s around that 20 points per game number. Um, as you’ve mentioned, this is a really equal opportunity offense and you’ve got quite a few scoring options, you know, with Modis Buselis needing some touches. Nicole Vuchovic in that, you know, secondary offense pick and pop. Um, Josh Giddy’s still going to be getting downhill sometimes. Trey Jones off the bench, uh, you know, as a scorer. Kevin Herder is going to be looking for his shot. Um, so I think Kobe will be kind of similar to last year and I think that’s a good thing. I I think if you’re getting up to Kobe in 23 25 points per game mode, then you’re kind of in Kobe hero ball mode. And I don’t think that’s when the Bulls are going to be most effective. And here’s one thing I always say about Kobe White is like as talented as he is individually and as much as his role has changed throughout his Bulls tenure, he’s always about putting the team before the the individual. And I think he recognizes while there are some games where he does need to shift into hero mode, that’s not when he or the team is at their most effective. So I think if he averages, you know, 19, 20, 21 points per game, he’s at his best. The Bulls are at their best. So I’m going to go I’m going to go under, but put a positive spin on it. How about you? Look, that’s why you’re Casey Johnson, man. Because I understand 100% that explanation with that because if Kobe is creeping into that 23 25 points per game category, that means of course the number of shots are going up drastically for Kobe. And that’s something that with his game, you want to in this offense, I don’t want to say stay away from, but I think this this team is best suited with their attack of spreading that basketball around. So, it’s just not like you said, Casey, hero ball for Kobe White. So for a guy that averaged a careerhigh and 20 points per game, Kobe has done a really good job of mixing up how he scores the basketball. And one thing specifically that I I noticed of Kobe last year was that he was able to use his size against smaller guards, especially going to the post or getting inside the lane, either hit him with a fadeaway or a pump fake and get into the rim to get those floaters in. So that part of his game is something that has opened up another layer to it. But when you talk of a guy that knows he’s going to have to produce, how much do you want him produce to produce with the sacrifice of someone else or the sacrifice of another part of his game? So, I’m going to say with that that Kobe could be in that 21 to 22 range, but I don’t see anything above that 23 25 points per game. But this is where you got to be careful with the sports book out there, Casey. Because I’ll say this, there’s a sports book that has Kobe White. If you have him averaging 25 points per game, it’s at plus 900. You can throw put some money down on that if you want, but I’m I’m staying away from that. So, just try and listen to Casey and I on this one. Well, I I think that now is when we should pause the podcast and drop the gamblers anonymous hotline. The game was fairly You’re a speaking a language I don’t understand, man. 500. I’m like, I I Hey, no, Casey, I understand it, man. I used to host a a betting show uh with Stadium Network before I transitioned over to CHSN. And it was all betting all the time. And I got to a point where it was like, all right, uh I’m betting on summer league, which was I’ve reached a interesting level. Um and I don’t want to go back to that level at all. So, let’s just keep it there. I was quickly looking up Kobe’s three-point attempts. That’s why I was looking down a little bit. Uh because I knew it was a career high last year, but he was at 7.9 three-point attempts last year. I guarantee you that Billy Donovan and the coaching staff are talking to Kobe White about getting three-point attempts over eight per game. And here’s why. He’s clearly going to be uh playing off the ball more this year. There’s no question about his role with Josh Giddy being given the keys to the end engine. And you know, Kobe has proven the ability to play on the ball, off the ball, but to me, he’s at his most effective when he’s in catch and shoot mode off the ball. I mean, he’s got the ability to drive, too. Um, he’s a three-level scorer. However, I I think you’re going to see him get a lot of open looks from three, and um I know that the Bulls want to take a lot of threes, so you want to see his attempts over eight eight per game. So, um I think he’s going to have a great year, but I’m we’re both going under. All right, it’s my turn and uh we’re having fun surprising each other. I got one for you. I got one for you. I’m And I’m G. The best part is I’m putting you on the spot and then I give you my context as to why I say it later. All right. Modest Buselis, 15 points per game. Over or under? [Music] KC. Uh this is a tough one. I I really have to think about this cuz my instant reaction and answer is yes. Because when you look at Matas and you look at how he hased throughout the year and how his role for everyone on this Bulls team, we talked about it with Kobe, we talked about it with Josh Giddy, Trey Jones in certain instances of on previous pods with Trey Jones on how that role expanded. I’m gonna say under though when I really sit back and look at it. And I say under just because it’s not a bad thing when it comes to Modus averaging 15 points per game. It’s a steady growth that he’s going to have with this team. And there’s still parts of his game that still need to expand. And there are also opponents that are going to, you know, check what he did really well last season and put that into perspective. I think Modis’s next step is making that outside shot uh more effective and more efficient for himself. We know that he can attack the lane and get to the rim and finish. But when it comes to this group as a whole, you still have Nicolus on this roster. We just talked about Kobe White and his shot attempts. Of course, Josh Giddy, even though I don’t believe that he’s going to be as much of the score as we saw last year, it’ll be more of a facilitator with this team that the pieces of the pie and how they’re divvied up. and Nio Dumu is going to be thrown into into that as well of how much do you want to put into Modis’ control and where he is on the court. So, I’m going to go slightly under with Modis, which is not a bad thing. So, I’ll go 134 range with Montas 15. If he does it, look, prove me wrong, Matis. And I’ll be the first person to shake your hand like, “Look, you proved me wrong. You definitely took another step and a bigger step for yourself.” But I just don’t think he’s there just yet. All right. I threw that number out because last year he came off the bench in 49 games and averaged uh where is it? 5.8 points as a reserve and in 31 starts he averaged 13 points as a starter. So uh and he in in his starting appearances he averaged 26.7 minutes per game. My feeling is that number will be higher. uh he’s clearly going to be a starter, so I’m guessing he’s going to be averaging 30, 31, maybe 32 minutes per game, depending on foul trouble, etc. Um and so that’s why I upped it two points per game from his 13 points as a starter last year because I feel like he’s going to be getting more minutes, more opportunity. But I’m with you. I’m going under. This is boring podcast and we’re three for three in agreement. But you just feel like I feel like uh I’m with you. I mean, I think expectations for Mis are probably a little too high right now amongst the fan base. I understand he represents the future. This is still a very young uh and developing player and also like I think his focus needs to be uh impacting the game in all levels, rebounding, shot blocking, defense. Um he’s going to be asked to guard bigger and stronger people this year. A lot of that is going to be still an adjustment for him. And this team has enough offensive weapons. They don’t need him scoring 15 points a game or more. If they if it happens, great. Then he’s ahead of schedule. But I think focusing on being a two-way player, hitting the defensive glass, continuing to hone those uh weak side instincts that he showed last year with his shot blocking ability, things like that. Um as a full-time starter, he’s going to be guarding big, strong guys every night, and there’s gonna be a lot on his plate. So yeah, give me 12, 13, 14 points per game. five, six, seven rebounds a game, 1.4, 1.6 blocks per game. Now we’re cooking with something. So, um, that will be a very good season for Modis. And, um, like you said, if we’re proven wrong, then the Bulls and He are both ahead of schedule. No doubt about that. I’d rather see Modis have that, and this is not more so uh, not wanting Modis to continue to grow, scoring the basketball, but I want to see that growth in year three. This is more so when it comes to his second year of impacting the game to your point is I love that point Casey of seeing the rebounds get up a little bit higher, the blocks per game, the steals affecting the game in other ways other than just scoring the basketball, right? So if he can do that and that defensive awareness approves improves even more, you’re really adding to the foundation of a player that for sure when he naturally will step into that scoring role that he will have for this team, he can bring the other aspect, the other side of the court to his game as well. And so I think that’s about that’s the growth that you want to see in modus in year two and which he can do. like we saw him take those leaps come first half of the season compared to second half of the season and we you know famously go to that Boston game his first experience of playing against the Celtics and Jason Tatum and Jaylen Brown and it wasn’t a good look for Modis and he knows this and he improved watch film and the next meetings against the Celtics he was a better player because he was more engaged and just more aware defensively and you saw him soar in those categories so the physical attributes are there for Miles Melis you see the time that he puts and off the court with his with his film and of course how he’s applying it to actual gameplay and this is a young man that hasn’t even scratched the surface of what he can become and we know that he will be a very strong player for this team uh for years to come. All right, so you brought up just handling being a full-time starter. I mean this guy only started 31 games. I mean that and he he played 80 games as a rookie. That’s really impressive. So he’s it you know knock on wood injuryfree he’s starting 82 games this year. That’s a lot for a player of his age. So, um, that’s another thing. It’s just like, forget the stats. Like, just handling being a full-time starter in year two of the NBA is a big deal. All right. Yeah. Last last one for you. All right. Casey, you talking about the four group, so I have to bring up this name. And, you know, this is a name that a lot of Bulls fans are uh just curious about to see what he will do. Some Bulls fans are just like, you know what, I don’t know what we’re going to get with this player this upcoming season. But that player’s name is Patrick Williams. Casey, do you think that Patrick Williams can be a guy that averages double figure points and really not so much on the points and the average, but really step into the guy that when we talk about his phys physical attributes and how we can impact the game, do you think that he consi can consistently be that player for Billy Donovan and this Bulls team? So, if you’re setting the overunder on 10 points scoring per uh per game, I’m going over. And uh here’s why. Um, first of all, uh, I project Patrick Williams to come off the bench for this team. Now, I could be wrong. They could start him and Modest at the at the forwards together. We’ve talked before, I think Isaac Aoro is going to emerge as a starting other starting forward. So, I project Patrick Williams to be coming off the bench. And let’s face it, um there are times where Patrick Williams has flat out admitted he’s more comfortable in that role because he just kind of finds his footing more, finds his uh uh aggressiveness a little more consistently in that role. And him coming off the bench and scoring more than 10 points per game is a boon not only to him, but to the Bulls because then you’re impacting that second unit. Um you’re, you know, consistently knowing your role and locking into it. Um, so I’m going over and another big reason is I just come back to this like I ran into Patrick last week briefly and like first thing he kept hammering to me was just like I’m healthy. I’m healthy. And like he repeated like three times in our short conversation and you can just tell how excited he is to be going into a season feeling really good about his body, really good about his mind. And you know, people uh I think fans have kind of overlooked Patrick obviously because they’re frustrated with his inability to stay healthy, inability to stay consistent. And I think he can come in in this role with less pressure coming off the bench and really impact the game. And look, if you’re getting double figure scoring consistently as a reserve, it’s a good thing for you and the team. So, I’m going I’m going over for Patrick Williams uh with the 10 points per game. And I hope it I hope he stays healthy for his sake. It’s it’s been frustrating watching him endure all the injuries he has. Yeah, I share that same frustration in him enduring all the injuries that he had to go through and just the setbacks with that. But this is also a guy that averaged 10 points per game in two of the last three seasons. And when he didn’t average 10 points per game, he was just under the double figures. So, um I’m going to actually differ a little bit, Casey. I think that he impacts the game more on the defensive end, but I’m with you in terms of I see the light of Patrick Williams and what he can be for that second unit. A guy that comes out aggressive, the physical tools of him getting downhill and really making plays at the rim. But with this group, I really want him just to impact the game more so on the defensive end, rebounding the basketball and making that more of a priority as opposed to scoring the basketball compared to scoring the basketball. cuz we talked about the second unit and I Dumu and Kevin Hurder. What we we just kind of project who those players are coming off the bench and Trey Jones as well. I think that they have some guys that can score the basketball. Jaylen Smith is another guy um that I expect to have a uh bigger role and a a bigger um season for himself within the system for Billy Donovan. So, I’m going to differ with you and say Patrick has more impact on the defensive end and not average the double figure points for himself. And it’s again, it’s not a bad thing for Patrick. I think it’s a stepping stone for him if he can consistently be that player. Barring health, hopefully he stays healthy so he doesn’t have another setback for himself this upcoming season. I love it. Uh we said two each, but I’m having so much fun and we’re near the end. I’m going to throw one more out for you. I just I don’t want an explanation. I want a one-word answer. Over or under? Okay. Noah Asen, 45 games played. Oo, I’m going under. Under. Under. Yeah. All right. All right. All right. Look, Casey and I are aligned on this thing. Look, this is not scripted, everybody. We put every each other on the spot, and this is this is what you have. Hey, this was this was so much fun. Let’s do another one of these before training camp. Uh I mean, before the regular season opener, during training camp, cuz you can come up with like 10 different topics, but uh we can do another one and and uh kick it back and forth. But uh maybe we’ll pick up with the Noah Senate one and flush out our reason, but we’re both under for now. Okay, I’m with the Casey. All right, that’ll do it for this edition of the By the Horns podcast for my man Casey Johnson. I’m Cam Smith. We appreciate everybody tapping in with this. Look, training camp starts next week for this Bulls team. First preseason game October 7th in Cleveland. We are getting closer to that start of the 2526 NBA season. We’ll talk to you soon.

Cam Smith and K.C. Johnson dive into preseason over/unders for the Chicago Bulls as training camp approaches. From Vegas’ surprising 32.5 win total to Josh Giddey’s playmaking, Coby White’s scoring ceiling, Matas Buzelis’ next step, and Patrick Williams’ role, the guys debate what’s realistic, what’s hype, and where the Bulls can prove people wrong.

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