Note: Transcript edited by Steven Watkins.<\/p>\n
McKay Coppins: Thank you to Ryan and Ashley Smith for joining us today. We are talking the day after the NBA lottery and I think a lot of people in this room are probably curious what your plans are for the No. 2 pick. But we\u2019re going to save it, we\u2019re going to save it for after. They told me backstage they\u2019re going to break the news here who they\u2019re going to pick. We just have to wait, all right?<\/p>\n
I actually want to start with what motivates you right now. So you both, you bought the Utah Jazz a few years ago, you brought an NHL franchise to Utah. I\u2019m curious why you are so committed to live sports. You know, this is an era that is largely defined by, you know, social media and smartphones and AI, and at a time when more and more people seem to be spending more and more of their time on their phones or on their laptops, you seem really committed to live events, live sports. Why is that, why does that matter?<\/p>\n
Ashley Smith: Well, I don\u2019t know if \u2014 whoever had a chance to go to a playoff game \u2014 but you can feel that it matters. You can feel \u2014 sitting in the Delta Center for a hockey playoff game was a new experience. And looking around, 18,000 people or however many fit for hockey, who don\u2019t know each other, high-fiving and hugging and all holding their breath at the same moment and cheering at the same moment. I mean, it proves that sports matter.<\/p>\n
And it\u2019s just this unifier, it\u2019s everything. And, like you said, you can go in my house and people are in different rooms at different times getting different feeds and different info coming to them and everyone\u2019s living an alone life, a lonely life. We\u2019ve kind of like programmed loneliness into our world and sports bypasses that and we\u2019re all there and we\u2019re all in it. I mean, yesterday the lottery, I mean my whole family of seven and everyone we know is on their phones, on a screen waiting for this moment to, like, feel connected about what pick are we going to get.<\/p>\n
Ryan Smith: Yeah, I don\u2019t think we set out to do sports. I mean, we went on a 20-year tech journey together and it was a little bit like, OK, we\u2019d have these conversations like, \u201cOK, we\u2019re going to sacrifice, I\u2019m going to be gone a lot.\u201d And it was actually something that I was doing and Ash was kind of supporting from her world. And then we obviously had a chance to get into the NBA with the Jazz and, you know, a lot of debate came into that. Specifically, I see Gail there, Gail sat us down multiple times and was like, \u201cOK, hey,\u201d a little bit like buyer beware. Like, are you guys sure you know what you\u2019re getting into?<\/p>\n
And there\u2019s so many Gail moments where she was handing that off, it was very much like, \u201cOK, I know you\u2019re going to do it different than us, but you care about Utah and you\u2019re going to keep it here.\u201d But also, like, I\u2019ll never forget the words, like, \u201cI hope it\u2019s as good for you and your family as it\u2019s been for us.\u201d And I\u2019ve thought about that, like, a hundred times, like, what was she really meaning? Like, what\u2019s behind the \u2026 ? And, like, there\u2019s moments of time where I\u2019m like, OK, this is what she was talking about. And not many people can explain that, but we\u2019re always asking ourselves, like, what our new \u201cwhy\u201d is and what is our new \u201cwhy\u201d together. It\u2019s really the first thing that Ash and I have been able to do together and that\u2019s really cool.<\/p>\n
Whether it\u2019s Ash at the hockey lottery or last year at \u2014 as she claimed she got fired from the NBA lottery.<\/p>\n
AS: They didn\u2019t have me back.<\/p>\n
RS: But it\u2019s also so much more than that. It\u2019s the community, it\u2019s definitely a young person\u2019s game right now in some of this stuff, like, whether it\u2019s with the player management and this, like, it is involved because, you know, these players are brand and businesses and, you know, it\u2019s interesting to see who\u2019s coming into sports now as well as just the impact it has on a community like Utah.<\/p>\n
Like, I just got done with \u201cThe Pat McAfee Show\u201d like an hour ago and it was like a five minute, like, he wanted to talk about Utah. He wanted to talk about everything that\u2019s going on in Utah and it\u2019s not by accident as we\u2019ve thought about what our \u201cwhy\u201d is \u2014 and Utah is a big piece of that \u2014 and probably the biggest piece in our community, that when you see the Mammoth on the screen it says \u201cUtah\u201d as opposed to \u201cMammoth\u201d in there. And that\u2019s really hard to manufacture in the NHL, where it\u2019s like the Sharks versus Canucks. We want Utah. It\u2019s not by accident that Utah\u2019s on the jersey. This was all thought through to the \u201cwhy\u201d for us. And we hope it\u2019s OK with everyone else but, you know, and we\u2019re not perfect by any means, like, we\u2019re going to make a lot of mistakes, but hopefully a little bit of luck, like we had yesterday (in the NBA lottery) and some other things, like, get us through it.<\/p>\n
So, I think that\u2019s why we\u2019re into sports. It\u2019s got to be a means to an end for everybody, because if it\u2019s not, you\u2019re not going to last long because the wins and losses are going to kill you. Like, there\u2019s one happy team at the end of the NBA season. The rest are unhappy. And I would argue that as fans and everyone, we finish happy but we haven\u2019t finished the happiest ever.<\/p>\n
MC: Is that going to happen? I mean, make the promise to the people in this room right now, right, five years, three years?<\/p>\n
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Ashley and Ryan Smith, co-founders of Smith Entertainment Group, sit with The Atlantic staff writer McKay Coppins to discuss the value of live sports in an AI-driven era, the evolving future of entertainment and their vision for revitalizing Salt Lake City as The Atlantic Across America tour \u2014 a three-year, 50-state event series delving into important topics of our day \u2014 partners with the Deseret News in Salt Lake City on Monday, May 11, 2026. | Scott G Winterton, Deseret News <\/p>\n
RS: The problem with a championship is you\u2019ve just got to bring more than the other person. And, you know, our best runs were \u201997, \u201998, I remember, like, I was on my mission, but the problem is you\u2019ve got Michael Jordan on the other side. The other teams happened to squeeze in when he had retired or whatever it was and we still, like, even with Michael, like, you see him, those are \u2014 any picture he signs about games or anything, it\u2019s in the Delta Center, it\u2019s those moments. Those were arguably some of the moments that made the NBA.<\/p>\n
MC: It\u2019s interesting what\u2019s happened since you brought an NHL team here because this is very recent and it seems like almost overnight you had a huge energetic fanbase. You know, I will say I grew up in Massachusetts, you know, those of us in the Boston area feel like Boston is the sports town, right? Like, all my friends skipped school the day after the Red Sox beat the curse and, you know, won the World Series. It was like a religion there, right? And then I lived in New York for a number of years, where they feel like they\u2019re a great sports town. I feel like Salt Lake, Utah might be like a sneaky good sports town. Have you been surprised by the amount of energy around whether it\u2019s the Jazz, the Mammoth? What do you attribute that to?<\/p>\n
AS: I mean it doesn\u2019t feel sneaky at all. Like, I mean, this state loves hockey. So it\u2019s really cool to be a part of figuring that out. But also now I have pride \u2014 I didn\u2019t grow up a hockey fan \u2014 but now I have Mammoth pride, I have NHL pride, I have East Coast pride because I feel like I can connect on a new level with people from the East Coast who grew up loving hockey. I mean, it\u2019s just a whole new door of ways to connect with people and ways to unify and things to cheer for and things to be mad about together. And hockey \u2014 Utah was just ready. They were just ready. And it was very clear to us, this is not our team, this is Utah\u2019s team. And Utah has completely taken it in with open arms and we\u2019re just here trying to kind of steward the way. But it\u2019s a lot of emotional connection for people.<\/p>\n
RS: Yeah, I think if we go back to how this happened, I mean, I remember sitting on a Zoom with the governor with Gary Bettman and he was just like all right, I\u2019m ready to give these people a hockey team. Are you guys on board? And right now, like, you fast forward two years, it would be very hard to get a hockey team and it is really hard. I mean, you\u2019re seeing how long the process for expansion is in the NBA. We\u2019ve been at the doorstep of Vegas and Seattle for 10 years. And what people understand is you\u2019ve got to get 30 owners to go vote and say, \u201cYeah, I want to give up some of the pie to bring these new people. I want to compete against Vegas.\u201d I mean because that\u2019s real for us. Those are two good markets that make it even harder to get that ultimate goal regardless of television and money and everything, that\u2019s the only way I look at it is like OK, is a free agent going to choose them or us?<\/p>\n
And so we were super fortunate that, you know, we were in a spot where Gary Bettman and the owners were in a spot where they trusted us and it was a little bit of a crisis going on somewhere else that we benefited from. But it\u2019s not just \u2014 hockey\u2019s different. The reason \u2014 we didn\u2019t have a lot of data that hockey would work, everyone could go run their models, you could get Qualtrics to do a hundred surveys: \u201cAll right, what do you think about hockey?\u201d None of it matters. Because you\u2019re seeing super small markets in Canada outpace all of the large markets from a revenue standpoint. <\/p>\n
And hockey\u2019s a story. It\u2019s the antithesis of what some people who are turned off by sports love. There\u2019s not one player bigger than the team. Everyone\u2019s on the ice for about 45 seconds. They get hurt and they\u2019re back on the ice right away. They never say I, it\u2019s about we. And it\u2019s little things. Like, our team just got done, they just got knocked out of the playoffs, this is a Friday and they\u2019re saying, \u201cHey, Ryan, what do you think about us going on a trip together?\u201d And they all go on a trip and go play golf at Pebble Beach for three days together to bond. This is after the season. And I\u2019m not knocking other leagues, but when the season\u2019s over on other leagues, that plane flying back home to Utah is empty.<\/p>\n
And then you overlay that with who we are as Utahns and our values and what you want your kids to grow up and believe. It\u2019s pretty crazy. And I\u2019ll tell this one story, we had a game the first year and we\u2019re on the glass with Will Hardy and Lauri Markkanen from basketball because Lauri goes to every game. And we\u2019re up 5-1 in the third, which is kind of like the game\u2019s in hand. Like, and Mikhail Sergachev, who\u2019s on the defense, their team goes for a slapshot, it\u2019s going about 80 miles an hour, he dives in front of it and gets hit in the head with the puck and kind of knocks him out.<\/p>\n
And that was a moment where Will turned to Lauri and was like \u2014 we\u2019re all new to this \u2014 we\u2019re like, \u201cWhy would he do that?\u201d And Lauri\u2019s like, \u201cBecause if he doesn\u2019t, everybody knows and he\u2019s an associate captain, he\u2019s got to put himself on the line for the team. You\u2019ve got to dive in front of the puck. You\u2019ve got to take that puck.\u201d I was like, \u201cBut it\u2019s going 90 miles an hour at his head.\u201d Well, the next night we\u2019ve got a basketball game and I\u2019m in the locker room after the game and we end up winning. And we weren\u2019t winning that many games.<\/p>\n
MC: You sound so surprised.<\/p>\n
RS: And I\u2019ll never forget Drew Eubanks, who was on our team, brings it in and is like, \u201cWay to get in front of the puck, guys!\u201d And I go, \u201cWhat\u2019d you say?\u201d He\u2019s like, \u201cWay to get in front of the puck\u201d and whatever. So I go to Will. I said, \u201cWill, what did you, what did you say? Why did he say that?\u201d He\u2019s like, \u201cWell, instead of watching video to prepare for the team, I just showed Sergachev getting in front of the puck and then I just told our guys, \u2018I\u2019m not asking you to do that, just get back on defense.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n
So that\u2019s a great crossover.<\/p>\n
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Utah Mammoth right wing Clayton Keller (9) poses for a photo with Smith Entertainment Group Chairman and CEO Ryan Smith after receiving the Team Most Valuable Player award after an NHL game against the St. Louis Blues at the Delta Center in Salt Lake City on Thursday, April 16, 2026. | Rio Giancarlo, Deseret News <\/p>\n
MC: The NBA players feel like a little kind of wusses compared to the hockey players, is that what you\u2019re saying?<\/p>\n
RS: No I didn\u2019t say that at all, McKay. I would never say that, ever. But I would say that these hockey players are built a little different than everybody because it\u2019s football 82 games. On skates. At least the football players play once a week, these guys are playing like \u2014 it\u2019s crazy. But our basketball players are very tough.<\/p>\n
MC: So it\u2019s interesting because I think that live sports, you both alluded to this, is one of kind of the last bastions of American monoculture, right? Like, sociologists have been talking for decades about America atomizing and people are more isolated and alone and everyone\u2019s paying attention to different things. But a live game, especially like a playoff game, can bring the whole country together, right, and everybody\u2019s paying attention together. But that said, there are threats to live sports, to professional sports and I want to talk about them a little bit.<\/p>\n
I mean, we\u2019re just coming off this big round of kind of debate and discourse in the NBA about how to make the NBA regular season in particular a better entertainment product, right? Because any of us who watch the NBA on any given day, you turn on a game. You know, the star might not be playing that day, there\u2019s load management; there\u2019s tanking. You know, it\u2019s a long season, no individual game during the regular season feels like it\u2019s that high stakes. I\u2019m curious how you\u2019re thinking about that. Like, for example, Adam Silver recently decided that the Utah Jazz invented tanking and you guys were fined. But like I\u2019m curious, like, do you feel like there should be a more aggressive approach toward tanking, should the season be shorter? Like what needs to happen to make the regular season more engaging for the typical fan?<\/p>\n
RS: You want to talk about this one?<\/p>\n
AS: You got this, babe.<\/p>\n
RS: So it\u2019s a fair question and there\u2019s a lot of questions in there, but let\u2019s just unpack season length, right? There\u2019s no question that with scarcity comes a higher value. I think if you watch the San Antonio-Minnesota game, which I watch \u2014 I\u2019m a junkie, I watch every game \u2014 like, it\u2019s pretty incredible product. And if it was once a week, it would spike rating-wise just as much as anything. I think the NBA lottery, of course I say this, was about as compelling as any sporting event I see yesterday. I mean, the amount of videos I\u2019ve seen where people jumping \u2014 jumping on the couch, jumping on each other, the dogpiling. If someone had a video in governor\u2019s house last night, I would have paid for that, right, because I saw David Locke doing it, like, it\u2019s just everyone from everywhere having this moment of a little bit of chance.<\/p>\n
Now do I wish there wasn\u2019t as much chance in that? Absolutely, and there\u2019s conspiracies everywhere. I will give the NBA credit, we\u2019re not afraid to change. And baseball was probably a little too late for it, but they\u2019re going to have to change again here in a major way because they\u2019re signing, you know, Shohei (Ohtani) on a 30-year deal that, like \u2014 they\u2019re having those changes. And so the player contracts, the media all play part of this. I mean, Danny Ainge used to say that you know, when they would go for a preseason game in Boston, when he was playing, they had eight preseason games and Larry Bird was literally like, \u201cI\u2019m playing all 40 as hard as I can, all 40 minutes,\u201d right? As a players\u2019 union we\u2019re only allowed three games. You know, so the world\u2019s changed a little bit. Health matters. You could ask the question: Are athletes going faster? Are they \u2014 the science really getting there? Are they wearing out their bodies earlier? I mean, I don\u2019t know. I mean, Anthony Edwards on a dislocated knee looked pretty amazing last night, right? And what Victor Wembanyama\u2019s doing at 7\u20193\u201d or Lauri Markkanen\u2019s 7 foot, it\u2019s pretty epic and the people are stronger, they\u2019re all lifting weights, they\u2019re all going through this whereas like Michael Jordan all of a sudden showed up and was a big thing because he lifted weights, right? So it\u2019s hard to compare the eras.<\/p>\n
We also just in the NBA have you know an 8 billion dollar a year TV deal. It\u2019s pretty amazing. Like, there\u2019s a product out there and a value and a market that, you know, a lot of other leagues would love to have that deal. You\u2019re also seeing us go into Europe and you\u2019re also seeing us look at other U.S. markets. So if I stand back from the NBA standpoint, the product\u2019s really, really in demand. As we think about basketball globally, it should start with the logo of the NBA, and I think that\u2019s where we\u2019re going. When it comes to mobile \u2014 I\u2019m on the media committee \u2014 we\u2019re fortunate that Mr. Naismith decided a ball was going to be this big because we can actually see it. I can\u2019t watch golf, it\u2019s hard to watch hockey on the mobile device, which we need to work on. And so there\u2019s a lot there. When it comes to tanking, the incentives are the incentives, right? And I think we\u2019re looking as a group to change a lot of those incentives. And we didn\u2019t create it even though it\u2019s been, we\u2019re the poster child of that. But I don\u2019t look at everything as tanking, I look at it as you\u2019re either rebuilding or rebuilding.<\/p>\n
In golf, when you\u2019re laying up, which means you\u2019re not going for it, and the water\u2019s 200 yards, hit something that only goes 150. You don\u2019t need to hit something that goes 195 so you\u2019re right there on the edge and you might go in. So I always have a saying that if you\u2019re going to lay up, lay up. So if you\u2019re not going to be good, like, lay up.<\/p>\n
AS: Well, and we play board games and it\u2019s the same. It\u2019s just a simplified version of as soon as everybody\u2019s at the same level of competence, we\u2019re like, \u201cWhat rule can we add? Let\u2019s do \u2026 .\u201d Or Rummikub: \u201cLet\u2019s have a few less tiles, let\u2019s \u2026\u201d right? And then somebody\u2019s finagling their way to win and then new rules, right? It\u2019s the same thing. And the NBA\u2019s not afraid of \u201cOK, let\u2019s figure out \u2026 we\u2019ve got to reinvent a little bit.\u201d <\/p>\n
RS: Everything\u2019s great till the humans get involved. Like, everything\u2019s always perfect till the humans come.<\/p>\n
MC: I kind of want to just hear about game night at the Smith house, what is it super competitive or what are we talking about?<\/p>\n
AS: It\u2019s just this, it\u2019s strategy. It\u2019s we\u2019re going to create a new rule, everyone\u2019s the same amount of competent, we\u2019re going to find workarounds. It\u2019s this exact same thing.<\/p>\n
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From left, Steve Levy, owner Ryan Smith, Mark Messier, and P.K. Subban on the set of “NHL on ESPN” prior to the first-ever Utah Hockey Club regular season game on Oct. 8, 2024, in Salt Lake City. | Al Powers, ESPN Images <\/p>\n
MC: All right, we have time for one last question. Are you trading up for AJ Dybantsa? Tell us right now, yes or no? We need the answer.<\/p>\n
RS: So, contrary to popular belief, we don\u2019t control that. It\u2019s just the way the world is and I think that we\u2019re trying to win a championship, so everything should be on the table. But one thing I\u2019ve learned in the NBA is everyone\u2019s like, \u201cOh, well, this year we got Jaren Jackson Jr. and it changed everything.\u201d You don\u2019t think Danny Ainge and Austin (Ainge) have been trying to grab someone like Jaren Jackson Jr.? I mean they only called for three years straight, right? So timing is really important in these things and the days of having someone on the opposite side of the front office who\u2019s not smart are long gone. OK? That being said, Austin and Danny have also been known to do some pretty crazy stuff on draft night, like when they traded the No. 1 back to No. 3 and took Jayson Tatum. And I will tell you this, Danny has a chip missing and he doesn\u2019t care what anybody else thinks, including myself. And that\u2019s what we want.<\/p>\n
We want someone who\u2019s not afraid to make moves regardless if they\u2019re unpopular or popular at this time. We know what the goal is, we know he\u2019s not getting younger, we know that Austin is an absolute star in this league and we are so fortunate to have them instead of me running basketball decisions in the draft because that\u2019s what they\u2019re there for. So my job is to get \u2014 you know, I said this earlier on the show, Danny is made a living with owners who are over-involved. And so our job is to put the right people in place to be the sounding board. And what\u2019s crazy is they always come to us because they want a different perspective, but at the same time they definitely are going to do everything in their power to improve our team to a championship.<\/p>\n
And I wish I could turn over the cards \u2014 we haven\u2019t got together yet, I\u2019m headed right to Chicago after this \u2014 we\u2019re going to go get together, we\u2019re in interviews with all these guys for the next little while. I have no idea honestly what\u2019s going to happen when we get out and then I think the next 40 days you\u2019re going to see some madness in the NBA and, you know, it might or might not be with us. And it may be the best thing that Danny sees and Austin sees is just the path of just to go and let\u2019s draft the best player available. I know that they don\u2019t draft just based on fit. Always take the best, they are of the mindset, always take the best player available, we\u2019ll figure out how to make them fit.<\/p>\n
MC: Man, talk about ending the interview on a cliffhanger. Ryan and Ashley, thank you so much for doing this.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"After years of tanking \u2014 for which the Utah Jazz were fined by the NBA \u2014 the club…\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":580413,"comment_status":"","ping_status":"","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[5122],"tags":[5,3157,4,487,51,5290,232,5291,5289],"class_list":["post-580412","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","category-utah-hockey-club","tag-hockey","tag-news-feed-local","tag-nhl","tag-podcast","tag-utah","tag-utah-hc","tag-utah-hockey-club","tag-utahhc","tag-utahhockeyclub"],"share_on_mastodon":{"url":"https:\/\/channels.im\/@nhl\/116613521642507885","error":""},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.rawchili.com\/nhl\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/580412","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.rawchili.com\/nhl\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.rawchili.com\/nhl\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.rawchili.com\/nhl\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.rawchili.com\/nhl\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=580412"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.rawchili.com\/nhl\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/580412\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.rawchili.com\/nhl\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/580413"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.rawchili.com\/nhl\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=580412"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.rawchili.com\/nhl\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=580412"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.rawchili.com\/nhl\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=580412"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}