Marco Sturm Interview! | EP 111 How Will Sharks Solve Defensive Logjam?

Marco Sturm Interview! | EP 111 How Will Sharks Solve Defensive Logjam?

Welcome to the San Jose Hockey Now podcast. We have Marco Sturm on the show today. Marco Sturm, former Sharks great now Boston Bruins head coach. We also will talk about what are the Sharks going to do? What in the world are the Sharks going to do with their nine defenseman? He just called up Vincent Ayurio today. And the Sharks keep winning. I love it. But before all that, uh before we get to it, a quick note from a sponsor that you might know. Do you know what needs to be brought back? Hockey. And uh a quick note, this show, like always, is free. And we make it because we love talking hockey, digging deep into the Sharks and the fans that bleed teal. You can see Shanks modeling the Mac Attack uh 1991 the tank shirt of the week. Third star of the week, by the way. the NHL super star of the week, Mlin Celiverini. It’s all made possible thanks to awesome support from bringhockeyback.net. They’ve been our title sponsor for what, eight months now, something like that. Uh, if you know Bring Hockey Back, they’ve been repping the Sharks for years with some really clever, funny t-shirts and a really good feel for what makes hockey culture and Sharks culture special. They do custom jerseys for your beer league, for any other occasion that you might need a hockey jersey for. So, if you’re in to hockey and you like to look fresh at the rink, check them out at bringhockeyback.net. Use promo code San Jose Hockey now for 15% off all things at bringhockeyback.net. Supporting them helps support this show and us. Boom. I’m getting better at this. Yes, you are. That was They should pay us to do it. Oh, wait. They do. Smooth as ice. I love it. So, as you notice, this is a old school edition of the San Jose Hockey Now podcast. Dan Bole, he’s taking a week off and Zubar, he’s in Spain. Zubar will be back um on this episode late in the episode for the Marco Sherman interview. But for right now though, it’s just if you guys have missed us missed us, it’s just Keegan and I talking about the Sharks and we get to we get to give Dan the next time he’s on about work ethic and you know um being sharing that with his daughters. All right. He’s being a good dad. Yeah, it’s Thanksgiving week everybody. This is going to be our um our bridge into Thanksgiving. So, you won’t hear us until after the the Thanksgiving holiday. So, um you know, we all need a little family time. So, yeah, I’m just joking with you, Dan. All right. So, this week, like you mentioned, I think um I haven’t uh listened to the Barker Sturtorm interview yet, but I’m super excited. He was on the podcast before when he was interviewing for the the head coaching job for for the San Jose Sharks. and um it’s awesome that he’s got a job and he’s doing well in Boston. I think that’s such a great fit and he’s such a good guy. So, I’m super excited to listen to and you all should be too. Before we get there though, um Vincent Aorio has been recalled from his conditioning stint with the San Jose Barracuda. So, now the Sharks have nine defensemen, which is too many. Nine defenseman. Yeah. When you only dress six, maybe seven on a strange night. So, what are the Sharks going to do, Shay? What are we going to do? Oh, boy. Yeah, that’s a good question. Right. They I has been on the roster the whole time. When a player is in a conditioning assignment, they stay on the roster. Mhm. So that’s why uh recently the Sharks have had 12 forwards only and they’ve been lucky to stay fairly healthy or have players available like Zach will stop Chuck um when Jeff Skinner goes down pretty readily available to them. Yeah. Anyway though, so what will the Sharks do? Boy, this is a good question, right? Because as we’ve seen over the last two months, I think it’s really defined itself that there are two defenseman that the Sharks probably will not scratch in a game. I think deservedly so. That’s Dimmitri Orof and that’s Mario Ferraro. I know that Ferraro is not always the most popular with with with the fans, but I think with Ferraro though his you talk about coach coaches love someone they can they can rely on and rely on doesn’t mean that they don’t make any mistakes. Obviously Mario makes a lot of mistakes. Some of them are related to the fact that he’s played for a lot of bad teams so it’s not always on him but uh what you can rely on with Mario is always energy. He’s always going to have that first step defensively on on other players. So, you know, you’re going to get that from Mario night in and night out. He’s always going to be the first one to eat a shot. And Mario at his best can defend very very good players very well because Mario can’t skate. Mario is gritty. Mario just knows how to play defense. So, anyway, Mario’s not leaving leaving this lineup until he gets traded. If he gets traded, he gets traded. If he gets traded. So any anyway that leaves really interesting kind of um you know John Cleanberg who we’ve talked extensively about Ryan Rosski gave him a very long rope and which I think is understandable and and Warski has said that yeah veterans deserve a longer rope than younger players and they do because if you look at John Klingberg’s resume it’s an incredible resume but obviously it hasn’t quite panned out as he hoped as the Sharks have hoped. And so John Cleberg is now seeing seeing the pine. Uh Nick Ley has seen the bench. Um so um that leaves and of course we have the young defenseman and Shakir Makumadulan who we’ll talk about later in Keegan’s prospects corner. Um and we have Sam Dickinson. We also have Vincent de Harne who has surprised and has actually I think locked himself a pretty good spot in the lineup on at least a consistent basis because he’s been so good on the PK and since not just obviously not just on on Vinnie that’s not not all the credit goes to him but since he got back in the lineup I think eight games ago or something like that the Sharks I think have only given up two power play goals and so that’s at least some credit to So, um, it makes a And also there’s Timothy Liginrren in there, too. Yeah. Right. Kind of forgotten there, too. Yeah. Yeah. He kind of is because he doesn’t fit in the convenient like veteran category like like veteran category that fans hate like Clingberg and Lety. He’s not like uh like like Ahar because there’s really nobody like Ahar in the Sharks defense which helps him, you know, this big defensive first guy. Yeah. Um there just isn’t anybody like like him. Also, he’s a great personality. He’s good with Sam Dickinson, so I think that also helps him too. So, yeah, we also have Logrin. And so, anyway, um it’s a good question what they do. I mean, the tea leaves probably look like I mean, they like Iorio, right? I mean, they they they’ve gone through a lot of gymnastics to keep Iorio. And I is is is a toolsy defenseman as you know I’ve spoken with scouts about him when the Sharks picked them up and he may not top out to be more than a like really good uh bottom pairing defenseman but he is younger he’s getting better and that’s not something that we’re necessarily saying about a Nick Ley or John Clingberg. Yeah. And so it’s really tough. I think I I think one of I think uh unless they’re able to trade I don’t think right now they’re going to trade a Ferraro. Um I know that he’s the most valuable defenseman to trade and he’s one of their many UFA defense by the way. I didn’t forget a defenseman by the way. Right. So many defenseman on this team. I’m going to look back and secure. I mentioned I said Sam I said or Ferraro are safe. So So in the lineup for now I think. Yeah I think you got everybody. It’s just I just want to make sure I I think it’s going to be tough to say but it would be interesting if it is something like Nick Ley getting waved cuz he’s just been kind of um when he’s gotten nine games. I think there’s been an injury in there as well right. And uh quite interesting about Lety though is that so it took him uh he was practicing for a while getting back in in in place. I think he played a couple of games. I think the trying to remember it was the Calgary game on the road trip. He got into a couple of games. Uh if he did play the Calgary game, I think you had to you had to forgive him. I think everybody was bad in that game. So I don’t judge anybody who who played played in that game. But it to me it’s interesting though that he got back in for a couple games and then he’s he’s back out. He’s not a lock for the lineup. Oh, he’s not a lock for the lineup. And sorry, I don’t mean to associate Nick Lenny with the Calgary game. He did not play the Calgary game. Actually, that after the Calgary game or Vorsu was like, “Forget this. You’re back in.” So, he got into the Utah game and the and the Utah win and the Seattle game at Seattle that the Sharks actually played pretty pretty well in. Um, so but what I found interesting though was after that Utah game which they won, it didn’t lock him into back in the lineup though. And so I think what a lot of fans have complained about and I think I think Wars has handled it right. A lot of fans have complained about Warace, oh giving the veterans rope over the kids. Um, and I think it’s fair to give guys, look at Nick’s resume, man. Look at Clingberg’s resume. Like if those guys figure it out, if Nick Ley turns back the clock a little bit to two years ago, if John Cleanberg turns back the clock to five years ago, you know, Clingber’s got to turn turn the clock back a little farther, but still if they do right, even if they’re like 80 90% of what they were, those are really really good players and who have done it. And so I think it’s perfectly logical to give those guys rope over Mukuman and Dickinson who haven’t really done it on a consistent basis at NHL level. To me, that makes perfect sense. But I think that right now is a good time for and we’re showing it that he’s conceding that okay these guys may not be every night in the line of players that the Sharks hope that they were uh when they when they acquired him over over the summer. And so I feel like Ligrin overall has been better this season than than Clingberg and and uh and Ley. Mhm. Day surprisingly has like I said for the reasons that that I I enumerated has I think I think locked him like or not locked I shouldn’t say locked but like has given a really good case. Yeah, he’s formed a very consistent pair with Dickinson too. That’s not to go understated to his the stability that he provides somebody like Dickinson is really improved Dickson’s game more than anything. And that’s super super valuable for the Sharks above like having Lety or Clingberg turn back the clock. It’s having Dickinson turn forward the clock. And if Dear is the guy doing that, you know, he’s got to stay in the lineup most of the time as long as he’s able to um win his minutes as as it were. So yeah, I agree. Darn is also I think he’s 29. So he’s in sort of the the prime or whatever his career. Cleber and Ley again wants great defenseman and it is very possible. I’m not going to write anybody off. We we’re going to talk a lot about writing players off to too too. I think a lot of Sharks fans should uh uh should should take note of that. We’re going to talk about Ryan Ree a little bit later. I mean Tai Landre who we may not may not talk about but a lot of fans wrote them off. So I’m not going to write off Clingberg and Lety, but they are older and they are at least in the first quarter of the season not the players that they once were. So, I think if the Sharks make a decision here, I suspect that they’re just obviously going to try to trade him first, but I don’t know what the market is for two veteran defensemen who make a good amount of money. I think they’re both at 4 million. Yeah. And who haven’t been able to stay consistently in a better Sharks lineup, but still not an intimidating top six by any stretch of the imagination. So, I think that’s what they do. I don’t think they weigh Ario. They they like him. He’s young. He’s getting better. He’s also like on the fringe of kind of like Kai Emerson when they picked him up on the fringe of being able good enough to play in the NHL now. Yeah. So, he’s not like a raw project that they’re kind of carrying like Sam Dickinson who’s a different kind of scenario, different kind of case. And so, anyway, Loinrren has been better. And Ligrin is also youngest 26, right? I think in the prime of his career. Mhm. So Mike I think right unless you have an injury or something like that but I mean what else what else what else do you do but like I saw I saw a joke on Twitter where the Iorio back from his conditioning synth so Mike Ger has to grease up the crowbar and get somebody back on IR you know like he’s got to got to hit somebody with a um we are missing Ryan Ellis that’s our 10th defenseman no uh yeah unless there’s a phantom injury or or they move somebody around. Not Phantom. Obviously, these injuries are real. They’re not They’re not always Yeah, I think Michael Misa is actually hurt. I don’t Yeah, I’m not I’m not dismissing these people actually being hurt. But I mean, that’s kind of what they’ve been doing. It’s just holding on for a month and a half of of moving around people on IR and conditioning stints. And now they’ve gotten to this point where somebody’s got to move. I think um it’s hard to have a balanced hockey team unless you put Iorio on the wing. And that’s interesting. Um, he hasn’t played wing or forward in forever. I asked him because they put him they put him uh on practice at forward one day like three weeks ago and I just said, “Hey, Vince, when’s the last time you played forward?” And he’s like, “Uh, maybe or something like that. I don’t know. Yeah, he’s like teenager or something.” So, um, yeah. So, I I think I think they carry eight defenseman still because I think they they like having the the kind of the working Dickinson in slowly. And I don’t think Dickinson has been so good that he’s every day Sharks defenseman. Though I don’t give Dickson a lot of credit though. He was good in the game yesterday against Boston and Wars. He said that was one of his better if not his best game as a Shark. Uh so I like that he’s growing. Uh but I think you can you can live with eight defenseman, but you can’t you can’t go with nine though because um they have a long road trip coming up. Um that’s the one that starts in Dallas early December. five five uh five game road trip through a lot of different cities too, not all in the same time zone. They were able to get away with it the last road trip, the one that went through Minnesota, Calgary, and Seattle because the Barracuda actually played in Abbottzford at the same time. So, I think that that helped them that that helped them kind of push back the the clock a little bit there. Or not the clock, but just push back the decision a little bit that you know, if they lost the forward in a game, they could very quickly call somebody up. But the next road trip though, they’re going to be like in Toronto. I think they’re going to be in Philadelphia. So, it’s going to be a little tougher um to to get somebody over in in a pinch. So, typically you want at least an extra forward. So, I think they’re going to need to make this decision. I think I mean they may still they’ve been able to to to kind of juggle this for a month, right? It hasn’t hurt them in the standings obviously. So, so maybe they can keep juggling. But I I think though that if I were to guess, again, I don’t this is not inside knowledge, but based on these guys’ play, um, Lety and Clingberg, that they’re just going to wave them and no one’s probably going to take them and they’re going to go down to the Barracuda and they’re going to work it out and maybe they’ll come back better. Um, but I I suspect that’s going to be the case. Um, be interesting. They can’t they can’t wave, you know, like you said, there’s there’s certain guys like um Dickson and Muka Madillan both have had ups and downs to be sittable, but they’re not waveable, right? They’re not movable, right? Right. You can’t send Dickson to AHL. That’s the rule. Muka Madullan, you’re going to you’re waving him. You’re not going to wave Muk Madillan. You’re not going to put him on waivers. He get picked up. He get picked up. Yeah. So, and Iorio had seven points in his conditioning stint in six games with the Barracuda. Um, and uh, yeah, they like him enough that, you’re right, I don’t think they wave him to try and get him back on the barracuda. I think they want to keep him up. I think I mean, I would say the one argument with Iorio is that like if they thought they could sneak him through, I don’t think it’s any coincidence that the Barracuda, they they’ve gone on, it’s not just Io, but like they really needed a solid AHL defenseman there. And I Arielio is a definition of he is I think a two-time Calder Cup winner with with Hershey. He’s very very good AHL defenseman and also pretty young too. So there’s that upside with him. So they could really use him down with the Barracuda for for sure because um I think that in October they were missing kind of a a glue defenseman like that. uh the Barracuda struggled in October and so they can use pressure off of Ken Yoni to um right you know who’s got his strengths but you know Idio has his strengths that are that are sorely needed like you said. Yeah Ira leans like Iro’s a good puck mover too in the AHL but in the NHL IO’s IRL is probably going to be more of a defensive guy. Yep. And so he brings that skill set to the Barracuda. didn’t have a really a true shutdown defenseman to to start the season. So maybe they think they can and if they if they think they can then they will try to try to try to do it. Um but I had to think that they’re worried though that they’ll lose him. Um so which is why they’ve you know sort of kept him for so long up on the Angel roster. But so that would be the second thing that they could do is just try to sneak him through and and and hope he sneaks through. Yeah. Um like cuz he can do 23man roster, right? So it could be 12 exact forwards that are pretty good right now that we like nine defenseman and two goalies. Um it’s just kind of weird, right? Well, that’s what I’m saying. I don’t think they can sustain that though. That’s why I think you had to make a decision on whether I think the two most likely things. And I guess another thing they could possibly do is like move a guy like like Lilrin who is um good who’s been pretty good, but he’s been citable. sat a couple times and he’s like less essential to team success than Ferraro and or I just don’t think he can trade unless you get like a a great offer for Ferraro which I don’t think he will anyway which is you know we always talk about that first round pick for Ferraro that they’ve been trying to get I think they’ve been trying to get for years. Yeah. If they get it then okay, but like otherwise like how can you do that to this team that’s actually winning games and how can you tell Mlin that who’s you know carrying the the the you know he’s 19 years old he’s going to be up for extension soon and he’s carrying this team along his scar off too like it just unless you get a a killer offer I just don’t see how you can you can do that um for Ferraro but below Ferraro though that line of defense be below Orloff and Ferrar I think I think everybody obviously besides Dickinson too everyone’s kind of movable um even Madulan but I don’t think Muk Mullan you know he struggled this year so I don’t think you’re going to get a killer offer for him um but like let’s say someone gives you like a third back for Ligin which is what you traded acquired for him okay maybe you do that I don’t know so yeah I guess you out is is lo more essential to team success than than Nick Ley and he probably is even if it’s not it’s marginal but he probably this. No, he is for sure. Yeah, but so you could wave Lety and it’s just kind of like you picked him up on waivers. So then you kind of are not admitting defeat, but you’re admitting like all right, well they it’s kind of it’s ran its course for the time being. You know, it’s it’s okay, too. Like I’m not going to kill Mike for, you know, I’m critical of Mike for certain moves. You need you needed a lot of defense, veteran defense, and you took three swings at Oralof, Clingberg, and Levy. They’re all, I think, very reasonable swings considering those guys’ track record. Um, and right now at least and not not not not shoveling dirt on clean burger, but right now at least only Olaf has worked out, but it’s it’s been fine because Olaraf has worked out nicely and a Scar office has a 955 save percentage in November. Yeah, that’s helped for sure. That’s helped just just a little. Um, so yeah, so I really think I think it makes sense. I think you could I think you could wave Nick Lety and later on if you know the team does trade Ferraro or Lagrand or whoever he’s still down there. You can bring him back up if he did um to to get Minutes later on. It’s not nobody’s going to pick him up after this season at $4 million. So yes, it’s I never want to have a kind of sucks to be the vet that has to get waved, but I think that’s kind of where you’re at unless they really think that he’s gonna be needed right now. And I don’t think I think there’s eight defenseman that make a better case for whatever reason right now. Like they’re not using him like they need him. Yeah, exactly. They’re kind of just hanging out with him. Clingberg, he has a lot of faults, but there are some pluses there when you might need him, right? Orlov goes down to an injury. Okay, you really need somebody who could be on the power play, right? even if um or who knows but he has uses where and Lety is not a bad defenseman right now but he’s not I wouldn’t say he’s been any better than than the guys that have been playing regular minutes so yeah yeah he’s not like a he’s obviously not a power play guy anymore he used to be a long time ago and even on a PK a guy like Dear has has has stepped ahead of him so so yeah so I think to conclude this I I I would suspect that if I were to guess one thing it would be that they wave wave. Did they just wave Lety or Clingberg? And the second possibility is waving our Oreo. Y I think that like a Logan trade. I don’t think you get a third back for Loigrin right now. Um I just I don’t think I don’t think he’s been that good to get back what you traded uh uh for Toronto for him. Um that would just be this not me. I haven’t been asked any about it, but Lugan has obviously been he’s been really good at some points this season. He’s been obviously he’s been scratched too. So, um, so that those would be my guesses. I don’t know if you have any any other kind of imaginative ways to to deal with this unless somebody’s injured and they haven’t told us yet and they get put on IR. That’s the other option. Exactly. That’s what we’ll find out tomorrow, right? We I go to practice tomorrow. Flared up injury for Lenny or Clingberg and then we’re back to where we were before and then we can get 13 forwards and AD, right? Um we the the tw the well the the top 12 with a stop truck coming up um for Skinner being injured and everything have looked really good and well I guess we can talk about that in in a little bit. We’re going to talk about the uh the home stand in general but I just really like the way that the the team is constructed right now. Yeah. Um the defense is kind of a uh work in progress or just like a mishmash of guys. Um, but the offense has really kind of formed an identity. So, really interesting. Uh, and Elchek is another one of those guys that, yeah, like don’t don’t throw dirt on a guy’s name too soon, especially a guy who’s like 21, 22. So, yeah, let’s transition to that. Um, okay. Um, do you want to do the uh Zeter Leno stop truck trade? Uh, or Misa situation. Let’s do bring up the Misa thing because this matters for the contracts that the Sharks have. Yeah, that’s that’s why I want to bring this up very briefly. Um, so Michael Misa um suffered an injury in Seattle three I think it’s been three in late October I think he was supposed to play a game and then uh he got hurt in morning skate. So I think it’s actually been about a month since his injury. Anyway, uh he is going to be skating soon it sounds or he has been skating on his own and the hope is that he rejoins practice in about a week. So this is a very interesting timing. I know there’s a lot of conspiracy theories around Misa’s injury, but I think this does line up perfectly for the Sharks though. Uh I don’t think it was a phantom injury, but still that uh December 12th, uh Canada’s I think going to start their training camp there, uh for the World Juniors. December 26th is when the tournament starts. And so I think you have a pretty good lining up. You know, it’s we’re recording this on November 24th. um you maybe you don’t even get to Misa’s nine ten games. Maybe you even decide after real juniors and give him a couple games after and see how you know how he’s progressed because let’s say actually he does begin to practice within a week. um then you can send them down to the AHL for that conditioning assignment and then that leads into the WJC’s and then after WJC’s you have a couple games left and see maybe Michael Misa in January is going to be more angel ready than Michael Misa in October. um Will Smith was like that and so that’s just that’s just a thought. And also too in terms of the contract situation um the Sharks are at 50 to 50 contracts now once Michael Misa same thing situation with Sam Dickinson’s Sam Dickinson once Misa plays his 10th game that NHL game that contract becomes counts toward the 50 and the contract doesn’t slide anymore and you start the clock on his uh three-year entry level contract. Yep. So, I think what’s interesting about the timeline that I’m kind of conceiving here is that that gives you kind of even more time to well decide what you want to do with all your defenseman for one thing, but also two to decide that if Michael Misa is a guy who can help you this year on your I can’t believe I’m saying this on your possible playoff ride. Yeah, that push for the playoffs. I love that push for legitimate Sharks push for the playoffs. I think I’m I’m about to faint here. Legitimate might be a little bit of a stretch with Asgar’s 950 and Cabbrini’s like 1.5 points per game or whatever the hell he’s doing. Believe a little bit. But yeah, I just no one no one no one stops shots at a 955 clip for a whole season. So yes, people actually score at a point 1.34 clip a game which Mlin is doing now. But yeah, exactly. Um, but I I see you just say it’s makes perfect sense and I’m It’s an interesting way that this has happened, but I think Canada’s probably happy they’re getting probably going to get Michael. We’ll see. Yeah, we don’t know this for a fact, but it makes sense though because again, I’ve talked a lot we talked a lot with with Michael that like um he he has very interesting characteristics and I mean this legitimately he has NHL characteristics that can play right now, but his strength and quickness are not there. and not on a night toight basis. And so I would say that he’s better served by going to the WJC’s and having this age conditioning assignment, too. I think those will be good things for him and we’ll come out of it and see where he is. And it wouldn’t shock me if in January you give him a couple games, you like, hey, he’s he’s a better player now than he was three months ago. And it’s good to remind everybody that um Will Smith went to the World Juniors in his draft plus one. He was just playing in college and then he went to the World Juniors for or out of college during that year as well. And he had a great, you know, um great tournament, was on team. Yep. He was a huge part of it. Looked great. And then he after that went back to college, but looked not like he wasn’t looking good before then. He was still looking good in college, but afterwards he was like on a tear the whole rest of the year um getting like um uh Hobie Baker talk and stuff like that. So, it’s it’s not a bad thing if Misa goes and dominates this tournament. He didn’t I think he played what two games last year in the World Juniors if he played. I can’t really remember um how much he played or if he did play or I can’t remember if it was him or Porter Barone that played a little bit. Let me look it up. I can’t remember. Uh he did not play last year. It was Porter that played. So he hasn’t played and I think Oh, yeah. No, because they they passed him over because that was actually a big debate. He was scoring so much, but he was young and so they passed him over. Yeah. Yeah. And they brought Porter who played like two games. They brought Schaefer who played two games but got injured. Um so I think it would be good for him to do that. And you know, obviously it’s also interesting, we’re going to see Misa joining a pretty solid Barracuda team as well if they do that, right? They could also just say, “Fuck it. We’re just going to put him in the NHL.” We have no idea. But this is just our thoughts. But I think that’s where Misa’s game is at though. I think it is right now. Uh, actually, and I teased it. I got to put it out. But talking with Shane Wright, one of the and I I mentioned last week, I talked to Shane Wright about that year that he went from the NHL to the AHL conditioning to WJC’s and then back to juniors. And I asked him, “What level do you think your game was at that year?” And Shane was pretty honest. He said, you know, the AHL was probably where my game was at. He’s like, I don’t think there was I had a lot of fun going back to juniors, but I don’t know if there was that much for me to learn on uh hockey on the ice basis. Sure. Um and so AHL was probably Yeah, AHL was too fast for Shane Wright that year, but yeah, AHL was about right for him. So that’s what he said. And so I thought that was that was pretty pretty honest of him to kind of say that. So, I wonder if for Michael Misa if if that’s the same case. Yeah. I’m just hopeful that everybody’s not going to be angry if they get sent to the World Juniors because that’s what I worry about is is everybody’s going to be like, “Why aren’t they playing with the NHL?” They’re going to get angry. They’re going to get angry. But don’t like he’s going to go and hopefully he does well in that environment and and he’s going to be um essential on that team. Yeah. So, he should be he should be. Don’t be mad. He can always come back, too. He’s still a Shark. He signed the contract and the Sharks are winning. So, we can’t even be like, “Man, we’re not winning and I don’t get to see Michael Misa.” No, Sharks are winning and be happy about that, too. I’m already pre-planning for all of you yelling at everybody. There’s going to be a lot of a lot of yelling. A lot of yelling. Yeah. Um, even in this Yeah. The Sharks have won so many games in November. I know a lot of is scar off, but some of it is is Ryan Morski pushing a lot of right buttons. I I’ll be honest. Yeah. I think um we’ll talk more about this maybe later, maybe end of the year. We’ll see how it all ends up, but I feel like both Warsoski and and Mike Greer and obviously some things haven’t worked out. Obvious things haven’t worked out, but in general, they’ve they’ve pushed a lot of right buttons to to get this team to be just competitive, you know? Uh and some of it is Yeah. Celebrini taking the taking a superstar leap and a scar off. But there’s other elements too that I guess I’ll talk about later. But um anyway, let’s talk about another thing that Mike Greer was panned for. Uh the Zetterland I as well. Oh, stop chuck trade. And so Fabian Zetterland came back with the Sanders. Actually, Fabian Zetterland had a great game. He scored the second goal. a very Fabian Zetterland goal just on the rush. Great shot and he also hit a post too. So good for Fabian who has struggled a bit with Ottawa. He just has two that’s just that was just the second goal of the year. But um I think it’s another way though to kind of re-evaluate the OPC trade. Sure. And Otop I liked Oop last year and I said it on on the show and I like him more this year. I think he’s gotten gotten to become a better player and he’s and he’s becoming that player that the the Sharks at least the you know I think there’s still some hope that and I don’t think Micro ever declared he’s going to be a third line center. I think some fans kind of mistake that that oh Mike said he’s going to be third line center. Micro never said that, but Micro hopes that he will be, you know, that’s sort of his like ceiling, right? But right now though, he’s looking like actually a very good, not just a uh a dime a dozen fourthline center, but actually a very good fourthline center. And a a a scout a after or uh during one of the games, I got a text from a scout who was watching it. He’s like, “Man, this O stop kid is is really good.” Mhm. And this scout, and I wrote a story about this scout, caveat, really good in a fourthline center way. Yeah. He doesn’t have the offense yet to be a third line center, but this scout, it’s in all the story. This guy talked about how Otop controls the center of the ice. He is disciplined. Small things that you don’t notice, like he makes himself available to his defenseman. um quickly to be available for for an outlet pass. Small things that you don’t you don’t always notice about about a centerman centerman’s job. And Oshopek last year when I watched him, he was a guy that you couldn’t skate through. M and that that was one thing I liked about him defensively that if he tried to get through him that you weren’t likely to do it no matter the player because he he was he’s big, he’s long and he’s he was pretty to me he was pretty quick last year but he’s quicker this year. Yeah, for sure. And so anyway, I’m not saying that he is he’s a different type of player than Fabian Zetherland, but you can definitely win games. I think you’re going to be able to win games in the playoffs with with Zack Stopchuk as your fourth line center. Hopefully, he’s your third line center and you can still win games with him, but I don’t know if that’s going to happen. But again, yeah, he’s I think he’s been impressive. I think the um the big thing is like if Sakoslav is a great fourthline center, he’s more valuable than a uh than Zetterland at his current production and contract for sure. And the the argument was always if Settletherland is really a middle six scoring winger that’s you know going to be in the lineup every night on a playoff team. Yeah. Then maybe he isn’t um as valuable as just like a good fourthline center. But um I think right now it’s looking that way. But this is a couple of games. So I think that’s a big caveat. This has only been a couple games. But he has looked really good. I think he he provides the um and and Dandre was doing it or God as well. The fourth line is just because of the way that it’s they just have a good identity, right? Like the fourth line has a a role, a defined role rather than trying to like be more than they need to be. They’re not trying to push off, not push play. They’re they’re kind of there to, you know, provide a spark, hit um check, do your traditional fourthline things. They’re occasionally going to pot a goal maybe, but most of the time they are there to hold serve and then they put them out deep. Yeah. Get the puck in deep. They put them out there exactly that point when they like if you notice whenever the Sharks have been hemmed in their zone with whatever line was out there. The next shift is probably going to be the fourth line because they’re going to try and get the puck out and put it in deep and then just for check. They don’t plan to do anything else other than just get it out and then reset and put Celibbrini back on the ice. When Waras is mad at how the team is playing, including the celebrating line and they’re turning the puck all over the place and they’re they’re trying to do all kinds of fancy stuff in a neutral zone and losing it, then then he puts out the fourth line. Or if if they’ve just been hemmed in their zone and they’re like, “Well, we need a reset,” then they’ll put the fourth line out. And it’s good to have a a line that actually has that identity rather than just guys that are playing on the fourth line because they’re guys. And that’s a credit to like we’re going to mention as well um to to Reeves as well as Good Row just that they’ve formed an identity of a line that um just that’s and stop kind of adds to it, right? He he adds perfectly into that line. So, we uh yeah, obviously a lot of it’s like the burden of the offense is not on Barkley Goodro anymore and I think that’s a good thing as my my own opinions of Barkley Goodro have always been uh that which is that’s not the kind of person he is. He’s not really the third liner anymore. He is a fourth liner and he’s doing well in that role right now. So, um yeah, I I’m super excited about that. I think my stop’s been good. Um, and we got a second for it as well. Did we get McKini in that? Is that what that who got the second? I think that that pick became McKini. So, I think there was it’s just funny to read some of the online narrative because when O stop um wasn’t as good as people hoped when he came over and and he didn’t make the team out of camp. People are like, “Oh, O stop wasn’t a big part of the deal. It was all about the second round pick.” No, man. That’s what Mike first time was. He really likes Oopsch. Oschuk and the second round. Those are both very valuable pieces. Even the co like it reminded me of the Kovaleeno revisionism. Like when that dream happened, they they they propped up, hey, we got a second round pick. That’s great. You don’t get second round picks for goalies usually. And we like this Kovaleeno kid. Yeah. And when Kovaleeno starts talking about about Woras, then fans are like, “Oh, no, no, no. He wasn’t a big part.” No, he was. He was. They just made a mistake. That happens. I’m not I’m not on on on Mike Riff for that. Like every GM makes mistakes. So like anyway, so so so so let’s not go full reversal on it and let’s not go full reverso and shovel dirt on Fabian’s name either. Fabian has struggled to score in Ottawa. Yes, he has three goals I think in 40 games with them cleaning last year. But we saw that Fabian obviously turned it around with the Sharks and Ottawa believed in him. Ottawa gave him a pretty good contract. I think a bigger contract than maybe the Sharks wanted to give him which maybe that was a sticking point. That was part of the reason probably but a threeyear Yeah. four four million AAV plus. So at the time a lot of the criticism from me and also other people was also just the the impact on the locker room, right? That’s that Ecklund and Zetterland were such good friends and even said the thing he misses from San Jose is William Ecklund the most. Yeah. And you know that’s not nothing, right? Like you want your your teammates to like each other and like playing for each other. And clearly Zetterland had career years here so far, right? he like 40 something points then he had was on a half point a game uh pace when he was traded so or more than that maybe um yeah probably around I think he had like 30 something points in 60 game so I think um there was definitely an argument there that this is a uh an interesting decision I I didn’t like it at the time because of that I was worried that it wouldn’t turn out um in that in that way but you know what it’s so are looking like a good trade. I I think I’ll say that I think that Ostopuk has at least I don’t want to go in too extreme because it’s been I think just five games of Zack Otopchuk and Zerland as we know is a streaky scorer. So and we saw in San Jose a couple days ago he can still skate, he can still shoot. Yeah. So So he can he can he can go on a tear the second half of the season for all we know. But um I would say that Osabchuk is at least showing that okay like we’re going to have a this this trade is a conversation at least. It’s not what a stupid trade. This Zach was kid totally sucks. He’s never going to be anything in the NHL. He’s shown that he he just might be something very valuable in NHL. But that doesn’t take away from what Fabian can do. And the fact again Ottawa has made a lot of good decisions in the last couple of years, right? And so they like Fabian Zetterland obviously based on based on um the contract that they gave him. And so the Sharks maybe did not like Fabian quite as much as Ottawa did. And so okay, we’ll see who who’s right in that. So there’s still it’s still open debate. It’s not one-sided either way just because Fabina struggled or Stop struggled last year or whatever. So yeah, after we traded Niko Sterm, now it’s all right, we have Nikosterm at home and it’s Zack Stop. I think that’s the role that maybe in the future he kind of fills is is the Nico Sturmas. I think he could be better than Nico though actually though because uh one thing though with Stop Chuck he just again defensively he’s really hard to get through like like Nico was was big and he was fast and Nico always gave you everything he had but Oschuk has a little bit of uh how do you say it like like he has I think a chance to be like even like a third line shutdown center who has like very little off you’re going to have to surround him with some good offense to make up for the fact that he’s not giving you offense. But defensively though, I think he’s he’s going to be he can be better than than Nico and everyone knows I love Nico Sturm. I’m one of the biggest Nicoms fan. I’m a hu one of the biggest Nikico Sturmans fans out there. Um but I think Doubtish kind of guy maybe. I don’t know if they’ll have the offense that that because Dow uh I covered Dow with Ontario Rain when he was in Kings organization. Dow was a really good AHL playmaker and you can see in his numbers that Dow has figured out some offense in the AL level. So I don’t know if a stop’s going to get quite there. But um but yeah, maybe in terms of impact though, maybe as a 4C though, he can be between a little above Nico, a little below a little above Nick. All right, I’m gonna I’m going to turn on my uh ring light so everybody who’s watching there lights. Um anyway, so all right, let there be a light. Let there be lights. Another trade that was kind of panned. Um kind of panned. Kind of panned. I to be fair by you. I’m not saying not by me this time. I did I did I did say that the Zland trade was not my favorite but I did not say I don’t think I said anything about the thr for for Reeves trade actually at all. Maybe I did I don’t know but I didn’t say anything negative. No no I don’t remember you saying much that but uh but Sharks Nation though this was a widely pan Well there was actually there were a lot of fans though who love the Reeves impact from even before that type of player. They’ve you know there also fans who be hey we need a player like this for a long time. So I I want to say that so I think it wasn’t as one-sided uh unpopular. I think the most unpopular the two most unpopular transactions of the mic career era I think are the I think the Z softuk trade actually might be worse than the Goodrill pickup because I think still had the some of the halo of being a Sharks fan favorite. also too was clearly essential part of Tampa Bay winning two Stanley Cups and also essential part of the Rangers going to the conference finals a couple times too. So I think that with Gdro fans were mad that he didn’t want to come here but in terms of the player that there was not quite as much anger. Whereas with Zetland or stop you can see Zetherland 20 goals fast popular you know buddy buddy comedy with Willie Meckllin Zack stop no goals. So yeah and also Zeterland came back from the the Meyer trade. So it was kind of like a like a money aspect. Not a not a found money aspect, but like a oh look, you made a good trade to get a guy that you really like. Don’t get rid of him. We like him. Yeah. Yeah. Um so so Thrun Reeves wasn’t quite on that level because I think because we’re on Twitter so much, we look so much at like the hockey analytics community that’s really big on Twitter. Of course, they hated the Reeves thrun trade like sure like Oopschuk Zeterlin. But I would say I that’s that that’s an interesting conversation for some other time. I would say I think Zetlin Sachuk was the most unpopular kind of yeah maybe career deal of hurdle people hated but that was more of like the uh I wouldn’t say casual fan but the more like the oh man that’s our like guy it’s Thomas Hurdle yeah yeah yeah but the the the rebuild forward looking fan that was like oh this is actually good pretty good trade got two first round picks and got rid of that contract so yeah we were pretty happy about it um But no, so um Reeves, uh his impact in the locker room and on the ice, actually the other yesterday when we were watching the game, there was a hit by Reeves in the corner that made all of like I I don’t know who it was, but there was one San Jose Sharks fan that like she let out just the most high-pitched scream that I’ve heard. It was awesome to hear on like you could hear it on TV. I heard on TV just that there was like a like somebody’s hitting people. So it it was it was a good hit. I think that kind of rolled out of it a little bit or else it would have been even bigger, but it was funny to hear just that. So like Reeves, not just that he’s only hitting, but he’s impacting the the locker room as well. So let’s talk about that. Well, yeah. So, this past week on the home stand, the Sharks debuted their team player of the game award, which turns out to be a I guess a shark necklace of some sort that that Ryan Reeves custom made. That’s awesome. And paid a good amount of money for um that that I’ve heard. Um so, yeah, it was it was it was a decent sum. It’s not a ridiculous sum, but it was a a decent sum for for a custom basically a custom artwork or custom necklace, basically. Uh but anyway, they’ll just it just speaks to how he has really fit into the room and I believe it, you know, asked Will Smith a couple games ago after the Ottawa loss just because Ryan Ree got into a pretty good fight there with um I think it was Hodchin uh Hodgeen I think who who who Hodgeen who charged Ferraro there. Mhm. And Smith was like, “Yeah, we we love him.” And you see just clips of him with Mlin Celabbrini. I think there’s one the yesterday’s game u of them of them kind of joking around. They sit next to each other in the locker room. Tofoley and Reeves sit next to Celibbrini uh in the in the Sharks practice uh at Sharks Ice basically. And these things are not coincidences. You know, these are these are well kind of these are planned out things for who they want sitting next to Mlin and Will Smith is next to Foley there. Um, so that’s that’s one where when they made the trade I didn’t really have much I think I remember I just didn’t have much of opinion of it. Like I I know I I do know on the surface it looked bad in terms of okay, you’re trading a young defenseman who you thought was a pretty good who I thought was a pretty good prospect a couple of years ago and he he was a pretty good prospect a couple years ago and a great guy in Henry Thr too. I want to I want to add in there. Always like dealing with Henry. But uh but the truth of it was that his game had sort of plateaued. He didn’t get much better with the Sharks as good as he had hoped. And we can see that now because I think right now he’s with the Marlies, right? I don’t know if he’s been called up yet or playing Angel games this year, but but he he didn’t make the Leafs out of camp though. I know that. And anyway, in Reeves though, yeah, he’s 37 38. He’s a UFA. Toronto was scratching him left and right last year. he wasn’t really he wasn’t happy in with his role in Toronto. But sometimes in a place where you get more opportunity like San Jose, obviously Toronto is a deeper lineup and also to the room needs somebody like you. Room needs that kind of volume and swagger. And Reeves, you know, to his credit, Reeves has been a part of I think Reeves is Reeves has made the playoffs I think in every year in the last decade. I’m not sure. Maybe there’s a year that he missed, but there’s a reason why teams keep adding him, right? And it’s not just because he he’s phys he’s, you know, like like you mentioned, he’s really physical. Sharks haven’t had a forward that hit have has hit like him in a long time, too. But also too, he will stand up for his teammates. Also too, he’s great in the room. Mhm. Um and so I I mean this this and for a defenseman who is yes young and sure Henry Stone can still figure it out too because Henry’s just 23 but I think it was a good calculated gamble by Mike Reer and it’s paid off I think better than anybody could have expected because turns out that Ryan Reeves can still you know he’s not as quick as he used to be on a for check. You think about what he is on a for check now and think about what he was 5 years ago a little bit quicker. He was scary on a forche. That’s what scouts would tell me. He was scary on a for check. Even if he couldn’t do much else on the ice in terms of, you know, he’s not a great puck handler. You know, when he gets the puck, he’s pretty much just shoot or pass pretty immediately. He knows kind of what he’s he’s good at or what he’s better at. Vegas days he was good. Like that’s he’s just ferocious. Yeah. As a force checker. I He’s so effective now. Yeah. He like I said, they the formation of an identity has been huge for this team offensively. just the the roles that every every line is playing. Um I think the the middle six is kind of still missing a few parts. Um and we are kind of arranging people in there and I think they could use one or two more high impact forwards there. But guys like Graph, guys like Good Row and Reeves, uh guys like Wenberg, they’re all forming their they’re sticking into their role and making the team. They’re allowing Celebrini to do the Celbrini things because he doesn’t have to or they don’t have to do more than they are they need to if Cabbrini is doing the most. You know, like that’s that’s all that really matters is that the the rest of the team is a they’re buying into the system to the forche. They’re buying into playing sound defensive hockey. There’s no firewagon anything anymore. It used to be like, you know, we’d give up two goals and then all of a sudden we’ve given up seven goals, you know, like that doesn’t really happen as much anymore. Now, if we get down, they they battle back and it feels like they can come back because you have Celini and you have his car off. You have a person who can actually do the things that are necessary to do it. You don’t ever feel like you’re out of the game most nights, right? Like we’re going to have Stinkers obviously, but most nights it doesn’t feel like that. And I think that’s awesome. It’s just it’s the vibes are really good again like they’ve been up and down I think for the Sharks. Um we started the year vibes were kind of in the toilet but then it’s gotten significantly just a rocket rise since then. Um including a great win last night over Boston. Yeah. Let’s let’s just wrap up before we get to Keegan’s Prospect Corner coming up which we’re very excited about and also our Marco Marco Sturman interview. But um you talk about how the the forward lines have this each sort of have an identity or this closure too, right? And so I think that again and I wrote about this a couple couple games ago um after the I think the LA win, I think it was LA they beat, right? um about giving my career credit that moves like Otopchuk and Deandria that were panned last year because Landre didn’t have a great year last year but no but and Gadrill obviously that’s been like pretty panned from the especially after last year because Gdro also did not have a good year last year I think that these guys have formed the the basis of a kind of a sensible, effective bottom six for the Sharks. And it’s not a perfect bottom six. I don’t know if it’s a playoff caliber bottom six. And this might come to bite me in the ass for saying this, but to be honest, of course, the fourth line could still use more offense between Reeves and Gadro, both on the same fourth line. I think on a playoff team, they’re more interchangeable. Like one of them is a 13th forward if we’re being honest on a playoff team. Yeah, that makes sense. I think I think I could be wrong, but uh Delandre as a third line center, love his motor this year. He really is making an impact on games. Offensively though, not probably not enough offense to be a everyday third line center on a playoff team. But though, I love the on this team. He they’ve all made this team competitive on a consistent shiftbyshift basis this year. And yeah, they’re not gonna they’re not gonna be popping in too many goals though. Dandre almost did put in a pretty nice one yesterday, right? Or nice move at least he made and that called call for a penalty which led to a Manson silver knee goal. But anyway though, um so you had these guys that were kind of on by by by a lot of fans, those three guys after their years last year, Reeves, Gdro, and Deandra. You had a Colin Graph who really has defined himself from the beginning of camp as a as a guy that he’s still young but man you know like he does a lot of things well and right and like I remember when the Sharks signed him and scouts were telling me hey this guy might be like Kevin Leank because they were looking because that’s what he did in in college he was he didn’t play PK he was offensive he was you know kind of light and he was a playmaker and we still see some of those dings, right? Colin can still use some strength. He is a play good playmaker, but he’s added this PK element that he didn’t he didn’t even do in college and he’s very good at it and he’s added just kind of this grit to his game and he’s kind of like he’s he’s he’s much smaller than those top chuck. He’s got long arms and so they both are very tough to get through uh you know when you’re attacking those guys specifically just because of their long arms, you know. So, so anyway, so, so Graph has really defined himself as a he’s obviously still young, needs to work on the consistency bit, which is every young player, but he’s he’s a player, and that’s like the ultimate compliment that Scott will give you. He he’s a player. He’s a player. Yeah. and and he’s a guy that looks like he has all the makings of a really good playoff like third line winger who can maybe swing up to second line sometimes you know when he hits his ceiling and man that’s a valuable valuable player especially with how much Pang he’s going to do cuz he is like you said really good at that um unexpectedly so just reads the ice super super well and he’s always done that like on the back check transition he can read the he can pick off passes and and reads the play. Um but he yeah he’s added a motor element to him. He’s gotten faster as well. He came in a little bit looked a little bit behind the play um just with his speed but now added some speed added he just kind of moves all of his elements together to make a just a really good third line winger. Um which is again testament to Mike Greer. So I get Mike Greer’s praises on this podcast like and the offense still might be there too. Um, and that’s that’s kind of the the thing that is really intriguing about him because he is playing this this uh reliable kind of B game. Yeah. And if that offense kind of shows up consistently like imagine Kevin Leank but who’s a really good PKer, good two-way player, a guy who could pop in 30 40 points but is also a super effective defensive player. Mhm. That’s a really really good player. That’s a really that’s like that’s a play again. You win you win in the playoffs with guys like this. Did you know real quick that uh Kevin Lebank once won an OHL uh penalty killer of the year award? I did not know that. Yeah, he played penalty. I really didn’t know that in the OL. Okay. U mostly because he um would go up high and steal the puck and then go score a goal. That was kind of like he was just really good at like picking pucks off and and scoring cuz you know he scored like a bajillion points in the OL. Yeah, I like Kevin and Kevin a lot personally too, but he never played in the NHL as a penalty killing role. It was never Yeah, Kevin never I I I think he tried, but he just he was a light player. He never got like strong enough to do something like that in the AHL level, I think. Yeah. Whereas Colin Grath, we were already seeing that he he did get strong enough to like do that at a confident level. I think that’s the biggest difference because Kevin Leank was always quick and he was always smart. I think he was always willing too. Um, but it just sometimes your body doesn’t cooperate, you know, like Ryan Berkeley, right? Sometimes your body just doesn’t cooperate. So, he never really had the positioning or like the the physicality element to to really do that in the NHL, so it’s never his thing. But Graph is already I mean, he’s taken the puck off of guys that are seasoned vets and yeah, I love it. Yeah, he’s he’s showing it. Um, and I also want to mention too, let’s not forget the bottom six guys who have consistently been in there. Adam Glad and Jeff Skinner. Jess Skinner who was hurt now and they provide different elements especially Skinner. Skinner is definitely more offensive leaning. But hey, you know what? When your for when your bottom six has Gdro and it has the Landria, it has Graph who’s still learning to be more offensive, right? And has Reeves, right? You need somebody with some real offense, right? And Jeff Skinner, not the most consistent player, but like he, you know, when he’s on, he’s winning pucks and when he’s on, obviously, he can finish with the best of them. I mean, some of his goals have been quite impressive this year. So, that’s been, I think, a good element. add just a kind of different element to that bottom six. And Adam Goddard, Adam Goddard’s been a really good sort of jack, you know, Ryan Rossi called him jack of all trades, right? He’s not uh he’s not um how do you say it? Um like he’s good at a lot of things. He may not be great like at at anything in particular, but he’s he’s uh he’s obviously he he can finish at any competent level. Uh he he’s willing to to to to grit and grind. Um yeah, they come in center at sometimes. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Uh I think they are um like you said, there is a a hope for a playoff push, but I I there’s you we talked about off the air, but there are missing elements, right? We’re missing probably two more impact forwards and probably a two more good top four defenseman. Well, we talked about this before the show, but um I guess I will say it then like um should have resigned ML Brandlin and plop Mar Gringer 2C. Boom. Put Wenberg as 3C, which is his ideal role on a playoff team. Sure. And trade for Rasmus Dallling. Bam. Bam. Playoff team. Yeah. And there you go. Um Quinn Hughes might be available. I heard that. Right. Trade for Quinn Hughes. Straight for Quinn Hughes. Um then you then you are probably a maybe a solid playoff team if Ascarov keeps up some good play. Well, let’s not forget Nadulkovich has played really well in November too. So let’s not uh let’s not forget him too in in this conversation. He’s done a really solid job and also too listen to Kevin Woodley last week. He talked up Nadulkovich great in the room also underrated season last year according to Clear Sight Analytics which Kevin Woodley uses. But anyway though, um, yeah, I so that’s that’s what I kind of see is still Yeah, those are the the clearest kind of elements that that they could use. Um, they don’t have a uh I like Weenberg a lot, but he’s not a clear-cut 2C in in this league. Yeah. Um, and so then if you had one as your 3C and you can kind of you can maybe make like I don’t know uh Otopchuk and Dandra could be the winger on on your 4C and interchain Reeves and Gdro or something like that. Yeah. And then you have Graph with Wenberg and Skinner. Maybe Skinner can finish Wenberg’s passes. So something like that. And then we start maybe we’re kind of in business there, right? We need we need um Akin and Granlin together again. We need Subaru’s prediction to come true where Misa becomes the 2C by the end of the year and then we’re set. You know, it could happen. Hey, you know, um you in in November would have laughed about Will Smith doing what Keith did. Well, I wouldn’t laugh. I would been like I don’t know if he’s going to score a point a game to end a season. I that’s that’s pretty good. Yeah. So, and yeah, Michael’s a really smart player, so I wouldn’t put it past him, but um but yeah, that’s that’s that’s kind of a tough uh it seems unlikely at this point that that that that Miso will develop that much, but maybe he will though. Yeah, we need to um take it in a little bit. Right now, we are we have a higher points percentage than the Edmonton Oilers, the um which is crazy. We have more points than the Winnipeg Jets, which is insane. Um, we are ahead of Chicago as of now, but they have more points percentage. And then obviously teams like St. Louis, Vancouver, Calgary, Nashville were all were beating pretty heavily in terms of uh the standings. So, if you upset the 161 and five Avalanche Wednesday, we Yeah. Well, they already won this year against the ABS, right? But it was overtime. They did. They did. They did. But yeah, if you do that, then um maybe you’re in the playoffs at Thanksgiving, which I know is one of those big sort of milestones. Yeah, you got to at least be, you know, either in the playoffs or really close to there to to consider making the playoffs. And oh, we have more points than the Florida Panthers right now, which is this is weird. This is a weird season, everybody. Like Boston is number one right now. uh or or no, sorry, they were one of the hottest teams. They’ve been kind of falling off a little bit, but they are um they’re up there in the standings. Pittsburgh has been up there. Detroit, Ottawa, Islanders with Schaefer. It’s just a weird beginning of the season that I wonder how it all shakes out. Anaheim is 14-7. What the heck? Yeah, the way I was looking at it that the Islanders, they’ve got Sroken and the Sharks have Escar off and they’ve both been amazing in November. So, a little bit of that I think uh a bloom or that gets popped a little bit once Escar is going to come back down to earth once Hokken comes back to earth. He’s well those two were like uh their goal save above expected was like way over everybody else is for this month. But anyway, let’s let’s talk a little bit about uh Scar Off. Yeah. Um I mean just no words, right? Just just amazing. Um, just great to see that he’s got this in him, which we did not know for sure. We had heard the talent was there. We saw it in places last year with the Sharks and obviously with the Barracuda, but um and he’s not going to keep this up, but um it’s it just Yeah, like he’s uh I mean he’s had a couple of he’s given up a couple of rough goals. one that got I think got called back maybe on off sides a couple games ago, but I mean it’s just been so good. Yeah. I don’t really know what was to say. Yeah. I mean, listen to the Kevin Woodley interview just the the transformation as it is like of um his play. He’s so calm. He seems higher up in the net. He’s catching things. He’s not um not just getting beat clean. He’s actually like using his hands and seems to be just not a different player, but just like more an advanced player of the player that we knew. And there his like uh Woodley said is like he’s so wide. Like the other like I was watching a shot and last night and somebody shot from the point and my brain was like there’s no like that that puck is probably going wide or something like that and it just hit his it hit his pad like it it was like all of a sudden his leg is all the way over here and he’s taken up like six feet across of the ice and you’re like what the Yeah, once he commits low he’s really hard to beat for sure. wide. He’s so wide and it’s awesome. Like when he can take up so much space, um you take away so much opportunity. Um just awesome. His rebound control has been excellent. His decision-m with the puck has been, you know, we lost a couple games early on for for some goalending gaps, but he’s been great. So great is even an understatement. Like he keeps this up. He’s Calder uh trophy contender. um if he keeps this up. Well, I I I I looked it up. Right now, he’s on pace for the best month of goalending in Sharks regular season history. Jesus. And that includes the Makov who had a caller called a trophy, right? Yeah. Well, I mean, just just a month, right? But like the uh I think the the previous best month of Sharks regular season goalending was 952 save percentage, I think. I think it was. Wow. Um, and that was I think that was actually NBA or Steve Shields. Um, uh, Steve Shields in February. Um, I don’t know what year had a 951. Uh, I probably should put years in this in this article actually now I’m looking at it. But anyway though, but that was only in seven games I think. And um, the Bachov’s highest for a month was a 949. Jeez. uh in December and Escaroff’s right now at a 955 and of course Escaroff probably will get Colorado will probably put a dent into this 955 on on Wednesday and then there’s a backto back to to end this month so as probably in line to play two more games this month but that we’re even having this conversation obviously is just a testament to just his his talent and I found myself and this was in my game notes yesterday in the Boston game just like trying to watched a scar off like I think Kevin Woodley would try to watch him and I just tried to watch him like look through traffic and I noticed on a power I think it was the power play that he was red alert on where David Posternok was like just exaggerated head swivels like you know when he saw P posture knock dart by not exaggerating like he did on purpose just like he could see that that was the guy he was looking for uh was was posture knock on on the power play and um So that that was really fun to watch. And there’s a couple of those saves where and actually Celini talked about it after the game when I asked Mlin just why Escarov’s so tough to beat. And a couple of those saves on posternoc. It looked like he was late, but no, he’s actually doing what I think Kevin Woodley suggested, like like trying to hold back on going low as as not as late as possible, but at kind of the right time, not to go too early, which he sounded like he ascar was doing in October, getting down low too early and exposing the top of the net. Um, and and he got over on those one-times and he looked uh you know, the way Selbrini said is he just he’s everywhere. You think you think you’ve beat him, but you haven’t. Yep. And that’s what he looked like yesterday against Boston on a couple of those posture knock maybe Gordon I’m sorry uh Morgan Geeky got a hold of of of one of those side to side one-times too and he’s just he’s just there. Yeah. Yeah. There’s it was good to see a really good good glove save from him too. That’s like that sliding one that went over. Is that the I think it was against Postra as well. Yeah. Yeah. I think Pastnok beat Orloff through the middle. I think Orlof was able to kind of um hit him just a little bit to to kind of uh uh interrupt his forward momentum, but he still got a pretty good shot. And yeah, there was the glove right there. So yeah, good to see that cuz again that’s that’s what you want is is him using his hands and um I remember there was a goal in October and I tweeted about it because I was like even I noticed and I’m not a goalie guy or goalie expert but I was like hey Oscar or Ascar was going down super early. It was like the guy skated into the zone and Ascro’s already in butterfly and then he just is waiting and waiting and waiting for the shot, isn’t moving backwards and gets beat up high. And it was like one of those clean goals. I don’t remember who it was, but this was in October and it was he was already down as soon as this guy like entered the zone and there was almost nobody else coming into the zone either. And it was like, why are you down so early? And then he got beat up high. And now, do you see do you observe like Kevin said that he’s taking that time to to to go down? It’s like he trusts himself now. Now he understands his own like he’s one of the more athletic, flexible goalies in the NHL and it’s like he’s finally started to trust that as opposed to trying to not believe at his own skills, which he has. Um, and I I I absolutely see it now. and also more that he’s standing up and using his hands. They seem to be more out in front of him as opposed to just kind of down and low. So, I’m just super excited about his his growth. It’s it’s really hard to maintain this, especially because of how athletic he is. I worry about that kind of thing. He’s young, though, so people have hips for a long time, but that’s always the the trouble with athletic goalies is you you can wear your hips out just from a you know, medical perspective. Um and he but you never know. Goalies are voodoo. They could play 20 years or 15 years and never have go right. Played a long time, right? A lot of guys. So it’s just um that’s what you always worry about is that’s what would ever really slow him down as injuries. It feels like or just you know but I think at this point we’ve we didn’t know in the first month if this was going to be the franchise goalie but it’s sure as hell looking like it. So, or like I think the the thought in October was, okay, this was going to be a slow build this season. That’s what it was looking like, right? Because that’s that that’s what I wrote. Um, even before he lost the opening night job to Nidelovic. Yeah. That not that worry about opening night. It’s more by the end of the season I want to see a scar off take the job and be good enough to show he’s good enough and show throughout the season that he’s good enough to play those 50 games like to be the de facto starter even if it’s there’s up and ups and downs and his save percentage you know is like in the 890s because we’re projecting sharks to be not very good. Um and obviously he has he has passed that uh you know he’s blown blown past that for sure and obviously there’s an add on that there’s going to be some downs too. So, he’s going to struggle some months. Is that just goalending in general? But, yep. That he’s been able to sustain this level of play for a good three almost four weeks now um is just it’s just very very very very impressive. And um yeah, I mean I I would say that just showing that he could do this for this long, even if he slides back a little bit, which he inevitably is going to do. Mhm. Um he’s ahead of of of what I I I hope for from this season. Yeah. For this season. Yeah. And my hope is that he becomes elite goalie. So it’s not that I’m down on him, you know. And speaking for ourselves, since we’re kind of going back on the Zel stopchuck trade and the Reeves trade, that’s something that, you know, we’ve always loved this as Scaroff trade because this is what your you were kind of gambling for that this was the upside that you can get from a guy of this talent and that’s exactly what you’re seeing right now that like you know this Sharks team is still not overall very good team but if you’re if if the Sharks were were were dumped into the playoffs right now in a seven game series, you feel pretty good because not you don’t I don’t know if you feel pretty good but you feel like you have a chance. Yeah, because you’ve got you’ve got a top 10 player in Mlin and you’ve got a scar off and uh I I’m going to I’m going to knock on wood cuz my it hasn’t come true yet, but my prediction that the Sharks will be a 500 team by the new year. It’s looking pretty good. Looking pretty good. Yeah. And it was and I remember and I look back at the the clip from this was last January when we did a mailbag and that was my big prediction. Um and I remember in that clip I mentioned Ascarov being coming into his own and celebrating. So it was this is what we got is celebrating and Ascarov like living up to the potential that they have. Super pumped. Well I would argue that they’ve been better than even we could have hoped for. Right. That’s that that’s what I’m saying because like I I thought Celebr would make a leap this year. We could talk about Mlin a little bit now because how can we talk Sharks and not talk it’s Mlin hour now guys. I thought he would make a leap this year but not into like you got to put him into team Canada territory. Like that’s that’s the kind of leap that I didn’t know. I didn’t think he would be that good this year. I thought that eventually he would be into team Canada like oh yeah he’s a must or team Canada territory. I I did believe all the hype that we heard before he got drafted. Yeah. After watching him uh last year, I believed all that hype about Crosby Taves, he he is all that, but to be doing this in his second year, I don’t know if I would have counted on that. So, yeah, and he’s still doing it. I do think that the last like couple of weeks, and that’s what I thought about actually. I thought this was funny, like I thought throughout this home stand. I think that he hasn’t been as quite as consistently good as he was on that road trip uh when they went to New York and he just was I mean he was good in I think all facets of the game. Puck management was better. Puck management is still something that I think he still has to deal with. Yep. But he still was Angel third of the week after a week that I thought was just like average for him for him for the the standard that he set on that road trip. Yeah. I was like yeah, you know, he wasn’t that good against Ottawa. No one I mean you know like everybody kind of like checked out after the first period there. Um but then yeah he he has seven points. He has a he had a hat-tick third start of a week and a and a and not not his best week. I would say and well that means you’re a good player. I guess you’re a great player not just a good player. I think he uh you’re right like there was a couple times he kind of like he kind of just gave the puck away and you’re like when he why’d you do that? But like it’s it doesn’t really matter when the the the the good outweighs that all the time and like as he goes on those times are going to become less and less. Yeah. Yeah. It’s got to hold on to the or keep possession more and you know good good and bad with that but it’s been and it fits ahead. I was going to say it kind of reminds me of when it’s not like it’s they’re not the same scenarios at all, but when Joe Thornton joined the Sharks and it was all of a sudden like, “Oh we have a superstar and he’s like carrying this team.” Um, it kind of feels like that. It’s not like everybody else isn’t playing good hockey. They are, but they they’re just kind of like Jonathan Gichu is now a 50 goal scorer because Joe Thornton’s there, right? Like Will Smith is now a great complimentary winger because Celabbrini is there. It’s like guys like Reeves and Goodro can fill their roles because Celibbrini is there. So, it’s like he’s kind of lifting everybody up and in in his own way. Yeah, it feels kind of like that from a fan perspective of the momentum we gained by the Joe Thornton trade. But we get it by celebrating. Yeah, I want to ask Dan this uh because I think a lot of fans I think were surprised when when when when Dan Bole kind of said that, yeah, maybe I haven’t really played with a superstar. And I’m sure fans were like you play with Joe Thornton. But I would say though that the Joe Thornton that played with Dan Bole was not the Joe Thornton that won the hard trophy. Yeah. You know, right a little bit older. Still a very very effective player. But I don’t know if that Joe Thornton was a uh when Dan Bole I got to ask Dan, we got to ask Dan this, but I don’t know if that Joe Thornton was a top five NHL player anymore or top 10. Maybe a top 20. Still a very really good player, but you know, I’m not sure. I’m not sure. I think back it was kind of the a lowerc scoring era in some ways at times when he played with Dan. So um but you’re right he wasn’t the superstar best player one of the best players in the league that he was for the first couple years in San Jose. Right. Right. I I just wonder about the the subtlety of that. But I think with um yeah, I actually wrote about this yesterday that I I think that it’s it’s both a good and bad thing. But and also this this actually reminds me of a of a great gift of of uh LeBron James and Russell Russ Westbrook in on on the Lakers, which was a uh if you’re a Lakers fan, that was a very very sad era. But there’s a great there’s a great gift great meme of of uh the Lakers coach and LeBron being hey we got to be greedy. We got to be greedy. We gota you know like talking about like we gota you know we got to keep rolling uh you know routing these guys right and Russell Russ’s like and we and we just got to like have fun win or lose just have fun and then just like the the LeBron just like looks at him. But anyway though, why why this is related with Mlin? I wrote this yesterday, is that Mlin is a very very greedy player. And I mean this in the best way possible, like he’s always trying to force that offense and put the other team on their heels and like he does this at a clip that like really there’s like only a couple of guys that for sure are better at him at it. Like Connor McDavid’s better at it than him. Nathan McKinnon is better. Kale Mar, a handful of guys. Very few people can can do this even at Mlin and 19, right? But it leads to some of these turnovers because Mlin tries plays that, you know, maybe 30% of the time they they they worked and oh my god, that’s amazing. Like the one the uh the Will Smith goal that was called off off the Smiths offside, right? That’s that’s just that’s just an amazing play by by by Mlin to try and worked except it didn’t work. But like anyway though, um I saw this in contrast to Weenberg and Weberg is like the opposite of a greedy player. Yeah. Yeah. Right. And that’s great too in its way. But Weenberg obviously his whole career people have told him you got to shoot more. You got to do this more. You are so talented. You got to do this more. And so it just kind of made me think that you know we talked about celebring about every day winning hockey. Mhm. And anyway that that it just I just kind of thought that yeah like Wenberg is a bit older so I don’t know if Wenberg can learn to be more more greedy at this point. I think Wenberg is just what who he is, right? Um you know Weenberg I think clearly actually has to me he has the talent to be a pretty good second line center but you know he’s he I think fits better as a third line because he’s not always as assertive as as you want him to be. I think to shoot the puck and things like that, but he’s always great 200 feet. He’s always responsible and all that kind of stuff. So, he’s he’s I think a excellent third line center. Mlin can learn a little bit of that. Sometimes you’ve got to just dump the puck out. Sometimes you just got to make that that safe play. It’s not always time to push like some incredible pass to Will Smith or whoever his linemate is. sometimes, you know, when the Sharks are are are behind like they’re being dominated in the period, some just just fire the puck on net, even if it’s not, you know, not likely to score, but just, you know, do things like that. Just like simple little things like that. And so I think though that’s something that I just thought was an interesting contrast watching uh the both of them last night and what again that I think that uh that that Mlin can still learn before he is like a true blue like going to win a Stalling Cup for the Sharks player. Yeah, it’s adding more pieces to the uh it’s like the Power Rangers when they like get their mega form, you know, like the I don’t know if that’s what it’s called. It’s been a while since I’ve seen Power Rangers, but All right. You ready for for for Keegan’s Prospect Corner? Are you ready? Uh, let’s see. Did we uh I think I think we got it. Anything else that uh anything else uh stand stand out for for you? Yeah. Uh no graph calling graph. Look at this colograph. Renie Han uh retweeting your your meme. I know. I’m honored. Um, and now I now I’ve had Jonathan Becker retweet me and Randy Hun retweet me. So, I’m the first one to do that, right? Uh, yeah, that was me. Okay. It’s been everywhere. But that was me. That’s why every time he scores a goal, JD tells me to post the thing. It’s just sometimes I’m not at my computer to find the image. But that was the original image that I posted. We got to put that up on We’ve been obviously you guys have seen we’ve been trying to pump up San Hawkinell Instagram. Thank you for following. We’ve had a had a good month and so yeah, we definitely got to start putting that one up there. Yeah. Put it up for the the insta masses. Look at this colog graph. Speaking of prospecting, uh a fan of the show sent in uh this audio clip uh which apparently is going to be the intro to Keegan’s Prospect Corner. Well, it’s up to you. It’s it’s your it’s your segment, but I’m doing it. Zubar and I thought that that it was great. So, thank you to Will Newman. Are you guys ready for Yeah. So, let’s let’s let’s drop it. All right, here we go. Keegan’s prospect corner. Keegan prospect corner. Keegan prospect corner. I Keegan, I love the Keegan part of that. That’s And also, I don’t know. I don’t know if they emulate or I don’t know if that’s from a movie or a show, but I did that last week though. Yeah, it’s out of like um I don’t know like like an old like Tekken video game like a fighting game where they’re like ready maybe fight and that’s what it’s out of like and then also there’s a random British guy in there. I don’t know if Will Newman is British. He might be just that the announcer is British. So, thank you Will. Thank you Will for sending that in. Um we uh we will keep it going as uh as long as people do not rally against it and form a a uh a boycott of Keegan’s prospect card. Like the char gold song. Yeah, like the shark’s gold song. This week um we’re going to take a look at one 2026 eligible defenseman and then uh exciting one. A very exciting one. And then Shakir Muka Madulan because I’m I I’m coping out because I watched a lot of Sharks this week and watched specifically Muka Madulan because he’s one of my uh I really like Muka Madulan. So um let’s start with Ver Verhoff so we can end with Muka Madulan. So Katon Verhoff is uh currently ranked uh number two by the consolidated ranking on elite prospects. So if you took all of the big rankings he’s um and consolidate them into one list he’s number two. He plays for the University of North Dakota in the NCAA and he has eight points in 12 games, four goals, four assists, playing very um big minutes uh most of the time, 18 to 20 minutes a night for for uh North Dakota. He is um going to be a top five pick. There is very little doubt in my mind at this point based off of his play so far and also his uh draft minus one play. He um is a 6’4 right-handed shot defenseman who’s only 17 already like 215 lbs. Already plays big, strong, physical with a great point shot. He is everything that a GM wants in a right-handed defenseman. Um the one that like GMs will trade or or cannot get through trade and like half the draft kind of thing. Um, I do Can I interrupt you with something? Yeah, go ahead. Let me Should I save this joke for another time? Yeah. Well, maybe. Uh, you know, I I already teased I already interrupted you, so I may as well tell the joke. So, uh, we have a a listener, Dylan, a loyal a loyal fan. Thank you so much for all the years of support, Dylan. And he actually sent me a great topic. I guess it’s a a big topic uh with on Sharks Reddit or something uh or some just about how the Sharks acquired that number one defenseman. Yes. And those are so hard to acquire as as you mentioned with Verhoff and you almost can only draft them that my only solution was that you got to get in time machine and rig the draft lottery to get Matthew Schaefer. Yep. So that’s kind of it. That’s my best answer because I don’t know if you’re getting Dalin and I don’t know if Adam Fox is still number one defenseman anymore. And anyway, go on though. I guess it wasn’t that good a joke. So Well, no, it’s like it’s true though. These are the guys that stick with a franchise for years and years and years and years. My comp for for Verhov has always been Alex Petrangelo. Um as a a guy that is big minutes on power play, penalty kill, and even strength and is, you know, he’s not I don’t think he’s going to be an 80 point defenseman. He’s not going to be Zach Florinsky or Quinn Hughes or Fox or whatever. I don’t think that that’s his his game. But even now at 17, he’s actively like just just killing plays in the corner so effectively and getting the puck back out and then getting to to his forwards that it’s it’s really fun to watch. He has a really good uh knack for either basically like getting to the puck first and if he doesn’t get to the puck, he’s tying up his man, putting him into the wall, battling, then getting the puck and then making the the next play. He never really gives up on a play defensively. and in the NCAA at 17 is amazing to do. Is he having a better season than Gavin McKenna in your opinion? I think he’s having a more h No, I don’t think so. Like Okay. McKenna has had ups and downs. I think um ah it’s tough because he’s he’s playing the exact way that you want to play to be a top pairing defenseman in the NHL. I think the ceiling on McKenna is just higher. So Yeah, but he is playing really well. So, I mean, expectationwise, I think you could say that he’s meeting or slightly exceeding his expectations in the NCAA, whereas McKenna is meeting or maybe a little under his expectations in the NCAA just based on their That’s what Yeah, the buzz, right? McKenna is like, h maybe he’s not going to be your number one pick. I I think he will still, but it’s um Burhoff is making case for it because he’s playing just super super well. Super sound. He has a great um he’s got good skill, too. He has great skill with the puck. He moves um super well with the puck on his stick. He often does just kind of um make the first simple play rather than trying to hold on to the puck and and finding the next play, but he um makes decisions at a very good speed, especially because he gets the puck and there’s somebody in his face almost immediately and he he knows where to go next. He doesn’t typically make mistakes that way. what he what he does make mistakes on is he is a little aggressive in pinching which you know that happens and normal. Yeah. Yeah. And the reads of guys kind of getting behind him are a little bit off but it’s going to happen. And then like I said earlier he’s got a great shot. He’s going to drive offense through his shot. He likes putting it on net. Um so I really uh I enjoy that player a lot. I think the Sharks honestly if they keep playing like this they don’t have a chance to get Fairhov without a without a lottery pick. But I got Scott Schaefer right from the from the 10 spot. So that’s very true. Without a lottery win though, I think um I think he’s a top five pick all day. Probably two or three, maybe one if he keeps on like if he takes another step and he’s um able to just start carving up defenses like carrying the puck. I think then you’ve got something very very special. right now he’s just you can tell that this he’s I think he’s going to play in the NHL next year, but if a team wanted to, they could put him in in college again just to give him even more of a role, like even um eat up every minute, play 28 minutes a night instead of just 20. But I think he could play in the NHL next year if you if you wanted him to. I think he still needs to work a little bit on his backwards skating. I noticed that like he doesn’t generate as much speed going backwards as he probably needs to. Um he power like the initial power of his steps needs to improve. He takes a ton of ton of steps to get up to speed, but he has good speed. It’s just like the power behind his stride is a little bit lacking so far. Um but you know, I really really like Veroff. I think the Sharks would be running to the podium if he’s there wherever they pick to get him that this is like kind of the guy that they need in their system for sure. Right. So, Right. Right. Right. The reason why I chose Muka McDullan is kind of like the um Can I uh Yeah, go ahead. interject one thing though. Um and we actually we should probably do a Keegan’s prospect corner about Dickinson. Yeah. But from what you seen about Dickinson though, like do you think he ends up as the Sharks? Just quick question like a number two then for the Sharks on a good Sharks team. Is that is that what we’re So we need that number one. You’re hoping for that number one in a Verhoff then I think so. Um okay it doesn’t have to be like I think that Dickson will be a I think he has the potential to be a top pairing defender. Um there’s just a lot that Dickinson does super well and there’s a lot of untapped potential there that um Okay. offensively that he hasn’t even really touched. Like he hasn’t even Well, at this level for sure in there’s it’s there cuz I’ve seen it at lower levels. Um but right now he just isn’t even like they’re getting there. There’s little bits that are they’re starting to come out of of Dickson’s offensive game, but right now he’s just trying to survive. So, but but you still feel the I feel comfortable that he’s going to be in the top four. I like I don’t know if he’s going to be the number one guy. Um or number even number two. Okay. Just curious your thoughts. Quick thoughts since we’re talking about Verhoff. But now we’re talking about another candidate for the Sharks top four, Shakir Mukuman. Yeah. And he’s always been the guy that like we’ve you and I both have held out a lot of hope for. Um he’s um he’s big. He can he can skate well. he has um when he’s on he has a really good ability to read the game and and read the ice um especially on breakouts like with the puck um and then I think what what I reason why I wanted to put these two prospects together is that Verhof when he will um battle for a puck if he doesn’t get the puck he then gets his man if he and he will tie him up and then find a way to at least stop play enough in the defensive zone until somebody else can pick it up. What I think Mukaan right now is struggling with a little bit in the NHL that I’ve seen is he’s either he’s getting into space. Like he’s getting into the right spaces, but he’s neither getting man nor puck. And he like on the goal last night where he’s seeing the puck go around the net. He sees his man behind him. And he knows and you can see it in his eyes like he recognizes that that puck might be going to his man, but he doesn’t get his man and the man beats through his check and then scores. Um, right. That was geeky, right? I think that was the geeky goal. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And he’s getting to the right space and he knows like he’s reading the play. It’s just he’s neither getting the puck nor the man and he’s kind of getting in this no man zone. There’s a goal against Vegas I think in his first game where the same thing happened where players coming down the boards. It’s coming towards the coming towards the net. There’s a guy in front of the net and the player’s coming at him and he neither gets the guy coming at him or the guy behind him and the guy cuts around and scores. And those are the kind of goals that whenever I see Mukaan getting scored on, that’s what’s happening is he’s he’s missing his opportunity to either get the man or the puck and he’s just kind of in space. That that breakaway goal, not breakaway, but that two-on-one I guess it was I don’t know if it was breakaway, but the goal where Clingberg didn’t get his stick off of the pad to clear it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, he’s had a couple of those which are kind of different. I mean, yeah, that’s but it’s different but similar cuz he’s in space, but then he does he doesn’t get the puck to or he doesn’t intercept the pass through him, nor does he get the guys that that go right by him. It was a really fast break. Really bad. I know. But the Perko goal was like that too where he let Pero get behind him, too. And these are like things that you have to either get the man or the puck and he’s getting neither. And that’s the problem. And and that’s that’s kind of unplayable to be honest like on a better team. Uh, and I love Mukuma Madulan style and I’m going to speak up a little more. I know it’s your corner, but Yeah. Yeah. Go ahead. No, I’m I’m not trying Mukuman. So, I’m laying the foundation of what I’ve seen and then telling you both bad and good things. So, I’m starting with you say about Vhoff because I’ve never seen him play beyond highlights. But, uh, but Mukumadulan though like those are unplayable things even if he does good things like the rest of the game. And those are things that that’s why um, and like I said, I like Mukmoodan. I think everybody knows this from where I rank him, how I’ve always talked about them, but it shocks me that people will say like, “Oh, this is the Shark’s best defenseman. They’re sitting him.” No, he’s not. No, he’s not even close. I think the problem is is sometimes he can be. That’s Well, he No, he he has talent for sure. That but just, you know, like he’s it’s got to be at a point where like you see enough of that talent and he doesn’t kill you. He doesn’t give up like breakaways. Yeah, I know. And if you can figure that out, then you’re playable because of course you’re not you’re a defenseman, right? And you’re playing 20 minutes a night against the best players in the world. You’re not going to be perfect. You’re going to make mistakes. Absolutely. Right. Demetri Orof makes a lot of mistakes. Uh Mario Farrell, obviously, he makes a lot of mistakes, but it’s the type of mistakes that that make it hard. Yeah. They don’t usually give up those like like what in the world was that kind of mistake. Sometimes they do, but they recover and or or or the next shift. They don’t let it affect their next shift. Yeah. Which I don’t haven’t seen yet with Mukuman, right? That ability and he’s young obviously and it’s um I think Ryan Warski said it. I think I think that’s it is a good way to look at it that Waras keeps saying that in his opinion defenseman, young defenseman don’t really establish themselves until like 200 games, 200 NHL games. Like you don’t really know who they are. And Mugo Doland obviously isn’t close to that, right? He’s at like not quite 50 yet, I think overall. I think something like that, right? 30 last year, a couple games before that. Yeah, probably around 50 something. Yeah, maybe maybe he’s past 50 at this point, but he’s been obviously been scratched a lot this year, too. But um so it hasn’t quite come together yet, though. And I I think that based on last year and what he was doing at the end of the year with me Ferraro that you were kind of hoping it would but we had to recognize that was kind of extenduating circumstances. Literally the Sharks had nobody else they could play defensively. Almost nobody else like I Yeah. So I didn’t know the guys line up last year. What I that’s the thing is I’ve watched a lot of Mukadullan and I’m and this is why I give you the the honest opinion on Keegan’s Prospect Corner. I don’t love the what I’ve prospects corner corner I I don’t love all of the things that I’ve seen from Muka Madullan but I will say the things that I have seen in the past from him that I really like and I think he when he’s more aggressive on on cutting off the angle and guys are coming up the ice I think he’s a better player when he uses his speed and his length to really force guys to the corner. Um he’s a better player. I think he’s right now just kind of playing in this I don’t even want to call it safe. He’s just kind of afraid to get out of position and um and then also trying to balance that out with trying to provide some offense, which he is a two-way defenseman. He’s not going to be a shutdown guy. He’s not going to be an offensive guy. He’s he’s there to provide um breakouts. He’s there to provide some some offensive play on the cycle. Um so if he’s like long tall Nick Ley in his prime, then you’re super thrilled that that’s what he ends up being. but he plays his best and c certain times last year and even certain times um when he’s played and then he got scratched and then injured and so there’s always been issues with his injuries as well where he’ll he’ll be injured and then he won’t play and then he gets rusty and then he doesn’t look good when he comes back and then he needs some time to really get up to speed again. So that’s possible that’s what’s happening right now. Um Worski did say he had a good game yesterday which I think he had he had a goal that was good. He had some good plays. I do think that that that defensive the goal against uh it’s not entirely his fault, but it it was one an example of why it’s tough to put him higher in the lineup when that’s the kind of goal he does give up. Um I was kind of surprised that he was back in the lineup after that that two on zero got and it wasn’t all on him obviously. Um when Kurishv and Smith and Celbrini they change early that really exposes like if you just think of it you know like Klingber talked about this too uh like 113 that suddenly you’re missing like yeah these the forwards aren’t there anymore to help you defensively. So that’s how the the the I forwards aren’t there to help you anymore. So the opposition forwards can get behind you more easily. Right. I was I was shocked that he was scratched and not or Clingberg was scratched and not Muga Madullan. Like I thought I thought it was I thought like the gap is like it you see it on you know the highlight is oh Clinker couldn’t clear the net. Um but player play part of it was Clinger’s fault as well at the at the blue line there but getting blown by two guys right there as well. So yeah doesn’t stop the puck two guys get behind him. I mean that’s just so I was surprised that he get and I’m happy because I want him to keep playing because I think when he gets to a level where he’s comfortable I think there is a good defenseman there and a good playable defenseman. It’s just like um so I’m hopeful that Worski sees that as well and I think he does that uh he he needs to get reps or else that defenseman doesn’t really come out cuz he gets rusty. He doesn’t have the confidence again. And I’m hopeful that this goal like kind of sparks that too because last year he had some really good play when he was up with the Sharks. And there’s something there that can make him a top four defenseman. It’s just now we’re in the in the range of does he get into the top four or is he in your bottom pairing guy? Um that’s just kind of you know like you’re Timothy Lagrin but a little taller like kind of thing. Um but I the talent is clearly there though, right? We agree on that. But yeah, I think a lot of it’s the mental part. I know there’s a lot of discussion of like is all these are the all these scratches like messing with his confidence. So then you put that on the coaching staff a bit, right? But in their coaching staff’s defense, they’re trying to balance eight nine defenseman. And that is Yeah. win hockey games, too. And that’s that’s a Mike that is that is more on Mike Reer. Uh and of course, you know, you can’t get that mad at Mike either because he’s just trying to add talent to the team. like he he likes him inside. Okay. So, you got you got to carry him for a while. Um but but it does make it harder though or it makes it easier to sit guys because like you said uh you’re trying to win games too. And so if you you do get less rope and you get less rope than yeah than a Clingberg and a Ley because again look at those guys look at their hockey DBs look at their hockey references right like there’s a reason why you give those guys a little more rope because if they figure out they help your team more than a young guy who is still trying to find his way but you don’t want to forget the young guy too which I think I think Waras has done a reasonable job of that they you know Dickinson Mukuman they’ve played plenty of games this year too. And I think that the thing that that is encouraging with Dickinson is there was some those big gaffs and there was that one the other day where that like exchange gaff that he had with somebody right with Kerishv. Yeah. Yeah. Calgary. Yeah. So that still happens but he’s improved a lot. Um just steadying his play defensively for sure. Um so you like that rise in in Dickinson’s play and Mukaan you’re kind of there’s been ups and downs. Um I I do think there are times when Muka Medulan looks like a top four defenseman and then there are times when he looks like you said not not playable at at the current time. So Warski has said this about Dickinson and you always wonder how true it is because coaches always say this about players if you ask them publicly but he did make a point of saying with Dickinson that Dickinson has that kind of personality to bounce back from mistakes which I think you really need on defense and especially playing defense for the Sharks. Y and I’m not as convinced that Mukuman has that. Maybe he does. Um, you know, we talked about before, right? Uh, like like Nikolai Oh and how I was told that he just Ho just had trouble with that that that part of it, right? Oh, I remember a pretty fun player. He liked to hit people and you know he had he had a he had a good personality but uh I mean on the ice too not just off the ice but like he had a kind of like style of play that lends itself to like yeah this this guy’s going to be a fan favorite and whatnot level but I was also told that yeah just he had trouble with uh kind of getting over his mistakes and Madillan will will really have to do that and um but granted though we’re just 50 games into this and so it might just be a slower burn. He’s been a very slow burn with Mukumadulan over the years. Obviously, he’s a he was actually drafted in a scar draft, I think, right? Wasn’t he? Um but maybe maybe that’s it’s still just a slow a slow burn and he and you hope it it just kind of comes together. Um when he’s at his best, he’s got he’s got something that is is hard to have, which is length, speed, ability to transition the puck. um hard to get in in the NHL. So, yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. I have a lot of hope for him. Um I think they they do as well. They they’ve also said we think the world of him. I think that was a reason. They’re trying to pump him up for sure. Um and he’s not been awful. It’s just there’s some mistakes that you’re like, “God, that was on you, Muk.” Like, and I think it’s a combination of of things. And the slow start did not help him. Like again, the injury, the scratchings, all that. So, yeah. Yeah, I mean he got after the first game and I know there’s a lot of debate about that. I think there’s argument for scratching him but then he was about to get back in the lineup I think and he got hurt. He got hurt. Yeah. Like two two games later. Yeah. So, but they won so hopefully and he scored so I don’t think he’s sitting next game. Hopefully. Well, he had a better game overall because like that uh losing geeky is I think a little more excusable than a twoon zero. Yes, it is 100% is that’s not what I’m trying to say. I’m trying to say like the like not that they’re equal. um equal gaffs just to notice the the types of play that he’s or mistakes that he’s making. It’s often times that um it’s that thing he doesn’t really get to or he knows where the play is going but he’s neither got his guy or the Well, I know it’s like a overthinking kind of thing, right? He’s just he’s kind of doesn’t want to make a mistake, but that kind of puts him a half step behind because he’s overthinking where he should be instead of maybe playing more instinctually, which I know I’m just sounds like a just a bunch of mumbo jumbo coming from. Yeah, I know Demar really likes him cuz he mentioned him on the podcast when he was on here. And we should get Boil’s opinion on on his play if we can get Bole to to glue down on him and and take some take a look. So, see what he sees as a young D. Um cuz like you said, it’s tough when you’re you make that mistake and you’re losing confidence and and everything. But hopefully that goal helps. Maybe maybe that’s all it’ll take, right? Yeah. Sometimes it’s just having that like number. Yeah. You know, that zero turns to a one and like you feel like you’re helping the team out, you know, and like And I think he had a bunch of blocks too and he got one off the he got one off the visor as well, I remember. Um so he had a good game. I don’t think he had a bad game at all. Yeah. Yeah. He overall he had a good game. Yeah. Mhm. Uh this has been kind of a depressing Keegan’s prospect corner, but we’re not going to get the guy I talked about and Muka Madillan is struggling at points. Oh man. But you know, we keeping it real here on the Keegan’s prospect corner. So I mean, yeah, maybe Mukadillan just needs maybe they’re going to give him that. And I know some fans will argue for this that just give him 10 games. Just let him, you know, let him let him work it out, make mistakes. Um maybe that’s more justifiable when you have less defenseman, you know, like you do have to let go of one of these nine defensemen. Yeah. Um so I don’t know, but or you got to hope you don’t hope for injury, but you got to yeah have an injury come up that that will alleviate this too somehow. But Mukadullan is also in is a uh one-year $1 million contract is going to become an RFA uh at the end of the season. So, he’s in an interesting spot where u if he had played super super well, the Sharks are like looking at a long-term contract for him, right? But now they’re probably looking at another short term or who knows. So, I mean, honestly, you don’t mean at this point like um his he is getting to a point where he’s about to not be a prospect anymore. So, he’s a guy like like Henry Thun, right? Yeah. And so I’m not saying they’re the exact same player, but it again, you know, one I I talked a lot about to Wasi about this. I have a story coming out about this about I I was talking with with Wasi a lot about sitting Moan and confidence and um you know this is also inspired by our chats with with with Boiler about just like and Dan would talk about just how he didn’t have confidence in Florida. He just needed kind of to to to have a coach really believe in him and let him kind of do his thing and trust him to do his thing and uh you know that eight out of 10 thing that uh that that that Dan loves to talk about you know you know do something bold eight out of 10 times it’s good enough. Um I actually asked S Dickson about that that exact number. But anyway though um one of the things that Morski did say about Mug Madulan though which is it’s the truth of it though is that um at least what I gathered from it was okay yeah his confidence is a little down but you can’t just play him just to play him. Yeah. Like you’ve got to when you’re in there you’ve got to produce. This is the NHL and Mukulan is 23, not 19 like Sam Dickinson. Yeah. You know, Sam Dickson use that kind of that that shield or that shelter, right? Michael Misa, right? These guys were teenagers. You can use that that that shelter, but Madulan is um yeah, he’s he he’s again he’s he’s going to pass the he for a lot of people, he already has passed that that prospect whatever line just because number of games and what the year he was drafted, right? And we need to see I mean with like right uh goalie goalies obviously take longer but we talk about him being dropped in years of scar off right and we just saw this last month of scar off that this is what he can do. Mhm. And so if you can take out a few more of Escar’s crappy games, have a little more of a of a of a of a of an average game in there, then you’ve got a Vzna caliber goalie with, you know, this ceiling, right? Um with Muku Doulan, we need to see something like that where um on a deeper team, he takes minutes from people. Yeah. Like last year, he was he was pretty good last year, but this was and we we did talk we did give these caveats last year. He was on a really bad team by the end of the year. Yeah. I I I don’t remember. I got to look at those lineups, but they it was a lot of guys. He was a bright spot on a very poor defense for sure. Yeah. Like there were just not a lot of playable elements. I got I got to check before we we finish the segment. Yeah. Because I I don’t think I I I’m I’m uh misremembering this. No, we always should have a caveat of I don’t know, we’ll call it like March hockey, something like that. Some something where like everybody, not everybody, but there are lots of players who look good in March and April. We talk about end of season hockey, right? That’s what they always call it. Yeah. End of season hockey. They look good on the Sharks when everybody straighted away and they have minutes to play and there’s nothing to play for. The problem is right now the Sharks have a lot of play for it and there’s not a lot of minutes to go around. Yeah, that’s a good way to good way to put it. Uh but I I’m just curious. I’m going to look back at some of the defenses they were running at the end of the last year. But yeah. Um All right. So, yeah. So, okay. here is one with um Luca Canon who as much as we love Luca, he is not a show ready yet. Yeah. Lucas Carlson who is you know a tweener guy, ah guy. Uh Lagrin who is up and down last year, right? Um Dear, who hadn’t really figured out or defined his role yet. That’s that’s one of uh the last lineups before he got hurt. Uh Jimmy Schultz was was was was in some of these lineups. uh great AHL defenseman but obviously has you know does hasn’t made AHL Mark Mark Edward Vic was in a lot of these lineups at the end of the season I’m looking at Y uh Vic Loigrin uh Jimmy Schul anyway so I’m not trying to I’m not trying to crap on guys but like this this is even though Lety Klingberg aren’t who they were like they’re close enough to to to what they were that they’re ahead of the guys I’m talking about here. So, so along with having Orof on the team and, you know, DRA finding a role and having wanting to to work Dickinson, obviously Henry Thun is in these lineups, too, at the end of season two. So, anyway, so yeah, I I’m hopeful just cuz Mukadullan, like you said, it’s only been 50 games. Like, even if he’s 23, there’s been such a leadup that he still needs time to adjust at this this level. um if he can and uh so I’m still hopeful for sure um that he’s going to figure it all out and and kind of make his way into a Sharks top six of the future. Just Yeah, I I hope so too. I still hope he can make in the top four. The talent’s obviously there, but I think we have to be real though that like he is coming at a point where like you start to think, hey, if we can get something for him and like Henry Thun, you just kind of predict, hey, this guy’s not if you can like move plus picks for a better defenseman. Maybe you do. Maybe there’s something there. But it had to be a veteran guy probably in that in that sense. Maybe a guy that’s in there. But I mean by I I mean like if you if you move to first in Muga Madulan, you might be able to get an actual top four defenseman. I think from a team that’s trying to sell a top four defenseman. Well, that that’s but it’s likely going to be an older player, which is fine. But yeah, I’m just saying that’s that’s usually like the trade-off, right? Like the team trading the the the veteran defenseman or the top four, it’s the established defenseman, they get a younger guy with some promise and they get a a draft pick, right? So that’s the uh I’m hopeful that he is part of the future for the Sharks, but that’s also a a possibility too that that Mike Greer could explore as well. Well, yeah, that’s what you’re saying though. Ultimately, I think we are talking about that question that it is now it’s on the horizon like it was for Guushian last year, like it was for Thr and like a lot of Sharks prospects that we’ve seen that like at a certain point uh that’s what Warasu was kind of saying like look at a certain point you’ve got to put up or shut up. He didn’t use those words, but like we are getting to that point to bring up Zudair’s Zubar’s uh pluses and dashes. He does lead the Sharks D and pluses. So, good for that. I’m Zubar’s going to watch this and go, why is he taking on me this whole podcast? I’m not super. I’m just bring it up because I do think there’s good things. Again, he’s got five points in 11 games. Like the stats wise look good. There’s just under underneath hood there’s a couple things that there’s reasons why um there’s to be cautious my there’s reasons why Oralof plays every night and Ferrar plays every night and so everybody else does it under the hood here at Keegan’s prospect corner I’m super excited about this this jingle and if anybody else wants to send another jingle we’ll just play I won’t even do a a corner I’ll just play jingles the whole time so make jingles also that’s the name of the guinea pig that’s in this room his name is Jingles Penny Anybody? Is it really? Oh, perfect. Okay. Okay. If anybody again wants a guinea pig in the uh Providence area, um you can contact me cuz he’s up for adoption. We’re just fostering him until he gets home. Oh, you want to show him to us or is it going to bother him? Yeah, we’ll close out with Really sweet. Really sweet. Yeah, Mushu is a rescue. I’m all about rescues. Keegan prospects corner. Keegan’s prospects corner. Keegan skinny pig corner. Keegan guinea pig corner. Keegan skinny pig corner or Keegan’s pet adoption corner. Yeah, I like that better. It’s okay. Ah, how old is Jingles? Jingles is I think six, five and a half, six. He’s had a couple medical problems. That’s why Anna is fostering him. But he’s doing well from his medical issues. He’s gained a lot of weight. He’s going to be like at a senior adoption. So, Um, if anybody wants a senior guinea pig, he’s very sweet. Um, yeah, that’s all I got for for Jingles. He wants food right now cuz he’s he’s squirming. He wants food. Keegan uh Keegan will will sing Keegan’s Prospect’s Corner to you if if you if you meet him uh to adopt Jingles. There you go. I’m going to get like five emails. Uh maybe not. Maybe none of you live in the East Coast. He’ll do a song song and dance. Well, you’re close. You’re like 2 hours away from Boston, so it’s conceivable for someone to come and uh come and come and adopt him. Anna’s going to be happy that I I plugged Jingles cuz she wanted me to show Jingles on the podcast. Yeah, of course. All right, y’all. We’ve been talking for two hours like we always do. Okay, so uh Marco Sturm is about So stay tuned. Yep. Marco Sturm is about to come on. Uh Zubar and I had a great interview with him earlier this week. We did talk with Marco before the game yesterday, the Sharks Bruins game. We talked to him on Thursday, actually. And really interesting conversation. Really, not that much about the Bruins or the Sharks, but just about coaching and that adjustment from being an AHL coach to an AHL coach and when you scratch a player, you know, his his kind of his view on sort of Yeah. when when you send that message to a player. Uh, Marco did that actually very couple interesting times this season in ways that would be very upsetting to Sharks fans I think. But Marco scratched Mason Lorai for five games. He scratched Casey Middlestat for for a while there too. And just what do you hope to get out of a player when you sit him and so things like that. So just kind of just general coaching topics that you usually don’t get to sit down and talk to a coach about. So anyway, stay tuned for Marco and thanks for listening guys. I think it was thought it was very cool just in season for him to come and and join us um or join you in Zubar. Um so super cool Marco. Hope to have him on again. Yeah, friend of the show. So thanks again, Marco. All right, y’all. Hope you have a good week. Bye. Marco Sturm is the new head coach of the Boston Bruins. But before that, he was a San Jose Sharks fan favorite forward, a 1996 first round pick who played eight years in teal before he was traded to the Bruins in the blockbuster Joe Thornton trade. Marco also guided team Germany to a silver medal in the 2018 Winter Olympics. And he was right there for the San Jose Sharks head coach job last summer that Ryan Morsovski got. Welcome, Marco. Hey, how you doing? Nice nice having you. I was also one of those fans that you were my favorite, Marco. So, I just got to tell you that I love watching you as a kid and you always you were wicked fast and I will always hold you accountable for the 200 I believe four playoffs where we lost to Calgary cuz your injury. Yeah. So, I’m just telling you now, I’ll always be mad at you for that. Marco told us the last time that if the Sharks had made the final that he he thinks he might have been able to play. Yeah, I I I pushed really hard and I remember that the guys were playing in Calgary. I traveled. I I was pushing myself really hard in practice, but I know I I know I remember listening to that podcast. I’m I’m sure rehabbing and recovery is like a whole another thing of hockey that is not discussed enough, but I remember I was really young at that time and I remember looking I was like, if we had Marco, we would have would have been able to beat that kippers off. Yep. Yep. That was a fun fun ride though, even for me even to watch. Uh I know it kind of stinks a little bit uh being hurt, but it was a it was a it was a fun was a fun Yeah, it was a fun ride. That’s for sure. That was a good team. They had a lot of grit and that was with you know that was that was a fun team to watch. And also um the time I was there in in San Jose, we we we not just on the ice, but off the ice, too. We had really good guys. We had really good uh not just hockey players, but human beings. Uh a lot of good characters. We always had that tight tight tight group. Um I I think that made it even more special. Um, now looking back and I think and I think that the Sharks organization and and also including the fans, I think I still felt like it was like a family to me. Um, you know, started in the room and outside of it. So that’s why me looking back it’s it’s it’s always special. And actually, I just thought of something, Marco, that I wanted to tell you. I spoke with Dean Lombardi uh about a month ago and he actually said that one of his favorite team maybe his favorite team was actually the 2000 2002 Sharks team that almost beat the Avalanche in the playoffs. Okay. And he just said like the the the culture the on that team the family aspect of it and you know Dean was really all about culture and family was really off the charts on that team. I mean, that was a test that he he mentioned. He was like that was kind of a test of how far could that family and culture go and in the playoffs. And obviously, you guys weren’t as talented as the Avalanche. That’s what Dean said. Dean said Avalanche had seven Hall of Famers on that team, but you guys were right there. And he that’s Anyway, I just wanted to pass that compliment on to you. Um that I Yeah, because you were you were a big part of that 2002 team. Yeah. Yeah. And we felt it. And again, the Ad Dean started the whole process and he did it in San Jose. He did it in LA. He won the cup in LA because of it. He kind of stuck with it. And it I played for a short time in LA, too. And soon as I walked in that room, that remind me of the San Jose. Uh, now he did it in LA. The character again, it always goes back and he added those pieces um along the way. Probably more in LA than San Jose, but um but yeah, that that he was He was our leader, that’s for sure. No, I love it. Uh, so you know, I the question the first question I have for you, Marco, is um it’s a two-parter kind of based on what we’re talking about, which is number one, have you seen Ted Lasso? Yep. All right. So, okay. So, I love Ted Lasso and uh question about Lasso, but then two, the same thing we’re talking about in terms of developing culture and as a coach now, you’re in a position to foster that culture with the Bruins. Um, so you know, number one, do you like Ted Lassos? Is there anything from there that you that you enjoyed from the show? I mean, know it’s all it’s obviously dramatized and all that, but in terms of coaching style, and then B, how are you fostering that culture with the Bruins? Yeah. No, it’s it’s funny. Yes, I do like the show. I I like Ted Lasso. Can you be um exactly like Ted Lasso? I don’t think so. But but having said there, there’s always this is the nice part about that movie or that show. Um there’s something to it though. There’s something and I even you know I I knowing some uh uh psychologists we were working with the teams not just the broomst even in LA like that also always that name always comes up really they actually everyone look at it and there’s certain things there is something to it and uh uh he took it to extreme he can’t do that but there’s uh yeah no this is this is the new way of coaching too a little bit right it’s not only just the hard way and this or this. No, you got to I always say you got to find uh you got to a and meet in the middle and uh and there’s certain ways um you have to do things now. It’s not just the X and O’s as a coach now. It’s it’s more the tat losser too, right? The the the way you handle how do you communicate, how you connect with players, how how do you get the most out of them? And I think that’s something I was very fortunate uh because I as a player I was involved the Daryl Sutter and remember in in in San Jose and the Clo Julian in Boston a little bit but then on end of my career you know I had the younger generation. So I kind of up both of them and that actually that actually helped me a little bit too and being in the minors working with the young kids that helped me even more. So, um, so I was very fortunate. Yeah. And I, that’s actually a big part of what we’re going to talk about, just coaching philosophy and things like that. But just to let everybody know who’s listening, we’re recording this on Thursday. This is 3 days before the Bruins come into San Jose to take on the Sharks, just so everybody knows. And a little bit about how what Marco is doing in Boston right now. Uh, Bruins are second place in our division. So, off to a pretty decent start, but obviously had just been hit by injury with Charlie Makavoy. And it’s been an interesting season for them. They had a I think a six-game losing streak, but also a sevengame winning streak. So anyway, just a broad view, Marco. Interesting start for you guys, right, this year. Yeah, it is. But we also, you know, it’s a it’s it’s a new coach. Uh it’s a new I’m not saying new system. We tweaked a lot of things, a lot of new players. So, uh we wanted to go back to to the Bruins culture, right? I think that’s that was one of why that got me uh because I I was part of it and I think it just takes time a little bit sometimes and that’s why you have to go through phases like that and it’s just the start of it. We only have 20 games in and unfortunately unfortunately um the way the schedule is this year because of Olympics, we don’t even have time to practice. So it makes it even harder for uh you know especially a guy like me or um or team like us. Um so we have to find different ways how to how to teach those kids and and players. So, uh, that’s I think that’s been the challenging part and that’s why I think you you will see those kind of on on and off, um, you know, games, not just with us, I think in general in the league. Yeah. So, and you talk about the the Boston culture and coming in there. I I know that you’ve talked before about, you know, Bergie and Z like being there and being with them in in sort of their leadership style and passing that torch on is something that you can kind of feel in the locker room. Could you talk to that a little bit, Marco, and your experience with them? It’s a good question because uh uh you know, when I when I got hired, I I heard from different directions that it kind of got lost a little bit and I want to get it back. Okay. Uh, but when I talked to few, I talked to all of them. As soon as I got I got hired, I talked to all the players and I could feel it. I could feel it already. It’s still in there. And and I was right, you know, now talking to some of the guys, it it’s still in there. Maybe not as strong, but the feel the culture is still in there. So now now, you know, it’s not to up to a few players. It’s it’s it’s it’s a commitment uh from from all of us and including me. So, I I think that’s something we just have to do it as a group group and especially with me as a as a leader. What was the uh Sharks culture when you were there with Dean Lombardi and Doug Wilson came on later? And then also, what was the Bruins culture that you’re talking about getting back? So, are they the same? Are they any little differences between them? Yeah, it was a little different. I was uh like I said it was um I remember San Jose we totally started from scratch like uh it was just a total rebuild. So there was a lots of new players. Uh we have to had to create our own culture a little bit there. Uh right from the from the bottom. So it took years to get there. Um and then I think we slowly got there and then unfortunately it got traded but they they they kept it going. All right. Uh I I think in in Boston it was you could tell it’s the original six. It’s it was more um more black and white, right? It’s very very strict, very straightforward. Uh there was no gray. Uh you do it harder than not. So that was a little bit the difference. Uh I think uh Boston it’s been because of original six. I think there was the mentality was a little bit different. Uh just like the heart knows everything had to be hard. uh instead of you know find them a little bit in San Jose. And then so let’s go to one of your players in particular uh Charlie Makavoy. Um fantastic player. I mean I’m a big fan. I was just having this discussion with a buddy last night. I think he’s you know one of the top defenseman in the league. Um and he plays the game in a great way. I I in the four nations I think the world saw really what Charlie Makavoy was. And I love watching those clips of him in the locker room after the injury when he reads the lineup, too. And so, you know, you want to just talk through that injury and and what Charlie Makavoy means to you on the on the Bruins and and you’re absolutely right. They they that lineup read that hit me too. And I didn’t know this this guy um teaches from playing against I never met him, but I always liked him, but when I saw that I’m like he’s the real deal because that shows me he’s all into it. And that’s exactly how he is. He’s uh he’s almost you have to calm him down a little bit because so so he he wants to win so badly. He wants to do everything in his power. uh you know on the ice sometimes that’s why he gets in trouble because he wants it too bad too badly right so so you kind of have to bring him down but he’s a good uh no he’s a winner I think he’s a champion I think he he one of those guys you need on your team uh because he brings brings everything every night and uh and it was really um I found this season uh because he was hurt last year um and he really found his game um before he got hurt and that was that was the tough part um you know um so it’s it’s it’s very unfortunate but hopefully he’s going to be back soon because we miss him and not just on the ice off the ice he’s just you know he’s not a loud leader but he’s you know he he does it his way and that’s that’s that’s what I like about him. Well, the good news there is from Emily Kaplan. She reported today that the hope is that Charlie is going to be there for the Olympics for Team USA. Doesn’t help you guys yet, but at least it’s not uh as longterm as it could be for an injury. But I wanted to ask you, Marco, uh like Sharks head coach Ryan Morski, you were a very successful AHL head coach before you got the Bruins top job. So, what’s been the biggest adjustment for you being the head coach for NHL players as opposed to AHL’s? Yeah. No, I mean, um, it’s not like a huge huge jump, but I I think if there’s one thing I I have to say, it’s just, you know, that the scheduling, especially this year, it’s uh there’s no breaks. You’re on uh you’re on the gas pedal all the time. uh you know facing different team uh teams all the time, not just you know eight eight or nine teams. Now you got really different from from a lot of speed to grinders to the long game, the short game, whatever it is. Um the the different style of teams you face every other night. I I think that that that’s something I think that’s a big change for me. Um and uh you know you always try to adapt few things on on your on your side of your team and and also you got to do the pre-scale from the other team and you got to tweak things. So so that that I’m not saying it’s a challenging challenging part but it’s also fun part uh to do that but it’s uh yeah but it’s uh it’s a lot. So there’s no no days off that’s for sure. You mentioned earlier this season when the Bruins were struggling that maybe some of the guys weren’t on the on the bus yet. That was the phrase I think you used with what you want. And again, you know, generally speaking or using specifics, how do you get guys on the bus? And once again, you know, is that different in the AHL or AHL level trying to get guys on the same page? Yeah, not really. But it’s it’s there’s a reason why players play in the NHL because they’re better and they’re so smarter. Uh there’s they get it. They get it right away. The thing I have to say when I say it on the bus is uh uh it’s not always the player’s fault. Yes, it is, but it isn’t. So just for example, the the Bruins since I played uh that’s a feels like a 100 years ago. Uh when I played in Boston, there was still the same system, right? Never changed anything. So now I tweaked a few things. I didn’t change the whole thing. It just tweaks a few things and that showed me they never done this before. Never. And the the the new guys who came in, they had a uh it was easier for them. But it actually been there forever. Those were the guys who got caught in between a lot and that’s why it goes back to, you know, the losing streak a little bit. Uh they they were just unsure. We’re still unsure. We’re still not there yet. Yeah. But it’s getting better. But it’s just again I needed the buy in from those players and they have to believe that and all of a sudden when you started winning they’re like oh okay yeah it actually works right. you need uh you need uh you need those winning streaks too that so the players believe in that uh they can see this this actually work and and that’s what happened all of a sudden boom uh you know we got lucky too obviously but it it it works and uh so that’s the challenge you have and also the the way you present it uh I think as a coach in meetings that’s just got to be the right way. What are a couple of those new things that you you may have done that were not as familiar? Yeah. No, it’s probably probably more in a D zone and uh in the neutral zone and that’s it. Uh you know the other ones too um again it’s sometimes you know different areas of the game. Sometimes it’s uh it’s the same but I use a different language for certain things. And then for these guys oh what does that mean again? Yeah. No, it’s the same thing. It just use a different word. That’s it. Uh but it it’s a lot again when you don’t practice this uh when you go don’t go over this a lot. You play a lot of games. It it just it makes it harder a little bit for for coaches uh in general in the league. So uh but I’m also glad I got hired this summer and not next summer, but next summer it’s going to be shorter. So it’s going to be harder for a new coach to come in. So uh it’s a never- ending story. So, Marco, when you were with the Ontario Rain, uh it was mostly a 131 you guys were playing down there, right? Um and the Kings system, is is that something that you helped implement or was that did you sort of inherit the 131? And is there any of that that you are bringing into the current structure of the Bruins? Yeah. No. Um uh uh so to answer your question uh Todd got hired and I was one of the assistant and we started the 131 and at that time where we at where we you know as our organization and as a team where we at um I think that was the definitely the right thing to do build up to build up that rebuild we had to build up that uh that defensive structure including the 131. really helped us the way or where the kings at right now. Um I think when you when you getting better players, you know, getting more speed, more talent, more skill, not sure if the 131 is the right thing, right? But to to start with, I think it was the right thing to do. Um where are we with the Boston Bruins? I don’t think we’re that level where we started with LA. Um you know, it’s not a total regroup. uh uh uh retool. It’s, you know, it’s a transition we made. So, I don’t think I don’t think uh I’m going to use the 131 gear and we never really did. So, uh but that was the whole process. Uh you know, in LA. Um and look at it now. Now, they’re in a you know, they’re in almost like a one two. They got away too. Uh because they got better players basically. Yeah. Yeah. No, it makes complete sense. Um, speaking of that that buyin with uh with veterans, um, I just I wonder if it’s like this, uh, because I I was a teacher a long time ago and anytime you walk into a classroom, there’s like there’s five five people there’s let’s say you have 20 students. You have five students who are like they hang on your every word. They’re like your your teacher’s pets. You have five people that don’t like you from the from the second you walk in or they don’t agree with you at least. And there’s 10 people in between. And so you’ve got to get first those 10 people in between to be on your side and then of course the the people that may be uh biased against you to get them on on your side too. Is that a little bit like that as a coach? Yeah. No, that’s uh actually I got to remember that. Uh you’re right. You’re right. That’s exactly what it is. And that’s how you pretty much as a new teacher and new coach because I’m a teacher too, right? in my way. I go in and I I have the same problem or issue or whatever or the same thing. So now it’s my job to bring everyone on the same page. And you’re right. And uh so that’s again going back to uh coaching this new generation. I would say this this is the challenge you’re facing right now. And uh it’s not about X and O. So that’s how you do it. how bring those other 10 uh how you bring them over to this side um so you bring more on that bus right you want to add those those guys and that’s I think that’s the quality now coaches has to have they they have to have that it’s how you communicate um you know how you treat players how you whatever uh I think that that became a big big part And I want to ask you about uh you were actually uh doing something similar with a young defenseman uh Mason Lorai, 25 years old. Uh the Sharks has someone similar who’s younger in Shakir Mukum who’s 23 who they hope will be as good as Lorai, but u what I want to ask you about Lorai is you scratched him for five games this season and you also did the same with Casey Middlestad too. And so what do you hope a talented player like those two like Lai and Middlestat, what do you hope they gain from being sat like that? It’s obviously not a talent issue. They’re definitely good enough to play in the NHL, but um can they learn a lot from watching from a press box or is that, you know, that’s the cliche that you can learn a lot from watching up top or is it more kind of a mental reset, a a wakeup call if you will? Yeah. No, a little bit of everything. I I done it before. It’s not my first time. I I done uh it’s almost like you you look for the reset button. Uh yes, it it sucks to to be scratched. I I get that. I was a player. Uh but I I do it. It’s not a punishment. I do it to get something out of this and it’s player better. So that’s the whole process. I did it in Ontario, too. So everyone looked at me like I’m like, “What are you doing?” right? Want to reset those guys. Um you want to set them down. Okay. Explain exactly um what he needs to do better and show him and and you know sometimes those those I think Casey for example he’s probably still pissed at me. But on the other side, on the other side, he came back way more motivated, way more motive than ever before because now he knows, okay, I I got to get my together and now I got to get things going. And and look at him how he took off. Uh Mason Lauri, we I didn’t want to scratch him five, six games, whatever it was, but we won all those games, so I don’t bring him back. But it was also I think it was a learning process from him for him because he never never happened to him before. He got thrown in last year because of a lot of injuries. He played first per it was not even fair to him. So it’s not even sometimes it’s not even the player’s fault. It’s not his fault but he it was the timing of it and again now I felt like I had to reset him. Um so you know those uncle need to get it certain things in their game if you think you’re going to survive uh uh in this league. No and did some things again uh he needed to learn and he’s still learning uh we’re still in that process but he definitely helped uh for sure. Yeah the response has been good is yeah from obviously from Casey but from Mason too right. Yeah. Yeah. No that’s as a coach that’s what I’m looking for. I don’t again I’m do not they think I’m going to punish them. Yes, I do. But but I don’t I actually want to help them. Uh because they’re they’re good players. They’re good players and they they they’re big part of our team and we need them. We actually need them. But going to continue the way they they were playing. They’re not going to help us. So how how how do we you know every coach has a different way. So I did it that way. And once in a while I I think I’m not doing it with every player, but once in a while I think it helps. And generally speaking as a head coach, it’s something I wonder about like what are like sort of your like biggest like on the ice pet peeves like in terms of just things that are just like non-negotiable on the ice that people that maybe fans don’t see. You know, a couple that like come to mind that I think coaches really don’t like is like for example when forwards they fly to zone too early like before you guys get possession. That’s probably something that the fans don’t see. But for a coach, you see that what are you doing? We don’t have the puck yet. I don’t know. We don’t have 100% or 90 or 80% possession of the puck. Another one is the too many men on the ice. You know, that’s obviously a sign of lack of engagement. So, I guess what I’m asking you is if you’re deciding between two players, you know, who sits and it’s close, what’s the kind of like infraction or just thing that you don’t like that just like h, you know, like that’s just like kind of a non-negotiable for winning hockey? Uh, yeah, it’s when somebody cheats the game. And for me, that’s I’m I’m a structure guy. I always been uh that way. And if and it has nothing to do with uh scoring goals or having a lot of points and this and this and that. No, if somebody is in uh is if there’s a player who uh who plays the right way, probably has less goals and points, I will probably put him in front of some other guys who cheats the game or has goals, you know. Um so that that’s me. I I I like players and again I always look at I never look at the goals or whatever but I don’t I want players to play the right way. They don’t cheat the game. Th those are the guys who are like the coach’s favorite. Um because I you can use them, you can trust them, you can use them on special teams and stuff like that. Um and if you have a lot of skill, a lot of kids have skill these days. Uh but they don’t play the right way. So there’s a fine line and I think that’s something I I don’t know. I have a I have a Yeah. No, I have a better feeling on on those kind of players. You’re you’re brilliant. You read our mind. Actually, that was going to be our next question on the other side. What’s the number one trait that keeps a player maybe even a less talented one in your lineup every night? So, let’s move on because you answered it. So, don’t cheat the game, kids. Don’t cheat the game. wanted to ask you then uh what’s your philosophy then with dealing with a superstar because you’ve got one in David Posternok and so how much do you work directly with a David and a sense of asking him hey what’s your fatigue level who do you want to play with what’s going to optimize your game um or are you a little more old school with that where you treat them like everybody else you know things like this you know phrase star treatment it sounds like a bad thing but I think it makes perfect sense in a lot of ways because even in a a sport like hockey, a larger team sport, you’re trying to maximize your stars. So, kind of treating everybody the same way. I know that’s like kind of ideal, but I don’t know if that really works, though. Yeah. Yeah. No. Uh, absolutely true. Um, you know, I think the biggest thing, uh, uh, first of all, everyone is different. I think uh if you got to know uh a guy like David uh he’s probably different than Mckennon and and some other guys. So uh so every superstar is different but every they’re all not they’re not perfect either. Not one of them, right? Uh but they have something special. There’s something special you can teach u something you need uh on your team and you want on your team. So, and David, uh, yeah, David is one of them. And he’s, uh, you know, he’s, uh, I would say he’s, uh, um, he’s still a kid. He loves the game, loves the game. And, uh, no, that’s why it’s so important, I think, with a guy like him that you you have a good relationship, you know. Um, yes, sometimes you have to close your eyes on on certain things, but he does so many good things. So again, long as you’re going to be honest with them and and and kind of point out the things and and and kind of having that uh communication relationship with him, I think that’s that’s going to be the biggest key. So Marco, you just talked about communication and and being honest with him, and I I know I’ve heard you speak about, you know, Daryl Sutter taught you a lot of that. Um, do you have any Daryl Sutter moments where he was really direct with you or just told you it straight up and and how do you manage that? Every day. Yeah, every day. I don’t want him and me in trouble. Uh, but no, he was uh he was uh again if I play bad, I would know. I would know the next day for sure. He would let you know somehow somehow just the way he looked at you, the way you you felt it. You felt it. Whatever whatever he he tapped you on the back of the shoulder, you’re up. You felt it. And and but it was good. It was just it was more like a motivation for me, right? Uh but again, uh sometimes you do it now to some players, they shut down. Um, thank God I wasn’t one of the guys. He kind of motivate me. I wanted to show him I I I got this. I I I I I I’m better than this and I want, you know, I wanted to please you and this and this and that. Uh uh but here Yeah. No, he but yeah, he I remember in San Jose practice one day I had a bad game. I don’t know I had a bad game. He thought I had a bad game and the next day I was going in and you know I was shooting. I thought I was shooting fine. He’s like, he was screaming at me. He’s like, uh, shoot the shoot the, uh, puck to score or he going to shoot somewhere else tomorrow. Um, so I’m like, as a young kid, right, I’m like, oh my god. Oh my god. I swear I went all out, right? Every every shot I want to score so badly. He did it a couple times to me. And uh, but now we laugh, but it was stressful when you’re 20 years old. Yeah. Well, Mark, I want to thank you so much for your time. Do you have a we have a couple more questions? Couple more minutes. Uh, is that good? Yeah. All right. Perfect. Perfect. Actually, I want to get get to a favorite question of mine I want to ask you. Um, as a media member, how do you use the media? Are you pretty good about not like losing your composure after a bad game? I think you’re pretty good about that. That’s what I’ve seen. But, do you send messages to players through the media? Like I’m sure you talk with the player directly of course, but do you also kind of tell the media that same message a little bit to for some players to kind of put a little more pressure on this guy? So I just wonder how do you how do you use us, Marco? Yeah, a little bit. There’s always something a little bit to it. But but I if I’m going to be honest, I’m I’m I’m honest. I think that’s the thing. I wish sometimes I I’m not that honest, but you know, especially to the media, but I can’t hold it. Um, you know, that’s that’s just me. Um, you know, try to try to try to be very direct, respectful. Um, I think that the for me the one thing it’s it’s um it’s a little bit of change and I’m still learning because of the Boston, you know, especially Boston, the market, the media. Oh, sure. Yeah, that’s good. Good way to look at it. Yeah. right after a game, you know, five minutes after a game or you do the first interview uh on TV on our local TV. I think those are one of the hardest ones in the game. You still, you know, sometimes very mad. Oh, sure. Sure. And and then uh sometimes, you know, that that part I’m still learning, I think. Um you know, but but again, long as I’m honest and and and and respectful, I think I will be fine. But I think that’s that’s something uh what’s what’s been new for me and it’s different for me. Um you know when it comes down to the press conference I think everything settles down you know those 10 minutes in between actually is a lot is that that uh so that helps. Do you do like a breathing exercise like after a bad game things like that? Yeah. No. Um probably not that but I I actually what I learned from Todd Mclon is and any any meeting uh or media you get a few minutes yourself you just kind of okay calm down um what happened right what happened in a game what happened to certain players what certain plays you kind of run through your mind and I I I don’t want to talk to anyone you kind of want you your own little two three minutes right just to kind of reflect of the game a little bit and uh and that’s what I do in the meetings too. So I I I can’t talk to you and go to the you know a minute later I have a team meeting. No, you got to mentally you got to prepare yourself um to go into situations like that. And I think for me he was the best by far and I think that’s something I took from him to you know in any interviews team meetings you name it. calm down. Go through. Get prepared. Get prepared of anything any questions too, right? I’m not going in there blindly. Uh I want to know what Shang Pang is all about. Like he might ask you this and this and that. So, um you know, you just kind of take a few minutes, breathe, and then go from there. Uh did you mention the interview right after the game? Is that like the interview with TV? That’s the one where you’re a little more like you’re not set yet? Yeah. No, it’s with Madison. It’s our uh it’s our um it’s our TV. Uh interesting. Interesting. He covers all and uh and I got interviews. What I I I absolutely love those guys and it’s not about them. It’s questions. Not even that. It’s about you know right after the game and you get on you talk and sometimes Yeah. You probably more emotional than than some other days but that’s that’s something you know sometimes not easy. Yeah, for sure. And what what have you learned so far about dealing with the Boston market? That’s a good thing that you bring up because in the Boston market, you say something it can just go very far, very fast, very viral. Yeah. Can it uh but they’ve been uh they’ve been very good very good to me. Uh but I think the one of the reason uh why we have a a good relationship uh because because I was there as a player so I kind of know I knew when I when I got hired what what Boston is all about. Oh yeah that’s a good point. That really helped me and also it helped me you know the same people are still there. uh and and and so I remember them all actually only good things and uh um and everyone has different opinions. They can write whatever but I I think as long as you you you know you’ve been very respectful respectful to each other and and and and honest uh I think you come you come a long way but that that I think that helped me just I’ve been through it as a player and that nothing really new jumped out at me. uh now as a as a coach and I I guess a final one related to it is um and last question in general actually is just uh in terms of like dealing with the media and talking about a player, do you sometimes withhold criticism of a player because maybe that player doesn’t respond to it or responds negatively to being talked about publicly because some players are different, right? Every every guy’s different. Yeah, absolutely. You got to be got to be really careful and uh and like you said, especially a market like Boston because it’s as soon as you say something, it’s it’s in the paper or it’s on social media. Uh so you really got to Yes, it’s part of that too. Um you know, the media part because of the social media, it’s everything is out right away. So um even after games when now he, you know, you got cameras now following you non-stop. Um I don’t even see it anymore. They’re in there. They’re in there and they they they they listen to everything. So, you you just got to be you just got to be really careful now these days. What do you say uh uh and about which player and uh what kind of tone you use and and this and this and that. So, uh yeah, again going back to coaching, it’s not a lot of people know it’s not just the all nice stuff. It’s actually, you know, I feel like something I’m a psychologist. I’m a media expert. I coach. So, there’s more to it. There is more to it. Not just in hockey, not just with me. I think in in general, in sports, if you look at if you look at all the coaches now, it’s it’s just uh Yeah, it’s just different. I can just imagine Daryl Sutter getting a interview five minutes after a 5-1 loss. Daryl, what happened in this game? We were horseshit. Yeah. Yeah. Sports was one of the last guys. Maybe there’s a one or two, but uh yeah, you just don’t don’t see that much anymore. Yeah. Well, Marco, really appreciate your time here. Congratulations once again on the Bronson Bruins job. Very welld deserved and uh look forward to seeing you in San Jose in a couple days. Hey, thanks for having me, guys. See you. Thanks, Marco.

San Jose Sharks legend Dan Boyle, insider Sheng Peng, prospects guru Keegan McNally, and Sharks Ice beer league champ Zubair Jeewanjee talk all things Sharks!

This week, Sharks fan favorite and new Boston Bruins head coach Marco Sturm gives us the in’s and out’s of his new job: What’s the adjustment like coaching AHL vs. NHL players? As a coach, what do you hope to gain from scratching players? Do you treat superstars differently than the rest of the team? How do you use and handle the media?

Before we chat with Sturm, we discuss this week in San Jose Sharks hockey!

The Sharks have recalled Vincent Iorio, what do they do with their nine defensemen?

We revisit the Fabian Zetterlund and Ryan Reaves trades.

Sheng says Macklin Celebrini had just an okay week…and Celebrini still won NHL Third Star of the Week?!

And Keegan zeroes in on Shakir Mukhamadullin and Keaton Verhoeff in his prospects’ corner, which also debuts a theme song, courtesy of Will Neumann!

(2:48) Vincent Iorio recalled, San Jose Sharks have to make a D decision?

(23:51) What’s going on with Michael Misa’s injury? Should Sharks send him to WJCs?

(31:30) Revisiting the Fabian Zetterlund trade: Zack Ostapchuk is opening eyes!

(42:20) The San Jose Sharks debut their hilarious Player of the Game Award! Ryan Reaves has made a huge impact on the locker room.

Of course, we talk about Macklin Celebrini and Yaroslav Askarov! And we discuss another winning week of Sharks hockey.

(1:22:00) We dissect Shakir Mukhamadullin’s game, for better and worse. Is Keaton Verhoeff going to be a No. 1 defenseman?

(1:56:00) Marco Sturm interview!