11 managerial candidates the Orioles should consider | Banner Baseball Show

11 managerial candidates the Orioles should consider | Banner Baseball Show

from inside the Banner offices along the Inner Harbor. It is the Banner Baseball Show. Paul Mano and John Mioli live on a Monday in October. Wherever you are watching, could be X, could be Facebook, could be YouTube. Give us a like, give us a thumbs up, drop a comment, let us know what you think of the show. If you’re listening to us on any of your favorite podcast platforms, write us a fivestar review. That’d be real nice. I’ll read it out here on the show. John and I today are going to dive into the managerial conversation because the Orioles, I don’t know if you’ve heard, they’re currently looking for a full-time manager for the 2026 season. Also maybe looking for a general manager. We’ll save that conversation for another day. We’ll talk about the manager candidates that are out there. Some guys that uh could be attractive to Michaelas in this front office. We’ll talk about what the Orioles should be wanting in a manager and what that person would need to accomplish early in order for their tenure in Baltimore to be successful. But John, I know you’re in a good mood because a new Taylor Swift album just dropped. Yes. In a good mood. I like it. Um I enjoy it a lot and don’t not a I mean I’m I I guess a long pause. Yeah, I know. I don’t know. I haven’t thought about the difference between that like and love, you know. It’s not like, you know, I haven’t listened to anything else since it came out. I Anything else? No. Well, some You haven’t listened to your your two children. Um or your wife at home. Well, I mean, that’s not what I meant, but also no. No, it’s I I enjoy it a lot. I really like it. I think that it’s, you know, it’s a it’s a matter of managing expectations. And I think when you hear like Max Martin 1989 part two, you think one thing and then you hear it and it’s not that thing and then you need to like Is Max Martin the producer? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Um and then you kind of meet it where it is. And I was I was with somebody this weekend. We were with them. Um the kiddos were running around the brewery. We went to an ice cream place next door to the brewery. Went to a park to eat the ice cream. Sure. There’s a birthday party where they were playing it. Okay. The album as the kids were eating their ice cream and like the friend I was with wasn’t super high on it. And then every single song that came on, she was like, “Oh, I like this one.” And it’s like, I think that’s what this is going to be. Like it’s it’s people are going to like all the people like all the songs and I like all the songs and then you’re like, “Well, I guess I” But then you the album has its own like judgment space. They’re like all the songs are good. It’s fun. Taylor Swift, you know? Sure. I She’s also like in her mid-30s. Some people, you know, you have different perspectives when you’re in your mid-30s, as I’ve found out in my mid-30s. I’ve also heard the take that artists, especially musicians, are sometimes at their best when they are looking for love and they haven’t they’re in an unstable place in their life and it’s when they get settled that and they have found the one that they love, i.e. Travis Kelce in this instance that the music quality drops off because there’s there’s not the same want. There’s not the same hunger. Yeah, I think there’s some of that, you know, it’s just, you know, that’s not a place of like, you know, incredible inspiration. Also, you she was like doing a lot of stuff. She was like popping over to Sweden for like a couple days at a time in between putting on like a huge Wow. like like this was like the European leg of the Aeros Tour, which was great. And it takes a lot of energy and like, you know, takes a lot of fuel, too, for that private jet. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I just don’t know how much like I don’t know how much like, you know, attention it got, but it’s I like it. I’m not gonna not I’m not gonna not like it. Period. But I do like it. That’s fair. It’s all about managing expectations. Um, speaking of Speaking of managing and speaking of managing expectations, let’s uh let’s dive into the conversation about the Orioles search for a manager. Andy Kuska of the Banner wrote a story a few days ago laying out the list of candidates of potential candidates. We haven’t heard anything from a national media side, from the Orioles themselves about any candidates that they have talked to or interviewed. The only one that we know of is interim manager Tony Manscolino, who Michaela said is a quote real candidate end quote, but that the Orioles will explore other options. Before we dive into that list of names though, John, if you are Michaelas, I would say build an ideal candidate, but you could just come up with all of the the attributes and qualities and put them all in a in a candidate, and that’s not realistic. You can’t have every single thing that you’re looking for in a managerial candidate. So, I want to know which qualities you would prioritize. I think there are a few different ones that they will look to explore, a few boxes that they’ll look to check when they interview these candidates. One is experience, I think. Another is bring their own ideas. Another is ability to work with the front office. There are certainly others that they’re looking to check off. What are you looking for? I think that they’re going to kind of, if you want to talk about keeping your eye on the ball, like I think that first and foremost, it needs to be somebody who’s collaborative for them. Um, that’s not to say that it can’t be an experienced person. It can’t be any of the other qualities, but these, you know, this group was in Houston when they, you know, and I and I, this is like the second time in a month that I haven’t been able to remember the book that wasn’t Astro Ball about the Astros, the religious book. Um, I can’t still can’t remember the name of it. Um, I’ve only read Astro Ball. I haven’t read the book that you’re talking about. Okay. I don’t think the Bo Porter experience was like a fantastic one for anyone involved with the Astros because of some of the friction and the conflict between the front office and the manager’s office and they did, you know, nobody enjoyed that. I don’t think they’re going to I don’t think even though there are other needs that the Orioles are going to sit here and be like, ah, you know, let’s get a wild card in there. um this is still a group that you know is going to want decisions to be made in a way that they agree with and that aligns with what they think and is going to want you know a partner in this and I think that’s first and foremost even though there is you know almost if you know we’re talking about like politics or like there’s like a change mandate like something needs different needs to happen I think that the part that they will want to make sure that change stems from is like They want it to be their idea of what the change should look like. And I think that’s why I would say collaboration. As far as experience, I don’t I think I would use the word cache more than experience. Um, gra I don’t know if gravitas because that lane’s like an older thing, but I think that, and I say that because, you know, there will be a ton of respect if we’re talking about like a veteran been there, walks into spring training and like bangs his World Series ring on the on the table and like or four. Yeah. Or four or however many you have and you say, “Yep, done this.” Like, “Come with me.” And there’s also probably for a clubhouse like the Orioles like a lot of value and like they would probably feel the same way about somebody that they grew up watching play baseball and they know is good at baseball and like they could be like, “Oh, that dude like I watch that dude on TV like in big moments doing it like heartbeat slow knows what I’m going through.” I think that will be important. I think that would be just as meaningful to the clubhouse as somebody who’s, you know, been there, won that. And I and I would say I would kind of put those I would probably replace like Cache with or experience with Cache. I think that’s a good comparison to make because we talked on our last episode about it doesn’t necessarily need to be a Bruce Bochi who we will talk about somebody who has been there won all of those rings who has who has managed at the big league level. That’s it’s not a must. And for Michael that’s what he reiterated as well. It’s not a necessity. If the best candidate out there is somebody who’s never managed before, then then he’s the best candidate, then you go and get that guy. And I like the idea of a recent player. I mean, Skip Schumacher is already off the board, but Skip Schumacher is somebody who has played uh before and, you know, is was known as a player before he decided to get into coaching. There’s another guy on this list that we’ll get into that recently played for the Orioles. Didn’t you know, was a fan favorite, but wasn’t exactly an all-star. Yeah. But I like that idea that, you know, the somebody who can step into the room and command detention. Somebody who is going to get the attention of his players, somebody who the players listen to, obviously, and whether that’s because of the reputation or because of their managerial style, it needs to be probably a little bit of both. I think what I would look for personally is somebody who does a little bit of buttkicking. And I don’t know if that was there near the end of Brandon Hyde’s tenure. I think Tony Manscelino kind of upped the Annie there. And that’s something that we heard from the players is he was able to hold players a little bit more accountable, a little bit more responsible for their actions and for uh the way that they carried themselves and and how they approached the game. That to me is the most important thing because getting your young players back on track is by far the most important thing. And there are individually little things that all these guys need to work on that Adley needs to work on, that Gunner needs to work on, that Jackson Holiday does, that Colton Cowser does. And getting them to appreciate what is holding them back and then to work on those things and not take it as an insult, not take it personally, but as a way as constructive criticism. That to me is is by far number one with a bullet. Yeah. and and and it’s and it’s worth pointing out that at the beginning like Brandon Hyde was hired because he was that kind of butt kicker like there was you know there was a standard and he was going to hold people to it and it was hard to do that because you have different people at different positions every single day and most of those people are waiver claims and not really big leaguers and that was his job he was you know Joe Madden wasn’t the buttkicker in Chicago they had somebody else for that it was Brandon Hyde um a and I think I think as time went on that probably those dynamics mic probably shifted as you know things do and somebody’s in in a job for a long time but I think that is something that you know that will be part and parcel with the the gravitas and the you know respect that this person commands just by virtue of you hearing his name and and it’s it’s as simple as that and you know whom whoever this person is I don’t know if it’ll be bringing people down to Sarasota whether it’ll be traveling around the country meeting these guys like they will they will establish that early and I think that’s going to be I think that’s going to be a unique challenge is to like you know you know what especially when we’re talking about November and December you aren’t going to be telling any of these guys I hope I hope any anything they don’t know about sure why their season went to went down the tubes why they regressed why this team regressed they I I think knew it as it was happening and I’m sure they see it in themselves in the moment and with a little bit of reflection and like breaking down what they need to do to get better, they’re going to know that. But like that person is going to have to have have the kind of nuance to have that conversation and not have it be like an like the person like they walk out the door and the players like f this guy. Like, yeah, you need to some you can’t just be like going in there and be like, “Oh, well, you did this bad.” And you a veteran manager who’s had those conversations a million times before and knows how to have those conversations. A a recent player who has been on the receiving end of those conversations and know what it’s like to immediately write off somebody who’s has that conversation with you and wants to do the opposite. They are going to know that and I think that’s going to be that is going to be among the most important jobs that this person is going to have. Yeah. So, let’s dive into some of the names that are on this list. Again, this is not a list of people that the oras have interviewed. It’s not a list of people that we know that they’ve contacted. It’s just possible that they could have contacted or will plan to interview these people. These are just names that are floating out there in the ether. Let’s start with the biggest bucket of all. I think the bucket that people, a lot of fans are looking towards the most as a very fertile ground for your next manager. This is a bucket of experienced big league managers. Tend to be on the older side. Yeah. Guys that have been there, done that, managed multiple clubs in some instances and will come in day one. Everybody knows their name. Orioles will get a lot of headlines in the national media for hiring these people. It starts with Bruce Bochi who’s 70 years old. Future Hall of Fame manager, four-time World Series winner, 2010, 12,4 with San Francisco, then 2023 in his first year with the Texas Rangers. Also managed San Diego Padres’s from 1995 to 2006. Went on his big retirement tour in 2019, then came back to manage Texas in 2023. I think a lot of the gifts that he got on that retirement tour, remember the Orioles got him some kind of bottle of wine or something, every team was giving him something. Shouldn’t he have to give those back? I mean, I I would assume he drank the bottle of wine. I I would think it could be sitting there on his shelf at home. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I I don’t know what he would have done with that. I’m sure that he thought about that, but like I’m sure all those teams in that moment who gave him a gift if four years later they could have hired him, they probably would have. So, like I’m sure they were more annoyed that they couldn’t hire Bruce Bochi rather than like that they gave him a gift. Maybe that was them saying, “Hey, here’s a gift.” And if you ever think about coming out of retirement Yeah. Yeah. Remember us fondly. Yes. Um in 28 seasons as a big league manager, he’s got a 498 winning percentage. Um there is an opening in San Francisco, his old club after Bob Melvin was fired. Bob Melvin we’ll talk about in just a bit. Buster Posey is running things in San Francisco. That could be a quick call if Buster Posey wants to get Bruce Bochi back to the Giants and say, “Hey, you want to manage this club again that you won three World Series with here?” I think Bruce Bochi has also got to be considering retirement because he’s 70 and has already retired once before. Yeah. So, I’m not sure that he would want to uproot his life and come to Baltimore at 70 years old. But if you’re looking for a the biggest winner on the market, it is by far Bruce Bochi. Yes. Um, you know, nobody around here needs to needs an explanation of what he did in that one year with Texas when, you know, yeah, they saw it firsthand. We saw it firsthand. And and I think and I think one of the checks in the box of like maybe the Orioles would do this is Mike was pretty clear last week that they want to find the right manager for this team for 2026. And I don’t know if that’s, you know, maybe there’s a world where they envision like a Bruce Bochi coming in and kind of steadying the ship and then you have somebody to hand it off to, not unlike what’s happened in Texas, although Gibbacher got there after Bruce Bochi. Um, that would lend itself to um that would lend itself to him being a desired candidate. I I do think that there’s a challenge in in managing managing this division that adds an extra layer of, you know, you got to really want to do this. Like you’re going to come here and you’re going to play the Yankees and the Red Sox and the Blue Jays who you just watched on television the playoffs and you have to deal with the Rays who are always doing stuff and like they’re pesky. Yeah. This is not this is not a like one last ride type spot. This is not a one last ride type job. I don’t know that it’s like I don’t know how much somebody who is not in this for the long term could or should have this job because it’s hard and if even if it doesn’t go perfectly immediately like you want somebody who’s invested in the turnaround. Like if somebody’s planning on just coming here and winning for a couple years not to say that he will. This is to characterize him. This has characterized anybody who’s at the tail end of their career. Yeah. I don’t know that it’s going to feel great if you don’t feel like even if it’s not like the results are not perfect in the first couple months of next year, if you don’t feel like you’re building towards something sustainable. Yeah. Uh by the way, the Giants did Buster Posey did say that that they were not considering Bruce Bochi for manager. We’ll see about that. I’m I’m not 100% sure, but you know, there he could go back there or he could just walk off into retirement. And like you said, John, I think the Texas job felt more like one last job. Yeah. Than this Orioles job because that Texas job when he took it, they had just signed Cory Seager to a bunch of money and Marcus Simeon to a bunch of money and several pitchers to a bunch of money and it was like, let’s get this thing over the hump, shall we? Um, and I think this Orioles job feels like a little bit more difficult. And just because a guy has won before doesn’t mean that he’s going to win in a new location. You know, look at what Bill Bich to Cross Sports is doing at UNCC who just walks into the room and he can wrap his six Super Bowl rings on the table. That’s not going to mean that UNCC is going to win any more football games than they did before him. Yeah. Uh Phil Knight when he went to the back to the Knicks could wrap his 11 rings. Yeah. On the table. That doesn’t mean that uh you know that Knicks team was ever gonna turn things around. So just because he’s done it before doesn’t mean he is going to be able to do it again. Yeah. Phil Jackson. Phil Knight Nike. Sorry. Phil Jackson. Phil Jackson the Bulls. And also like there will be no Bill Blander here. Um although although he does deserve it right now I would say and I and I think and I think to get into the next candidate who’s Bob Melvin who I see on on the agenda and I think you could put Bud Black into this category too. Yeah. There is also not a super you know I guess Bruce Bochi did it because he was with the Padres’s and he went to the Giants and it was like one of those like oh let’s get this guy who’s like a really good manager and a team with a little heft behind it but like Bob Melvin went from it was a it was an ordeal to get him out of Oakland. Yeah. to get him to San Francisco. And eventually after doing a really good job in those circumstances in Oakland, then you you get into a bigger chair and the circumstances are different and the expectations are different and it’s harder to meet those expectations. Bud Black was like everybody thought whoever hired Bud Black after he was let go in San Diego was going to be like really lucky. I know it was a big deal to Nats didn’t get him. um because they were that kind of like let’s get this guy type team like kind of in the position the Orioles are now for like you know not able to really get over the hump. Yeah. Um you know good team, good core. Um and that obviously didn’t work out in Colorado either. But I think there’s a challenge of and this is the Orioles challenge not our challenge of figuring out like can those guys you know who is going to scale who is going to you know who is a product of like a good situation that isn’t going to translate. Those are those are real things that I think they’re probably thinking about right now. And I think and I think as you’re talking about somebody who was in a place for a long time, has been in a place, moved to a new place, didn’t work out, like there’s sometimes it’s circumstances that it didn’t work out in the second place, and sometimes it’s circumstances that it did work out in the first place. There’s really no way to know that unless you like get in the room and really figure that out. Yeah. Maybe the Padres’s are the problem because Bruce Bochi, Bob Melvin, and Bud Black all managed the Padres’s. Yeah. None of them could get over the hump. Yeah. Bob Melvin took them the farthest I believe out of all three of them and that was to the NLCS in 2022. Yeah. Well, they made the World Series in the n like late 90s Yankees and I don’t believe they won a game as most teams have played the Yankees in World Series in the late 90s though in any games. Yeah. Um it is, you know, maybe that maybe that’s it. Maybe it’s just an or maybe it’s just a Padres’s thing. I’m not sure. Uh it it could just be Bob Melvin managed the Padres’s for two years. He was uh most recently with San Francisco. He’s 63 years old. First a manager with Seattle in in 2003, then hired by the Arizona Diamondbacks. Then that stint in Oakland that you mentioned, and then to San Diego. He wasn’t fired by the Padres’s as well. Uh they just let him interview with the Giants before the 2024 season and he was hired. 22 seasons as a manager. He’s got a 514 winning percentage. He has that experience of working with a low payroll and a forwardthinking analytics driven front office in Oakland. And he did very well there. Couldn’t get them over the hump. Couldn’t get them to the World Series. Couldn’t, I don’t think, ever get them to the ALCS. Only got them to the divisional round when he was with Oakland. Is he somebody that you would consider interviewing if you were Michaelas? Absolutely. I mean, I think you consider I think you consider the interview. I’m not sure. I’m not sure again the long-term like viability and I’m not sure, you know, I think it’s it’s a tick in in his, you know, in in the pro box that he did spend that time um, you know, in Oakland kind of working under those circumstances with, you know, what they were doing there. That is the kind of collaboration the Orioles are going to be looking for. I’m I I think he’s probably the even though there’s no there’s no rings, there’s no, you know, ring culture, I believe would be what they call it in the NBA. Um even though there’s not the championship pedigree, I think that’s probably like the floor of like what an experienced manager would be deemed as acceptable if we’re talking about like getting people going. Yeah. Um let’s talk about Bud Black as well. 68 years old, fired by the Colorado Rockies 40 games into this 2025 season with a 7 and 33 record. Was manager of the Padres’s before the Rockies from 2007 to 2015. Never made the playoffs with those Padres’s teams. Came to the Rockies in 2017 after the Nationals tried to hire him and I think it was a compensation issue. I don’t think that they wanted to pay him or give him the number of years that he wanted in that instance. um made it to the postseason I believe just once. It was the Rockies. The the structure there was never great. So, it’s hard to take his winning percentage on face value and judge him by that career winning percentage of 477 as a manager in 18 seasons. Bud Black, how high is he on your uh list of candidates you want to interview? He’d be on there if if this is like a lengthy process. um if there’s a lot of time to to interview these people. But and and I think I think particularly, you know, he’s got more of a pitching background, I believe. And I think it would be interesting if they brought someone in with that kind of background given that the Orioles pitching side kind of feels like it’s in a good place and like you don’t really want I I don’t know how much like oversight or like outside influence I would want on that right now. Yeah. Um, one more experienced manager that we’re throwing into this bucket, Brian Snicker, 69 years old, managed the Atlanta Braves for 10 seasons with a 548 winning percentage, won the World Series in 2021. Now, he was offered an advisory role in Atlanta’s front office after they decided to part ways with him as manager within the past week. I would expect that he would take that because he’s closer to retirement age. Seems like he just kind of wants to stay in Atlanta. But maybe if there’s a team that comes calling Yeah. and says, “We really want you to be our manager.” He could be coaxed out of that. I’m I’m just speculating here. Would you want to at least talk to Brian Snicker? Yeah, that doesn’t feel like, you know, I think the more like steeped in like something someone else is, the harder it’s going to be to plop them in heat into Baltimore and like that ecosystem over there at the warehouse. Sure. and say like here’s how we do things. Brian Snicker has been with the Braves for his entire career um as you know minor league big leagues like that is he’s a brave that is different and I don’t know I don’t know how I don’t know if that is the that is the kind of different the Orioles are looking for. Yeah. All right. So those are the four kind of biggest names there that could be on the market. Our second bucket is guys who have managed in the big leagues before but haven’t found a whole ton of success. Two guys in this bucket that I put here, Scott Service and David Ross. Scott Service, 58 years old, 11-year big league catcher, then managed the Seattle Mariners from 2016 to 2024, finished with a 514 winning percentage. Made the playoffs just once 2022 that broke a believe the longest streak in the majors at that point of being postseason lists for the Mariners. um ended that drought but then was fired in the middle of the 2024 season. Mariners are are currently doing very well without him. Does Scott service interest you at all, John? I think so. Um you know, I think there’s that I think there’s the you know, you definitely have the cache, you definitely have the experience, you definitely have the um relative success. I I do wonder, you know, I think and I I think he among all these candidates and I think you get into the the lower down on like the success in your past stops ladder you go, the more it’s about like are you going to be able to play ball here? Um sure, you know, if if somebody with four World Series ranks comes in, they are going to get more room to operate and room to influence things than somebody who does not have that. And I think that is just that feels like just a kind of not a deal breaker, but it feels like it feels like there’s going to be a need to kind of understand where the Orioles priorities lay with that. Like how much are they willing to let someone come in and and like, you know, demand is jazz Yeah. jazz things up and do things differently when I I when they don’t like when there’s not like a not I don’t want to say not a reason but like where are the proof points that you did not you know that you can or should be able to do this that you’re a good manager. Yeah. Yeah. And I think, you know, I I think there’s I think this is where you get into like uh you know, you know, everybody likes coffee. Like what do you put in your coffee? Like do you want this flavor? Do you want that flavor? Like do you want sugar? You know, it’s all about like what they want at that point. And I think that’s this is where it gets a little more gray and amorphous of like, okay, yeah, like you’ve been you’ve done this and you know, so have we. Yeah. They they’ve had a long time to think about this, too. They they fired Brandon Hyde back in May. They’ve had a long time to think about who their ideal candidate would be, who the people are that are out there on the market and what they want. This is going to be a test of what we talked about last week, John, and how much is Michaelas in this front office willing to change? How much are they willing to seed control of areas of the organization that they have been incredibly tightfisted over? Yeah. talking about the hitting operation, talking about the pitching operation, talking about the way that they approach their players, um, and talking about filling out the coaching staff, how much are they going to be willing to relent? And if Bruce, you know, obviously Bruce Bochi walks in that door, you’re going to have to let him run things his own way because he’s won four World Series. But if somebody like Scott Service walks in that door, you could say, “All right, you’ve done it before, but it’s not like you’ve won a World Series. You’re not going to be able to hire whoever you want. You’re not going to be able to do whatever things however you want.” Yeah. Another guy that is on this list that is really intriguing, David Ross, 48 years old, 15-year big league catcher, catcher, the catcher to manager pipeline is is strong. Yeah, Robin Cinos is already along that way as well. I a side note for Robin Cinos, I think he could be a manager one day. Just one year of big league bench coach experience. I’m not sure that he might get a a courtesy interview from the Orioles. I’m not sure. Yeah, it’ll be interesting to see how they like that whole like kind of those like I think I think uh Tony Mansel will call them like the fundamental coaches, not like I would be really interested to see how that group goes because Britain. You want I would love to hear I would love to if I had a chance and I was with the Orioles, you know, front office like I’d love to hear what that would be. You know, you don’t want these people to go off and wow someone else in an interview before they get a chance to wow you. That would be bad for business. Yeah. Uh let’s talk about David Ross, though. won two World Series near the end of his career, won Boston 2013, then rides off into the sunset with the Chicago Cubs in 2016, managed the Cubs for four seasons from 2020 to 2023. Finished with a 480 winning percentage, made the playoffs in 2020, fired in order to bring in Craig Councel, who many consider to be one of the best managers in the big leagues. They lure him away from Milwaukee and unfortunately David Ross is on the outs because of that. And then the Orioles were one of two teams along with the Yankees that were reportedly interested in bringing in David Ross as a bench coach since he was fired by the Cubs, but the reporting is that he told teams, I’m only coming back to the dugout to manage, which good for him if he wants to to set that uh boundary as well. Yeah. Um David Ross would be an interesting candidate and if the Orioles had interest in bringing him in as a bench coach, surely they would have interest in bringing him in now that they have an opener at manager. Yes, absolutely. I think the mitigating factor of like this time last year when they’re trying to bring him in as a bench coach, his old first base coach, Brandon Hyde, was the person who was in the big office and now he is not there. Um, you know, I’m not I don’t know how I don’t know if they’re like tight, but I know that they’re there’s a relationship there. And I’m not sure I’m not sure, you know, anyone I’m not sure. I’m not sure if that’s like a an avenue that either party would would go down. Again, I’m not saying I I don’t know. Brandon Hyde was fired by the Orioles like in a like and it kind of stinks when that happens and like he worked here for a long time and I’m sure that I’m sure that it’s hard um for him and those around him to have had that happen and I don’t know that somebody who would be seeking his perspective on working here would would be a person who would um want to work here. Yeah. For the same reason that I think the Orioles did not give the interim manager job to Tim Cousins even though he was kind of like the most senior member of their coaching staff when Brandon Hyde was fired. It’s because Tim Cousins and Brandon Hyde are best buds. Yeah, that would be awkward that I don’t think Tim Cousins would want to do that, would want to take over for his friend that was just fired for a similar reason. I’m not sure David Ross would feel have great feelings about the Orioles if they fired his good friend Brandon Hyde. Yeah. Because on a this is not like and I’m not saying like I know that like Brandon Hyde and David Ross like talked about this but if you are taking a job like this you know that there’s going to be lumps and you know there’s going to be a lot of blame that comes your way and like you’re just going to you know that is part of being a manager is that like you you ride the wave. Yeah. Yeah, wave goes, you know, wave crest, wave falls, you’re you you are on the roller coaster and there is very little like we we’re not relating against this for a million time. The Orioles were doing like playing badly, but there was a lot that went wrong that was not Brandon Hyde’s fault. Yeah. And you don’t want to take a job where you somebody you intimately know was like fair, unfair, blamed, blamed for that. Yeah. Um All right. Final bucket here is a list of guys who have never managed at the big league level but are seen as upandcomers in the sphere. Can I put Rockco Baldi in that mix too? Let’s throw Rockco. I think the Twins kind of I don’t want to say they’re like oral Z and how they operate but you know I think they’re all the front offices are basically spawned from like one other front office. Um at this point um you know quote unquote like smart team done it with different resources. Um work collaboratively won three division titles in seven years. um things didn’t they fell apart down the stretch last year like they were a playoff team until they weren’t um this year who who even knows what happened with that team like that could be a situation where you know you have you know that dude’s done it um the wound socket rocket obviously go New England um would love to have a New Englander in the mix for obvious reasons we could talk about Drake May um we’re not talking about Drake May on this podcast Roco Baldonian I can’t Oh. Oh, gotcha. Okay. Yeah. Good. Cuz you save those conversations for off air. Yeah. Yeah. There’s been a lot of there’s been a lot of winning. There’s been a lot of like young players producing there. Yeah. It feels like it feels like that could be I think there’s a world where that’s a good that’s a good good manager who you know bad circumstances why he’s available and like that is the type of thing that that is a like a buying opportunity. Yeah. I think the Twins situation, watching from afar, wasn’t too dissimilar from the Orioles situation. I mean, had some expectations to win this season. Things fall apart so early, so quickly that they have to sell off at the deadline. They traded even more guys at the deadline than the Orioles did, I believe. I think they traded away like 11 guys. The traded away nine. Come on, guys. Uh 44 years old for Roco Baldelli. So, on the younger side, wins 101 games in his first season in Minnesota in 2019. And as you mentioned, some success here and there, but things kind of fell apart at the end. Would be interested to see what he learned from that situation and and get an interview with Roco Baldelli. Interesting candidate. Yeah. And and um and also like if it works out, he can be the manager here for a decade. And I don’t know anyone I don’t know that anyone we’ve talked about can go into that bucket. Yes. So far yet. But here’s a bucket of younger guys. This is the upandcomers, John. All right, let’s go. Let’s talk about Craig Albernaz. 42 years old. He is Cleveland’s associate manager. You talked, John, about all the the weird titles. Made up titles. Made up titles. So that you don’t get Yeah. hired. I’m sure that is how that happened. Yes. Because he’s a former uh minor league catcher. Again, the pipeline is so strong there. Bullpen coach and catching coach with the San Francisco Giants from 2019 to 2024. Then was the bench coach as recently as a year ago with Cleveland. They must have sensed that he was getting coaxed by other teams. Yeah. Getting interest from other teams to be hired away. So they gave him a new title. Promoted to associate manager in 2025. He has been a very fast riser these last few years. Only one year as a bench coach before getting that promotion. Interesting guy as a a younger guy on another forward thinking in another forward thinking organization, another analytics driven organization. But Craig Alberz, you can throw in to this this new bucket of upandcomers. Yes. And and I think for, you know, I think for all of these types, I I I think if we’re talking about the threshold being that the Orioles need to win the offseason, which is kind of what Michael has said last week. You read all about that on on the banner.com. Um where people can subscribe for $1 for six months, I believe. Still the case. They sure can. Um, I think I think that you kind of have to like assess who the market thinks is the best one and then like you can either hire a winner or you could hire the guy that everyone thinks should get hired if and like that’s a terrible threshold, but like that is how you win. That’s part one of winning the offseason. Sure. Winning the offseason and we’ll we’ll dive into this I think a lot and you wrote that great story this morning. I think is so such an interesting concept because it Michaelas talked about wanting to be competitive in the AL East and be competitive for a division title, but he also talked about wanting to have a team that everybody feels good about coming into everybody that everybody thinks is going to do that. Like the baseball world, US, you I think you referenced the the assembled media there at the warehouse bar and grill. um you know every Baltimore us the baseball world his front office and like team lost 87 games this year like there’s there’s a lot of green shoots like the pitching staff that ended the season was a million times I think quantifiably million times better than the one that started it the rotation uh rotation I should say um bullpen was fine and on on the days that they could be fine right um you know and I think I I think that is an interesting threshold because that means you have to hire a manager that people are like oh all right we got a good manager you got to hire you got to go do stuff that’s like oh good job as and like nobody literally nobody except for maybe me sometimes was like oh Tommyuki Sugano good job yeah I think it’s an interesting turn for Elias because I don’t know if he’s ever cared that or at least openly cared that much about perception no he’s always cared about the process over the results and he’s always cared about the reality over perception of well we may not be picked to win the division but we’re going to punch above our weight class and we’re going to have a good team by season’s end and people will be surprised. This one is like we care about the perception. We want people to to boost that win total. We want everybody from the outside to be writing good articles about how the Orioles are going to be great which creates higher expectations. I mean, and it to me, obviously, he’d much rather have the reality than the perception of being good. Yeah. But he wants to win the perception game as much as he wants to win the reality game. As he knows though, the perception game can be tricky because a lot of us picked the Orioles to go to the playoffs and go to the ALCS and they didn’t do it. And so, you raised expectations and then you end up uh, you know, shooting yourself in the foot when you don’t meet those expectations. I mean, a lot of people picked the Ravens to win the Super Bowl, and we know how things are going, myself included. Yeah. So, interesting that he wants people to be talking about the Orioles positively, uh, as well as them to have success. Yeah. And and that to bring that back to this, there’s, you know, there might be the next great manager of these like firsttime managers who are hired this year. Yeah. There might this might be the guy there might we might be about to talk about the guy who can you know who can energize the room and and connect with the players and make you know and run a tight ship and keep everybody up to a certain standard and get the everybody to buy in and like that person might be on this list. I couldn’t tell you the first thing about any of these people we’re talk about. That’s the problem and and they will have you know and they have to and I I don’t know how much decision-m is going to be driven by that fact. You know maybe they say like we’re going to hire a smart manager and you know we’re going to make the impact that that we’ll make it so that the world thinks we’re going to be a playoff team again in the months in the months to months to come. we’re going to get like a dude on in the rotation and and that person people are going to look at that on paper with Kyle Bradish and Trev Rogers and say that seems like it’s going to be good and then we’re going to hire like or we’re going to sign or trade for a couple of relievers and like we’re going to get a dude in the lineup and you look at the names on paper around that and people are going to think it’s good. That is easier to do than to hire a manager who has won before who you don’t think is going to be a good manager for you. Yeah. So maybe that’s maybe that’s where that impact comes. But you know, as step one of that stated process that he said a couple times, it wasn’t just something that like he said once. He said it a couple times that he wants everyone to think that. Step one is like to break through the noise. There’s a team next door to them over there on that’s like falling apart itself. to break through the noise and be like, “We hired a firsttime manager who’s been who’s been third in command in Cleveland who you’ve never heard of. He’s going to be great. He might be great, but like how is that going to change the projected?” Is that going to start the process of people thinking this team’s going to be good in in reality? Maybe. In like in the sphere of public opinion, I don’t know. Let’s let’s I don’t know. And it’s clear now that that’s something that he’s he cares about. Yeah. And and I would say they cared. I think I think a lot of things that happened in the first, you know, especially like, you know, like I I I heard a story that he like the the week the first 2019 offseason after they were like when they were about to trade like Dylan Bundy and like VR like and he was just like, “Ah, this is going to be a bad week.” Michael. Yeah. But like knew he had to do it like knew I mean had to in the context of like being the Orioles general manager and the circumstances he was working in and the things he wanted knew it was the right thing to do. Knew that was the thing to do in that moment, but like also knew it was going to be like, “Oh, this is going to be like this is going to be annoying. People are going to think this is dumb and like there’s nothing you can really do about that.” Yeah. Um, so like and like I think they care and I think they’ve always been realistic about, you know, even like they’re like ripping things up in 2023 and like this we you know we’re outperforming ourselves like we expected to be like in playoff mix like wild card mix and I think that’s I think they’ve always been like realistic about what was going on and like when you start playing this feels like a bit of an away game is all. Yeah. Uh all right, a couple more guys in this bucket. George Lombard, 50-year-old Detroit Tigers bench coach, first base coach with the Dodgers from 2016 to 2020 and has been the Detroit Tigers bench coach since 2021. Kai Koreah, youngest guy on this list, 37 years old. He is the Cleveland Guardians bench coach. He began his coaching career on the coaching staff of the University of Puet Sound in Seattle in 2010. Beautiful. I I’d love to go to see the Puet Sound. got his first big league job uh coaching the Arizona Fall League as an infield coach in 2018, hired by San Francisco as their bench coach, infield base running instructor in 2020 at like 32. Nice. At that point, Gabe Kappler fired in San Francisco. So, they made Koreah the interim manager for the final three games of the season. So, he’s got big league experience as a manager. Got it. Uh Cleveland then hired him back. They gave him his first big league or his first Yeah. big league job. Uh they hired him back as a major league field coordinator. Now he is ready for a long fake title here, John. He is the director of defense, base running, and game strategy as well as the major league field coordinator. Holy titles, Batman. Hey, you know, bless him if he can do it all. I’m sure he can. I’m going to start adding things to my title. I’m gonna be uh audience engagement editor, director of sports podcasting, and uh social media guru. Yeah. How does that sound? That sounds great. I think I I call you all those things anyway. So So I’ve already given you those titles. That’s a We’ll come up with an acronym for that. Kai Kareah. So he’s he’s a young guy who, you know, is clearly highly sought after by these big league organizations that they keep hiring him and promoting him. And then last but not least, got to talk about our old guy, Ryan Flity. Old friend Flash, 39 years old. He is the Chicago Cubs bench coach. We keep going back to that Cubs bench coach position. Um, former rule five pick, of course, by the Orioles. Spent six seasons with Baltimore member of three playoff teams. You recall he had a pair of homers in 13 playoff games. started his uh sphere into his, you know, dipping his toe into the coaching realm as an advanced scout and development coach for San Diego. Hired as a bench coach for Craig Council’s Cubs in 2024. It would be awfully cute to bring back uh Ryan Flity. I I think there’s a rule in when you hire coaches or managers, don’t hire a legend because then you have to fire a legend. That’s always a always an difficult problem. Yeah. Um to have. It’s like why, you know, you got to be careful when Denver hires, you know, like John Elway or uh even honestly San Francisco hire Buster Posie. That was my first thought is, yeah, you better do well because you don’t want to have to fire Buster Posey one day. That will be weird. Yeah. Um for Ryan Flity though, I don’t think it would have the same kind of He’s not like he’s going to be in the Orioles Hall of Fame one day and you have to worry about insulting him if you have to fire him in 2029. No, maybe he will be as a manager though. Maybe he will be. Maybe he will be as a manager. Would it be too cute to bring back Ryan Flity? No, I don’t think it would be. I think it would be it would probably be the sweet spot of that, you know, what we’re talking about. Like people would, I think, be happy about that. Nobody has ever had a bad thing to say about Ryan Flity. Sure. So, so it would it would boost the public approval, boost sentiment around fans for sure. um in the same way that Krooken Jr. on the ownership uh side boosted and also but he’s also like been around really smart teams like Craig Councel knows how to manage period full stop like they he has like any you know he’s been with teams that are in this position that the Orioles are in like need to like get over the hump and he’s seen firsthand um working with a variety of managers like what that could and should or look like. He’s got a ton of experience. He I think he gets here and I I wish I didn’t I wish those words didn’t come out of my mouth. Like every team has good baseball fans and every team likes like players that work hard. Like show me the fan base that wants like somebody loafing and like you know not running out of ground balls and like letting balls you know nobody wants that. So that was a dumb thing to say. No, but he gets it and he’ll understand and he knows, you know. I think there would be a value to that connection that like for from when this team was good. Nobody’s saying that like this team was good because Ryan Flity was on it. He he was like a bench player and he played sometimes when other people were hurt. But there has been, you know, intentionally, unintentionally, it feels like more severed ties with the past here than than connections to them. And you know, people think fondly of that era. And if they think if they see a person from that era, excuse me, I just spit on you. I didn’t see it. Just kidding. I just made that up. Then they will then that will be that would be a good thing. Speaking of that era and people from that era spitting on people speaking of spitting on No, not speaking of spitting on people, but speaking of that era of the Orioles baseball where they won more games in the American League league than any other team, let’s bring back Buck Shoalter. Let’s bring him back. I’m good on that. But uh you know, hey, don’t think it’s going to happen. For any fans that are clamoring, and there is a small portion of the fan base that is clamoring for Buck Shaw Walter, I don’t think it’s going to happen. I think what people want is the idea of Buck Shaw Walter. Yes. Not Buck Shaw Walter himself. Yeah. Let’s have some new ideas. Hey, let’s give let’s give a if there’s one Buck Shaw Walter quality that the Orioles can or should should seek, it’s not any like the you know taskmastery and like the weird control stuff that he had. It was like it was the lack of respect for like the big boys. Like he used to hate when there was when anyone talked about like oh this is a tough division like oh we have our work cut out. He used to hate that and like he used to not entertain it because like whatever that I mean I would say they’re not going to change. It might change if they do expansion realignment. Like it might change, but until then, this is just the reality. And you can like you can, you know, put your head sat on the table and like feel bad about the fact that there’s all these good teams in this division or you can not. And he always chose not to. And I think that helped because I noticed a shift back to that happening once he was gone. And like I I think that you can’t really like live in that world. No, there’s you can’t be in an awesome. We’re just happy to be here. Yeah. Oh, this is going to be hard. We got good teams in this division. They spend a lot of money. It’s challenging competitive landscape. I believe I I I think it came up. I don’t know why it came up. I guess cuz they’re playing each other in the playoffs, but like somebody asked Bryce Harper at the beginning of the season about like the Dodgers spending money and like how unfair it is and he said anyone who thinks that is a loser. Yeah. And like Yeah. I completely agree with every line of everything offshoot of like thinking about that type of stuff. I don’t I’m I’m with Bryce Harper. I ride with Bryce Harper. It may be because Buck Shaw Walter had managed the Yankees in the past, but he came in with an attitude of we can compete with them. They’re they’re no better than us. I don’t Yeah, I don’t know if the word is pugnacious, but that’s what it makes me think about. Yeah, pugnacious is is certainly a good word to describe Buck Sha Walter, I think. Eager to quick to argue, quarrel or fight? Yeah, sure. Yeah. Yeah, sure. Like an Earl Weaver type. Um, but yeah, he was he came in with a we’re not just the fourth team in out of five in this division. Yeah. You know, and whoever is entering this job is going to enter division that has three playoff teams. Yeah. In the Red Sox, Yankees, and Blue Jays. All going to get better. Yes. All going to get better, I assume, because those seems like the Red Sox trade had one massive contract and they traded away for some like not for some reason. They have a huge opportunity to spend money. The Yankees don’t care how much money they spend. Yeah. Toronto is going to be they’re they’re winning division champs. Yeah. And and they’re going to be emboldened to get better because they see what it’s like when they’re winning playoff games. like they there is I I think it can become infectious if you kind of hear it from the front office or you hear it from the national media or you hear it from the players of this kind of mentality of being the the also rans and I think Orioles fans felt like that for a long time. Yeah. um because of all the years that they didn’t make the playoffs and for all the years that they just were getting habitually beat down by the Yankees and the Red Sox in that division and they just sometimes you can internalize that accidentally and Buck Shaw Walter came in with an attitude of of f that whoever comes in I think that is something that you know they would do well to uh embody and I think you going back to what you said about different fan bases of Ryan Flity knows what this fan base is like. He knows, you know, the kind of hunger that they have. I think there are times where there are there is a good manager, but he fits poorly with the market. He fits poorly with the team. He fits poorly with the city. And I think there there are so many instances people usually use it with an instance of, you know, with somebody who’s hired to manage the Yankees or the Mets and he’s just not built for that. He’s just not not ready for the bright lights or whatever it is. I think it does take a certain kind of personality to manage the Orioles, too, because this is a bluecollar city. This is a city that hasn’t had a whole lot of success in the last three decades. This is a city that wants a championship quite badly and knows that it’s going to have to be the underdogs to get there. Yeah. Knows that it’s going to have to run through some tough challenges and break through some ceilings in order to get there. And so I do think that there is something to that that you know the the manager who was hired here has to be the right fit and have the right personality for the city as well. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. I guess we did talk about Buck Shaw Walter. There we go. Yeah. There we go. Uh all right. There are probably a lot of names out there that you’re thinking about uh if you’re listening to this and you want to throw our way. So please do in the comments section, in the replies, wherever. Uh John’s handle. I’m Paul Manoano and All Banner Sports. We will have plenty more coverage. We have no idea when the Orioles will wrap up their coaching search, but we will be ready when they do. John is going to Italy in 6 days. So, he will be away from us for a while enjoying the sights of Rome with his family. That’s lovely. Uh I will be back here on the podcast at some point next week, hopefully with uh beat writer Andy Kuska to talk more about the manager search, talk more about everything that’s going on with the Orioles. Yeah. What do you think? like 33% chance we get a manager hire podcast this week I think so maybe the fact that it’s been totally silent is but that’s the way the oras operate as we’ve said before yeah and I think it’s important you know I think there’s there’s you know I think there’s a group of candidates who are employed by other teams and like it will get out when they interview but like if you’re just talking to like people who are out of a job and it’s just you and their agent like and you ask you know one of your criteria is like, let’s see how you do at not telling people about this, then that’s why we’re not hearing about these things. Yeah. I mean, Flity, his team is still in the playoffs. Um, you know, George Lombard, his team is still in the playoffs. So, there are some guys out there that are currently tied to other teams. So, we’ll see. Um, all right. Thanks so much for tuning in for Jamioli.

Banner Baseball Show co-hosts Paul Mancano and Jon Meoli discuss what the Orioles should be looking for in a manager (4:27).

Then they run through the list of potential candidates, including:

Bruce Bochy (12:26)
Bob Melvin (18:08)
Bud Black (21:51)
Brian Snitker (23:13)
Scott Servais (24:30) 
David Ross (27:55)
Rocco Baldelli (32:07)
Craig Albernaz (34:16)
George Lombard, Kai Correa and Ryan Flaherty (42:01)

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