Detroit Tigers Offseason To-Do List with Cody Stavenhagen

Detroit Tigers Offseason To-Do List with Cody Stavenhagen

It is time to talk the Detroit Tigers. Cody Stevenhagen on the show with us today. You can of course see him um all over the place. He writes for The Athletic. He’s the co-host of Tiger Territory. Cody, thanks for being with us. We appreciate it. What are the top three things that the Tigers need to do this off season? Well, yeah, thanks for having me on. First of all, I think you can pretty easily um narrow the Tigers off seasonason to-do list down into three categories. Probably the most obvious is is to fix the bullpen. Um it was a weakness at many points last year and more specifically to add more swing and miss to the bullpen so that you’re not living and dying by um batting average in balls in play. The Tigers bullpen ranked 29th in whiff rate last year, which is unacceptable if you’re trying to win a World Series. They need multiple relievers. They I think need at least one legit back in swing and miss type reliever. I don’t I’d be highly surprised if they would spend when an Edwin Diaz or a Devin Williams, but the tier of guys right below that Pete Fairbanks, some other names in that group make sense. And again, they’re going to have to get more than one right now. Will Vest and Tyler Holton might be your only sure sure things in the bullpen, although you do have some other existing guys who have had success. Um, but you got a lot of work to do in the pin. Number two, you have to add a starter. The Tigers, for now, we’re just going to assume they’re going to keep Terk Scubble and not trade him. Uh, for the purpose of this exercise, they’re okay. They’re in okay shape in the pin or in the rotation. Scooble, Casey M, Jack Flity, Reese Olsson, and Troy Meltton with Kater Montero. Some other guys in that mix, but they use, I think, 15 different starting pitchers last year, including Bullpin Days. We all know you need more depth. I think they have to get at least one legit starter on a major league deal. And I would argue maybe they should uh target someone who can pitch almost as a number two to Scooble because you’re not just building for 2026. You’re building for the future. After 2026, you are likely to lose Terk Scoo, Jack Flity, and Casey Mai all to free agency. So maybe you could almost work ahead. Now, one thing I want to note on both of those topics with the pitching, the Tigers, as much as it’s fun to link them to names like Michael King or whoever else, we know they like to get creative. So, I do wonder or just food for thought, might they be looking around the edges, is there a reliever they think they could convert to a starter or a starter they could convert to a reliever? I would not rule out them doing something more outside of the box uh that that conventional wisdom, you know, isn’t bringing to the top of all our minds. And then the third thing is to improve the offense. Um, for what it’s worth, the Tigers ranked 11th in run scoring last year. They did that with a really young lineup. I think the fourth most played appearances of hitters 25 or younger, but their awful September and in the playoffs. Some of their flaws really showed up. There can still be too much swing and miss, a little too much chase. I think a lot of what happens with this lineup will revolve around what Glabber Torres does. Uh this afternoon, we will learn whether he accepts or declines the qualifying offer. If he accepts it, that’ll be good for their lineup. He’s a dependable professional hitter. Uh, but you do wonder how they will configure the rest of their infield, especially with a lot of existing young players in place, especially with Kevin McGonagal, arguably the top prospect in baseball, and some other guys on the rise. Um, I think they need more, but there’s not beyond Gabbert Torres, there’s not a clear solution, like a clear fit. You know, the they could go after the Alex Bregmans, the Bobettes in the world. Makes a lot of sense, but they’ll have to do some other shuffling. And again, for better or worse, the Tigers tend to be creative. So, I’m really interested to see what kind of solutions they will ultimately land on. Talked about the bullpen needing more swing and miss. Is there any of those guys besides the two that you had mentioned that need to change maybe their pitch mix, their repertoire? Because you’re not going to find six guys that have swing and miss that just are out there available and the Tigers aren’t willing to spend that much money. So, are there guys that they’ve said, “Hey, you know what? can increase this to increase that swing and miss. Yeah, always a good question and generally something the Tigers have been pretty good at is helping guys tweak their arsenals, optimize their pitch mix. Kyle Finnegan, who they traded for last year, is the perfect example. He’s a free agent again, but I think there could be some mutual interest in bringing him back. And they didn’t acquire him necessarily. You he was a good reliever, a good closer, but he wasn’t a huge swing and miss guy. he got to Detroit almost doubled the usage of his splitter and the swing and miss went way up. So that’s a Finnegan’s a prime example and I think that’s a reason uh he would like to maybe return to Detroit and maybe they would like to have him back because they already made that sort of adjustment. Um there’s certainly more guys internally but um you look at some of the major major names in their bullpen like Brennan Han if he’s more of a sinker ground ball type guy. Brent Herder, he can miss some bats with a slider. You know, he’s a he’s a lefty, but still more of a ground ball type guy. So, I don’t know that you can completely change the the profiles of some of your existing players in house. That’s why it’s certainly going to take multiple external additions while Yeah, I guess you’re hoping, hey, uh, throw this slider, throw the slider a little harder, and maybe you can get a little more swing and miss so at least you’re not ranking 29th. Cody, what would it take to trade TKO? What do you have to get in return? Yeah, I mean, obviously, it’s one of the biggest questions of the whole off seasonason. I I think it would take a real hall, you know? I think you’re talking multiple major league ready players, top 100 prospects, if not greater than that. Um, it’s hard to see a world where it’s not at least a three player package, and all three of those players are going to have to be pretty good. Uh, I think you would like some some major league ready pitching, starting pitching and maybe some up middle athletes for as much as we look around in free agency at third baseman, stuff like that. Short stop and center field seem to be some areas the Tigers could stand to improve. Maybe it’d be easier to do that on the trade market than uh free agency, but I don’t know that you can just snap your finger and come up with an offer that makes sense. It would it would really have to be a pretty mind-blowing offer. Uh, I think for the Tigers to do this, doesn’t mean they won’t, doesn’t mean they’re not listening because they certainly have not shut down this talk. Scott Scott Scott Harris, Jeff Greenberg, when they’ve been asked about it, they’ve basically said no comment, which to me says, hey, they’re they’re open to listen to offers. Um, but they don’t have to trade them. So, I think it would take something that they really would have to feel strongly is worth it both in the short term and the long term. I Cody, I was going to say what you what you missed on that offseason to-do list was sign TK school, right? I mean, that’s it. And I joked with Scott Harris when we were in Seattle together like and TK walked by and I go, “Scott, when are we announcing this extension here?” And and Scott, you know, Scott Harris looked at me like I was crazy because I said in front of TK, but you know, that’s me. Whatever. Anyways, so I thought it was funny. Hinch was there, too. He laughed. Everyone kind of had a good chuckle about it. And I think Terrick said something like, “Well, have Scott call my Scott and we’ll figure it out.” But I don’t think that’s going to happen. It’s not that simple. But you mentioned offense at the end, right? And I watched them play five games. I watched them play more than five games, obviously, but the five games against the Mariners. It was swing and miss, swing and miss, swing and miss, strikeout, strikeout, strikeout. And I love I love Riley Green. I think Riley Green could be one of the best hitters in all of baseball if he just cut down his strikeouts. Will he change in order to do that? Because I’ve talked to some people in baseball that say this guy could be a three400 million guy or if he continues on the path he is, he’ll be a hundred, which listen, $100 million is crazy amount of money. You know, a hundred to $200 million guy if he stays where he’s at. So, do you think they can talk him into changing and just cutting down on the strikeouts? just I mean just a go from 200 strikeouts to 150 strikeouts and put the ball in play in situations. Yeah, I I think it’s certainly attainable. Like when he was coming up as a really highly touted prospect, I never viewed him as a guy who was going to strike out 200 times. Now around the time he got to double A, myself and some others kind of started noticing like this guy does swing and miss a little more than maybe we’ve talked about. So, it started to show up, but he was viewed as like a very pure hitter, a very natural hitter, a line drive, all fields type hitter. Um, and the big question was like, how’s the power going to develop? Is this a 20 homer guy, a 30 homer guy, a 30 plus homer guy? And you look up at age 24, he hit 36 home runs. But I think it’s fair to say there was a little bit too much selling out for power. It led to um a franchise record for strikeouts. Yeah, he got the home runs, but some other parts of his game really suffered. Playing the game, moving the ball forward. Huge issue. I think he’s a good enough and adaptable enough hitter to know that’s not going to fly. His first couple years in the majors, he was hitting the ball on the ground too much. He adapted, started hitting the ball in the air, tapped into his power. Again, it seems now fair to say that was probably an overcorrection. Uh something’s going to have to change and and surely Riley knows that. Cody, if Gaver Torres decides to take the qualifying offer, um, number one, do you think he will? Number two, does that mean the Tigers are all of a sudden out of the Alex Bregman perhaps Bo Bashette sweep stakes? What does that mean to you? Yeah, the first part of your question, I don’t know what Gabber is going to do, but I think if I were advising him, I would say take that qualifying offer. I’d be surprised if there’s a team willing to give him a four or fiveyear deal that could near, you know, 80 to$100 million. I just have a hard time seeing that, especially given um he grades out negatively in the field and on the bases. But you can come back to the Tigers one year 22 million. You had a pretty good season until he suffered a sports hernia and was playing through it in the second half. So play like you did. Hope you can stay healthy. hit the market next year coming off a full year and then maybe you can get a three, fouryear deal. Pair that with a 22 million you just made in 2026, maybe you end up being closer to that hundred million type player um that Gabber Torres has openly said he would like to be. That makes the most sense. Unless there’s just a team out there that values him above and beyond kind of what the market would would normally predict, I think it makes sense for him to take the qualifying offer. We just talked about it. They can use some help, man. They could use another professional, proven hitter for as much as we talk about young talent, but what are they willing to sacrifice if they were to pursue another big ticket free agent? If you sign a third baseman, what are you doing with Colt Keith who’s an ascending young hitter still, but doesn’t really have a position, isn’t at the level of an Alex Bregman right now. And what does that mean for Kevin McGonagal and Max Anderson and these other prospects that you view as part of your bright future? um they could get aggressive and go sign a guy, but everything about this front office in three plus years under Scott Harris has told us that may not be the course that they take. I was going to ask you about Kevin McGonagle. Yes, he is maybe number two. I think he’s ranked number two or number three prospect in all of baseball. They’re number one prospect. Is this team able to bring up a Kevin McGonagal to the big leagues and at the same time say we think our team is getting better and we’re going to win a World Series because normally it’s you either keep all your stars and get more stars. We talked a lot about free agency and if it doesn’t go well then we call up our prospects. Yeah, I I think that’s the whole I don’t know if it’s the problem, but it’s the difficulty of trying to thread the needle and build the sustainable winner, right? Because you get these young prospects and you got to get him to the big leagues at some point, but we all know young players are prone to struggles. Wasn’t that long ago Colt Keith was not quite Kevin McGonagle level, but he was a very highly touted prospect and he really struggled for the first 80ish games of his major league career. got a little better, but probably still hasn’t hit what he eventually might be. McGonagal, this guy’s really good. I would not be surprised if he has success pretty early on, but is he going to be as good as Bo Bashette is from day one? I mean, that’s a hard sell, right? It’s probably going to take a couple years. Uh, so I don’t know. It’s It’s why it’s really difficult. I think McGonagal’s legit. I think it helps. He can play second. He can play third. He can play some short. I’m not sure he’s an everyday shortstop, though. and and so that um that’s part of the equation that makes it a little bit harder. All right, Cody McGonagle’s a super prospect. They have Max Clark who is coming. Also, I love what the Tigers do with Cole Keith. They’re not afraid because they’re in the central winnable division that they can still do this. What I want to know though is Scott Harris. Okay, Scott Harris is the GM. He’s he’s been in charge for a few years now. What’s his role? Can he go to Christopher Illich and say, “Mr. I need more money. I need 10 million and we can get Bregman Ambishette and have McGonagal or is he not have that power? Cuz he’s a young guy. He came from the Cubs. The Cubs are a big market even though sometimes they don’t act like it, right? So, did he learn to be stingy or will he does he have the ability to go to Christopher Lynch and say, “I need this much more money and we can get past Seattle and maybe go to the World Series.” Yeah, I I don’t know exactly how those conversations go down, but oddly enough, for as much as Chris Ilich isn’t his father and isn’t known as a big spender. It it seems like he’s always being been willing to open the pocketbooks to like a reasonable level. Like people who complain about the Tigers being cheap, it wasn’t that long ago they signed Jav Bayz and they signed Eduardo Rodriguez and they spent pretty big in the in the 2022 off season. Um, now I do wonder if Chris Hillich hired Scott Harris in part because there was some alignment that they didn’t have to be a luxury tax team that they didn’t have to be the Mike Illich Tigers. Yeah, Scott Scott Harris, you know, he came up under Theo Epstein, but then he worked for Farhound Zedi in San Francisco. Um, it doesn’t seem so far like free agency, like spending is necessarily how he views, you know, the best way to build a baseball team. This is a guy who likes the waiver wire. And I think that the challenge of finding surplus value and winning on the margins and all those kind of buzzwords, but to some degree has been pretty good at it. So, um, maybe the answer is somewhere in the middle. I I think this offseason can be a test though for Chris Illich. How hands-on do you want to be? How much do you want to spend? And then Scott Harris, he’s done a really good job at a lot of the finer aspects of building an organization, but pishing putting the finishing touches on the major league roster, I’ve always viewed that as the hardest thing to do. And sometimes that means um that that means you got to spend. I think Cody, why doesn’t Chris spend like Mike? I I think it’s also important to remember Mike Illich spent big for what less than 10 years toward the end of his life. Uh he wanted to win a World Series, but Mike Ilich owned the Tigers in the 90s and they didn’t really act like that. and in the early 2000s, maybe to some degree, when they signed Pudge Rodriguez, that was a huge deal. Um, but it wasn’t really until later in his life and his ownership of the Tigers that he spent at that level of aggression. So, um, it was abnormal and it wasn’t his entire ownership. Cursilic clearly just doesn’t view things the same way his dad did toward the end toward the end there. Yeah, that’s when they started winning is when they signed Pudge and they signed Magalio and they had Justin Verlander and they brought Kenny Rogers back and they went and got Carlos Geon and they went and got Placido Palanco and they went and got all these guys Max Scherzer and Porcel and David Price and that’s when the Tigers were good. Maybe they should look in the mirror and be like, “We were good.” And starting 06 because 04 they were 04 they weren’t very good when they got Pudge 05. But then 06 when they all started coming together that’s when they went to the World Series and then obviously they had that great run in the 2010ish. Trust me, I played against all those guys. They went and got Megie Cabrera, paid him. They went and got Dantro and they they paid him even though he didn’t work out right. But they did these things and that was how they won. And America can be awesome. I’ve seen it and thank god they got a new well they didn’t get a new scoreboard. They moved the scoreboard so you can now actually see it. So they’ve done some good things there. Yeah. Um they did all that and they got to the World Series twice and they didn’t win it. And so unfortunately I think that is like ammunition for the newer class executives who would say why should we do all that and then having to risk tear it down or we could operate like this and make the playoffs in backtoback years and think that we’re going to continue to get better. Now obviously there are a million cautionary tales of examples that didn’t quite work out. the Orioles last year, even even the Cubs who did win a World Series, they thought they had the makings of a dynasty and that thing fell apart pretty quickly and they and it wasn’t necessarily that they were uh you know, they were willing to spend in Chicago, too. But I think that’s one of the more fascinating like philosophical debates because everyone wants to spin spin spend and I think they’re like I think they’re t the Tigers are at a point where they need to get serious about spending a little bit more. Um, but I don’t know.

Cody Stavenhagen from The Athletic, co-host of Tiger Territory, joins the show to lay out the Detroit Tigers three biggest offseason priorities. From rebuilding a swing-and-miss bullpen to adding real starting pitching depth behind Tarik Skubal, Casey Mize and Jack Flaherty, Cody explains what it will take for Detroit to chase a World Series. He breaks down the future of the Tigers’ offense around Riley Greene and Gleyber Torres, plus what top prospect Kevin McGonigle’s timeline means for potential pursuits of stars like Alex Bregman and Bo Bichette. The crew also digs into how Scott Harris and Christopher Ilitch view spending compared to the Mike Ilitch era.

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