Which rising Boston Celtics prospects will make a leap forward this season?
[Music] Welcome in to another episode of Hav Stole the Pod. I’m Justin Quinn. I am not here with Alex or Daniel. Uh they have the pod off as they uh you know enjoy the end of the summer. I suppose I guess it’s technically fall with the uh equinox here, but we have a special guest, Bryce Simon, Motor City Hoops, Pistons Pulse. Uh, how you doing, Bryce? I’m good, Justin. Um, probably a good move by you to let your co-host go because I tend to talk a lot and so I I don’t know that we needed two more people on here or else we would have been here all evening. So, good good decision on your part, although I would have loved to meet them and and talked uh Boston Celtic basketball with them as well. Yeah, maybe sometime in the future. Yes, sir. We’ll drag them out. So, let’s get into uh what’s going on with this pod. We’re going to be talking about some cuts and some signings around the margins, some Celtics uh and the zeitgeist uh if you will, but mostly what we want to see from the younger players on the team. Uh last week we talked about the veterans on the team and our expectations for that. Uh Bryce is going to help us get an external view uh on what we should be expecting or hope for from the uh younger players on the roster. Uh there is a little bit of news that we want to touch on real quickly. Uh let’s just start with the Jason Tatum fours. Uh the Jordan Tatum fours, I should say. Uh they are out. Uh got to look at them. I’m not a big sneaker guy. Uh did you have a chance to see them at all or? Uh, listen Justin, I feel pretty confident that I’m going to be able to talk about Max Scholga and Amari Williams and Baylor Shyman and whatever else you want to talk about. I’m probably the worst guest ever to talk about shoes, but I’ll tell you this. I will Google it right now and give you my immediate thoughts on the uh Sure. Um, Sure. Sure. They’re Yeah, I don’t know. Very red. Yeah, I mean, no one is saying that they’re ugly before they even for sale. So, that’s good. That’s better than the first round. Uh, I am also not a sneaker sneaker guy. Uh, the last time I bought a signature sneaker, it was the Converse weapon. Should tell you about how old I am. So, uh, yeah. Moving along. Speaking of Jason Tatum, he sounded like he hopes to return this season. He’s been doing some interviews with people uh the Today Show and he really sounds like he thinks he can during this season. He’s careful to couch his language in ways to kind of reassure the public that he’s not going to rush back or anything like that. But I am again as the resident old person of this podcast uh of of a time where if you had any kind of those like ACL, Achilles, anything like that, you were going to miss a year. that doesn’t seem to be the case and I’m I’m kind of coming to terms with that and I’m seeing some of my peers kind of also doing that. But what what do you think of this whole thing? Should he come back this season? I mean to me and and maybe this is a copout answer. I’m actually very familiar with ACL injuries. Um you know for your listeners, I played division one basketball. I tore my ACL three times. It essentially ended my career. Um, but I mean I I feel like the 12-month thing with ACL’s now is truly like the mental side of it, not the physical side of it. You know what I mean? And so I think to me it would come down to how does Jason respond to it? Because I responded differently to every one of my surgeries and rehabs. And obviously, you know, Tatum as a, you know, the highest level of athlete, he’s going to get the best care, but does his body body respond in a way that he can push through that rehab mentally? Is he able to trust it when he comes back and they’re in high leverage situations? Is that what you want to immediately throw him to? Or can you get him a few weeks of February, March, you know, whatever, March, into the season, regular season type of basketball before you hit the first round of the play? And here’s the other thing, just where’s the where’s the team at, right? I mean, this is a team where I think there’s still talent on the roster, but it’s a flawed roster. Do you make decisions at the trade deadline? Does does that change your decisions at the deadline based if he’s coming back or not? Right? Like maybe you want a different situation at center if Jason Tatum is going to be back and you want to make a run in the playoffs. Do you really want to push that if with all due respect to these guys that’s still your center rotation going into the NBA playoffs? So I think all of those things factor in. But first and foremost is the long-term future of Jason Tatum. and by never putting that in jeopardy whatsoever, by rushing things for no reason. Yeah, I think you’re right. And I think that if he does end up coming back before the end or before the end of the regular season, then they’re going to be looking at a variety of possibilities. And with the new the new, shall we say, cap environment being what it is, I think we might see players become available that we would not necessarily expect to come available kind of out of nowhere. So, something serendipitous might end up happening to make the team kind of competitive. And to be clear, there’s a lot more work that’s going to be needed to be done with this roster for it to be like a true contender again. But they might be able to get out of the first round if Jason Tatum is back and they could find the right move. But there’s a lot of ifs in that sentence. So, I think it’s still bested really temporary expectations and plan on seeing him back and competing seriously the season after the coming season. Yeah. No, go ahead. No, I agree with you. Jaylen Brown has been making a lot of public events recently. Uh, as well as we kind of move back into the non-hibernating part of the league calendar. Uh he called the Celtics being in a new era, which I think is pretty safe to say we agree on that. Like I don’t know what we would call this new era. I think it’s kind of too soon to say based on we we still don’t even really know what Jason Tatum looks like coming back. And there is a chance that he is not quite the same player. Uh but he’s also been doing, you know, some some fairly less depressing things than commenting about the state of the roster. Uh like showing up for Bill Nye’s uh Hollywood star ceremony. Did you did you catch any of that at all? I I did not Bill Ny guy u I mean I I know who Bill Nye is but obviously but I did not um I did not catch that. Well, you have something on my wife uh who granted she is Mexican. We live in Mexico and she had never heard of Bill Nye which is a shame. I’m going to have to show her all the Bill Nye stuff now. Uh but yeah, she she she doesn’t know. So you got one on her. But while we’re talking about Browns, uh the Celtics also signed Kendall Brown and Jaylen Bridges to camp deals. Do you think either one has a shot at making the roster? I think they’re competing against R.J. Lewis most likely. Yeah. So, um, Jaylen Bridges is a little more interesting to me. This is a guy that I really followed throughout his career um, at Baylor and I just thought he was kind of a prototypical wing forward type player that you were looking for. Obviously started his career at West Virginia, but I mean like reading my pre-draft notes on him, obviously he’s one year in already. prototypical NBA 3 and D wing forward. Um, may not have a bunch of upside anywhere else, but could nicely fit into a role in a second unit. So, you know, I think for Bridges, as with a lot of these guys that are potentially fill these roles, it really comes down to the three-point shooting, right, Justin? Like, can he come in and can he consistently knock down three-point shots? And I feel like, you know, especially with the Boston Celtics, that’s something that they really value. So, I’m always about taking a chance on these type of players. This archetype just makes sense to me. Um, you know, so I I’m Yeah, like he would be of those names. I’m not saying either’s going to stick, but he’s the one that would be a little bit more interesting for me because I think that’s just such an archetype that every team needs multiple of. Yeah. He’s also shown himself, I think, to be able to stay on the court, I guess you could say, a little bit better at the NBA level than his alternative in Brown. Uh R.J. Lewis is of course completely untested at the NBA level at this point, but he is also a prototypical three in Dwing, but again with less less experience, so I I think I kind of lean towards Bridges as well. Uh, one person who will not be competing for a two-way spot with Boston is Hayden Gray, who was waved and will likely join the main Celtics to be eligible for a $75,000 bonus. He remains with him for a 60-day uh stretch. I think that is to encourage some players uh to kind of stay in the NBA ecosystem instead of going overseas. Um, this is not on the rundown, but I’m just curious your thoughts. If they do make an NBA Europe, uh, what do you think is gonna happen to players on the margins like this? If I I thought about this the other day. I’m obviously a podcast listener in general, so I’m just like everybody else. I listen to the Hoop Collective. I listen to the Zack Low podcast, all of that stuff. And I I was thinking about this when in the front office show. I I have to mention those. You know, our, you know, Keith Smith is good. Yeah. He’s a good friend. He’s been great to me. He joins the Pistons podcast all the time. and his, you know, Trevor Lane, also an amazing dude that I I get to talk to frequently. But, um, so one of those was talking about it the other day and I was like, okay, what is this going to mean? Like, are these teams going to be affiliates of NBA teams in some capacity? Is there going to be no affiliation to specific teams? You know, is it a is it the feeder to the NBA that replaces the G? Like I’m just I haven’t fully workshopped all the ideas and I don’t know that the NBA has as well. I’m just I’m kind of like you. I’m still in the stage of what is this going to mean? And then what does it mean for those players in terms of monetarily, right? Like are they going to be able to make more money in this NBA Europe League than they do in the GLeague? And so there’s all these other fascinating aspects of it that I’m really encouraged by, but quite frankly, Justin, I simply don’t know the answers to right now. Yeah, same. I I cover the Capitanis here in Mexico City and it seems like they are really trying to invest in the G- League and I think the Capitan are really leading the charge in that way. But how it will play out in Europe could be completely different even if it is something that they’re doing here to kind of integrate things more uh into the way the league works uh as they kind of have been moving over the last like decade or so. Um you’ve had some uh nice draft prospects to watch the last couple years. my guy Malik. Oh, yeah. Who’s now in the MBL, but um a really I’m I’m a fan of his game. And then obviously Dink Pay is, you know, was a a big name last season. So, you’ve had some some nice names down there with with the Cavatones to to watch over the last couple years. Absolutely. Dink is a great kid, too. I really hope I got a chance to talk to him when he first got here, and he he has big dreams, and I think he has he has the the the tools in the frame to do it, but he’s got to find someone willing to take a chance on him. He’s He’s still a ways away, I think. But yeah, he’s got a bright future. Yep. So, let’s change gears. And before we do the closer look, we have a thing called uh the steel where our guest, you in this case, gets to steal the podcast. Uh basically, the idea is you just get to talk about whatever it is you want that is not on the rundown or is not sufficiently covered on the rundown in the way you would like it to be talked about. So, what do you got for us? Does it have to be Celtics related or literally anything? Anything. Literally anything. Doesn’t even have to touch on basketball. Oh, well, I live and breathe basketball. I married a college basketball player. Like that. That’s all that’s all we do in this house. That’s sports in general. Um, okay, Justin, let me I have two questions, but the first one is basketball related and then I will go non- basketball, but sports. Um, thoughts on the Detroit Pistons, right? Like this this is the team that I do a podcast on. Um, I I’ll make it more specific. I’ll make it a little easier. What are your thoughts on Cade Cunningham as a basketball player? Where do you see him in the hierarchy of the Eastern Conference, the NBA? You think he’s a perennial AllNBA player or, you know, do you think that was more due to injuries last year and stuff like that? So, your thoughts on Kate Cunningham, the face of the franchise of the Detroit Pistons? I think a lot for the career of a player can depend on what kind of a situation that they’re in. And I think that had the older ownership group uh slashmanagement group stuck around, he might be in a bit of trouble. But I like the direction the team has been moving in. Uh more generally, I look at them as currently this season they’re kind of a big question mark along with like Indiana, uh the Philadelphia, the Celtics. And I I think that probably of those middle of the pack teams, they are probably best positioned to break out and maybe even steal home court by the end of the season. As far as Cadmore specifically, uh going back to just like the talk of circumstance, I think that with less guards on the roster, uh I think that he will have a chance to grow a bit more. I’m I’m not real confident about Jaden Ivy. Uh I’m curious what your opinion is going to be for his future with the team. Uh and I think that depending on what ends up happening with him could shape his future considerably. I think he will eventually be a perennial all-star. I’m not too sure he has a higher ceiling than that at present, but he could depending on if that three ball ever comes around. Um I’m curious how you see him honestly. Yeah. So, real quick, Ji for me, I think is the most important Piston this year in terms of the future. I mean, obviously Kate is the face of the franchise. I think Assar is probably the second most important player just in general for their but Ji I think is the most like what is he you know because I think you could make arguments anywhere from second scorer on the team you know this is a guy that shot 40% from three last season before the injury to six man and you know how many six men are there on the team that drafted them in the top five you know and so with him being extension eligible him and Jaylen Duran as well I think Ji is the player that is most talked about for you know people around the Pistons because what is he and as my good friend Sam Vassini like to says the delta of his outcomes is quite wide compared to Jaylen Duran’s where I think his delta of outcomes is a little tighter Kate Cunningham you won’t find a bigger fan Justin um I I was still pushing the Kate Cunningham narratives whenever they were losing 28 games in a row and I still thought he was going to be an excellent player in this league I think everybody got to see that last year I think he has even more to show. I think he’s a real two-way player. I don’t think he gets enough love for his defense. And so, I do think he is perennial allNBA, like, you know, even if it’s like third team, whatever. I think the biggest question for me is he perennial MVP conversation, right? Like, is is he able to be in the Jason Tatum type conversation of every year you’re talking about this player potentially being an MVP? I think that’s what Cade has to answer here moving forward. I couldn’t agree more. Okay, real quick. If I say Kansas City Chiefs and Patrick Mahomes, you say I hate football. Oh, okay. Good. I thought maybe I thought maybe as a Celtics fan here it would get like he’s no Tom Brady, you know, or something like that. So, I’m I’m from Kansas. I I I live in literally the middle of nowhere in the middle of the country in Kansas. So, I’m a Chiefs fan. That’s it’s the only thing I’m a diehard fan of. like a Chief’s loss can ruin my night. Um, you know, like I I don’t I barely consider myself a Pistons fan. I just podcast about him because I love to podcast, you know, and I cover the NBA as a whole now. So, that’s gone down even less. But the Chiefs are the team that like I understand the irrational fandom of every other fan base whenever it comes to Kansas City. So, no, no, nothing here between Yukon. Okay. Where does this come from? So, I was born in Connecticut. I became a fan of the Celtics because they were the closest NBA team and I was fascinated by the fact that there was this cup in my grandparents house that showed uh like 11 w 11 wins in or 10 wins in 11 years. And that and the shot by uh Tate George by the Yukon Huskies against Clemson, I think it was a 1989 NCAA tournament, transfixed a 13-year-old uh and got him absolutely fascinated with the sport of basketball. The Huskies were a lot better when I started following them than the Celtics were uh for reasons we don’t need to discuss uh any particular length here. A patino and uh the irrational fandom you talk about. I still have that with with Yukon. Uh I manage to excise that from most areas of my life. I mean you still kind of root for the teams that you cover just because it’s a human thing to do. Y but yeah. Yeah. No, I that irrational phandom thing if if the Husky like I I almost convinced myself I liked uh football again just for a second when the Huskies were beating uh Syracuse uh for most of the game. Then they collapsed in epic fashion and uh once again I don’t play football. So here’s the thing. Terrace Reed Jr. the name that everybody needs to know. That dude is going to be a monster this year at Connecticut and uh I think is going to end up on a lot of NBA draft radars. He is a really good player. I don’t disagree. So, let’s talk about some other really good players in the closer look. Uh bigs, I think, are the area where the Celtics need the most luck. They need one or two of these players that we’re going to be talking about to actually turn into a real rotation player. I think three or four of them might, but you can tell me what you think when we’re done. Uh but Nimeta I think is probably the name at the top of everyone’s list for wanting to work out and I don’t think he’s that far away what we saw from him uh at FIA Euro Basket was very very promising on a number of levels. We we’ve discussed that in particular in the past but um mostly I’m I’m curious do you think he’s ready to start at the NBA level and if not how far do you think he is? Um I think he’s at least worth trying. Right. Like this is one thing I’ve said even when the Tatum thing happened. I I don’t listen no Celtics fan they’re all going to roll their eyes at me if I say there’s some sort of silver lining to the Tatum injury because there’s just not like there is though. I mean like it’s not it’s not like the kind of silver lining that makes you like excited that it happened but there there’s some benefit there there is. It’s just like when you’re a team that’s in a championship window, losing a year of that championship window is tough. But the the silver lining is I said it from the the the the episode we had after the Tatum injury. Boston now gets a chance. I I think if they don’t take this opportunity to find out what they have in guys, it’s a missed opportunity. And and the first name I always brought up was Baylor Shyman. I know we’ll get to him eventually, but Kada is another one, man. Like I I find myself very positive on him. He’s always interesting to me. He moves well. You know, he’ll he’ll have uh, you know, some blocks, some rotations, uh, the play finishing aggressively. Again, the the defensive rotation and rim protection, you know, at his size. I’m just like, let’s see what it looks like in what do we think, 25 minutes a night or something like that. I will say it’s interesting because he’s just not the type of big that we’re used to working in Boston, right? like he’s the complete opposite of Porzingis. He’s the opposite of Al Horford in terms of the skill level that those guys have. And so like that’s where I think it’s an interesting fit for him because while I think he does some things well, it’s not the things that it seems like maybe Boston always values from a big man. Yeah, I I am really looking forward to seeing how he plays with the Celtics this coming season, but he’s going to make a lot of mistakes and we have to give him room to make those mistakes. My cat is going to attack the door uh perennially. So, uh if you could just filibuster for me for just a second. Yeah. No, absolutely. So, um, yeah, I mean, Kada’s, like I said, it would be interesting to see. And I think where Justin was going with that was in terms of giving him a little bit of a leash, right? Like giving him some freedom to make mistakes and then learn from those mistakes. You know, it’s it’s one thing to give players a leash and allow them to make mistakes, but then eventually they have to learn from them, right? And so, I think to start the year, you give him that room and that freedom. And then if he’s not correcting it or not getting better, then maybe you have to look to the other guys on the roster like uh Luca Garza or you know I know Amari Williams is a name um that maybe I’m not as high on but um you know I can understand if Boston wants to turn to one of those guys. Absolutely. So let’s touch on Luca Garza. He is shall we say raw defensively but has flash offensive potential. I am skeptical he’s going to be more than a third big, but I do see the path for him to be a good second big. I don’t think he’ll ever have starting potential. I could be wrong, but I’m curious about your opinion. Yeah, I mean, so for people who don’t know, this is where Garza started his career right here in Detroit. So, um I’m sure you can go out and find some Luca Garza video breakdowns uh from myself. I’m with you. I I think here’s the thing with Garza. the shooting is a little bit more theoretical than practical. And I think that’s why you get, you know, kind of stuck at third big and can’t even get to second big. Justin, if he shot it the way I think sometimes people think or even what it looks like, you know, or some of the streaks he goes on making shots, I think he’s a second big even with the vast defensive limitations. But I’m interested to see in a system like we just talked about where I assume he will be very encouraged to take as many threes as he can get if being in a system like that where it’s very encouraged if he can knock down shots because if he knock down shots maybe he finds a long-term home for Boston as the you know the third big that plays when somebody’s out and you know I I think that could be a good role for him but I I think it it begins with Luca Garza knocking down threes at a real rate consistently. So between he and Keta both have been shooting the three. I think it’s pretty clear that Keta is much newer to that form of offense uh than Garza is. But do you think that Missoula is going to coach Joe Misoula is going to have the patience for that to become part of their game? because it’s really, you know, the confidence aspect of being able to be trusted making that shot when you’re open is really important and in past seasons there just wasn’t that available for Keta. Presumably both going to have the runway this season, don’t you think? Yeah. I mean, if that’s the way they want to play it, it I’m glad you bring up the mental side of it, Justin. I think it’s real easy for people to go, “Oh, well, the mechanics look better. the mental side of it is is just so important. And the more I’m around this, I think this is my started my sixth year doing NBA podcasting and as I’ve I’ve grown, I’ve got the, you know, the pleasure and the opportunity to meet coaches and shooting coaches and talk to players and stuff like that. The mental side is so huge, man. It’s so huge. And so, what’s the thing? What’s What’s Kada going to do the first time he catches at the top of the key and bricks it and then he bricks the second one and then the center on the other team just stares at him from the free throw line and says, “Be my guest. Is he going to shoot it again? Is he going to shoot it with confidence? What if he misses that one? Is Missoula taking him out and now Garz is going in? What if Garza?” You know, so I guess my point here is the mental side for those guys is important. I also think Missoula and you could speak on this better than me. I think that team also has to have how are we gonna play without five floor spacers? How are we gonna play without a floor spacing big? Because our offense can’t just be a disaster if they’re playing off of Garza in the corner or Kada at the top of the key or whatever, you know, like what is the actions? What are we going to play? How are we going to play if we’re playing without a floor spacing big because these guys can’t do it consistently or the other team’s not respecting it? Because at the end of the day, you guarded Kristoff from 30 plus feet because that dude could shoot it from real distance. And you knew you had to guard Horford at the very least in the corners. And there’s a world where there’s one guy on the floor at all times for Boston this year where that’s not the case. What he’s not on the run, but what are your thoughts on Chris Bucher? I know he’s not going to start. He’s never he’s never really been a starter and he’s more of a four leaning towards a three than a four leaning towards a five. Uh do you think he would have any utility? you know, as a as a short time like uh small ball. Yeah, sure. I I I think that’s reasonable. And, you know, depending on what lineups you put out there with him, like who you if you played big enough at the four or you know, it’s always like who who on the other team like you got to be able to get the matchups and and those type of things. But, I mean, I think as we talked through this, you like it’s just like Missoula is going to have options and this is where, you know, he’s probably going to do his best coaching job in Boston. And that’s no disrespect. Like listen, I I’m not one of those people that are like, “Oh, they have Tatum Brown, Derek White, whatever. This is really easy.” Like, no, it’s not easy. You know, he took over for a coach that did a really good job and, you know, lost his job for things that had nothing to do with basketball, right? And he came in, he took that over and then he had to put his identity into that and go win. Yeah. And go win basketball games at the highest level. So, I’m not saying that in a disrespectful way like Missoula hasn’t done an incredible job. I’m just saying, you know, sometimes when we talk about options for a coach, it’s in a positive way and it should be, but it also means they have to make the right decisions with those options. And right now, we’ve talked about like five different dudes that he could play at the big man position. He’s got to find the right uh guys in the right spots against the right teams. And it will be really interesting to see how him and his staff handle that. Low key, that’s going to be one of my favorite themes throughout the season, just seeing how he adapts to this level of talent, these kinds of goals, and how it’s not really kind of more like a I don’t want to say ego management because it’s far more than that, but uh it’s a different kind of a task where you you have to get the people who are already kind of established in their game to play well together in ways that depend on a lot of things and not just how they play on the court. Uh what about Amari Williams? I know you kind of expressed a little bit of reservations. I am doubtful about what his NBA level skill besides passing is going to be. Uh he he seems like one of the people in the league like Cam Johnson who originally started out playing in the back court and then had a growth spurt and he hasn’t quite figured out what to do with the growth spurt yet. Am I wrong about that? Yeah. No, that’s I mean he’s strong, well built lefty, very left-hand dominant, very left-hand dominant. Um I do he has very active hands defending in the ball screen plays the cat and mouse game all of that has some movement ability but it’s really the passing ability right with Amari Williams I just sometimes I like I I know it it’s exciting to talk about that skill for bigs right like I understand it and I’ve even got myself into this a little bit but it’s like okay if that’s Amari Williams number one offensive skill is that really what you want from a third big or do you want like something that’s a little bit more lob thread or you know some of the other true big guy things. So I think for Amari Williams that’s what’s going to be like do the other quote unquote big guy things and then the passing becomes intriguing. Now here’s the thing. Let’s say you’re playing a game and a team decides they want to double Jaylen Brown off every ball screen action or something, right? Amari Williams may be your best option to go in there and be that ball screen setter, right? because he’s going to short roll and he may be the guy you trust the most to make the passing decisions out of it over some of these other guys. So, I mean, again, all of these different little puzzle pieces that Joe’s going to have to decide. Um, but but Amari’s not a guy I’m as high on as maybe other other people you may talk to. So, okay. Yeah, it’s basically where I’m at as well. I’m really hopeful that he can build those baseline big man skills, but it is kind of late in the game thankfully. that is probably I mean everyone is needs needs to know how to like box out and rebound and such like that. So I mean like he’s going to need to improve those skills regardless but yeah I’m hopeful he does. Uh the question is whether or not there’s gonna be enough runaway for him when things can ramp back up to being a contending team because he’s like several years away in my opinion. Yeah. Yep. Josh Min of the Wings. Uh he kind of he’s kind of more of like a a three four like leaning more towards a four in my opinion. Uh I’m curious to does does he have real rotation potential in your opinion? He’s he’s had some time in the NBA but he’s never really had any playing time at the NBA level. Yeah, I mean he’s one I’m not you know as high on you know like the shooting’s never fully materialized. Obviously a big time athlete. you kind of alluded to it like he’s a little bit of a tweener in terms of like the position and all of that. Uh listen, I’m not anti- Josh Minot and if if he plays minutes, great. If I’m Boston though, like I’m using this season to give minutes to Baylor Shyman and and we’ll depending on where Hugo is at um potentially Hugo as well. But and and quite frankly Jordan Walsh in my opinion um over my not. So again, I’m not anti- Josh Minot, but like I would be investing my time at least early in the season of minutes into a a Shyman into a Jordan Walsh and again potentially a Hugo Gonzalez. Definitely agree. Uh speaking of Walsh, uh it seems like a lot of people in the Celtic sphere are kind of down on him even though he had a bounceback summer league after a pretty disastrous one and he showed some real signs at the end of last season as well at the NBA level. I’m curious. Do you think he has an NBA future and like what does he need to do to secure it? Yeah, I thought he did. Um this this may end up being a guy I was, you know, wrong on. Um but I I really thought Jordan Walsh was a guy I I loved it. Again, it it was kind of the Jaylen Bridges thing, right? Like this is the archetype of players that you look for in the NBA, especially on the margins, right? Like we want to talk about on the margins. So, you know, whatever happens with Walsh, if it if it doesn’t span, you know, pan out, I think that’s okay. But it was a guy I thought had potential because I thought he could be impactful defensively, little bit athleticism, but again, you know, NBA career, he’s at 27% from three. Even looking at the G-League numbers, um, you know, it was better last year. The year before was at 35%. You know, well, it was only one game last year, so that doesn’t even count, you know. So, um, you know, it just it I I know sometimes it sounds oversimplified, but it truly is for that role. You got to knock down shots, Justin, and then be good defensively, find other, you know, rebounding, whatever. But if you can’t make shots, you can’t play, you know, and so like I I think again, we’ll we’ll see from him this year. I think it’s one of those years and those opportunities that he’s got to take advantage of or his NBA career for sure in Boston may be a little bit in doubt, right? Yeah, there’s been some discussion. We don’t know like how much it’s going to change. You alluded to it as well whether or not Boston continues to play the same kind of style that they may be more open to cutting even though it affects the spacing in ways they aren’t necessarily fans of when they had the roster they had, but they don’t have that roster anymore, right? So with the players they have on the roster, cutting seems to be something may be doing more of this coming season and I think that would probably benefit Jordan Walsh in particular more than a lot of other people on the roster. Ugo Gonzalez I think is the other name and he is so when this podcast had a different name uh in earlier iterations one of our founding co-hosts uh Josh Coin he is based in London and he is a huge fan of uh Ugo I’m very curious what you think of him because he is such a tabular rasa blank slate if you of of a player in an NBA context. And it’s very very hard to see a player who played as little as he did in a European context. That’s very normal there as I understand it. But I am I’m not a fan of the European game the way that some people like Josh and perhaps yourself are. What What are your thoughts on his potential role with the Celtics and what kind of expectations we should have with him in his rookie year? Yeah, I mean I think we should keep our expectations low. I mean, this is a, you know, an 18-year-old kid. Well, no, what 19 now? Yeah, I just turned 19 in February. Um, you know, he was tough for me all evaluation cycle because the minutes were so low and it was just like it was, you know, it’s tough to get a a great evaluation. He finally built a little bit more. I think the thing that always stands out with him is just like the size and the physicality even at 19, right? So, you know, he shows here’s here was my summer league notes. Impressed every game I watched. Size, athleticism, and energy level. Has to do a better job making shots, taking care of the ball. I think he’s going to have to learn to control his energy and harness it in a positive play on both ends of the court. Those are my word for word notes from summer league. And listen, I know summer league isn’t the end- all beall, but it kind of stay that that’s kind of in lock step with my notes from my pre-draft evaluation of him as well. There’s real potential here. Again, theme of the pod, you got to knock down shots. But I think with Hugo specifically, the energy level is going to be there. all of that, can you can you, you know, focus it into positive winning basketball plays, not sometimes things that look a little bit reckless on both ends of the floor, whether that’s a defensive mistake being out of position or a turnover offensively with a bad pass or, you know, driving into trouble. So, it it’s going to be a learning curve for Hugo, but again, I think it’s a mistake. I think it’s a missed opportunity if you don’t at least give him some NBA minutes along with what I assume are minutes with with the team in Maine as well. That was going to be my other question as to how much you thought he was going to be in Maine versus in Boston. I I agree with you. I think he’s probably going to be mostly in Maine, but I do think particularly this season with the opportunity that’s available early in the season at least they should be giving him a chance. Yeah. Yep. I would agree. RJ Lewis, the last of the wings. Uh, what does he need to do to not lose his two-way spot? Um, we talk about this all the time, make shots, right? I mean, um, listen, I I’m not, you know, I’m not a huge RJ Lewis guy. Um, people know if again if they listen to the podcast, you know, Game Theory, we didn’t love the decision that that he made. Um, but this is a guy, you know, career 31% from three, 76% from the free throw line. Um, so a 3 and D guy where the three is a huge question mark right now. So, um, defensive versatility is is good. Um, has good burst. Um, but off the ball player, you know, going to be good on the defensive end. You got to come in and make shots. So to keep his two-way, I guess to answer your question, you got to be that versatile wing defender that your reputation is right now. And then can you turn your game into a catch and shoot three-point guy and do that at at a high rate in a consistent clip? So we have two guards left of the players who are more or less in a developmental season uh this coming campaign. Baylor Shyman, who you touched on, and also Max Schulga. Uh there’s been there was a huge amount of excitement among Celtics fans at the end of last season when we got a good look at Shyman getting some real NBA minutes with some real confidence that he would be able to play those minutes. And he did pretty well overall. Though, weirdly, what he was like largely hyped about was his three-point shooting, which was not very good at the NBA level. It’s been fine at the G-League level. Again, I think this is a confidence thing to keep touching on that that that topic. Uh but what what does this season need to be like for him to be a success? Yeah, I mean, he’s got knockdown shots. And here’s the thing is Baylor is a guy that I really thought could shoot it. So, I’ll read you my pre-draft. Wing floor spacer who has solid positional height combined with great overall strength for his position and role. His absolute Here you go. His absolute elite skill has to be his three-point shooting and floor spacing value. Has been a high volume three-point player throughout um all of college. Tertiary skills that will offer a team include a plus positional passer and ball mover along with impactful defensive rebounding. My biggest questions would center around how else he scores the ball offensively and if he can at least be neutral on the defensive end of the court. Um feel like that’s pretty close to what he’s been Yeah. so far in his NBA career. Listen, if if he doesn’t shoot it at a high rate in the NBA, it will be a big miss for me because I thought he was going to be a really big-time shooter. The college stats are good, the free throw percentages are good. Maybe just simply, you know, that the confidence isn’t there. So, I would I’m expecting a really nice year from Baylor Shyman where he does knock down, you know, maybe not 40%, but maybe we get to 35 36 decent volume and then then the questions become, can you attack a closeout and hit a mid-range pullup? Can you attack a closeout, get to the rim? I know he can attack a close out and then spray it out and make good passing decisions. And again, I think he’s an impactful rebounder. So, can we start there and then start to build off that? But the foundation has to be knocking down the three. Definitely agree. I think he’s gonna surprise people who are worried about him this season with a lot more runaway than he’s had in the past. Uh but he does need to start making those shots and finding other ways to score. He could also be a beneficiary of more cutting on this team as well, but I think it’s really going to be more like the Jordan Washes, the the Josh, and the Gonzalezes who benefit from that. Of the many big men I hoped that the Celtics were going to take in the last draft, none of them materialized. And then Liam McNeely fell into range. But they didn’t take him either. The only player the Celtics did take that I was really hopeful they were going to take was almost at the end of the entire draft in the second round being Max Schulga. Um, I’ve been a big fan of his game, not because it’s flashy. In fact, it’s very not flashy. uh as we saw in summer league this year, he is a very stable presence and he lived up to that. Uh we didn’t really get to see his three-point game at the uh G the summer league level, which was a little concerning to me, but it wasn’t, you know, like a disaster either. Uh he was, you know, again, not impressive, but very little turnovers, good assist rate. Uh did not ever look flustered. managed to like draw to and kick without any problems, which is going to be really important for him in in Boston if he ever does get a rotation role. Uh I’m curious what your thoughts on him and his future in the NBA are. Yeah, I mean literally my notes from summer league on Schulga. Let him run your G-League team. Like let him go run your team in Maine. And that’s not a knock. I was I was having a conversation actually with a college coach the other day that was a former G-League coach and we were talking about how like how important that is, how important having a lead guard, point guard for your team is because in the G-League because you’re trying to learn about guys down there. You learn less about who go Gonzalez if you don’t have a Max Schulga type of player running your offense. You know, the team that I can always reference is the Modis Bazllis Ron Holland um G-League Ignite team. All we said all year with that team was they needed a point guard to just run the show and get the ball to the guys in the spots they wanted. So, this is a compliment to Scholga. Go earn your, you know, show what you can do. Help those guys out down with Maine and then build out your NBA future from that. So, I’m all in on the offense with Schulga. Again, I think he’s a guy that can shoot it. All of the the numbers and the metrics from college kind of back that up. the catch and shoot numbers are really good and I think it’s just a smooth and effortless jump shot. Um, you mentioned like playing under control, assist to turnover, all of that. I’m probably a little lower on the defense than others were coming into the draft, but I think he’s going to really compete in all of that. I think the defense is fine. I think he’s going to be fine defensively. Um, he’s really going to make his hay if he makes it in the NBA, knocking down shots at a really high rate and then running and controlling your offense without turning the ball over. Absolutely. And it doesn’t hurt to have a Payton Pritchard on the roster to learn from how to be a small guard who can still defend competently at the NBA level. Of these players, who would you say has the highest ceiling, if anyone? Oh. Um, Hugo. Hugo has the highest ceiling for me. Um, I don’t know what percentage that is. Um, you know what I mean? But I I think you just talk about like the energy, the athleticism, the body, all of that. I I think right now if if you wanted highest of ceiling, if that’s all you were betting on, I would probably go Hugo. Yeah, I’ve had uh one of our co-hosts uh sees him as a potential future wing version of Derek White in terms of the defense. Uh the shooting obviously would have to come along considerably to be in that regard, but it did for Derek as well at one point. So, it’s definitely not out of the question, but agreed. It’s a pretty unlikely flip side of the same coin, who do you think has the lowest floor of any of these prospects? Um, Amari. Yeah. Yeah. Just because at least for me, I agree completely. you you need to have at least one established NBA level skill. And his passing is very good for a big man, but it’s unclear if it is an NBA level skill at this point. So until I actually see that in a context where he can, you know, see the floor and convert it without getting stripped, without, you know, getting pulled, but for other reasons. Yeah. So I I tend to agree with that. Doesn’t mean, you know, we’re not crapping on him. No. But he’s a young player. He, you know, we highlighted the reasons why his game is different from everyone else on the roster and he’s got a lot of time to work, but the question is, is it going to be with Boston? And there’s a pretty good chance it’s not going to be ultimately. Yep. If you had to guess who’s most likely up for a breakout season, who do you think it would be and why? I’ll I’ll roll with Baylor here. like this is this is this was the first name I thought of when the Tatum injury happened and I started thinking again through the quote unquote silver lining. So I think if any of these guys really break out with the Boston Celtics, you know, um you like if you told me uh you know like we just talked about Schulga that he has an incredible GLeague, you know, whatever, but I think Baylor’s the most likely to really break out with Boston this year. Um, I think he’s a willing high volume three-point shooter and so if he gets it going, you know, that could he could have a really good year from there. Again, he’s an he’s a rebounder and he’s also a good passer. So, I I think Baylor fits into what they want to do and if he knocks down shots, I think he would be a guy. Definitely agree. Not the best, most exciting podcast you agree on so much, but I mean I think uh with so much ahead of this team there, we we’re kind of drawing on the same stuff and the same same material to to uh analyze them. So I guess it’s not that surprising. What is a success successful developmental season look like for the whole team in your opinion? Sure. Yeah, that that’s an interesting one. So, if I’m Boston, if one of these centers is a rotation center for me in 26 27, that’s a win. If I can find one of these guys, whether it’s Kada, which they already have info on Kada, right? But, um, or if it’s Luca Garza, like you just like, hey, like he actually fits perfect with what we want him to do. Um, and when I say rotation center, maybe not it’s the second, maybe it’s the third center. And then I want to say one wing probably two maybe two of those guys of Schulga Shyman Hugo Jordan Walsh like if you could get two of those guys again just to be like rotation level players where you’re coming out of this like you know what I think I think Baylor can play for us even in 26 27 whenever we’re back competing for a championship and I think Jordan Walsh is now, you know, our 10th guy or something like like if you can find two of those guys. So not I I don’t know that any of the I would say Hugo. So let’s say one center Hugo and one other wing type player. I think that would be like a really successful like young group like development for the Boston Celtics. Um I I think that would be big for them. I don’t disagree. I I think I would be okay with a big and a wing only. Sure. But that’s what we’re going for. Maybe I got Maybe I got greedy there, Justin. I I couldn’t leave out Hugo. You couldn’t leave out Hugo and uh and Baylor there, so I had to put them both in. Cool. So, I you’ve been super generous with your time. It’s super late when we’re recording. Uh but before we get you out of here, uh where can we find your stuff? Sure. Yeah. Motorc City Hoops on Twitter on Blue Sky. I have a Substack. Um, I wouldn’t recommend to your listeners subscribing to it. Just anytime Detroit plays Boston, um, go check it out. Um, I I put out game notes. It’s just it’s literally raw notes. Like I just it’s bullet point notes. It’s not paragraph form. I think people kind of like it. And then sometimes I do video breakdowns. What you should subscribe to is the new game theory uh with Sam Vassini Substack where he’s got video breakdowns. I’ll do some NBA draft video breakdowns whenever I have a chance over there as well. Pistons Pulse podcast if you want some Pistons content. Um, but again definitely go listen to the Game Theory podcast with with Sam Bassini uh YouTube, Apple, Spotify, whatever. So that’s uh everything I got going. Can’t re recommend the Game Theory enough in particular that that uh that podcast got me through the worst of the doldrums uh your defensive players series. I really enjoyed that. Yeah. So before we get out of here uh for good, we do something that we call something to remember or forget. It can be whatever you want. Again, doesn’t have to be MBA related. Mine is going to be I’ll give you a second to think. Uh the thing I want to remember is free agency. Once upon a time, it was a real thing. It kind of isn’t anymore. And I’m wondering like how related that is to the entire middle class of the NBA kind of being screwed over by this current CBA. Not intentionally. I don’t think either side had it out for the other, but like all the salary away from like very small like mid-level exceptions and down up to like these maxes and super maxes. There’s like very little gray area at the present. That’s probably going to change in the future. But I can’t help but wonder like is the labor aspect of the NBA and the union and players association playing a role in this and that without free agency and the robust protections that a really aggressive union pushing for expanded free agency instead of this kind of like we just trade into the team that we want to. Uh, I’m just remembering how that used to be versus how it is now. And I’m really curious to see how it plays out in the future in terms of the next CBA negotiations. Hopefully not a labor stoppage. Yeah. Um, I want to remember what it’s like to just analyze onc court basketball. So, I agree with everything you just said, Justin, but I am to the point of the offseason where I’m tired of talking about Kawhi Leonard and the Clippers. I’m tired of talking about Jonathan Kaminga and restricted free agency. Even though I agree with you and I do think the this restricted free agency stuff probably needs to be looked at. You know, luckily we got the giddy and the Cam Thomas stuff done. I listen I realize it’s my job. I realize that’s what people want to listen to and that’s why I do it and I do it with energy no matter what. But I am ready for opening night of basketball and to talk about why so and so didn’t play drop coverage right and why so and so pushed the pace and how they got the switches and how you know I am ready for real games to talk about. I remember being able to do that and I miss it all all the the fun stuff like the Indiana Pacers of each season. I am so looking forward to whatever happens next next season and uh as we recorded we had our first media days in the league today so not long away. Yes sir. It’s very close. All right man. Well thanks again for joining us and uh from Hex the Pod. We’ll talk to you all soon. Take care. It’s all over. It’s all over. [Music] It’s all over. [Applause] [Music]
Which rising Boston Celtics prospects will make a leap forward this season? In something of a retooling season for the Celtics as star forward Jayson Tatum rehabs a torn Achilles tendon, the usual emphasis on deep postseason runs in pursuit of NBA titles has downshifted into a campaign that will focus on trying to find some diamonds in the rough among Boston’s younger players.
More established players on the Celtics roster like Neemias Queta, Luka Garza, Josh Minott, Baylor Scheierman, and Jordan Walsh are looking to cement a spot in future Boston rotations. And the incoming trio of 2025 NBA Draft prospects Hugo Gonzalez, Amari Williams, and Max Shulga and two way forward RJ Luis are looking to polish their game as they look to grow their skills with the Maine Celtics.
To talk about what a successful development season might look like for each and the team as a whole, “Havlicek Stole the Pod” cohost Justin Quinn and guest Bryce Simon of “Pistons Pulse” and “Game Theory” sat down and hashed out the finer details of a very different campaign for the Celtics. Check it out