How important is environment when it comes to quarterback development?
November 23, 2023
13 comments
Its like the soil for a plant
This phenomenon is vastly exaggerated for QBs. Anybody who acts like it’s a completely impossible task to tell how a QB would turn out in a better/worse situation has no idea what they are talking about or what to look for.
Take Mitch for example – he always stared down his first read, couldn’t go through his progressions, and panic-threw into his checkdown option if his first read wasn’t there. All traits of bad QBs that made it obvious he didn’t have what it takes, and he never improved. It didn’t matter how clean the pocket was, how good the playcall was, the same traits remained. It was obvious that he sucked and would continue to suck wherever he went after us, and sure enough he did. If you didn’t predict that, then you didn’t know what you were talking about.
The same can be said of Fields – he’s not some perpetual victim of bad circumstance, he’s just not very good, and it’s obvious. I’ll bet anyone any amount of money that he will be mediocre at best with whoever we trade him to this offseason too.
listening to this video from a Bears fan standpoint. Do you guys feel like we have ever truly invested in the quarterback room? I know at the end of the day it come down to the individual player, but it just never felt like we made sure that our quarterbacks had the best coaches
Are there examples of defensive-minded head coaches developing elite quarterbacks with rookie offensive coordinators?
Certainly has some but it’s even bigger than that. I think a lot of them just take time to “get it”. Problems are: A. Everyone is too impatient for guys to figure it out. Jobs on the line, money being lost, etc.
B. there’s no “NFL minor league” for these guys to at least play more evenly matched opponents regularly. Watching A kid at ‘Bama trounce colleges doesn’t really always show true talent.
C.By the time it’s second nature they aren’t the same athletes they were when drafted.
I think it’s slightly overrated but still important.
Philadelphia had its famous “Quarterback Incubator” when there was Carson Wentz / Nick Foles w/ Doug Pederson, Frank Reich, and DeFillippo; however, Wentz fizzled out and Foles seems to be more of a guy that catches lightning in a bottle than any real sustained success.
CJ Stroud is in arguably a worse situation from Fields and he is absolutely thriving. The Texans run a similar scheme to the Bears, are anchored by rookie receivers, and up until recently were operating with the definition of a patchwork line.
I think stability is more important than the overall environment (though I guess they can seem synonymous), but when I think of guys who have developed they’ve often been paired with coaches and general managers such that everyone’s timeline is in sync.
The Bears haven’t done this in forever. Emery and Trestman inherited Cutler, Nagy inherited Mitch, Eberflus inherited Fields. Everyone’s timeline is askew so there are never similar expectations across the board.
Your answer can be found in how many QBs get better after not getting extended by their drafted team.
I see development as raising the ceiling instead of raising the floor. There’s only so much you can try to teach, and being a QB is already incredibly hard.
Always love a FlemLo breakdown.
The only real data is how often bust QBs go on to be successful at new teams: some but not very many.
Fanbases get irrationally attached to qbs their teams drafted and have a hard time accepting that they are not good. Hence, to absolve their qb of the blame, they can blame something unquantifiable like ‘situation’ or ‘coaching’.
There has never been a better time to have a new head coach than after this season.
I actually think if the bears go with a rookie QB, he will have the best situation a rookie has ever inherited in terms of offensive personnel.
O line is good and with a few more pieces great
Number one WR and a statistically top 5 tight end.
(This assumes we get new coaching along with the QB.)
QB development at the NFL level is about taking somebody with an elite trait or set of traits and finding a playcaller who will cater to their strengths and cover up their weaknesses significantly to make them more consistent against good defenses.
i said it when we hired our staff and i will say it again, we took shots in the dark with the most talented QB we have ever had as a franchise and it went exactly like everybody said it would.
The Bears need a veteran offensive head coach who can call plays and has had success in the playoffs and a veteran defensive playcaller who runs a 4-3.
If Poles doesn’t want to do that, you also need a new GM.
13 comments
Its like the soil for a plant
This phenomenon is vastly exaggerated for QBs. Anybody who acts like it’s a completely impossible task to tell how a QB would turn out in a better/worse situation has no idea what they are talking about or what to look for.
Take Mitch for example – he always stared down his first read, couldn’t go through his progressions, and panic-threw into his checkdown option if his first read wasn’t there. All traits of bad QBs that made it obvious he didn’t have what it takes, and he never improved. It didn’t matter how clean the pocket was, how good the playcall was, the same traits remained. It was obvious that he sucked and would continue to suck wherever he went after us, and sure enough he did. If you didn’t predict that, then you didn’t know what you were talking about.
The same can be said of Fields – he’s not some perpetual victim of bad circumstance, he’s just not very good, and it’s obvious. I’ll bet anyone any amount of money that he will be mediocre at best with whoever we trade him to this offseason too.
listening to this video from a Bears fan standpoint. Do you guys feel like we have ever truly invested in the quarterback room? I know at the end of the day it come down to the individual player, but it just never felt like we made sure that our quarterbacks had the best coaches
Are there examples of defensive-minded head coaches developing elite quarterbacks with rookie offensive coordinators?
Certainly has some but it’s even bigger than that. I think a lot of them just take time to “get it”. Problems are: A. Everyone is too impatient for guys to figure it out. Jobs on the line, money being lost, etc.
B. there’s no “NFL minor league” for these guys to at least play more evenly matched opponents regularly. Watching A kid at ‘Bama trounce colleges doesn’t really always show true talent.
C.By the time it’s second nature they aren’t the same athletes they were when drafted.
I think it’s slightly overrated but still important.
Philadelphia had its famous “Quarterback Incubator” when there was Carson Wentz / Nick Foles w/ Doug Pederson, Frank Reich, and DeFillippo; however, Wentz fizzled out and Foles seems to be more of a guy that catches lightning in a bottle than any real sustained success.
CJ Stroud is in arguably a worse situation from Fields and he is absolutely thriving. The Texans run a similar scheme to the Bears, are anchored by rookie receivers, and up until recently were operating with the definition of a patchwork line.
I think stability is more important than the overall environment (though I guess they can seem synonymous), but when I think of guys who have developed they’ve often been paired with coaches and general managers such that everyone’s timeline is in sync.
The Bears haven’t done this in forever. Emery and Trestman inherited Cutler, Nagy inherited Mitch, Eberflus inherited Fields. Everyone’s timeline is askew so there are never similar expectations across the board.
Your answer can be found in how many QBs get better after not getting extended by their drafted team.
I see development as raising the ceiling instead of raising the floor. There’s only so much you can try to teach, and being a QB is already incredibly hard.
Always love a FlemLo breakdown.
The only real data is how often bust QBs go on to be successful at new teams: some but not very many.
Fanbases get irrationally attached to qbs their teams drafted and have a hard time accepting that they are not good. Hence, to absolve their qb of the blame, they can blame something unquantifiable like ‘situation’ or ‘coaching’.
There has never been a better time to have a new head coach than after this season.
I actually think if the bears go with a rookie QB, he will have the best situation a rookie has ever inherited in terms of offensive personnel.
O line is good and with a few more pieces great
Number one WR and a statistically top 5 tight end.
(This assumes we get new coaching along with the QB.)
QB development at the NFL level is about taking somebody with an elite trait or set of traits and finding a playcaller who will cater to their strengths and cover up their weaknesses significantly to make them more consistent against good defenses.
i said it when we hired our staff and i will say it again, we took shots in the dark with the most talented QB we have ever had as a franchise and it went exactly like everybody said it would.
The Bears need a veteran offensive head coach who can call plays and has had success in the playoffs and a veteran defensive playcaller who runs a 4-3.
If Poles doesn’t want to do that, you also need a new GM.
How would *we* know?