Spiegel & Holmes rant on Cubs being ‘outclassed’ by Brewers in NLDS
To me, it goes back to the construction of the pitching staff and my anger at the trade deadline. It all came boiling back up last night, today, and beyond. And think about it. I you, the angry fan, I know you might be angry at Craig Council, and that’s cool. That’s the manager’s job is to wear that anger. But the curious fan goes a little deeper and thinks about this. You’re begging for your manager to choose Colin Ray. You’re begging for your manager to choose Javier Assad. That’s why I couldn’t do it. That’s why I was like, Sha is the move. Matt Boyd on three days is the move because you’re begging for him to choose contact options who are great depth pieces to help you get through a season. That’s what those guys are. It’s about the loss of Kate Horton and it’s about the failures of a trade deadline. the absolute failures of a trade deadline to add swing and miss dominance to a staff that does not have it. And they survived that weak trade deadline in the regular season because of depth and because of defense and frankly because nobody jumped up and took their spot from them. Lawrence, let’s be honest, the Mets faded in full. The Reds got lucky to get in. The Padres’s got close and then the last weekend they were like, “Ah, we’ll just go to Chicago.” They survive. They survive in the regular season, but come the playoffs, it’s a different game, man. Look around this league in the postseason. Swing and miss weaponry on pitching staffs is everywhere. And you don’t really have it. You just don’t have it. And it shows up on both your offense, which only gets three runs a game whether you need more or not, and on your pitching, which doesn’t get strikeouts when you got to get strikeouts. You just don’t have enough. And I know that Pat Murphy, he won the chess battle with Craig Councel, but look at the pieces he had to use. Look at Jacob Miserowski coming in and throwing 103. Yeah, that was hilarious. With slide with sliders or cutters, whatever you want to call it at what 97, 96, freezing guys at the plate and they’re like, “Wait, what was that?” Uh-huh. So, yeah, the look at his opener. Ashb is throwing 99 98. It’s like he has better weaponry. Frankly, every pitching staff in the postseason right now does. Okay. So, this goes back to something that I’ve said for the last couple of years. That right there, that that statement that you made that Pat Murphy has better weaponry than Craig Council is an indictment. It’s an indictment on the Cubs as an organization because you’re supposed to be bullying these hoes and you’re supposed to been bullying them for a long time and you’re not. And what fine if that your your roster going into the season I I would say is fairly solid, but then there was an opportunity for you. Everybody knew what you needed, Lawrence. Everybody knew what you needed and we talked about it and we were furious and all that fury came back up. being right about this one. And and I think that we’re not alone. Like, it’s not us on an island. And if we’re on an island, we’re on an island with every bleeping Cub fan that was sitting there at the trade deadline going, “Wait, y’all ain’t going to do nothing?” Like, y’all y’all just going to sit here like Sroa is your move. That’s your move. That’s the big move that you’re going to make when you have a team that is in a great position to be a playoff team. Hey man, due respect to Andrew Kitridge, who’s a very nice part of your bullpen and has stepped up, but the other bullpen guy you got, Taylor Rogers, he isn’t even on your roster. He’s not even on your playoff roster. And the idea of And then you match that with the ridiculous statement from Carter about the idea that you’re looking ahead to 2032. Offensive. It’s absolutely offensive because in the postseason, Lawrence, look at these teams just throwing out dude after dude after dude. And if you don’t have dudes, you go out and get them. And if you got dudes in the minors, you bring them up. You fast track them so they can be your weapons in the postseason. What I don’t understand is is why the off season and the end season don’t match. Here’s what I mean. In the off season, the Cubs make a move that is aggressive, trading away Cam Smith, who most people think is going to turn out to be a pretty good pro. and he was up and down, but he, you know, he at least hit he hit home runs for for the Astros this year and you get Kyle Tucker and you kind of know that it’s for one year and we’ll flesh that out more, but it is clear that it is it was a go for it move in your lame duck president of operations season. So, why doesn’t the trade deadline match the off season where if you are in a go for it mode, if you’re being aggressive the way that the Cubs were being aggressive, why didn’t it match? And and look, I know that this show is is on October 7th. If you rewind the tape at the trade deadline, we were talking about it and so were you. We talked about it in real time. Frankly, we talked about it leading up to the trade deadline. You know, when we talked about it in real time, we broke it down when Jed Hoyer’s contract contract extension got announced and and and and it I struggled with how to frame it and how to think about it. And then I I’ve been comfortably blurting it out that that man sold his aggression. That man sold his aggression on the day on the day he signed that he sold his aggression. I don’t want to go that far. I I think that they are coincidental, dude. But you just said it. You trade for Kyle Tucker. you are aggressive with your bullpen uh roster churn and your roll churn and then all of a sudden at the deadline you don’t finish the job. No, I I I’m with you. I just I don’t know if I want to put it on Jed getting the contract extension cuz that would make me think bad things about Jed, especially when at that point the rabbit had the gun. Well, well, maybe that’s too that that’s too clever or too um using the verbiage to to try and and poke the knife and be provocative. How about this? I I get why you’re I’m just not willing to go that far with you. I get it. What what what he what he what he did is he extended the partnership. He extended the partnership and all of a sudden 2032 is something you care about. AJ AJ Per is not out here caring about 2032. I I can’t He’s not out here. Dave Dumbrosski is not out here caring about 2027, let alone 2026. Carter walked that back on a subsequent interview here on the score. He walked it back. But it left a mark. Of course it does, Speeds, because it lets you know how they were thinking at the time. At the time when it looked like the Cubs needed to do something, they didn’t. And they wrapped it in, well, we’re the stewards of the baseball team. We have to make sure that the baseball team is going to be good years from now. And I get it. Like I don’t know if you saw Buster Ron just tweeted something about Hank Steinbrer the other day that George was championship or bust. Anything but a World Series is a failure. Hank’s definition of success is more nuanced. Yankee fans lost their mind at that. But this is the truth is that it sometimes through variance and postseason randomness the teams you don’t expect to win do not win. They chose that. they opted for that and at a certain point they’re like let’s go ahead and bank on the variance and our $40 million manager and that’s just not really giving your $40 million manager everything that he needs. What I hate about it for the Cubs organizationally is that you saw this team pass you in the regular season and now you’re seeing them outclass you in the postseason and you go look how far you have to go to be competitive with them. Now you won the season series. That’s great. You won that three out of those five games that were played in August with the Brewers, but you’ve seen them for the two years that Craig has been here, they’ve still been the better team. Yeah. And I don’t mean to throw this onto Craig’s lawn. All I’m saying is is that organizationally, you continue to let the Brewers be better than you, and you’ve got to figure out why that keeps happening and what it is you need to do to be more competitive. I completely agree.
Matt Spiegel and Laurence Holmes reacted to the Cubs’ deflating 7-3 loss to the Brewers in Game 2 of the National League Division Series. In their minds, the Cubs’ lack of aggressive action at the trade deadline has contributed to them trailing 2-0 in the best-of-five NLDS. The guys also believe that Cubs fans’ frustration should be centered on the front office, not manager Craig Counsell.
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23 comments
The Cubs owners only care about the sold tickets.
I could not agree more, with everything you 2 said. & I will take it a step farther. I knew, as soon as Jed's extension was announced, that they would fail @ the deadline!
We needed 2 things. A reliable, slump proof bat; & a good, headliner type, starting pitcher.
We got, Willie Castro, I love his defense, everywhere, but he doesn't hit a lick. & Micheal Soroka, who was obviously already injured. Evident by his significant drop in velocity! He lasted 2 GD inngs!!!! I was livid!!!
I am so disappointed in how this season has turned out, honestly! We, kinda, won game 3, as a fluke. That blown call was huge, & everyone knows it. & known we are just getting spanked! Its been painful to watch.
All the organization cares about is the bottom line so if you want championships I suggest you root for a different team
It doesn't match because they gave Hoyer an extension so Jed had nothing left to fight for
Come on dude
It doesn’t help that Craig Counsell is playing checkers while Pat Murphy is doing quantum physics.
Let’s Go BREW CREW
The writing was on the wall after the trade deadline.
People can complain all they want about the lack of activity at the deadline, but that doesn't do any good now. The offense, not the pitching and bullpen, is what's truly held this team back the past few years. Unfortunately, Hoyer probably won't be able to tweak the offense in a significant way until 2027, when Happ, Suzuki, and Hoerner's contracts all expire. Happ, Swanson and PCA all play exceptional defense yes, but they strike out too much. Tucker isn't the transformative, slump proof bat they were hoping for, so they need to retool things a bit.
I think Hoyer knows they're more than a piece or two away from being a true World Series contender, so that's why he didn't exhaust his prospect reserves at the deadline. And really, there wasn't a single pitcher reliver or bat traded at the deadline who carried their respective team at the deadline. Suarez was bad at T-Mobile Park. Helsley was awful with the Mets. Bednar was the only consistent reliever out of the three the Yankees acquired. A single trade wouldn't have fixed anything. Instead of focusing on what the Cubs didn't do at the trade deadline, I'd like to hear specific moves that can be made to help the team next year and beyond. The season is all but over. When it officially ends, I won't be screaming, "Why didn't the Cubs trade for Merril Kelly?!"
It’s so sad that the Cubs don’t have the desire to be better
Content with spending less and hoping for the best
There better be some f ing big changes this offseason
I don’t care if we have to trade Steel to get a star hitter
But we need a big turnover asap
Come on Speegs and Holmes… how about talking about the Brewers being scared of the Cubs? Really replay that segment… where you opined that Cubs where a lead pipe lock… you guys totally missed the mark on that one… let’s pump the brakes and get real and stop being so fickle… a little better insight… please
The Brewers play their prospects, the Cubs make theirs sit and observe.
The fans already know the problem was and continues to be Tucker, PCA, and Suzuki going into a devastating 2-month-long swoon that only Suzuki has escaped. Hoerner, Shaw, and Busch picked up some of the slack while the pitching was superlative. But when it's playoff baseball, you can't succeed with automatic outs in the heart of your line-up. Was Jed supposed to anticipate the tremendous drop-off in production from his all-stars and trade them at the deadline? The players' lack of perfomance (not lack of effort) explains why the Cubs are where they're at.
Ugh – Brewers fan here – you know that’s for midseason trades, you need prospects to trade, and a willing partner…your farm system is still being built up, and you weren’t going to trade into a World Series this midseason. The future is good for the Cubs, and it ain’t 2030…the Brewers are in this position after years of trading away our best players right before free agency…Corbin Burnes, Devin Williams, more to get guys for the future. With that they first were able to have guys to trade for mid season, now finally going for it…to be sustainable it will mean more trades , which is not a money thing, but a time thing, and a talent evaluation thing
If you don't score runs you don't win. Cubs pitching really hasn't been the main issue this year, its the offense collectively going into a deep freeze the 2nd half of the year. Same broken offense we have been talking about year after year since 2018.
Jed so predictable. Does same thing over and over
We are going to be the first team to exit since New York won that means out of the 8 Team’s left. We are the worst one the only one to lose after three games.
Shaw has not picked up any slack! He has floundered in the 220 zone all year and is still floundering now at the bottom of the order.
So much for your chance to be 3rd man in booth Matt S!! I give you credit for being so honest though, much respect!!
Let's give Craig Counsell another 20 million a year, that makes us a better team!
Can't stand the trade deadline talk anymore. Who did you want, Matt???
Should they have traded Caissie & either Shaw or Horton for 1/2 a season of Eugenio Suarez? For Mackenzie Gore? Stop it already. Who was available that would have changed this?
You couldn't have predicted at the deadline that Horton would go down in late Sept and that Tucker would be essentially useless.
Cubs have good players who have not produced. At some point it's on them. How does the coaching staff NOT get PCA to lay off high pitches? So simple. If you get called out on 3 just above the belt, so be it. Eliminate the high ones and cut the strikeouts by 1/3. Force pitchers to throw you more strikes.
Brewers fan here: The Cubs problem isn't a lack of talent. The Cubs problem hangs his head and wrings his hands in post game interviews while parroting the strategies of Murph as potential solutions to his own team's problems. "Pressure burst pipes" is our guys line…not Counsell's. Pure comedy that y'all flexed that franchise bankroll only to make your biggest rival better.
I think the main problem is the Cub's hitting approach. They don't emphasize consistent contact. The Brewers do. Small ball is still relevant. Pass the baton, and string together base hits. If you need to go deep, make sure there are men on base. A three run jack is still better than a solo.